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White supremacists are convicted of training for a civil war in Michigan


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Three members of a militant white supremacist group were the first in Michigan to be convicted of conspiring to train with firearms for a civil war, state Attorney General Dana Nessel announced Tuesday. 

The men belong to The Base, a pro-Hitler movement that advocates a race war against non-white people with the goal of using violence “to overthrow the existing social and political order,” according to the Anti-Defamation League.

Justen Watkins, Thomas Denton, and Tristan Webb were charged in August 2021 with larceny in a building, gang membership, felony possession of a firearm, and conspiracy to train with firearms for a civil war. They were accused of breaking into the vacant Michigan Department of Corrections Camp Tuscola annex and Tuscola Residential ReEntry Program in Caro in October 2020 and stealing state-issued clothing from one of the jails. 

Prosecutors allege they were scoping the site as potential training grounds for “hate camps,” which is the name the group gave its paramilitary firearms training exercises. 
 

https://www.metrotimes.com/news/white-supremacists-are-convicted-of-training-for-a-civil-war-in-michigan-30073737

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Not trying to defend these guys, they seem rather bad, but what is the legal difference between training with firearms for a civil war versus other types of training.  It just seems rather arbitrary and I have never heard of a law like that before.

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1 hour ago, DarkHunter said:

Not trying to defend these guys, they seem rather bad, but what is the legal difference between training with firearms for a civil war versus other types of training.  It just seems rather arbitrary and I have never heard of a law like that before.

Domestic terrorism

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3 minutes ago, joseraul said:

Domestic terrorism

Domestic terrorism is it's own criminal charge and from the article it seems one of the legal charges was training with a firearm for a civil war.  

What is to stop the state from grabbing anyone from a gun range and hitting them with the same charge.  Also is only training with a firearm for a civil war illegal or just any training for a civil war illegal, what's to stop the state from saying watching a video of how to provide emergency care isnt training for a civil war if the state decides they want to arrest a person and charge them with something.

The charge just seems extremely broad and extremely arbitrary and easy to abuse if the state decides to.

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"Conspiracy to train with firearm for civil disorder" And again, theyre domestic terrorist guys. They broke into a vacant corrections camp to scope it out as a training site according to prosecutors? There is a case built up. I'm guessing there is stuff we don't see in the article? lol. Theyre not just rounding up people at shooting ranges.

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They all admitted to gang activity from what the article says so they may have all had previous criminal records and they did commit crimes. There is nothing said about their ages and past history with the system so yes there are things unsaid.

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Posted (edited)

I grew up in Minnesota.

This **** was going on there back in the 70's as well.

It's not new... but we're starting to hear about it more often.

 

I suspect there's always been a percentage of folks who ascribe to this type of thinking.  Anti-Authoritarian.  Won't matter a whit who's in charge... if it's not them, then it's completely disregarded as oppressive.  If they can't do anything they want anytime, then they're being oppressed.  It's typical immature, non critical thinking in action.  Don't expect we'll ever be rid of it... so we must remain watchful and vigilent.

 

It's rather exhausting na?

Edited by quiXilver
reworded a sentence for clarity
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9 hours ago, quiXilver said:

I grew up in Minnesota.

This **** was going on there back in the 70's as well.

It's not new... but we're starting to hear about it more often.

 

I suspect there's always been a percentage of folks who ascribe to this type of thinking.  Anti-Authoritarian.  Won't matter a whit who's in charge... if it's not them, then it's completely disregarded as oppressive.  If they can't do anything they want anytime, then they're being oppressed.  It's typical immature, non critical thinking in action.  Don't expect we'll ever be rid of it... so we must remain watchful and vigilent.

 

It's rather exhausting na?

It's basically the platform of the current republican party. 

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Posted (edited)

self snip

Edited by OverSword
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In my experience the type that identifies heavily with race do so because of a lack of certainty about their family.  A few of my old friends that grew up not knowing who their father was were very concerned about racial identity.  I have a feeling that many of the people that worry about or would like to have a race war would fit this description.

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13 hours ago, joseraul said:

Christ, that law has a rather wide remit. Glad it worked in this case, anyone who identifies with Nazis is by definition a loser after all, but sheesh.
Basically anyone who prevents anyone in a position of authority from going about their business during “a civil disobedience” can be arrested. 
That’ll put the Jan 6th mob in a cell right next to everyone from Extinction Rebellion and just up from BLM, hell - it’d have locked up the Boston Tea Partiers!

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With what we know so far, at least one of the charges are very concerning. I mean they aren’t being charged with wanting to start a civil war. With plotting to start one. Seems to me they are being charged with just trying to prepare for one in case it came to them. 
 

While some may find that strange, it’s hardly a crime. 

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15 hours ago, DarkHunter said:

Not trying to defend these guys, they seem rather bad, but what is the legal difference between training with firearms for a civil war versus other types of training.  It just seems rather arbitrary and I have never heard of a law like that before.

I imagine there's other information to indicate the reasons they were training.

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