Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -

The Christian Church/The Kingdom of Heaven.


Will Due
 Share

Recommended Posts

10 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

This is WHY the fact that we are no longer born sinful is important.

Christ died to wash awy those sins and give us a new start .

The rest is up  to us although, in christian theology, we will only succeed if we follow Christ, as a template for how to live our lives.   

Hi Walker

Christ only exists in the Christian theology and that is when sins and him dying has any relevance, in my world there is no sin but there are wrongs and if you do wrong with intent then you have to deal with that in this world here and now.

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Walker

It really isn't the sport some people look for fights and know they can start them quite easily during sporting events

I don't drink wine last lime was over 40 years ago it took 6 guys to hold the door shut and one guy to lock it. Upside was I never had trouble with them again.:lol:

How would you know you don't go to church? :huh:

I have nothing to divide, I'm single have no religion and don't follow sports. Single women yeah I might know something and if a married or in a relationship woman starts in on me I just tell them they are married to the guy that they can speak like that to and that isn't me.:D:tu:

and some people use religion for the same purpose 

My point was that alcohol is consumed at football, wine at church :) 

Flirting at church is a well known historical fact  However I did go to many churches while investigating Christianity in my early 20s  You are much more likely to get hit on at a church than a t football Generally there is a far higher proportion of women as church than at football  Things may have changed. but there  were also more pretty   girls at church and the parameters for first contact were already set down for you  

I'm with you on the monogamy issue,   but if you are single, no matter what your age, a good place to meet single women is at a church.  

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Walker

Christ only exists in the Christian theology and that is when sins and him dying has any relevance, in my world there is no sin but there are wrongs and if you do wrong with intent then you have to deal with that in this world here and now.

I agree.That is how I was raised, as a humanist. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

(3) Jesus said, "If those who lead you say to you, 'See, the kingdom is in heaven,' then the birds of heaven will precede you. If they say to you, 'It is in the sea,' then the fish will precede you. But the kingdom is inside of you and it is outside of you. "When you become acquainted with yourselves, then you will be recognized and you will understand that it is you who are children of the living father. But if you do not become acquainted with yourselves, then you are in poverty, and it is you who are the poverty."

The Gospel of Thomas

Edited by Hammerclaw
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

and some people use religion for the same purpose 

Hi Walker

Religious wars were lead by kings and popes and not the people fighting on their own accord. Sports teams do not riot and fight nor do the team owners or management nor do they finance wars.

5 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

My point was that alcohol is consumed at football, wine at church :) 

Catholic church the priest is the only one getting his cup filled.

7 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

Flirting at church is a well known historical fact  However I did go to many churches while investigating Christianity in my early 20s  You are much more likely to get hit on at a church than a t football Generally there is a far higher proportion of women as church than at football  Things may have changed. but there  were also more pretty   girls at church and the parameters for first contact were already set down for you 

I went to church until my 20s and you know what I never flirted with a girl at church, likely because we went to school together and with me being grounded for a good part of my early years. I would go out with girls from the far side of town so I could lollygag around while walking 10 miles to her house and shoot a couple games of pool then the journey home. She wasn't really my girlfriend and knew that I just wanted to get off the leash at home, we were friends and did stuff together we just weren't a couple and were both good with that.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Mr Walker said:

and some people use religion for the same purpose 

My point was that alcohol is consumed at football, wine at church :) 

Flirting at church is a well known historical fact  However I did go to many churches while investigating Christianity in my early 20s  You are much more likely to get hit on at a church than a t football Generally there is a far higher proportion of women as church than at football  Things may have changed. but there  were also more pretty   girls at church and the parameters for first contact were already set down for you  

I'm with you on the monogamy issue,   but if you are single, no matter what your age, a good place to meet single women is at a church.  

