Jan 6 public hearings Live

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

3 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

Well just watch in amazement as he gets 200 million votes.

Including twice and even three times the number of votes as per living in certain states lmao.

That’s how amazing he is, even Saint Pat (Patron Saint of Postmen) is enabling postal voting from The Hereafter to laud and support the Great Man. 

[Gromdor]

1 hour ago, Cookie Monster said:

Biden`s approval ratings are now down to 29%.

Can any Americans confirm thats the lowest of any president ever?

Truman had a 22% rating once.

Edit to add:One Bush had 29 the other 25.  Nixon had 24. Carter had 28.

United States presidential approval rating - Wikipedia

Edited July 10, 2022 by Gromdor

[spartan max2]

2 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

Well just watch in amazement as he gets 200 million votes.

Including twice and even three times the number of votes as per living in certain states lmao.

Your conspiracy theories aside.

It shows how bad of a candidate Trump was, that Biden with such a low approval rating got millions more votes than Trump.

Edited July 10, 2022 by spartan max2

[Electric Scooter]

Just now, spartan max2 said:

It shows how bad of a candidate Trump was 

Hang on, the vote hasn`t happened yet lol

[psyche101]

On 7/9/2022 at 7:44 PM, DieChecker said:

That's like asking why is a 10 closer to 7 then 4? Why is a communist closer to a democrat then a republican? 

Yes I suppose.

The number ten is comprised of ten single digits. The number seven has seven and four has four.

Seven is closer to ten because it has more digits than four. Logical.

The larger majority of thug life people find the values imparted by the right closer to their views. 

People more interested in human rights and community find left wing view closer to their values. 

Communism is a theory or system of social organization in which all property is owned by the community and each person contributes and receives according to their ability and needs.

That's why. Theoretically communism is giving the people power over large corporations. A more peaceful view than guns and gods laws. Right wing views are much more intolerant and favours capitalism. 

On 7/9/2022 at 7:44 PM, DieChecker said:

Many ideologies are great for society, IN Moderation. Anything taken to an extreme can be wrong for society.

Which is why at the extreme ends of both parties is where we find the worst examples. 

That's not what I'm referring to. Coming in from the ends of extremes, it's about motivation. It's why the proud boys, the KKK and nazis go, hrm, out of what is available to me I find the Republican core values represent me better than any other.

That is the point where personally, I would second guess those values.

That is what I'm talking about. How good are values that appeal to those ideologies? Why are these values closer for the majority of bad people? 

From large national organisations like the KKK down to the Westboro Baptist church. It's what is drawing them to the right.

On 7/9/2022 at 7:44 PM, DieChecker said:

You're trying to use a fallacious parallel, that since Nazism is wrong, and racism is wrong, then if Nazis and Racists vote Republican usually, then ipso facto, all Republicans are Nazi Racists.

No, that's on you entirely. 

A republican can hate a Nazi just like drivers in a race might hate each other. A shared respect for a specific instance doesn't mean collusion. But it does raise the question of why those values are a common ground.

On 7/9/2022 at 7:44 PM, DieChecker said:

If a Nazi is closer to a Republican then a Democrat, that doesn't make the Republicans wrong, just as Antifa rioters are closer to Democrats then Republicans, doesn't necessarily reflect directly on Democrats. 

Well yes it does. 

I've laid out the reasoning. You are an intelligent man. 

The majority of Antifa protests are peaceful. There's an extreme end. Most right wing protests degenerate into violence. Capitol Hill will be the cross right wing values will bear for some time. 

Antifa people aren't drawn in by violent ideologies like gun culture or immigration deterrence. They are drawn in because of them. If you removed the controversial aspects of Republican ideology, would they continue to exist? I can't see they would. Antifa is a symptom of Right wing values. It's symbiotic. 

Jan 6 just for a start. Peaceful ideology? Not in any form or rational view. I mentioned the trucks already. We didn't see that from the Dems during campaigns.

On 7/9/2022 at 7:44 PM, DieChecker said:

I think another term to use is "False Equivalency ".

 I don't think so. It might be more that the question is too close to home? 

[psyche101]

On 7/9/2022 at 8:25 PM, Manwon Lender said:

I think if someone is using blanket terms to describe either group, they are foolish and completely lost! There are no absolutes, and only a narcissistic personality would group people in that manner cut and dry! 

The discussion is entirely about the motivation.

