Free speech ‘stifled’ as universities cancel record number of speakers

[+and-then]

1 hour ago, Eldorado said:

“Universities and colleges must be places that champion debate and diversity of thought and this government has warned of the chilling effect of censorship on our campuses.

I wonder how she'd react to the "inclusive" crowd in America's most liberal unis.  ANY deviation from the accepted narrative can lead to violent beatdowns.  This crowd think of themselves as enlightened and entitled to dictate how others must think.  In truth, they're just spiteful, undisciplined, ignorant children.  The world has a way of beating that out of us all.  

[Knob Oddy]

1 hour ago, The Silver Shroud said:

So do you support Toby Young? And why, if you do?

I don't support or know anything about Tobys personal life.

I support his position on freedom of speech

[Knob Oddy]

1 hour ago, spartan max2 said:

As long as the speaking engagements are voluntary events than I don't think we should be banning speakers.

Except for very extreme circumstances. Like someone preaching violent revolution against the government, violence, or probably some other stuff. I think the guidelines for restricting speakers needs to be very specific and clear. 

Being simply contraversal should be enough to be banned 

While I tend to agree, I am concerned that the next George Washington will be locked up instead of leading a revolution for freedom.

 

Calls for a revolution should always be non-violent, until met with violence from authorities. For example: At the start of the revolutionary War, armed American citizens (77 individuals) stood on Lexington Green and confronted the governments army. 

If it wasn't possible to discuss overthrowing a tyrant (or any government) you'd still be living under tyrannical rule

[Eldorado]

11 minutes ago, and then said:

I wonder how she'd react to the "inclusive" crowd in America's most liberal unis.  ANY deviation from the accepted narrative can lead to violent beatdowns.  This crowd think of themselves as enlightened and entitled to dictate how others must think.  In truth, they're just spiteful, undisciplined, ignorant children.  The world has a way of beating that out of us all.  

For a lot of the woke crowd in Britain, this sort of speech is ok......

"I love to see a rich white man brought down by Asians."

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/nish-kumar-divides-fans-with-tweet-about-loving-seeing-white-man-brought-down-by-asians/ar-AAZgoHk

[Knob Oddy]

4 minutes ago, Eldorado said:

For a lot of the woke crowd in Britain, this sort of speech is ok......

"I love to see a rich white man brought down by Asians."

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/nish-kumar-divides-fans-with-tweet-about-loving-seeing-white-man-brought-down-by-asians/ar-AAZgoHk

They don't even hide their racism and claim the other side is racist

[psyche101]

It depends who was cancelled. 

Universities have a duty of care, they are education institutions and we expect the highest standards of them. 

TED has banned Rupert Sheldrake and Graham Hancock from speaking as they lie a hell of a lot. A very positive move.

Could be simply quality control. Covid seems to have created a whole new generation of whackjobs and nobody needs to hear from them.

If they are dismissing and cancelling people of Sheldrake and Hancock's calibre, more power to them I say. 

We shouldn't have to bend over backwards for morons and aholes like that. It is Joe Rogan's job to give platforms to liars and losers. Tell them to go there. He will lap up any BS 

[itsnotoutthere]

7 hours ago, Eldorado said:

For a lot of the woke crowd in Britain, this sort of speech is ok......

"I love to see a rich white man brought down by Asians."

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/nish-kumar-divides-fans-with-tweet-about-loving-seeing-white-man-brought-down-by-asians/ar-AAZgoHk

Yes, the woke crowd are full of contradictions (hypocrisy). Inclusive & diverse...unless we don't like you.

Edited July 15, 2022 by itsnotoutthere

[Silver]

9 hours ago, Knob Oddy said:

I don't support or know anything about Tobys personal life.

I support his position on freedom of speech

I'm not talking about his personal life, I'm talking about his stated political views. Don't you think it would be better to be informed? Anyway, what is his position on free speech?

Edit: Actually, I have given some info below.

 

Edited July 15, 2022 by The Silver Shroud

[Silver]

1 hour ago, itsnotoutthere said:

Yes, the woke crowd are full of contradictions (hypocrisy). Inclusive & diverse...unless we don't like you.

I agree with you on wokeness. I have said before I am anti-"woke". Like most people, I'm not even sure what it means- it seems it is sometimes a cover for political agitation.

[Silver]

9 hours ago, Knob Oddy said:

I don't support or know anything about Tobys personal life.

I support his position on freedom of speech

When a group of student activists were recruited to create a freedom of expression campaign, they were optimistic that their wide-ranging views could be part of its mission “to get all young people enthusiastic about free speech”.

The reality of the Free Speech Youth Advisory Board, they say, was rather different.

Instead of finding a forum for their hopes of opposing repressive regimes and helping minority voices to get heard, they claim that they were censured if they disagreed with the group’s right-of-centre orthodoxy. And they say they were dismayed to realise that the supposedly grassroots project appeared to be an “astroturfed” front for Toby Young’s controversial pressure group, the Free Speech Union (FSU).

Students quit free speech campaign over role of Toby Young-founded group | Toby Young | The Guardian

Edited July 15, 2022 by The Silver Shroud

[Saru]

11 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

This is typical lefty behaviour trying to make everything they dont personally agree with illegal, or cancelled.

Yet as we speak, we have a right-wing government that is implementing new laws to outlaw or stifle protests, as well as attempting to pass new laws to limit what people can say on social media, to remove the protections of anonymity online and to implement draconian punishments on those who don't tow the line.

