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Transgender swimmers banned from women's elite events


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1 hour ago, psyche101 said:

If female athletes support the notion, seems to me the rest of us should butt out and let the athletes make the call. 

True, I didn't know they supported this, I'm a bit puzzled as to why they would.

Edited by openozy
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2 hours ago, openozy said:

True, I didn't know they supported this, I'm a bit puzzled as to why they would.

i do not think it is true that the most female athletes are OK with having to compete against males.  That article said the majority do not believe males have an advantage.   We no, for a fact, that they are wrong.   So they are either lying or only polled dumb females.  This is the left sticking up for something just to pretend that they are righteous while showing that they are against female rights.

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3 hours ago, Myles said:

i do not think it is true that the most female athletes are OK with having to compete against males.  That article said the majority do not believe males have an advantage.   We no, for a fact, that they are wrong.   So they are either lying or only polled dumb females.  This is the left sticking up for something just to pretend that they are righteous while showing that they are against female rights.

You're trying to say The Sydney Morning Herald is left wing?

Transwomen have been competingbin women's sport 50 years.  And you don't have a single example of a trans woman dominating in a way a normal healthy male would be expected.

Can you educate is all with the facts you know about testosterone inhibitors?

Edited by Golden Duck
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Just how much of an advantage did Lia Thomas possesses over biological females? The numbers paint a clear picture. The fact that the University of Pennsylvania swimmer soared from a mid-500s ranking (554th in the 200 freestyle; all divisions) in men’s competition to one of the top-ranked swimmers in women’s competition tells the story of the unfairness which unfolded at the NCAA level.

In her final meet, Thomas finaled in three events at the NCAA Championships, highlighted by a victory in the 500 freestyle. She also finished fifth in the 200 freestyle and was eighth in the 100 freestyle. Although she didn’t contest the event at the NCAA Champs, Thomas had one of the country’s top times in the 1650 freestyle. Here’s a look at her performances throughout the season, including their comparative status to her times as a member of Penn’s men’s squad.

  • In the 500 freestyle, Thomas’ time of 4:33.24 from her NCAA-title swim handed her the fastest time in the nation by more than a second over Arizona State’s Emma Nordin (4:34.87). Additionally, Thomas’ difference from her personal best with the Penn men’s program was just 6%, as opposed to the typical 10% to 11% difference generally seen between men and women.
  • Thomas’ best time in the 200 freestyle ended up being her 1:41.93 mark from the Zippy Invitational in December. That effort ultimately ended up 3.76% slower than her best time before her transition. Again, that time was between 7% and 8% faster than the typical separation between men and women.
  • When Thomas won the 200 freestyle at the Ivy League Champs in 1:43.12, she was even with runnerup Samantha Shelton at the midway point, but crushed the Harvard swimmer over the last 100, highlighted by a 25.04 split for the last 50 yards. The closing split of Thomas was faster than the finishing laps of Missy Franklin in her American-record performance, and the best closing effort of the likes of Katie Ledecky, Mallory Comerford and Siobhan Haughey, among others.
  • In the 100 freestyle, Thomas’ best time prior to her transition was 47.15. At the NCAA Championships, she posted a prelims time in the event of 47.37. That time reflects minimal mitigation of her male-puberty advantage.
  • During the last season Thomas competed as a member of the Penn men’s team, which was 2018-19, she ranked 554th in the 200 freestyle, 65th in the 500 freestyle and 32nd in the 1650 freestyle. As her career at Penn wrapped, she moved to fifth, first and eighth in those respective events on the women’s deck.
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7 hours ago, Myles said:

Just how much of an advantage did Lia Thomas possesses over biological females? The numbers paint a clear picture. The fact that the University of Pennsylvania swimmer soared from a mid-500s ranking (554th in the 200 freestyle; all divisions) in men’s competition to one of the top-ranked swimmers in women’s competition tells the story of the unfairness which unfolded at the NCAA level.

In her final meet, Thomas finaled in three events at the NCAA Championships, highlighted by a victory in the 500 freestyle. She also finished fifth in the 200 freestyle and was eighth in the 100 freestyle. Although she didn’t contest the event at the NCAA Champs, Thomas had one of the country’s top times in the 1650 freestyle. Here’s a look at her performances throughout the season, including their comparative status to her times as a member of Penn’s men’s squad.

  • In the 500 freestyle, Thomas’ time of 4:33.24 from her NCAA-title swim handed her the fastest time in the nation by more than a second over Arizona State’s Emma Nordin (4:34.87). Additionally, Thomas’ difference from her personal best with the Penn men’s program was just 6%, as opposed to the typical 10% to 11% difference generally seen between men and women.
  • Thomas’ best time in the 200 freestyle ended up being her 1:41.93 mark from the Zippy Invitational in December. That effort ultimately ended up 3.76% slower than her best time before her transition. Again, that time was between 7% and 8% faster than the typical separation between men and women.
  • When Thomas won the 200 freestyle at the Ivy League Champs in 1:43.12, she was even with runnerup Samantha Shelton at the midway point, but crushed the Harvard swimmer over the last 100, highlighted by a 25.04 split for the last 50 yards. The closing split of Thomas was faster than the finishing laps of Missy Franklin in her American-record performance, and the best closing effort of the likes of Katie Ledecky, Mallory Comerford and Siobhan Haughey, among others.
  • In the 100 freestyle, Thomas’ best time prior to her transition was 47.15. At the NCAA Championships, she posted a prelims time in the event of 47.37. That time reflects minimal mitigation of her male-puberty advantage.
  • During the last season Thomas competed as a member of the Penn men’s team, which was 2018-19, she ranked 554th in the 200 freestyle, 65th in the 500 freestyle and 32nd in the 1650 freestyle. As her career at Penn wrapped, she moved to fifth, first and eighth in those respective events on the women’s deck.