That's what DC keeps dancing around. Nobody is blanketing either groups, but if it's painted that way what I'm actually asking him isn't actually being answered. It's diversionary.

It's a big problem with American politics that I have noticed. No accountability. Just, well dems did this, Republicans did that. It's just an endless tit for tat.

I'm questioning why they are there. 

[Grim Reaper 6]

26 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

The discussion is entirely about the motivation.

That's what DC keeps dancing around. Nobody is blanketing either groups, but if it's painted that way what I'm actually asking him isn't actually being answered. It's diversionary.

It's a big problem with American politics that I have noticed. No accountability. Just, well dems did this, Republicans did that. It's just an endless tit for tat.

I'm questioning why they are there. 

It's actually pretty obvious, Americans have become complacent and allowed their government to become out if control. Starting in 2016 during the President election that Trump won, it became obvious to me how truly bad things had become, both candidates were pieces of crap. Neither should have ever been nominated to run, Clinton was an enept, lying, and worthless politician who was directly responsible and allowed the US Embassy in Libya to be over run and the Ambassador to be murdered.

Trump, has been involved with White Supremacy and racial discrimination since the 1970s he totally lacked any ability to serve in such an office. I don't honestly why so many Americans did not see what our political system was coming too and I don't know how to fix it. But, The country I was born in, love and willing to give my life for has changed into something I no longer recognize and the infighting your speaking about also is personally embarrassing to me personally!

Before 2016, there were obvious problems on the horizon, but I  doubt many American realized what would occur and so quickly what would happen when Trump was elected. The man is a Russian Colaberator, he split the nation along racial and political lines, he intentionally attempt to destroy NATO, he supported the White Supremacy and extremist groups that has been ingrained in our country since the Civil War, and .I could go on. Yet I know you understand this. 

My friend I don't have much else I can say, I hope I have made myself clear if not repose your question and I will try again!

Edited July 11, 2022 by Manwon Lender

[psyche101]

1 minute ago, Manwon Lender said:

It's actually pretty obvious, Americans have become complacent and allowed their government to become out if control. Starting in 2016 during the President election that Trump won, it became obvious to me how truly bad things had become, both candidates were pieces of crap. Neither should have ever been nominated to run, Clinton was an enept, lying, and worthless politician who was directly responsible and allowed the US Embassy in Libya to be over run and the Ambassador to be murdered. Trump, has been involved with White Supremacy and racial discrimination since the 1970s he totally lacked any ability to serve in such an office. I don't honestly why so many Americans did not see what our political system was coming too and I don't know how to fix it. But, The country I was born in, love and willing to give my life for has changed into something I no longer recognize and the infighting your speaking about also is personally embarrassing to me personally!

My friend I don't have much else I can say, I hope I have made myself clear if not repose your question and I will try again!

Before 2016, there were obvious problems on the horizon, but I  doubt many American realized what would occur and so quickly what would happen when Trump was elected. The man is a Russian Colaberator, he split the nation along racial and political lines, he intentionally attempt to destroy NATO, he supported the White Supremacy and extremist groups that has been ingrained in our country since the Civil War, and .I could go on. Yet I know you understand this. 

Suffice to say, from what I have read of the discussions you have had with others, a RINO strikes me as more a patriot than a modern Republican. 

I just think if I was thinking some things I held dear were also held dear by the majority of thugs, I'd reconsider those values. 

[Grim Reaper 6]

6 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

Biden`s approval ratings are now down to 29%.

Can any Americans confirm thats the lowest of any president ever?

Man Cookie Monster I suppose I should not be surprised it only makes sense since you worship Putin you would also worship his puppet Donald Dump Trump, you never stop bowing to strong dictatorial leaders. Do you like that position because it comfortable or is the air better in that position!

[Grim Reaper 6]

5 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Suffice to say, from what I have read of the discussions you have had with others, a RINO strikes me as more a patriot than a modern Republican. 

I just think if I was thinking some things I held dear were also held dear by the majority of thugs, I'd reconsider those values. 

First I don't know what a Modern Republican is. I am a little dense today sorry, but I don't understand your second paragraph could you break it down for this dumb old soldier? 

[Will Due]

13 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

I just think if I was thinking some things I held dear were also held dear by the majority of thugs, I'd reconsider those values. 

 

And that's what makes you different than someone like Dick Cheney.

 

 

[psyche101]

21 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

First I don't know what a Modern Republican is.