 

 

I think it is more about being open to any situation or opportunity to find love. I met the love of my life in a bar that my friend encouraged me to go out instead of sit home alone, I was just a few days out of ending a marriage, meantime my Sean was encouraged by his friend to go out to the same bar too. We call it fate. It was love at first sight we have been inseparable from the start, 25 years later we are deeply madly in love. I truly have a fabulous marriage, we have so much fun and delight in hanging out and are a team. My youngest son met his love at work, my middle son met his love on tinder. When he was younger being on the football team brought plenty of girls. Lots of people meet in college. For some church is the only option they have, unfortunately I have also heard some horror stories about meeting a potential partner in church. A dear friend met an abusive perverted creep in church. I have been told by those that use it that Christian mingle online is more of a hook up place. Albeit, I do know lots of couples who met on Tinder and are going strong. I suppose it is the approach based on the one seeking love. I was recently clubbing in South Carolina with my son, his girlfriend and his friends, we were downtown Charleston and it was alive with young people meeting each other. It was so much fun to see love in the air. Of course, I am biased I am a romantic at heart. I would encourage anyone to be open to love not limited to a certain place, love can happen anywhere. Cheers to the love of my life, He is as kind and compassionate and caring as he is hot. :P I am so grateful to my friend for encouraging me to go out to the bar that night. Truly one of the best decisions of my life. 

23C111A4-2B08-4410-A589-BB3E8883B0D6.jpeg

Edited by Sherapy
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/19/2022 at 4:34 AM, Sherapy said:

To live without hope is an earmark of a healthy lifestyle when one lives their life mindfully, it is a life that embraces the uncertainty, with this comes resilience, liberation, an inherent freedom. Clinging to hope is little more than clinging to much “woo about nothing” holding ones fears at bay at the most a way to cope with the life one does have as opposed to living it as it is and embracing all its polarities, embracing  the opportunities and challenges that setting aside the narratives and fantasies and facing reality for what is. 
 

I do not feel sorry for Joc, I admire how he walks his talk and as a result shares viable wisdoms and a spirit of contentment. If one is embracing the moment there is no need for hope in fact, hope is the desire for things to be something other than what they are, hence the clinging to fantasy. it is running away from that which is as opposed to accepting it, Death is a fact of life, it is what it is. You would be better served making peace with your fears by facing them try it and let us know how it goes. I will not be surprised if you share that you connect to a deep sense of gratitude and wonder for the life you do have. Just framing a clearer picture infused with compassion from one who too once clung to blue sky fantasy, there are better ways. All the best to you. 

 

 

I keep thinking about this^  :)      I don’t see what is so bad about hope.  Can’t it sometimes simply be a compassionate wish ?  If a loved one tells you they are not feeling well..what’s the harm in thinking and saying “ aww, well, I hope you feel better soon”.   Hope needn’t necessarily always be “clinging to fantasy”  or a desperate attempt  to avoid or escape reality ?  It’s not too unlike giving someone well wishes ?  ..such as you have given me and my wife.    When you offer Mr. Walker “All the best”  isn’t that sort of a wish or hope for that to come to pass?       I hope what I’m trying to say..makes sense.    :wub:       

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, lightly said:

I keep thinking about this^  :)      I don’t see what is so bad about hope.  Can’t it sometimes simply be a compassionate wish ?  If a loved one tells you they are not feeling well..what’s the harm in thinking and saying “ aww, well, I hope you feel better soon”.   Hope needn’t necessarily always be “clinging to fantasy”  or a desperate attempt  to avoid or escape reality ?  It’s not too unlike giving someone well wishes ?  ..such as you have given me and my wife.    When you offer Mr. Walker “All the best”  isn’t that sort of a wish or hope for that to come to pass?       I hope what I’m trying to say..makes sense.    :wub:       


Thank you for your thoughts. 

I do not see dropping an attachment to the “hope of” as a bad thing, but a good thing for me, it is an acceptance of what is regardless of what it is, then one works from this place. A place of actuality, for ex: not ever dying is fantasy, hoping to never die is fantasy etc. etc.. Biologically we all die. To hope for other than what is in some cases can be a poor choice, the point is to be as clear as possible about what is actually going on, not what one hopes is going on, for example: a person discovers a lump in the breast, has a family history of cancer they can hope it is nothing ( which is a way to deal with fear/ by avoidance) a hope bandage or woo to cope with the fear of as opposed to getting medical advice a.s.a.p. anything caught early enough has a chance of a better outcome. Of course, a person will be scared and anxious waiting for the diagnosis it would be part of the experience. To invest in the hope that one would never feel afraid or anxious is a woo approach to fear, one can accept they are afraid and push thru too, which if done enough will become a habit of being resilient.etc. etc. 
 