Thomas won the 500 as a as a fifth year senior trans female in an event Thomas was ranked sixth as a freshman.  Your information even shows decreased performance over a career affected by testosterone inhibitors.

An NCAA career a has a limit of four competive seasons in a five year period.  The improvement over an NCAA career is well documented.  You've presented nothing that shows the increase in performance is unusual; nor, did answer anything on on the effects of testosterone inhibitors.  And, to top it off Thomas didn't even make the US team for the 2022 World Aquatics Championships.

As someone who holds themselves out to be such a noble supporter of womens sport, you would already know this.  How come you prefer to talk about Lia Thomas' NCAA success rather than Katie Ledecke's International success?  Why don't you wish to celebrate the amazing improvement in the Women's 400m hurdles by US Athlete Sydney McLaughlin.

Your little exercise in confirmation is says so much. Why are you so negative?  Why are you so bigoted?

As I said earlier in 50 years of transwomen competing in women's sport we don't have an example of domination to match the expectation of a normal healthy male.

Off-topic.

Male NCAA athlete Matthew Boling, in his third NCAA season had achieved a feat only ever performed by Carl Lewis.  In the 2022 season Boling ran a sub-10s 100m, a sub-20s 200m and jump over 8m in the long jump.

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16 hours ago, openozy said:

True, I didn't know they supported this, I'm a bit puzzled as to why they would.

Cause it’s better then being accused of being a bigot, 

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There is apparently a Tans-woman dominating in women’s disc golf now. 
 

BIOLOGICAL MALE IS STARTING TO DOMINATE WOMEN’S DISC GOLF, BUT COMPETITORS MOSTLY STAY QUIET

https://www.outkick.com/biological-male-starting-to-dominate-womens-disc-golf/

As a biologically male player continues a meteoric rise on the female circuit, women are starting to speak out.

https://quillette.com/2022/09/28/is-this-the-lia-thomas-of-disc-golf/
 

I’m mostly offended by Frisbee self-identifying as a sport. 

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14 hours ago, el midgetron said:

There is apparently a Tans-woman dominating in women’s disc golf now. 
 

BIOLOGICAL MALE IS STARTING TO DOMINATE WOMEN’S DISC GOLF, BUT COMPETITORS MOSTLY STAY QUIET

https://www.outkick.com/biological-male-starting-to-dominate-womens-disc-golf/

As a biologically male player continues a meteoric rise on the female circuit, women are starting to speak out.

https://quillette.com/2022/09/28/is-this-the-lia-thomas-of-disc-golf/
 

I’m mostly offended by Frisbee self-identifying as a sport. 

The left ignores the facts.

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3 hours ago, Myles said:

The left ignores the facts.

You constantly cherry pick to support your feelings.  Cherry picking is ignoring facts.

BTW, when, as the big supporter of women's sport that you are, are you going to let us know about the result of the 2022 FIBA Women's Basketball World Cup?  Did you miss while looking for negativity?

Edited by Golden Duck
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18 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

You constantly cherry pick to support your feelings.  Cherry picking is ignoring facts.

BTW, when, as the big supporter of women's sport that you are, are you going to let us know about the result of the 2022 FIBA Women's Basketball World Cup?  Did you miss while looking for negativity?

I am a supporter of women being able to compete in a fair sport against other biological females.  It is you who is against female sports.

 

The fact that the University of Pennsylvania swimmer soared from a mid-500s ranking (554th in the 200 freestyle; all divisions) in men’s competition to one of the top-ranked swimmers in women’s competition tells the story of the unfairness which unfolded at the NCAA level.

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6 hours ago, Myles said:

I am a supporter of women being able to compete in a fair sport against other biological females.  It is you who is against female sports.

 

The fact that the University of Pennsylvania swimmer soared from a mid-500s ranking (554th in the 200 freestyle; all divisions) in men’s competition to one of the top-ranked swimmers in women’s competition tells the story of the unfairness which unfolded at the NCAA level.

I see you are cherry picking again to support you feelings. Thomas was ranked sixth as a freshman in the 500.  You are hiding the normal progression over the course of a NCAA career.

Thomas didn't even make the US team for the World Aquatics Championships.

The complaint that women's sport doesn't receive fair coverage is obviously something you don't care about.  You show far more interest in researching the feat of a trans woman that one a race.  You love to wallow in negativity.

