The comprehensibility of God

[Will Due]

2 minutes ago, quiXilver said:

The bible is a book, written wholly by humans.  Compiled (and adapted multiple times) by the Catholic Church, then the Protestants, then by... then by... then by.....  Edited, rewritten and translated and retranslated for centuries.  Humans playing telephone with the bible through the ages, with other humans sitting at the operators position, adapting to their whim, for their benefit.  At last count, over 30,000 distinct versions of 'christianity'. 

It's rather embarrassing you cling to this comic book series as a source of anything aside from commentary and exemplification of the effects of social indoctrination, conditioning and control.

 

 

 

All right, but as a point of reference given the fact that it speaks to being taught things that make God comprehensible. For example, in the way Jesus lived his religious life and the things that he taught, which were often, if not almost always something to do with a relationship between a parent and child or something along those lines.

Isn't there significance there about what was recorded in that regard? Or just because there were things that happened with the Bible. It's many translations. The many times it was altered that somehow it takes away from the heart of what is behind the teachings of Jesus and the example of how he lived his life for us to follow. At least if there is a compulsion or interest in knowing God for who and what he really is, doesn't that all mean something?

 

 

[Will Due]

5 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

What I find significant is that you will accept anything and everything written about Jesus at face value without questioning the motives of those who did the writing AND THEN pretend that it bears any relationship to what the man himself did or didn’t think, believe, etc. That says far more about you than it does about Jesus, and not in a positive way. 
 

cormac

 

Are the teachings of Jesus in the example of how he lived his life as its recorded in the Bible, positive or negative?

Forget the other stuff if you can. Just his teachings. Are they positive or negative?

 

 

Edited June 21, 2022 by Will Due

[cormac mac airt]

12 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Are the teachings of Jesus in the example of how he lived his life as its recorded in the Bible, positive or negative?

Forget the other stuff if you can. Just his teachings. Are they positive or negative?

 

 

It doesn’t matter, they are others interpretations and have no verifiable bearing on what Jesus’ life was actually like. One could write an account about your life while neither knowing you nor having been alive when you were and their account would be just as irrelevant to your actual life as the Bible is to Jesus’ life. It’s rather telling that regardless of the facts you insist on calling them “his” teachings, considering there’s no evidence they were ever his. 
 

cormac

Edited June 21, 2022 by cormac mac airt

[XenoFish]

The golden rule is pretty universal.

[Will Due]

9 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

It doesn’t matter, they are others interpretations and have no verifiable bearing on what Jesus’ life was actually like. One could write an account about your life while neither knowing you nor having been alive when you were and their account would be just as irrelevant to your actual life as the Bible is to Jesus’ life. It’s rather telling that regardless of the facts you insist on calling them “his” teachings, considering there’s no evidence they were ever his. 
 

cormac

 

Then standing alone without attribution to anyone, what do you think they tell about what and who God is?

You don't think they're meaningless do you?

 

 

Edited June 21, 2022 by Will Due

[cormac mac airt]

2 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

The golden rule is pretty universal.

Which one, “do unto others, then split” or “he/she who has the gold makes the rules?” 
 

cormac

[cormac mac airt]

3 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Then standing alone without attribution to anyone, what do you think they tell about what and who God is?

 

 

They show that people 2000 years ago were ALSO trying to explain the unknown/unknowable in such a way that many might agree. Nothing has changed much. 
 

cormac

[XenoFish]

[+Sherapy]

1 hour ago, Will Due said:

 

I've been trying to do just that. But at this point I've got to be honest. The vitriol that comes from some of the posters, is getting really old. But I'll keep trying. 

 

 

Will robust exploration of beliefs and our reasons for them is an exceptional way to see how they hold up under the  scrutiny of evidence or lack there of. Why do you take feedback personal and see it as vitriolic?

Edited June 21, 2022 by Sherapy

[+Sherapy]

18 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Then standing alone without attribution to anyone, what do you think they tell about what and who God is?

You don't think they're meaningless do you?

 

 

What is it about the mythical Jesus that resonates with you and why. What are your take aways? 
 

 

 

[Will Due]

Just now, Sherapy said:

What is it about the mythical Jesus that resonates with you and why. What are your take aways? 
 

 

 

 

Mythical?

Are you flame baiting me? 

 

 

[Will Due]

8 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

What is it about the mythical Jesus that resonates with you and why. What are your take aways? 
 

 

 

 

It resonates with me because it makes sense that God would be something like Jesus is portrayed and that he would do the things that Jesus did. It resonates with me. Intensely. And based on my personal experience, especially having children and being their dad that I see very clearly that what Jesus taught is true.

 

 

[Will Due]

 

And because of what I see in Jesus and what he taught, on top of a lot of other things, God has become highly comprehensible to me.