By the way, this person I am using as an example did get medical intervention and turns out she caught the cancer early and is doing well.
‘Another example: Or a person unvaccinated gets Covid, refuses to get help in hopes of Covid being something other than it is in favor of what they hope so then the person lets it go, starts coughing up blood still hoping they will get better, and a member of this same family was told by their doctor that by refusing the vaccination if they didn’t get vaccinated and got Covid they would die ( this person died of Covid). The son collapsed completely was admitted to hospital for 3 months, got out but, so far will be on supplemental oxygen for the rest of his life due to the lung damage.  In my line of work, I see a lot of hope used as much woo about nothing as opposed to clear thinking and being proactive. I hope this brings clarity to my post. 
 

All the best, is my way/ approach of saying kind regards, in other words, anything I offer is not personal it is just my two cents, in the end ones choices or lack of are on them. 

Edited by Sherapy
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Sherapy said:


Thank you for your thoughts. 

I do not see dropping an attachment to the “hope of” as a bad thing, but a good thing for me, it is an acceptance of what is regardless of what it is, then one works from this place. A place of actuality, for ex: not ever dying is fantasy, hoping to never die is fantasy etc. etc.. Biologically we all die. To hope for other than what is in some cases can be a poor choice, the point is to be as clear as possible about what is actually going on, not what one hopes is going on, for example: a person discovers a lump in the breast, has a family history of cancer they can hope it is nothing ( which is a way to deal with fear/ by avoidance) a hope bandage or woo to cope with the fear of as opposed to getting medical advice a.s.a.p. anything caught early enough has a chance of a better outcome. Of course, a person will be scared and anxious waiting for the diagnosis it would be part of the experience to hope one would never feel afraid or anxious is woo too. By the way this person I am using as an example did get medical intervention and turns out she caught the cancer early and is doing well.
‘Another example: Or a person unvaccinated gets Covid, refuses to get help in hopes of Covid being something other than it is in favor of what they hope so then the person lets it go, starts coughing up blood still hoping they will get better, and a member of this same family was told by their doctor that by refusing the vaccination if they didn’t get vaccinated and got Covid they would die ( this person died of Covid). The son collapsed completely was admitted to hospital for 3 months, got out but, so far will be on supplemental oxygen for the rest of his life due to the lung damage.  In my line of work, I see a lot of hope used as much woo about nothing as opposed to clear thinking and being proactive. I hope this brings clarity to my post. 
 

All the best, is my way/ approach of saying kind regards, in other words, anything I offer is not personal it is just my two cents, in the end ones choices or lack of are on them. 

      Thanks Sherapy.    I see what your saying.   Yup, people sometimes do hide behind hope.. instead of getting on with ‘it’. .   As you are very familiar with in your work.   (Which I admire greatly!…it takes some special sorts of strength and compassion to do what you do.)

           I still hope it warms up here soon..  but I realize that my wishes won’t raise the temperature. :P    

  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, lightly said:

      Thanks Sherapy.    I see what your saying.   Yup, people sometimes do hide behind hope.. instead of getting on with ‘it’. .   As you are very familiar with in your work.   (Which I admire greatly!…it takes some special sorts of strength and compassion to do what you do.)

           I still hope it warms up here soon..  but I realize that my wishes won’t raise the temperature. :P    

Well you and your beautiful wife can get in more snuggling time. :wub:  Thank you for your kind words on my chosen path of service. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Sherapy said:


Thank you for your thoughts. 