Like the trumpian Republicans who follow blindly regardless of lies he tells. Those who are calling anyone not fundamentally supporting such ideals blindly RINOs. 

21 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

I am a little dense today sorry, but I don't understand your second paragraph could you break it down for this dumb old soldier? 

DC posted a Wikipedia link saying the values stated within are ones he supports and why he is Republican. The values listed including gun culture, anti abortion, immigration deterrence and old conservative Christian values. 

About a week or two ago DC and I were on this topic and we agreed that those values (guns anti abortion, immigration deterrence and conservatism) were valued by thing groups like the KKK, Nazis and proud boys because they are close enough to their own values. The left offered values that those groups find incompatible with their views. 

Those views, and what influences them is the topic of my inquiry. If the worst of the worst sees them as close to their values, that would prompt me to second guess those values and what they mean to me.

Basically if people like the KKK, proud boys, Nazis and Trump all think those values are sound and good, they probably aren't. I would like to think my views would be incompatible with such types. Not a common ground. That would be personally concerning to me. 

[psyche101]

27 minutes ago, Will Due said:

And that's what makes you different than someone like Dick Cheney.

Actually Will that's exactly where I'm going with this. Looking at others as examples. 

[psyche101]

44 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

Man Cookie Monster I suppose I should not be surprised it only makes sense since you worship Putin you would also worship his puppet Donald Dump Trump, you never stop bowing to strong dictatorial leaders. Do you like that position because it comfortable or is the air better in that position!

Lol what a silly cookie monster.

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

5 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Like the trumpian Republicans who follow blindly regardless of lies he tells. Those who are calling anyone not fundamentally supporting such ideals blindly RINOs. 

DC posted a Wikipedia link saying the values stated within are ones he supports and why he is Republican. The values listed including gun culture, anti abortion, immigration deterrence and old conservative Christian values. 

About a week or two ago DC and I were on this topic and we agreed that those values (guns anti abortion, immigration deterrence and conservatism) were valued by thing groups like the KKK, Nazis and proud boys because they are close enough to their own values. The left offered values that those groups find incompatible with their views. 

Those views, and what influences them is the topic of my inquiry. If the worst of the worst sees them as close to their values, that would prompt me to second guess those values and what they mean to me.

Basically if people like the KKK, proud boys, Nazis and Trump all think those values are sound and good, they probably aren't. I would like to think my views would be incompatible with such types. Not a common ground. That would be personally concerning to me. 

I support and completely agree with on all counts. On this forum it's is easy to identify the individuals your describing on all counts, just like you can if your American living in the United States. However, how do you change things without physical violence, not that violence for that purpose bothers me at all but how do Americans change what the political system has become? 

[psyche101]

7 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

I support and completely agree with on all counts. On this forum it's is easy to identify the individuals your describing on all counts, just like you can if your American living in the United States. However, how do you change things without physical violence, not that violence for that purpose bothers me at all but how do Americans change what the political system has become? 

Community is the answer. 

We the people know everyday life better than those born with a silver spoon ever will. Trump never new real life. It sounds like Biden's life started that way, but I expect it's been decades since he did an honest days work. 

It's the reason gun regulations worked here. Not some brilliant government plan, the people wanted change. John Howard initiated the program, it worked because of the people. 

I just hope after Trump that America can find community and work together instead of against each other........ those posters again.......

You're a good peaceful man. America needs more of that. Not trying to tread on each other, giving each other a leg up instead. Unify. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by psyche101

[Will Due]

2 minutes ago, Manwon Lender said:

how do Americans change what the political system has become? 

 

Look for a leader along the lines of an MLK and get to work sitting down in protest while tolerating being on the receiving end of all kinds of abuse?

 

 

[psyche101]

4 minutes ago, Will Due said:

Look for a leader along the lines of an MLK and get to work sitting down in protest while tolerating being on the receiving end of all kinds of abuse?

I seriously doubt you're going to find that person in a nursing home.

America needs to step up the overall quality of presidential candidates.

[Grim Reaper 6]

30 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Look for a leader along the lines of an MLK and get to work sitting down in protest while tolerating being on the receiving end of all kinds of abuse?

 

 

My friend I grew up during the time your speaking about, forced bussing and all the rest. At this point little can be done short of removing people civil rights and I could not support that under any circumstances!

[Grim Reaper 6]

34 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Community is the answer. 