 

 

[oslove]

Science does not explain where existence come from, because science is robotic, and scientists ape to be robotic also.

[+Sherapy]

19 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

It resonates with me because it makes sense that God would be something like Jesus is portrayed and that he would do the things that Jesus did. It resonates with me. Intensely. And based on my personal experience, especially having children and being their dad that I see very clearly that what Jesus taught is true.

 

 

What did mythical Jesus teach that resonates with you. I use the mythical Jesus as the frame because we really do not know what Jesus said what Jesus was actually like, what he actually believed what he taught or what he thought and how he really lived or ascribed too. There is the historical Jesus and we have evidence that their was a man named Jesus, who was a Jewish preacher/teacher and was crucified maybe a few more details but that is it that is literally all we have evidence for. Any thoughts or teachings ascribed to him are hearsay and written approx. 30 years after the HJ lived. 
 

This is not personal towards you as not everything is about you in my world so do not take it’s such, I post the way it works best for me, which is being clear and credible as possible,  and you can always seek clarity on any of my posts that is a much more productive way to handle disagreement as opposed to only taking it personal and lashing out feeling a need to defend yourself. No one us attacking you. IMHO

Edited June 21, 2022 by Sherapy

[+Sherapy]

5 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

And because of what I see in Jesus and what he taught, on top of a lot of other things, God has become highly comprehensible to me.

 

 

What are these things that you see in the mythical Jesus and what is the source, the UB or the NT?

[cormac mac airt]

17 minutes ago, Will Due said:

It resonates with me because it makes sense that God would be something like Jesus is portrayed and that he would do the things that Jesus did. It resonates with me. Intensely. And based on my personal experience, especially having children and being their dad that I see very clearly that what Jesus taught is true.

Sounds to me like everything written in the Bible about Jesus HAS to be true, otherwise on some level you’d feel emasculated. If true that is so sad. 
 

cormac

[Will Due]

Just now, cormac mac airt said:

Sounds to me like everything written in the Bible about Jesus HAS to be true, otherwise on some level you’d feel emasculated. If true that is so sad. 
 

cormac

 

I know this is a problem. That I don't agree that everything written in the Bible about Jesus is true. As well as other things. I think a lot of Christians that participate in these discussions are not very keen to discuss things with me because I don't feel that Jesus dying on the cross was some kind of a ransom paid to a vengeful God for the sins of all mankind. He was basically murdered because he exposed a hypocrisy and corruption of the elite rulers of the people in those days. It's a common thing that occurs. You can see it happening today amongst our politicians.

The reason why I know that it's not true that he was some kind of a weird archaic gruesome sacrifice to appease an angry God, is because being a father myself, there is no circumstance where I would ever spank one child for the mistakes made by another. To do that would be complete lunacy. And utterly ridiculous.

How that became the cornerstone of Christianity however, is something I completely understand. It's because when researching the origins of Christianity, the source of Christianity, the evolution of Christianity, that besides it being based about the life and teachings of Jesus, it's actually much more the religion of Paul's personal experiences and the harmonizations between Greek philosophy and Hebrew theology provided by Philo, than it is the religion of Jesus.

Faith in God as your Father, and faith that you are the Father's child, plus faith in the fact that learning to do His will is possible, in my opinion, is what the religion of Jesus actually is. And not believing that you will go to heaven because you accepted the blood of Christ as a sacrifice for some imaginary sins of all mankind.

 

 

[+Sherapy]

5 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

Sounds to me like everything written in the Bible about Jesus HAS to be true, otherwise on some level you’d feel emasculated. If true that is so sad. 
 

cormac

 

12 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

Sounds to me like everything written in the Bible about Jesus HAS to be true, otherwise on some level you’d feel emasculated. If true that is so sad. 
 

cormac

Indeed, while it is Will’s topic it is a living breathing thread that includes others and with it many styles of communication. 

[oslove]

There is existence, no one with sane working faculty of reasoning can deny, unless he is out of his mind.

Examples of existence are all humans who have a brain by which they can come to the existence of God, as the permanent self-existent creator and operator of man and the universe and everything transient.

 

Dear everyone human i.e. with a brain where the faculty of reason dwells and operates, here is how to come to the reality of God existing:

1. Take notice that we all humans come from our papa and mama.

2. Our papa and mama in turn come from their papa and mama, and on and on and on . . .

3. We all live for a while and then die i.e. cease existing.

4. That fact brings to our mind that humans are transient beings, meaning, they are temporary entities.

5. Transient entities implicate the permanent self-existent creator and operator of man and the universe and everything transient.

Therefore, God exists - otherwise we have no explanation for all things transiently existing, like stone, chicken, and us humans.

[XenoFish]

Probably off topic, but I see so many threads discussing god. Yet I haven't seen any discussing righteous living.

