Biden stands with Muslims after 'horrific killings' in New Mexico, it appears they were targeted

[+Desertrat56]

10 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Calm down my brother, if you read MOST of posts in this thread you should be able to see that the majority of those who posted here are reasonable people who understand the reality of the situation. The way I see it these threads bring out a persons real personality, and I think its worth noting that now at least the closet door is open and those individuals have exposed themselves that's much better than not knowing how people actually feel. I understand your anger and the only reason I am asking you to calm down is so you don't say the wrong thing do to anger and get yourself in trouble because I don't want to see that!

Take care my friend, hope you and yours are healthy and safe!

 

I agree with what @Odas said, and at least two of the posters on this thread are not reasonable people.   And I am sure they think the same of me, but that doesn't matter.   You are new I guess so you think those people were in the closet but there is no closet here.   And Odas was not being emotional, he was being rational.  You are reacting emotionally by telling anyone to calm down.

[+Desertrat56]

2 hours ago, Autistocrates said:

Due to the pattern of which this murderer set, we could add together this circumstantial evidence, in order to get closer to the truth

Not your job.

2 hours ago, Autistocrates said:

As for the Jews, Israel is not one of the more friendly nations regarding immigration:

What you call "the Jews" live all over the world so why do you bring them up in the first place and why do you mention Israel in the same breath.  You try to sound like you know something but you don't.   What is your agenda?

[Grim Reaper 6]

6 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

It is horrible and in the past when we had crimes like this it was not locals that did it.   It was usually someone driving from California or to California for what ever reason OR it is witness protection people who don't belong, don't want to belong.   When it was a local person it was personal, not religious, or targeted.   I think people who have a narrow view and spend too much time in fear have started going bonkers and if it is happening in Albuquerque it most certainly is happening elsewhere.   It happened in Texas in 2001 but no one remembers that this has been going on for a few decades.

I think in this case it’s motivated by religious practices, it’s pretty obvious that someone doesn’t like Muslims. What’s really sad about this is that the majority of Muslims practice Islam are peaceful people who bother no one and according to statistics this group of  people out number Islamic Extremist by approximately 1.8 Million, with a 1.4 billion Muslims worldwide this leaves approximately 8.6 Hundred Million people who do not. 

Here is an interesting fact I wasn’t aware of, however I suppose it would make perfect sense that a person’s education level would certainly have an effect on how they view and prejudge others. I think most people don’t really under that prejudice or prejudgment are actually nothing more than an expression of fear. When you consider that prejudgement, prejudice, and racism are driven by fear  easy to understand why people like that strike out. We all know that when some harbors fear of anything most people will not honestly admit, because they feel shame for being afraid! So they hide it and speak out publicly against their fear, to show everyone their not afraid! That’s the problem in a nut shell, if someone is honest any can very be overcome but just the opposite will happen if fear is buried. Because over time that fear will grow, it may start as a simple prejudgement, but that will over time become prejudice and finally by holy that fear inside for years that person become a full blown racist

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 hour ago, Desertrat56 said:

I agree with what @Odas said, and at least two of the posters on this thread are not reasonable people.   And I am sure they think the same of me, but that doesn't matter.   You are new I guess so you think those people were in the closet but there is no closet here.   And Odas was not being emotional, he was being rational.  You are reacting emotionally by telling anyone to calm down.

You are mistake I me and Odas are friends, I maybe more aware of what he angry than you. Yes there certainly is closet and there various people who work very hard to keep their Prejudgements indirect in nature! However, anyone who prejudges others or is racist no matter how hard they try, they will slip up Subconsciously and clearly show their true colors, that what I mean by the closet door. My only for telling my friend Odas to calm down was to stop him from getting trouble, I work do the same thing too you . And I can only hope you would do the do same fir me!