I do not see dropping an attachment to the “hope of” as a bad thing, but a good thing for me, it is an acceptance of what is regardless of what it is, then one works from this place. A place of actuality, for ex: not ever dying is fantasy, hoping to never die is fantasy etc. etc.. Biologically we all die. To hope for other than what is in some cases can be a poor choice, the point is to be as clear as possible about what is actually going on, not what one hopes is going on, for example: a person discovers a lump in the breast, has a family history of cancer they can hope it is nothing ( which is a way to deal with fear/ by avoidance) a hope bandage or woo to cope with the fear of as opposed to getting medical advice a.s.a.p. anything caught early enough has a chance of a better outcome. Of course, a person will be scared and anxious waiting for the diagnosis it would be part of the experience. To invest in the hope that one would never feel afraid or anxious is a woo approach to fear, one can accept they are afraid and push thru too, which if done enough will become a habit of being resilient.etc. etc. 
 

By the way, this person I am using as an example did get medical intervention and turns out she caught the cancer early and is doing well.
‘Another example: Or a person unvaccinated gets Covid, refuses to get help in hopes of Covid being something other than it is in favor of what they hope so then the person lets it go, starts coughing up blood still hoping they will get better, and a member of this same family was told by their doctor that by refusing the vaccination if they didn’t get vaccinated and got Covid they would die ( this person died of Covid). The son collapsed completely was admitted to hospital for 3 months, got out but, so far will be on supplemental oxygen for the rest of his life due to the lung damage.  In my line of work, I see a lot of hope used as much woo about nothing as opposed to clear thinking and being proactive. I hope this brings clarity to my post. 
 

All the best, is my way/ approach of saying kind regards, in other words, anything I offer is not personal it is just my two cents, in the end ones choices or lack of are on them. 

 

This is the Oxford definition of 'hopelessness'

 

 

hope·less·ness

/ˈhōpləsnəs/

noun

a feeling or state of despair; lack of hope.

"his face bears the expression of utter hopelessness"

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Will Due said:

 

This is the Oxford definition of 'hopelessness'

 

 

hope·less·ness

/ˈhōpləsnəs/

noun

a feeling or state of despair; lack of hope.

"his face bears the expression of utter hopelessness"

 

 

Will, from my perspective if I am experiencing hopelessness it doesn’t require hoping for something other than what is, it would be approached as an opportunity for exploration/personal growth. For me:  feelings, experiences, situations come and go things are transient anyway, my approach is accept what is and go/proceed from there, not to cling or attach to anything as a reaction to avoid or distract from actuality as it is. This is an approach not unlike those that need to believe there is an invisible hand to hold. It is not necessary, yet it might be one’s choice.
 

Fair enough.:D

Edited by Sherapy
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

When all recourse or belief fails, the Goddess Tyche, Fortuna, Lady Luck yet reigns supreme over all lives and good fortune and belief in her actions or displeasures are unshakable. There is no life which has not benefited from her blessing, or never suffered from her slight. 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

When all recourse or belief fails, the Goddess Tyche, Fortuna, Lady Luck yet reigns supreme over all lives and good fortune and belief in her actions or displeasures are unshakable. There is no life which has not benefited from her blessing, or never suffered from her slight. 

Hi Hammer

Love and Lady Luck I wouldn't beat either of them either way if I had one or the other or both That's why I am single and doing my own thing my way.:tu:

 

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, jmccr8 said:

Hi Hammer

Love and Lady Luck I wouldn't beat either of them either way if I had one or the other or both That's why I am single and doing my own thing my way.:tu:

 

You lucky stiff!:tsu:

  • Haha 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

You lucky stiff!:tsu:

Hi Hammer

I have missed our comradery greatly and humor with everyone who we shared those times with all friends and perceived foes no matter how wild it got here at times. I wouldn't call women my greatest weakness in as much as they are my greatest distraction.:innocent::whistle:

It's sad when I make 4 smart a$$ comments and end up with a dozen likes on the popular poster list hell before it took a couple hundred to get on there so have tried not to say much. Looks like you me, Walker, Habitat, Will, Eight Bits , and the team are are part of what makes this place popular, how about we all shed that self imposed restrictions on comedy and have a few laughs.:D:tu:

  • Thanks 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, Hammerclaw said:

When all recourse or belief fails, the Goddess Tyche, Fortuna, Lady Luck yet reigns supreme over all lives and good fortune and belief in her actions or displeasures are unshakable. There is no life which has not benefited from her blessing, or never suffered from her slight. 