[Will Due]

17 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

What are these things that you see in the mythical Jesus and what is the source, the UB or the NT?

 

What I see in Jesus is that he's anything but mythical. To me, he is the most real thing that exists in life, that makes God comprehensible. I'll say it again. It makes total sense that the creator would want to incarnate himself as the creature he's created and live their life in the way that they're required to live it so that his creatures can see a revelation of who God is in the life of he who was incarnated.

The fact that there is so much doubt about Jesus being real as I've just described is due to the circumstances that at the time that he lived making records was a very primitive thing. So that has to be taken into account. It isn't that hard to do. Archaeologist do it all the time. There's an aspect of seeing Jesus for who he is that's rather scientific and involves what you often like to bring to the attention of everyone, critical thinking.

 

 

[+Sherapy]

27 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

I know this is a problem. That I don't agree that everything written in the Bible about Jesus is true. As well as other things. I think a lot of Christians that participate in these discussions are not very keen to discuss things with me because I don't feel that Jesus dying on the cross was some kind of a ransom paid to a vengeful God for the sins of all mankind. He was basically murdered because he exposed a hypocrisy and corruption of the elite rulers of the people in those days. It's a common thing that occurs. You can see it happening today amongst our politicians.

The reason why I know that it's not true that he was some kind of a weird archaic gruesome sacrifice to appease an angry God, is because being a father myself, there is no circumstance where I would ever spank one child for the mistakes made by another. To do that would be complete lunacy. And utterly ridiculous.

How that became the cornerstone of Christianity however, is something I completely understand. It's because when researching the origins of Christianity, the source of Christianity, the evolution of Christianity, that besides it being based about the life and teachings of Jesus, it's actually much more the religion of Paul's personal experiences and the harmonizations between Greek philosophy and Hebrew theology provided by Philo, than it is the religion of Jesus.

Faith in God as your Father, and faith that you are the Father's child, plus faith in the fact that learning to do His will is possible, in my opinion, is what the religion of Jesus actually is. And not believing that you will go to heaven because you accepted the blood of Christ as a sacrifice for some imaginary sins of all mankind.

 

 

Hmmm, interesting interpretation. I enjoyed reading it. What was the religion of Jesus? It is good to see the effort you are putting into learning and form some quality sentences too. 

Edited June 21, 2022 by Sherapy

[cormac mac airt]

7 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

I know this is a problem. That I don't agree that everything written in the Bible about Jesus is true. As well as other things. I think a lot of Christians that participate in these discussions are not very keen to discuss things with me because I don't feel that Jesus dying on the cross was some kind of a ransom paid to a vengeful God for the sins of all mankind. He was basically murdered because he exposed a hypocrisy and corruption of the elite rulers of the people in those days. It's a common thing that occurs. You can see it happening today amongst our politicians.

The reason why I know that it's not true that he was some kind of a weird archaic gruesome sacrifice to appease an angry God, is because being a father myself, there is no circumstance where I would ever spank one child for the mistakes made by another. To do that would be complete lunacy. And utterly ridiculous.

How that became the cornerstone of Christianity however, is something I completely understand. It's because when researching the origins of Christianity, the source of Christianity, the evolution of Christianity, that besides it being based about the life and teachings of Jesus, it's actually much more the religion of Paul's personal experiences and the harmonizations between Greek philosophy and Hebrew theology provided by Philo, than it is the religion of Jesus.

Faith in God as your Father, and faith that you are the Father's child, plus faith in the fact that learning to do His will is possible, in my opinion, is what the religion of Jesus actually is. And not believing that you will go to heaven because you accepted the blood of Christ as a sacrifice for some imaginary sins of all mankind.

 

 

The problem with that, as I see it, is that Jesus (the man) was never trying to create his own religion but at best was trying to reform the one he was born into, Judaism. I firmly believe if he could see what has been written and done in his name he’d be ashamed of his followers since they’ve effectively used him as a scapegoat for the writings and beliefs of others. Thinking that he even has a dog in that race is essentially crapping on his memory IMO. 
 

Is that REALLY what you want to be a part of? 
 

cormac

[Will Due]

Just now, Sherapy said:

Hmmm, interesting interpretation. I enjoyed reading it. What was the religion of Jesus? It is good to see the effort you are putting into learning and from some quality sentences too. 

 

Well thanks Sheri. To be honest, I kind of abandoned typing things with my fingers on my cell phone since I've discovered how easy it is to use the voice feature instead lol.

You asked what is the religion of Jesus. Well as far as I can tell, it is this:

Faith in God as your Father, faith that you are the Father's child, plus faith in the fact that learning to do His will is possible; is what the religion of Jesus actually is. The one main distinction about it is that the religion of Jesus isn't something to believe in, but rather, it's something to do. I think you know what that is.

Spoiler

It's the business of doing the Father's will.