cormac mac airt Posted June 21, 2022 #226 Share Posted June 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, Sherapy said: It sounds like the typical archetype attachment figure common to the monotheist expression. What would god do, or Jesus in your case. If this works for you great again it does help me to understand your reality tunnel. I would just add that it doesn’t, nor can it, apply to everyone else. It can only be personal and applicable to Will. cormac 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #227 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Abramelin said: God is better than your parents. He's a super-parent. It has to do with extrapolating human accomplishments, human characteristics. I see what you're trying to say, but it's actually the other way around. At least that's how I see it based on my experiences. The experiences that are experienced based on faith are actually like a classroom where our human characteristics are converted into the characteristics that are God's. In other words, the purpose for being involved with faith is to interpret more and more, better and better based on experience what and who God really is (and not what mere men have written about him) and then attempt to become more and more like him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted June 21, 2022 #228 Share Posted June 21, 2022 We should give Will Due a chance to reply to all of us. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Sherapy Posted June 21, 2022 #229 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 minute ago, cormac mac airt said: I would just add that it doesn’t, nor can it, apply to everyone else. It can only be personal and applicable to Will. cormac Thank you for the reminder, you are correct this applies to Will only based on discussion with him about him. If anything it helps me get a perspective on him so that we can have productive conversations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted June 21, 2022 #230 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Will Due said: I see what you're trying to say, but it's actually the other way around. At least that's how I see it based on my experiences. Your first experience with authority and love were your parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #231 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Abramelin said: We should give Will Due a chance to reply to all of us. I've been trying to do just that. But at this point I've got to be honest. The vitriol that comes from some of the posters, is getting really old. But I'll keep trying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #232 Share Posted June 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, Abramelin said: Your first experience with authority and love were your parents. That's true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted June 21, 2022 #233 Share Posted June 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Will Due said: That's true. Ok. So, extrapolating from that experience, you arrive at the idea of "God". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted June 21, 2022 #234 Share Posted June 21, 2022 "God" is a leap of faith, whose existence can neither be proven nor disproven by any material means. No one can be argued into believing, any more than one of Faith can be argued into disbelieving. Whatever exists beyond the bourn of this world waits for us all--no one is left behind, whether that be oblivion, or the arms of the almighty. Those of Faith must be content that the grand Perfection they envision as God would know his own, even if they know him not. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted June 21, 2022 #235 Share Posted June 21, 2022 6 minutes ago, Will Due said: I've been trying to do just that. But at this point I've got to be honest. The vitriol that comes from some of the posters, is getting really old. But I'll keep trying. I'm doing my best to be as polite as can be. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #236 Share Posted June 21, 2022 11 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: From my experience Sherapy hit the nail on the head as God is an internalized parental archetype authority for you. You make that self-evident every time you attempt to explain yourself. That you are blind to it is beside the point. cormac With everything that you know about the life and teachings of Jesus and how he lived his religious life as it was recorded in the Bible, where do you think it ranks as something of supreme significance that most of his teachings were based on the relationship between parent and child and that he consistently spoke of God as his Father and that we are His children too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #237 Share Posted June 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, Abramelin said: Ok. So, extrapolating from that experience, you arrive at the idea of "God". See my post #236 https://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/topic/358099-the-comprehensibility-of-god/?do=findComment&comment=7409720 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted June 21, 2022 #238 Share Posted June 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Will Due said: With everything that you know about the life and teachings of Jesus and how he lived his religious life as it was recorded in the Bible, where do you think it ranks as something of supreme significance that most of his teachings were based on the relationship between parent and child and that he consistently spoke of God as his Father and that we are His children too? Considering that we don’t actually “know” anything about Jesus beyond what can be reasonably inferred by his life as a 1st Century Jew I don’t think it really matters. One’s belief doesn’t become fact simply because you, or others, say so. Nor can it. Therein lies the distinction. cormac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted June 21, 2022 #239 Share Posted June 21, 2022 10 minutes ago, Abramelin said: I'm doing my best to be as polite as can be. Quite often I think some equate disagreement with vitriol just so they can take offense. cormac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #240 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 minute ago, cormac mac airt said: Quite often I think some equate disagreement with vitriol just so they can take offense. cormac You're right about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #241 Share Posted June 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said: Considering that we don’t actually “know” anything about Jesus beyond what can be reasonably inferred by his life as a 1st Century Jew I don’t think it really matters. One’s belief doesn’t become fact simply because you, or others, say so. Nor can it. Therein lies the distinction. cormac Yes, but we can know something about Jesus based on what the Bible says about him. What it says about what he taught which most of the time had to do with the relationship between parent and child. That he consistently referred to God as his Father and us as his children too. Without reference to anything else, just the Bible, what do you think the significance of that is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted June 21, 2022 #242 Share Posted June 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Will Due said: You're right about that. Perhaps you should work on that. cormac 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted June 21, 2022 #243 Share Posted June 21, 2022 One's faith is weak if mere words can shake it. Such a faith is like a reed, trembling in the wind. A true Faith bends with the wind but is never broken. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted June 21, 2022 #244 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Will Due said: Yes, but we can know something about Jesus based on what the Bible says about him. What it says about what he taught which most of the time had to do with the relationship between parent and child. That he consistently referred to God as his Father and us as his children too. Without reference to anything else, just the Bible, what do you think the significance of that is? Therein lies the problem, as beyond his being a 1st Century Jew we can know NOTHING about the man himself, his beliefs, etc. particularly and specifically as EVERYTHING written about him was done so decades after his death by people who never knew him to begin with. That’s not remotely relevant to who Jesus really was, it only gives a glimpse of one less than accurate interpretation of him. I think the significance is that people will believe almost anything, regardless of its veracity, if it sounds in any way better than other prevalent beliefs. cormac 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Hammerclaw Posted June 21, 2022 #245 Share Posted June 21, 2022 Most people believe because they were taught to believe, as a family tradition, in the Faith of their ancestors. The world is just as full of people who were indoctrinated with religion but were never taught the art of believing and so believe not. It's no mean feat to suspend one's disbelief and for some it ever eludes them. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Due Posted June 21, 2022 Author #246 Share Posted June 21, 2022 1 minute ago, cormac mac airt said: Therein lies the problem, as beyond his being a 1st Century Jew we can know NOTHING about the man himself, his beliefs, etc. particularly and specifically as EVERYTHING written about him was done so decades after his death by people who never knew him to begin with. That’s not remotely relevant to who Jesus really was, it only gives a glimpse of one less than accurate interpretation of him. I think the significance is that people will believe almost anything, regardless of its veracity, if it sounds in any way better than other prevalent beliefs. cormac It's not a problem. It's what was recorded in the Bible. The Bible is referred to for many things. In the context of what I am trying to get to, the Bible records the teachings of Jesus. Whether they were written years after he departed. Even let's say for the sake of what you're arguing, they weren't the teachings of Jesus but somehow were recorded by somebody for some other reason. I mean we can go on and on and speculate about this but that doesn't change what the Bible records as his teachings and certain things about how he lived his life. His religious life specifically. That everything he did was in accordance with the Father's will. And if one would be interested to learn how to do the Father's, will he simply asked that you would follow him. So once again solely based on that, I would say there is an extreme significance to the fact that his life was exemplary in putting on display what God is like. That he is like a father. That he loves his children in the way that a good father does. He even said that he who has seen him has seen the Father. And perhaps even more significant than that is what he said about us. His children. That we are the Father's children. And not subjects of a king. So once again, taken all together, what do you think the significance of all this is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XenoFish Posted June 21, 2022 #247 Share Posted June 21, 2022 5 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said: Most people believe because they were taught to believe, as a family tradition, in the Faith of their ancestors. The world is just as full of people who were indoctrinated with religion but were never taught the art of believing and so believe not. It's no mean feat to suspend one's disbelief and for some it ever eludes them. There can be a positive trust in some unknown higher power, just as there can be a negative. A god of love or wrath. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quiXilver Posted June 21, 2022 #248 Share Posted June 21, 2022 The bible is a book, written wholly by humans. Compiled (and adapted multiple times) by the Catholic Church, then the Protestants, then by... then by... then by..... Edited, rewritten and translated and retranslated for centuries. Humans playing telephone with the bible through the ages, with other humans sitting at the operators position, adapting to their whim, for their benefit. At last count, over 30,000 distinct versions of 'christianity'. It's rather embarrassing you cling to this comic book series as a source of anything aside from commentary and exemplification of the effects of social indoctrination, conditioning and control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted June 21, 2022 #249 Share Posted June 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Will Due said: It's not a problem. It's what was recorded in the Bible. The Bible is referred to for many things. In the context of what I am trying to get to, the Bible records the teachings of Jesus. Whether they were written years after he departed. Even let's say for the sake of what you're arguing, they weren't the teachings of Jesus but somehow were recorded by somebody for some other reason. I mean we can go on and on and speculate about this but that doesn't change what the Bible records as his teachings and certain things about how he lived his life. His religious life specifically. That everything he did was in accordance with the Father's will. And if one would be interested to learn how to do the Father's, will he simply asked that you would follow him. So once again solely based on that, I would say there is an extreme significance to the fact that his life was exemplary in putting on display what God is like. That he is like a father. That he loves his children in the way that a good father does. He even said that he who has seen him has seen the Father. And perhaps even more significant than that is what he said about us. His children. That we are the Father's children. And not subjects of a king. So once again, taken all together, what do you think the significance of all this is? What I find significant is that you will accept anything and everything written about Jesus at face value without questioning the motives of those who did the writing AND THEN pretend that it bears any relationship to what the man himself did or didn’t think, believe, etc. That says far more about you than it does about Jesus, and not in a positive way. cormac 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cormac mac airt Posted June 21, 2022 #250 Share Posted June 21, 2022 7 minutes ago, XenoFish said: There can be a positive trust in some unknown higher power, just as there can be a negative. A god of love or wrath. Or one of polite indifference. cormac 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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