[odas]

4 hours ago, Autistocrates said:

Due to the pattern of which this murderer set, we could add together this circumstantial evidence, in order to get closer to the truth

It doesen't really matter. The motive of pointing this out was to prove that there are also voluntary converts who have no advantages to gain from doing so, unlike the Pomaks in Bulgaria and the Muslims in Bosnia-Herzegovina gained, during their centuries of yoke under Ottoman occupation

 

West Africa, the Balkans, Indonesia, Malaysia, Turkey, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran and Bangladesh are obviously not located within the cradle of Islam, as one would imagine a stereotypical Muslim to be. Within the cradle itself, there you'll definitely find a racial hegenomy, within this belief. 

Whether the spread of Islam without the realms of this cradle was accepted with open arms or not is a matter to be debated, given the Ottoman Empire's consequential imposition of this belief onto what they labelled "Infadels". The consequences of not coverting were harsh and involved requiring to pay the Blood Tax and being levied higher taxation than Muslims were to bear.

Generally though, Islam is absolutely not a racist belief, despite individual prejudices of emmigrant Muslims towards their host citizenry.

As for the Jews, Israel is not one of the more friendly nations regarding immigration:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/may/20/israel-netanyahu-african-immigrants-jewish

Despite liberal Jews making up a notable percentage of the constituency there, conservatives are always the ones setting policies regarding racial hegenomy there

I cannot speak for the Bulgarians or the recent converts ( like noone ever converted before islam, right ? ), but I can most defenitly speak, as a bosnian about Bosnian muslims. So if you are interested why my ancestors have converted to Islam some 500 years ago let me know and we can start a new thread. Hint: has something to do with the catholic and orthodox opression of my good christian ancestors who were neither catholic or othodox (unelss by force). Let me know. 

[+Desertrat56]

13 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

I think in this case it’s motivated by religious practices, it’s pretty obvious that someone doesn’t like Muslims. What’s really sad about this is that the majority of Muslims practice Islam are peaceful people who bother no one and according to statistics this group of  people out number Islamic Extremist by approximately 1.8 Million, with a 1.4 billion Muslims worldwide this leaves approximately 8.6 Hundred Million people who do not. 

Here is an interesting fact I wasn’t aware of, however I suppose it would make perfect sense that a person’s education level would certainly have an effect on how they view and prejudge others. I think most people don’t really under that prejudice or prejudgment are actually nothing more than an expression of fear. When you consider that prejudgement, prejudice, and racism are driven by fear  easy to understand why people like that strike out. We all know that when some harbors fear of anything most people will not honestly admit, because they feel shame for being afraid! So they hide it and speak out publicly against their fear, to show everyone their not afraid! That’s the problem in a nut shell, if someone is honest any can very be overcome but just the opposite will happen if fear is buried. Because over time that fear will grow, it may start as a simple prejudgement, but that will over time become prejudice and finally by holy that fear inside for years that person become a full blown racist

 

We were programmed by all media in the 90's to fear muslims.   You may not remember or aren't old enough to remember, but I do.   This is not because there are extremists of any kind as much as it s because we got news on all networks that "extremist muslims" bombed the OK city federal building, oh but wait, that was some white, militant, "patriots" that did that.  And the FBI knew who Kazinski was for years, kept an eye on him while he bombed at least two places before some whistle blower advertised this, but the composite photo that they circulated was "middle eastern"; the first time the twin towers were bombed it was advertised that "middle eastern men" were seen fleeing the scene just before the bomb went off, but wait, it was more white natural born citizens that were prosecuted for that one.    Don't spout statistics that have nothing to do with the issues.

I am totally floored that this happened in Albuquerque and I suspect there has been some more media pressure to get people to fear muslims.  I don't pay attention to any of it any more because it is almost always lies, half truths and fear mongering.   Albuquerque is the biggest most benign melding pot in the country, or was until a bunch of people moved her from the midwest, either fleeing something or looking for work.   We  have another peson on this forum who lives in Albuquerque and we disagree about a lot of things but I suspect he is just as floored that this happened here since we both grew up in the area.   We did not have predjudice in the same way that the rest of the country did.  It was predjudice against long hair, short hair, types of music, types of clothing, too much money, not enough money, which reservation one was from, and never about skin color and rarely about ancestry or religion.