We the people know everyday life better than those born with a silver spoon ever will. Trump never new real life. It sounds like Biden's life started that way, but I expect it's been decades since he did an honest days work. 

It's the reason gun regulations worked here. Not some brilliant government plan, the people wanted change. John Howard initiated the program, it worked because of the people. 

I just hope after Trump that America can find community and work together instead of against each other........ those posters again.......

You're a good peaceful man. America needs more of that. Not trying to tread on each other, giving each other a leg up instead. Unify. 

Did you notice that your being trolled? Unity would certainly be the right start, however, unfortunately I an not the peaceful man you think I am I have another side you have never seen or heard,honestly you give me too much credit. I honestly believe the only way to change what has happened is through a violent group of swift actions . Then I believe once the truth is exposed for all to see unity would be possible. Again all the nonsense of both parties must be exposed to the American public and the world, because the only way to destroy the lies is to truly and completely exposed them sadly only violence will be to do that!

Peace my friend!

[DieChecker]

1 hour ago, psyche101 said:

The larger majority of thug life people find the values imparted by the right closer to their views. 

Well, let's see...

Republican...

Quote

Its 21st-century ideology is American conservatism, with the party supporting free market economics, social conservatism, and originalism in constitutional jurisprudence.[17] The GOP supports small government, deregulation, lower taxes, gun rights, restrictions on immigration (including restrictions on illegal immigration), restrictions on abortion, restrictions on labor unions, and increased military spending. It has grown increasingly supportive of free trade since the 20th century.

I'm not a Neo-Nazi racist expert, but I suspect they agree on many of those topics rather then disagree. Probably specifically on immigration, and gun rights.

It's easier to draw neo-nazis from the right because it's easier to go from a anti immigration stand to a nationalist stand. And then to ultra-nationalist. 

Just as It's easier to go from a belief to provide protections with more regulations, to controlling everyone on everything (communism).

You're asking why the ultra nationalists have more in common with nationalists, rather the globalists, or communists.

Again, I'm wondering if you're trying to just be purposefully ignorant to try making a point, or if you just really are completely ignorant on political philosophies.

[Grim Reaper 6]

45 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

Well, let's see...

Republican...

I'm not a Neo-Nazi racist expert, but I suspect they agree on many of those topics rather then disagree. Probably specifically on immigration, and gun rights.

Well the fact that White Supremest’s, NeoNazis, and most Religious Extremists are certainly Right Wing and there are so many groups it difficult to name them all. While Gun rights, and Immigration are things they like your forgetting two other attributes they also support. Which is Religious Extremism and Racism. 

45 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

It's easier to draw neo-nazis from the right because it's easier to go from a anti immigration stand to a nationalist stand. And then to ultra-nationalist.

NeoNazis are not actually Nationalists, they prejudiced racists who support anyone who doesn’t support racial harmony and depending upon the group they also support Religious Extremism also!

45 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

Just as It's easier to go from a belief to provide protections with more regulations, to controlling everyone on everything (communism)

Yes that is axcommon theme for Conservative Republicans, but  please point out a Communist group of democratic political representatives or groups of democrats who are proven communists by name. Arecyou able to do it and prove the claim above?

45 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

You're asking why the ultra nationalists have more in common with nationalists, rather the globalists, or communists.

Again, I'm wondering if you're trying to just be purposefully ignorant to try making a point, or if you just really are completely ignorant on political philosophies.

 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Manwon Lender

[Grim Reaper 6]

2 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Suffice to say, from what I have read of the discussions you have had with others, a RINO strikes me as more a patriot than a modern Republican. 

I just think if I was thinking some things I held dear were also held dear by the majority of thugs, I'd reconsider those values. 

I suspect you both should read this, it clearly identifies who the American Communist Party actually supports. This is not directed at anyone but the term communist is frequently used on this forum and this will allow a discussion from a factual point of view that give us the knowledge to comment accurately. It’s really a great read that is very informative! 

Next steps for New York State CPUSA (report): https://www.cpusa.org/article/next-steps-for-new-york-state-cpusa-report/

On 7/9/2022 at 6:44 PM, DieChecker said:

That's like asking why is a 10 closer to 7 then 4? Why is a communist closer to a democrat then a republican? 

Many ideologies are great for society, IN Moderation. Anything taken to an extreme can be wrong for society.

You're trying to use a fallacious parallel, that since Nazism is wrong, and racism is wrong, then if Nazis and Racists vote Republican usually, then ipso facto, all Republicans are Nazi Racists.