Indeed, well said, good luck, good luck good fortune does make an appearance from time to time in all human lives. 

Edited by Sherapy
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/25/2022 at 12:07 PM, jmccr8 said:

Hi Walker

Religious wars were lead by kings and popes and not the people fighting on their own accord. Sports teams do not riot and fight nor do the team owners or management nor do they finance wars.

Catholic church the priest is the only one getting his cup filled.

I went to church until my 20s and you know what I never flirted with a girl at church, likely because we went to school together and with me being grounded for a good part of my early years. I would go out with girls from the far side of town so I could lollygag around while walking 10 miles to her house and shoot a couple games of pool then the journey home. She wasn't really my girlfriend and knew that I just wanted to get off the leash at home, we were friends and did stuff together we just weren't a couple and were both good with that.

Kings and popes are human beings, and if their followers weren't wiling to fight ,wars would not have existed 

Not at all sure that your second point is completely true  

Oh I thought everyone a t communion  had at least a sip :)  

Ah but you were probably an exceptional young man  The catholic youth group, held  on a Friday night was renown for a good place to pick up girls 

Even a lot of non catholic boys attended,  just for that chance.  Historically church was the most common meeting place for young people  as it was attended by all people of a similar belief,  every week, and offered an opportunity to talk with each other  while being observed by adults .   There were very few other opportunities for young people to meet, given there were no large working places , no schools for most people, and few dances etc.

It was one of the few things which worried me, being raised  as an atheist.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/25/2022 at 10:07 PM, Sherapy said:

I think it is more about being open to any situation or opportunity to find love. I met the love of my life in a bar that my friend encouraged me to go out instead of sit home alone, I was just a few days out of ending a marriage, meantime my Sean was encouraged by his friend to go out to the same bar too. We call it fate. It was love at first sight we have been inseparable from the start, 25 years later we are deeply madly in love. I truly have a fabulous marriage, we have so much fun and delight in hanging out and are a team. My youngest son met his love at work, my middle son met his love on tinder. When he was younger being on the football team brought plenty of girls. Lots of people meet in college. For some church is the only option they have, unfortunately I have also heard some horror stories about meeting a potential partner in church. A dear friend met an abusive perverted creep in church. I have been told by those that use it that Christian mingle online is more of a hook up place. Albeit, I do know lots of couples who met on Tinder and are going strong. I suppose it is the approach based on the one seeking love. I was recently clubbing in South Carolina with my son, his girlfriend and his friends, we were downtown Charleston and it was alive with young people meeting each other. It was so much fun to see love in the air. Of course, I am biased I am a romantic at heart. I would encourage anyone to be open to love not limited to a certain place, love can happen anywhere. Cheers to the love of my life, He is as kind and compassionate and caring as he is hot. :P I am so grateful to my friend for encouraging me to go out to the bar that night. Truly one of the best decisions of my life. 

23C111A4-2B08-4410-A589-BB3E8883B0D6.jpeg

And I met my wife to be at my 21st birthday party

I was probably talking about younger  people 

I was raised atheist, and so wasn't encouraged to go to church groups, but all my mates reckoned that the catholic youth group on a Friday night was the best place to meet a girl   (outside of school) 

Later, when I was investigating different churches, I found many young women who wanted a relationship/marriage, but by then I was already committed  

Yes it's being open to the opportunity but, especially in the past, church was the best opportunity just to meet young  men or women You also knew something about their  beliefs moralities and values, just from them being church members. Parents (back in the day when their opinion had to be taken seriously) were usually a lot happier if you were dating a church member 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
On 4/26/2022 at 3:11 AM, Sherapy said:


Thank you for your thoughts. 

I do not see dropping an attachment to the “hope of” as a bad thing, but a good thing for me, it is an acceptance of what is regardless of what it is, then one works from this place. A place of actuality, for ex: not ever dying is fantasy, hoping to never die is fantasy etc. etc.. Biologically we all die. To hope for other than what is in some cases can be a poor choice, the point is to be as clear as possible about what is actually going on, not what one hopes is going on, for example: a person discovers a lump in the breast, has a family history of cancer they can hope it is nothing ( which is a way to deal with fear/ by avoidance) a hope bandage or woo to cope with the fear of as opposed to getting medical advice a.s.a.p. anything caught early enough has a chance of a better outcome. Of course, a person will be scared and anxious waiting for the diagnosis it would be part of the experience. To invest in the hope that one would never feel afraid or anxious is a woo approach to fear, one can accept they are afraid and push thru too, which if done enough will become a habit of being resilient.etc. etc. 
 