That is why I mentioned that other crimes like this have usually been perpetrated by people passing through the area, it does not seem personal but I suspect that if the police really investigate and they find a local did this it will be personal, not religious.

[+Desertrat56]

13 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

You are mistake I me and Odas are friends, I maybe more aware of what he angry than you. Yes there certainly is closet and there various people who work very hard to keep their Prejudgements indirect in nature! However, anyone who prejudges others or is racist no matter how hard they try, they will slip up Subconsciously and clearly show their true colors, that what I mean by the closet door. My only for telling my friend Odas to calm down was to stop him from getting trouble, I work do the same thing too you . And I can only hope you would do the do same fir me!

First, there is only ONE human race on this planet.  Second, how can anyone on this forum know anything about anyone's ancestral origins unless that information is shared?   You use the term racist inappropriately and that leads me to beileve you are the racist.  Isn't that how things work nowadays, the racists run around yelling that everyone else is a racist so that no one will villify them for their racism?   It is a very old trick that only reprobates use.   

Edited August 9, 2022 by Desertrat56

[odas]

15 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

Not your job.

What you call "the Jews" live all over the world so why do you bring them up in the first place and why do you mention Israel in the same breath.  You try to sound like you know something but you don't.   What is your agenda?

That is a very good post. I tried and tried and tried to reason with people, to explaine the difference between a jew and Israel, between a muslim and Saudi Arabia or Iran.....they just don't want to listen or understand.

 

[Grim Reaper 6]

2 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

First, there is only ONE human race on this planet.  Second, how can anyone on this forum know anything about anyone's ancestral origins unless that information is shared?   You use the term racist inappropriately and that leads me to beileve you are the racist.  Isn't that how things work nowadays, the racists run around yelling that everyone else is a racist so that no one will villify them for their racism?   It is a very old trick that only reprobates use.   

Its very easy to identify a racist, their comment will sooner or later betray them they cant help it at all. When I said I know more than you about his anger that because we have discussed this personally so that information as you put it above has been shared with me.

Did you notice that Odas like the very post you jus quoted?

I don't understand what your angry about, my comments were not directed at you so honestly I am confused. Because I used the term exactly as I meant to use it so, I certainly didn't misuse that term. I actually think your confused, because you don't know who I am. This Manwon Lender you know me, have I ever come across as racist, have I ever given you a hard time, I think you read to much into my comments

9 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

We were programmed by all media in the 90's to fear muslims.   You may not remember or aren't old enough to remember, but I do.   This is not because there are extremists of any kind as much as it s because we got news on all networks that "extremist muslims" bombed the OK city federal building, oh but wait, that was some white, militant, "patriots" that did that.  And the FBI knew who Kazinski was for years, kept an eye on him while he bombed at least two places before some whistle blower advertised this, but the composite photo that they circulated was "middle eastern"; the first time the twin towers were bombed it was advertised that "middle eastern men" were seen fleeing the scene just before the bomb went off, but wait, it was more white natural born citizens that were prosecuted for that one.    Don't spout statistics that have nothing to do with the issues.

I am totally floored that this happened in Albuquerque and I suspect there has been some more media pressure to get people to fear muslims.  I don't pay attention to any of it any more because it is almost always lies, half truths and fear mongering.   Albuquerque is the biggest most benign melding pot in the country, or was until a bunch of people moved her from the midwest, either fleeing something or looking for work.   We  have another peson on this forum who lives in Albuquerque and we disagree about a lot of things but I suspect he is just as floored that this happened here since we both grew up in the area.   We did not have predjudice in the same way that the rest of the country did.  It was predjudice against long hair, short hair, types of music, types of clothing, too much money, not enough money, which reservation one was from, and never about skin color and rarely about ancestry or religion.

That is why I mentioned that other crimes like this have usually been perpetrated by people passing through the area, it does not seem personal but I suspect that if the police really investigate and they find a local did this it will be personal, not religious.