If a Nazi is closer to a Republican then a Democrat, that doesn't make the Republicans wrong, just as Antifa rioters are closer to Democrats then Republicans, doesn't necessarily reflect directly on Democrats. 

I think another term to use is "False Equivalency ".

 

[psyche101]

1 hour ago, Manwon Lender said:

Did you notice that your being trolled? Unity would certainly be the right start, however, unfortunately I an not the peaceful man you think I am I have another side you have never seen or heard,honestly you give me too much credit. I honestly believe the only way to change what has happened is through a violent group of swift actions . Then I believe once the truth is exposed for all to see unity would be possible. Again all the nonsense of both parties must be exposed to the American public and the world, because the only way to destroy the lies is to truly and completely exposed them sadly only violence will be to do that!

Peace my friend!

I'd like to hope so, but when I see so many people supporting the stolen election claims I have to wonder what interests people have at heart. Heck, even groups like America Frontline Doctors. Politics over medicine. A disgrace to the country.

Politics needs to step down and listen to the people, not people supporting politics blindly. That's what needs to change. They aren't gods, they are men of low calibre. 

I understand from your posts that peace is your goal. If it's in your heart and your head, IMHO, then you're heading in the right direction. Personally I think you're a good decent fellow. 

[psyche101]

1 hour ago, DieChecker said:

Well, let's see...

Republican...

I'm not a Neo-Nazi racist expert, but I suspect they agree on many of those topics rather then disagree. Probably specifically on immigration, and gun rights.

They are big ones.

It's why they agree is what I'm talking about 

They agree because it suits their world view. Their world view is bad.

You're saying you use those things for good.

I thought that's what needs evaluating. Are they good values? If they appeal to them, just how good are they? 

Let's say I had bad Covid and in some wild brain fog I agreed with the papameter. First thing I would do is as soon as my brain is working is second guess and reevaluate that conclusion. I wouldn't trust my own conclusion if it meant agreeing with a crazy person. I'd know something is probably wrong. The red flag would go up.

It doesn't for supporters of stolen elections or outright nutters like MTG. If it's Republican, it can slide. 

1 hour ago, DieChecker said:

It's easier to draw neo-nazis from the right because it's easier to go from a anti immigration stand to a nationalist stand. And then to ultra-nationalist. 

Just as It's easier to go from a belief to provide protections with more regulations, to controlling everyone on everything (communism).

But what are the reasons for wanting a communist style of government? Is it because the last few government leaders have been a joke? Trump lowered the bar as far down as it will go. Why would people be happy with your government?

So the options people seem to go for is prepare for civil war (right wing) or remove government give power to the people (left)? 

In principle the latter seems the more sensible non violent approach, given no other options. I'm not at libertarian by any means. I think there place for a hierarchy but as I've often said, based on knowledge, not the most impressive year long campaign. That's manipulation IMHO. 

The nationalism is one of the principles I'm talking about. Is it a good thing? The worst people on the planet think so, as such, to me that's a giant red flag. 

1 hour ago, DieChecker said:

You're asking why the ultra nationalists have more in common with nationalists, rather the globalists, or communists.

No, I'm saying those people should make one wonder if nationalist ideology is actually a good thing. Instead of going, yes it's awesome, but Nazis like it, so what they suck. You should be thinking, why do Nazis like this, why do I support the same thing they are? Am I doing the right thing? 

They should be a reason to second guess, just dismissing them is to one's own detriment. 

You don't seem to be understanding that I'm pointing out how all the bad groups love Republican ideology. Nazis, KKK, Proud Boys, Americas Frontline Doctors, why are all the worst public groups right wing orientated ? The worst individuals, Trump obviously at the top of the list, but go to any western country, there, here, the UK, all have groups and right wing loud mouths who aren't fit to step into society making headlines. It's simply just not as prevalent or consistent on the left. 

Isn't that a giant red flag in itself? 

1 hour ago, DieChecker said:

Again, I'm wondering if you're trying to just be purposefully ignorant to try making a point, or if you just really are completely ignorant on political philosophies.

I'm still not sure you're picking up what I'm putting down. You keep talking about people and saying it's not the fault of the right that the worst groups tend to gravitate right, but I'm saying if you all believe in the same things, how far apart are you really? Do you even recognise that you both had those values in common before? Are you comfortable knowing that, and certain that you are on the correct path? Do you not think those red flags are important?