By the way, this person I am using as an example did get medical intervention and turns out she caught the cancer early and is doing well.
‘Another example: Or a person unvaccinated gets Covid, refuses to get help in hopes of Covid being something other than it is in favor of what they hope so then the person lets it go, starts coughing up blood still hoping they will get better, and a member of this same family was told by their doctor that by refusing the vaccination if they didn’t get vaccinated and got Covid they would die ( this person died of Covid). The son collapsed completely was admitted to hospital for 3 months, got out but, so far will be on supplemental oxygen for the rest of his life due to the lung damage.  In my line of work, I see a lot of hope used as much woo about nothing as opposed to clear thinking and being proactive. I hope this brings clarity to my post. 
 

All the best, is my way/ approach of saying kind regards, in other words, anything I offer is not personal it is just my two cents, in the end ones choices or lack of are on them. 

To put it very simply, if you get a diagnosis of serious cancer  there are 3 possible emotional Reponses. Hope,  despair, or indifference 

Of the 3, hope is the cognitive mechanism evolved to best deal with such crises 

It enables emotional stability psychological well being and the strength and will to carry on  

Interestingly, because of the mind/ body connection, hope (and faith)  also increases your physical chances of recovery

We choose Reponses like fear, after being conditioned to feel them , (it is not woo to learn how  to undo that conditioning and learn how to choose to feel fear or not To learn the cognitive /psychological skills and methods   to minimise or avoid them. We  can "grow" both courage and fear  through our cognitive choices  Hope is a tool which helps us resist fear and despair, and gives us courage 

Hope should  not encourage foolishness and, personally, I cant see how, or why, it would. You would also seek the best medical advice But hope stands outside that It is what sustains you when you have got all the possible advice and are following it    Eg  The specialist says you have a 50 /50 chance of surviving an operation How you perceive that, and what degree of hope you feel, is important  to your emotional and physical well being  

Better to go to the operating table hoping to live  even if you die, than believing you will die.

A lack of hope, in that sort of scenario, might cause a person not to undergo the operation,  knowing they would die eventually (say within a year or two) but not immediately, whereas if the y lived through the op.  they might have many decades of life .  

Edited by Mr Walker
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/10/2022 at 3:17 PM, Will Due said:

The Christian Church, as it developed into what it is today, became a substitute for being individually spirit-led and a believer in the teaching that the kingdom of heaven is the enthronement of doing the Father's will in the heart of the individual. "The kingdom is within you".

Has it become a substitute or is it the other way around?

The oldest religions are all centralised. They have a structure that is adhered to. It's how people become aware of the creator idea. 

Spirituality seems to be the offshoot. Either people who find the absurdities in holy books too much to support, yet insist on retaining certain principles in their own view. Viola spiritualism.

Basically those who don't have the patience or inclination to commit to a church group. Failed parishioners on a sense. 

Organised speaks of structure, guidance and support. Spirituality doesn't. It seems pretty open ended. Just whatever sticks to a wall. Wouldn't a more devout and faithful person actually go through the trouble of organised religion to illustrate real faith? Discussion and guidance over what is required to properly worship one who is supposed to be all? 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, psyche101 said:

Wouldn't a more devout and faithful person actually go through the trouble of organised religion to illustrate real faith? 

 

Not really.

A more devout and faithful person would allow themselves, when being persecuted for daring to live a life free of organized religious authority (but in accordance with the Father's will) to go through the trouble of being nailed to a cross (for the benefit of his friends) to illustrate what the real faith of true religion is really like.