Like I said about, my comments were not directed at you and I don't understand what is going on. But it appears that you have misunderstood my comments, because again this manwon you have known me for a number of years now and I have not changed, and I have always treated you with respect so again I think your mistaken.

Take care!

[+Desertrat56]

7 minutes ago, odas said:

That is a very good post. I tried and tried and tried to reason with people, to explaine the difference between a jew and Israel, between a muslim and Saudi Arabia or Iran.....they just don't want to listen or understand.

 

Yes, after the second time of repeating myself I usually walk away if the response is the same as before.  Some people don't want to be reasoned with.

 

[Myles]

On 8/8/2022 at 9:45 AM, odas said:

No, I am not upset, just pointing out what is incorrect.

Anyway, we all can speculate until we know the truth. The murderer could be anyone for whatever reason. Looks like the police has some kind of trace. I believe this will be solved soon.

I agree with you a think it is sad that posters in this thread have called others racist.   The race card is thrown around so often now I don't buy it anymore.

[+Desertrat56]

5 minutes ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Its very easy to identify a racist, their comment will sooner or later betray them they cant help it at all. When I said I know more than you about his anger that because we have discussed this personally so that information as you put it above has been shared with me.

Did you notice that Odas like the very post you jus quoted?

I don't understand what your angry about, my comments were not directed at you so honestly I am confused. Because I used the term exactly as I meant to use it so, I certainly didn't misuse that term. I actually think your confused, because you don't know who I am. This Manwon Lender you know me, have I ever come across as racist, have I ever given you a hard time, I think you read to much into my comments

Like I said about, my comments were not directed at you and I don't understand what is going on. But it appears that you have misunderstood my comments, because again this manwon you have known me for a number of years now and I have not changed, and I have always treated you with respect so again I think your mistaken.

Take care!

I am sorry, I didin't recognize your name and I was thrown by the comments about racists.  You don't usually do that.   I was not angry, just annoyed and had something to say about this incident that the thread is about.   

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 minute ago, Desertrat56 said:

I am sorry, I didin't recognize your name and I was thrown by the comments about racists.  You don't usually do that.   I was not angry, just annoyed and had something to say about this incident that the thread is about.   

No problem, I made those comments because a few members let their true feeling openly show in this thread. Its not the first time either there is a small group here on the forum who always fall into that pattern. But, I had some guy following me around the forum that was maybe in love even after I told him I did not roll that way it didn't work!! It was pretty weird his username was Mr. Sausage  no joke that's odd! So I changed my username to my radio call sign that I had as a government contractor and most people don't know me yet!

Oh and by the way, me Odas, and Helen of Annoy are all really good friends I have his back trust me!

So please take we are good as always!!

[+Desertrat56]

7 minutes ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

No problem, I made those comments because a few members let their true feeling openly show in this thread. Its not the first time either there is a small group here on the forum who always fall into that pattern. But, I had some guy following me around the forum that was maybe in love even after I told him I did not roll that way it didn't work!! It was pretty weird his username was Mr. Sausage  no joke that's odd! So I changed my username to my radio call sign that I had as a government contractor and most people don't know me yet!

Oh and by the way, me Odas, and Helen of Annoy are all really good friends I have his back trust me!

So please take we are good as always!!

Yes, we are good.   

[Grim Reaper 6]

Just now, Desertrat56 said:

Yes, we are good.   

Thank you very much!

[odas]

@Desertrat56, @Grim Reaper 6

You both confused each other and myself. Good you got it solved because I was just about to explode...ups, did I say it outloud?

[Setton]

15 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

according to statistics this group of  people out number Islamic Extremist by approximately 1.8 Million, with a 1.4 billion Muslims worldwide this leaves approximately 8.6 Hundred Million people who do not

Your maths is off there. It leaves 1.398  billion people who are not extremists. Or 99.9%

I think you also need to define 'extremist'. That's a lot higher than most estimates I've seen.