Why is that acceptable, but when a university chooses not to host a talk on a contentious subject it is "typical lefty, woke etc. etc." ?

[itsnotoutthere]

3 hours ago, itsnotoutthere said:

Yes, the woke crowd are full of contradictions (hypocrisy). Inclusive & diverse...unless we don't like you.

Case in point :-

[Duke Wellington]

5 hours ago, Saru said:

Yet as we speak, we have a right-wing government that is implementing new laws to outlaw or stifle protests, as well as attempting to pass new laws to limit what people can say on social media, to remove the protections of anonymity online and to implement draconian punishments on those who don't tow the line.

Why is that acceptable, but when a university chooses not to host a talk on a contentious subject it is "typical lefty, woke etc. etc." ?

I`m only aware of legislation to remove protestors from roads, pavements, and fences, when they cause a nuisance.

If I remember correctly that included blocking other people going about their thing by handcuffing and bolting themselves to things. A lot of people seem  able to go about a demonstration or protest normally. Those ones, the ones set to get large sentences, are forcing society to stop around them.

[itsnotoutthere]

On 7/15/2022 at 1:44 AM, Knob Oddy said:

I don't support or know anything about Tobys personal life.

I support his position on freedom of speech

There is nothing of importance to know. He just doesn't fall in line with the 'mob' and as such has  been targeted by them, much like JK Rowling. 

[itsnotoutthere]

On 7/15/2022 at 11:08 AM, The Silver Shroud said:

When a group of student activists were recruited to create a freedom of expression campaign, they were optimistic that their wide-ranging views could be part of its mission “to get all young people enthusiastic about free speech”.

The reality of the Free Speech Youth Advisory Board, they say, was rather different.

Instead of finding a forum for their hopes of opposing repressive regimes and helping minority voices to get heard, they claim that they were censured if they disagreed with the group’s right-of-centre orthodoxy. And they say they were dismayed to realise that the supposedly grassroots project appeared to be an “astroturfed” front for Toby Young’s controversial pressure group, the Free Speech Union (FSU).

Students quit free speech campaign over role of Toby Young-founded group | Toby Young | The Guardian

https://thecritic.co.uk/with-free-speech-practise-what-you-preach/

[bmk1245]

I'd say, ban Orwell's '1984' and 'Animal Farm'....

[Silver]

1 hour ago, bmk1245 said:

I'd say, ban Orwell's '1984' and 'Animal Farm'....

Why?

[bmk1245]

1 minute ago, The Silver Shroud said:

Why?

For giving some ideas for mocking. 

[Silver]

18 hours ago, bmk1245 said:

For giving some ideas for mocking. 

This reply frustrates me. A Trump speech is as important as something George Orwell said? TikTok is more relevant than Shakespeare in these modern times? Give them equal recognition, and treat them equally? This is why education is important.

[Setton]

On 7/15/2022 at 12:51 AM, zep73 said:

Are they sure it's not because of the lockdowns? Most education around the western world went on at home during that period.

The clearly know that. Just see this quote from the minister for higher education in post #3.

On 7/14/2022 at 11:43 PM, Eldorado said:

“While we know that the pandemic made it difficult for many organisations to arrange speaking events, this sharp rise in rejected speakers is very concerning.”

But the Tories will never miss an opportunity to whip their ignorant followers into a frenzy. See this thread for reference.

[Michelle]

On 7/14/2022 at 7:51 PM, zep73 said:

Are they sure it's not because of the lockdowns? Most education around the western world went on at home during that period.

In the US it was happening long before the lockdowns. If a conservative speaker was allowed on campus they had to have guards to get in and out. Some doors were even broken down, attaching anyone there to listen. One guy became quite famous for his padlocks in a sock severely injuring several people. When the uni basically stopped letting conservative people speak they said they didn't have enough security or police to guarantee their safety.

[zep73]

6 minutes ago, Michelle said:

In the US it was happening long before the lockdowns. If a conservative speaker was allowed on campus they had to have guards to get in and out. Some doors were even broken down, attaching anyone there to listen. One guy became quite famous for his padlocks in a sock severely injuring several people. When the uni basically stopped letting conservative people speak they said they didn't have enough security or police to guarantee their safety.

It's certainly not something I condone, but it's just big kids. For many kids it's second nature to become radicalised. Everything is black and white in immature brains. Most of them outgrow it.
I had radical views myself until my mid 20's, before I finally rejected them on my own.

[Michelle]

1 hour ago, zep73 said:

It's certainly not something I condone, but it's just big kids. For many kids it's second nature to become radicalised. Everything is black and white in immature brains. Most of them outgrow it.
I had radical views myself until my mid 20's, before I finally rejected them on my own.

Yeah, but did you physically attack or kill people for different views?

[zep73]

49 minutes ago, Michelle said:

Yeah, but did you physically attack or kill people for different views?

No, that's not who I am. Very very few people are like that. And those few who are, are found on both sides. It's not a Left or Right wing trait.

 

Edited July 22, 2022 by zep73

[Michelle]

2 hours ago, zep73 said:

No, that's not who I am. Very very few people are like that. And those few who are, are found on both sides. It's not a Left or Right wing trait.

 

This is not a boys will be boys situation. It's felony assault, destruction of property and in some cases attempted murder. And there were so many the police couldn't keep it under control. It wasn't just a few time after time.

Edited July 22, 2022 by Michelle