 

 

 

Edited by Will Due
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Mr Walker said:

To put it very simply, if you get a diagnosis of serious cancer  there are 3 possible emotional Reponses. Hope,  despair, or indifference 

Of the 3, hope is the cognitive mechanism evolved to best deal with such crises 

It enables emotional stability psychological well being and the strength and will to carry on  

Interestingly, because of the mind/ body connection, hope (and faith)  also increases your physical chances of recovery

We choose Reponses like fear, after being conditioned to feel them , (it is not woo to learn how  to undo that conditioning and learn how to choose to feel fear or not To learn the cognitive /psychological skills and methods   to minimise or avoid them. We  can "grow" both courage and fear  through our cognitive choices  Hope is a tool which helps us resist fear and despair, and gives us courage 

Hope should  not encourage foolishness and, personally, I cant see how, or why, it would. You would also seek the best medical advice But hope stands outside that It is what sustains you when you have got all the possible advice and are following it    Eg  The specialist says you have a 50 /50 chance of surviving an operation How you perceive that, and what degree of hope you feel, is important  to your emotional and physical well being  

Better to go to the operating table hoping to live  even if you die, than believing you will die.

A lack of hope, in that sort of scenario, might cause a person not to undergo the operation,  knowing they would die eventually (say within a year or two) but not immediately, whereas if the y lived through the op.  they might have many decades of life .  
 

 

In my line of work, I see all kinds of these type of reactions ( they are not right or wrong they just are) and I also see incredible responses. I know a woman in her 80s cancer has been a part of her life for years and these days she is stage 4, but she is so busy working and has a daughter who she adores and a husband by her side. She is amazing truly an inspiration is incredibly grateful and lives her life to the fullest. She works harder than a person who is younger and healthier. One of the Dr’s I work for is almost 90 he had a heart valve replacement 4 years back and is doing amazing, he goes to work everyday he is a Pulmonary Dr., and has loved being a part of Covid, he feels grateful he got to be on-the front lines to save lives still learning stuff, he loves his work and his wife who has Parkinson’s and he works all day and races home to help with gratitude even though we have a full staff 5 caregivers, a chef, and many others. They do not “hope” they do what they can, the basics, they are proactive, by eating healthy, exercising  everyday, and they have so much love and joy due to their incredibly loving relationship of 66 years, they love each other more each day and they also have 17 grandchildren and 6 amazing adult children of their own. 
 

Doc., always says one doesn’t need hope or faith one needs exercise, he says exercise covers a multitude of sin. :PMy husband and I have followed all his advice between us we lost 85 pounds ( about 3 years now) and eat clean and exercise and spend our time loving each other and our family and doing work we are passionate about.
 

Doc would say “you have two ears and one tongue use your ears to listen more and your tongue to talk less and get control of what your hand puts into your mouth, he would say health begins in the kitchen, he would say some of us will get hit with serious things and some won’t and if it happens to be you do not make it worse by not helping yourself, physical health is the easiest thing to turn around, we have the tools, we know more now, he would say but Sheri remember, you can lead the horse to water but you can’t make it drink, He would say people are afraid, driven by fear and it is this fear that convinces one that they can exist on hope alone. :wub:
 

Warm regards. 

 

Edited by Sherapy
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

54 minutes ago, Will Due said:

Not really.

A more devout and faithful person would allow themselves, when being persecuted for daring to live a life free of organized religious authority (but in accordance with the Father's will) to go through the trouble of being nailed to a cross (for the benefit of his friends) to illustrate what the real faith of true religion is really like.

How is that true religion? It's not. It's a bastardised version of the original text. It's anything but showing humility or submission to a higher power. It's more screw you creator, you should be doing it "like this". 

Anti authority with a message of submission is just an oxymoron Will. 

What does spirituality demonstrate other than "I can do religion better than god"?

That which birthed the idea is abandoned for personalised versions. A more devout and commited person would suffer whatever it takes to get closer to their creator and put up with any inconvenience to offer real worship in a house built specifically for that very reason. That strikes me as real faith. Isn't that the point of the book of Job? 

I challenge your thread title as backward. Spirituality is a remnant of true religion. It's not true religion. 

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

How is that true religion? 

 

True religion is the doing of the Father's will (The Kingdom of Heaven here on earth).

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.