Edited August 9, 2022 by Setton

[acidhead]

 

[acidhead]

If anybody is interested.  Here's LIVE coverage ----> 

 

[acidhead]

Oh...  ... slight Plot twist

 

Edited August 9, 2022 by acidhead

[Golden Duck]

3 hours ago, acidhead said:

 

So it was a Volkswagen Jeddah?

[bmk1245]

17 hours ago, Setton said:

Your maths is off there. It leaves 1.398  billion people who are not extremists. Or 99.9%

I think you also need to define 'extremist'. That's a lot higher than most estimates I've seen.

Is death penalty for leaving islam extreme view, or not? If someone holds extreme view, can he/she be called 'extremist', or not?

Edited August 10, 2022 by bmk1245

[Buzz_Light_Year]

On 8/8/2022 at 6:44 AM, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Not surprised you would say that, I think most people think that whoever is doing this is a freaken nut!

But anyway your point of view is always on targe, and at least we know where you stand thank you!

Seems I was right after all. It really wasn't a conclusion based on anything but the information given in the original link. Muhammad Syed, 51 doesn't seem to be what one would call a white supremacist name. Wouldn't you agree?

But please do continue to post insults to those you disagree with. It's all you know.

[itsnotoutthere]

On 8/9/2022 at 8:31 AM, Grim Reaper 6 said:

I think in this case it’s motivated by religious practices, it’s pretty obvious that someone doesn’t like Muslims. What’s really sad about this is that the majority of Muslims practice Islam are peaceful people who bother no one and according to statistics this group of  people out number Islamic Extremist by approximately 1.8 Million, with a 1.4 billion Muslims worldwide this leaves approximately 8.6 Hundred Million people who do not. 

Here is an interesting fact I wasn’t aware of, however I suppose it would make perfect sense that a person’s education level would certainly have an effect on how they view and prejudge others. I think most people don’t really under that prejudice or prejudgment are actually nothing more than an expression of fear. When you consider that prejudgement, prejudice, and racism are driven by fear  easy to understand why people like that strike out. We all know that when some harbors fear of anything most people will not honestly admit, because they feel shame for being afraid! So they hide it and speak out publicly against their fear, to show everyone their not afraid! That’s the problem in a nut shell, if someone is honest any can very be overcome but just the opposite will happen if fear is buried. Because over time that fear will grow, it may start as a simple prejudgement, but that will over time become prejudice and finally by holy that fear inside for years that person become a full blown racist

 

Whatever you do, don't give up your day job. 

Edited August 10, 2022 by itsnotoutthere

[itsnotoutthere]

On 8/9/2022 at 8:31 AM, Grim Reaper 6 said:

I think in this case it’s motivated by religious practices, it’s pretty obvious that someone doesn’t like Muslims. What’s really sad about this is that the majority of Muslims practice Islam are peaceful people who bother no one and according to statistics this group of  people out number Islamic Extremist by approximately 1.8 Million, with a 1.4 billion Muslims worldwide this leaves approximately 8.6 Hundred Million people who do not. 

Here is an interesting fact I wasn’t aware of, however I suppose it would make perfect sense that a person’s education level would certainly have an effect on how they view and prejudge others. I think most people don’t really under that prejudice or prejudgment are actually nothing more than an expression of fear. When you consider that prejudgement, prejudice, and racism are driven by fear  easy to understand why people like that strike out. We all know that when some harbors fear of anything most people will not honestly admit, because they feel shame for being afraid! So they hide it and speak out publicly against their fear, to show everyone their not afraid! That’s the problem in a nut shell, if someone is honest any can very be overcome but just the opposite will happen if fear is buried. Because over time that fear will grow, it may start as a simple prejudgement, but that will over time become prejudice and finally by holy that fear inside for years that person become a full blown racist

 

Actually, thinking about it you are right. It seems it was motivated by religious practices.... Islamic ones. 

Edited August 10, 2022 by itsnotoutthere