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14 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

I see you are cherry picking again to support you feelings. Thomas was ranked sixth as a freshman in the 500.  You are hiding the normal progression over the course of a NCAA career.

Thomas didn't even make the US team for the World Aquatics Championships.

The complaint that women's sport doesn't receive fair coverage is obviously something you don't care about.  You show far more interest in researching the feat of a trans woman that one a race.  You love to wallow in negativity.

More "whataboutism".   Fair coverage has nothing to do with this.  Fair competition is what I care about.  Biological males have a big advantage over biological females is most sports.   You not admitting that fact is concerning.  

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56 minutes ago, Myles said:

More "whataboutism".   Fair coverage has nothing to do with this.  Fair competition is what I care about.  Biological males have a big advantage over biological females is most sports.   You not admitting that fact is concerning.  

The advantage is due to testosterone.  You've been asked to explain the effects of testosterone inhibitors, but you prefer to behave like an intellectual coward and discuss a school competition.  You say a swimmer was dominant when they didn't even make the national side.

PS.  I don't think someone hacked your account.  Some idiot who doesn't know the meaning of "whataboutism" to how to use it in a sentence is pretending to be you.

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46 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

The advantage is due to testosterone.  You've been asked to explain the effects of testosterone inhibitors, but you prefer to behave like an intellectual coward and discuss a school competition.  You say a swimmer was dominant when they didn't even make the national side.

PS.  I don't think someone hacked your account.  Some idiot who doesn't know the meaning of "whataboutism" to how to use it in a sentence is pretending to be you.

Testosterone inhibitors brings them closer together but does not even the playing field, I think you know that.  You are using them as an excuse to punish biological females. 

Lia was dominant and won an NCAA National Championship against biological females.   Lia would not have had a chance against her own biological males.  

 

 

https://www.si.com/college/2022/03/17/lia-thomas-first-trans-athlete-national-championship-swimmer 

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My cousin Adriana with the winning caper toss at this years Highland games! :)     (she’s 6’9” and mean as hell..the subject of gender never seems to come up.)  image.jpeg.7fe2baf34588d7080a7433ff33257aa3.jpeg

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1 hour ago, lightly said:

My cousin Adriana with the winning caper toss at this years Highland games! :)     (she’s 6’9” and mean as hell..the subject of gender never seems to come up.)  image.jpeg.7fe2baf34588d7080a7433ff33257aa3.jpeg

Saturday, I went to see the Highland games that are put on in the small city I live in.  They had male and female divisions.  They were all very strong.   I had a good time and was impressed.  

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1 hour ago, Myles said:

Saturday, I went to see the Highland games that are put on in the small city I live in.  They had male and female divisions.  They were all very strong.   I had a good time and was impressed.  
 

Yup, I have difficulty telling them apart. They’re all Big and wear skirts and, most have beards.

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On 9/30/2022 at 6:38 PM, openozy said:

True, I didn't know they supported this, I'm a bit puzzled as to why they would.

That's not a straight observers call IMHO. 

If females are ok with it, then those that rabbitting on aren't actually giving one damn about what's fair in sport, it's like I say a political football. People get to act like bigots and think it's justified. That's the real point of the argument.

Read Ducks posts on Lia Thomas to see what an uninformed bunch of bigots these haters are. He has laid it all out in detail but the idiots still post her as an example, yet when considering the facts, clearly she is not an example of an unfair advantage. 

Some incredibly deliberately uniformed idiots in this thread. Transgender sports issues are largely bigotry wrapped up in protests.

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So we find out, after all, that America's best women have penises :)

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1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

So we find out, after all, that America's best women have penises :)

Sticking in them or out of them? 

~

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It is almost humorous to see the left wing bigots try everything to defend having biological males compete against biological females.   They claim hormone therapy decreases their dominance but fail to say that it makes thing equal.  Fair sport is what is important.   The bigots support cheating.   

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8 hours ago, Myles said:

It is almost humorous to see the left wing bigots try everything to defend having biological males compete against biological females.   They claim hormone therapy decreases their dominance but fail to say that it makes thing equal.  Fair sport is what is important.   The bigots support cheating.   

In fifty years you find one example of a trans athlete that won a race, but never set a record and didn't make the internationals squad.  You cherry pick results to support your bias and bigotry.

One in a row is meaningless.  The fact that NCAA altered their rules about allowed testosterone levels shows that correct usage of testosterone inhibitors works.

When testosterone is reduce to typical female levels physical strength is reduced.  And can reduce ratio of muscle to skeletal mass can actually be a disadvantage.  This is obvious.

You yourself declared you don't support the real goals of the administrators of womens sport and that is greater coverage, greater marketing opportunities leading to greater pay.  It is the market that is the greatest obstacle to women athletes chossing a sporting career.

You ignore the acheivements of female athletes from your own country.  The perfomance of Sydney McLaughlin over the last couple of seasons is incredible on a historical level.

You have demonstrated zero interest in female competition.  You just follow the media to rant like a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic towards a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.

Its humourous that you have to resort to labels and actually try to mimic my language.  You've shown why you are a victim of confirmation bias. You don't possess an actual original thought.

Edited by Golden Duck
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