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Erikl

Iran won't drop nuclear program

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Stellar
How many times do I have to keep saying this?...let me know when it sinks in.

For it to sink it, something has to be pushing it in... right now its just floating.

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Celumnaz

arg this is so old and it's still going... there was more than one reason and there was no lie about WMD unless you want to say the intelligence agencys around the world were lying.

I have this saved as a pdf on my computer, but I know people don't like pdf's and I don't know where to find it on the net now... I'm sure it's somewhere on a .gov site...

THE WHITE HOUSE

Office of the Press Secretary

For Immediate Release October 2, 2002

________________________________________________________________________

JOINT RESOLUTION TO AUTHORIZE THE USE OF UNITED STATES ARMED

FORCES AGAINST IRAQ

Whereas in 1990 in response to Iraq 's war of aggression against and illegal

occupation of Kuwait, the United States forged a coalition of nations to liberate Kuwait

and its people in order to defend the national security of the United States and

enforce United Nations Security Council resolutions relating to Iraq;

Whereas after the liberation of Kuwait in 1991, Iraq entered into a United

Nations sponsored cease-fire agreement pursuant to which Iraq unequivocally

agreed, among other things, to eliminate its nuclear, biological, and chemical

weapons programs and the means to deliver and develop them, and to end its

support for international terrorism;

Whereas the efforts of international weapons inspectors, United States

intelligence agencies, and Iraqi defectors led to the discovery that Iraq had large

stockpiles of chemical weapons and a large scale biological weapons program, and that

Iraq had an advanced nuclear weapons development program that was much closer to

producing a nuclear weapon than intelligence reporting had previously indicated;

Whereas Iraq, in direct and flagrant violation of the cease-fire, attempted to

thwart the efforts of weapons inspectors to identify and destroy Iraq's weapons

of mass destruction stockpiles and development capabilities, which finally

resulted in the withdrawal of inspectors from Iraq on October 31, 1998;

Whereas in 1998 Congress concluded that Iraq's continuing weapons of mass

destruction programs threatened vital United States interests and international

peace and security, declared Iraq to be in "material and unacceptable breach of its

international obligations" and urged the President "to take appropriate action, in

accordance with the Constitution and relevant laws of the United States, to bring Iraq into

compliance with its international obligations" (Public Law 105-235);

Whereas Iraq both poses a continuing threat to the national security of the

United States and international peace and security in the Persian Gulf region and remains

in material and unacceptable breach of its international obligations by, among other

things, continuing to possess and develop a significant chemical and biological weapons

capability, actively seeking a nuclear weapons capability, and supporting and harboring

terrorist organizations;

Whereas Iraq persists in violating resolutions of the United Nations Security

Council by continuing to engage in brutal repression of its civilian population thereby

Threatening international peace and security in the region, by refusing to release,

repatriate, or account for non-Iraqi citizens wrongfully detained by Iraq, including an

American serviceman, and by failing to return property wrongfully seized by Iraq from

Kuwait;

Whereas the current Iraqi regime has demonstrated its capability and willingness

to use weapons of mass destruction against other nations and its own people;

Whereas the current Iraqi regime has demonstrated its continuing hostility

toward, and willingness to attack, the United States, including by attempting in 1993 to

assassinate former President Bush and by firing on many thousands of occasions on

United States and Coalition Armed Forces engaged in enforcing the resolutions of the

United Nations Security Council;

Whereas members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks

on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on

September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

Whereas Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations,

including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of American citizens;

Whereas the attacks on the United States of September 11, 2001 underscored the

gravity of the threat posed by the acquisition of weapons of mass destruction by

international terrorist organizations;

Whereas Iraq's demonstrated capability and willingness to use weapons of mass

destruction, the risk that the current Iraqi regime will either employ those weapons to

launch a surprise attack against the United States or its Armed Forces or provide them to

international terrorists who would do so, and the extreme magnitude of harm that would

result to the United States and its citizens from such an attack, combine to justify action

by the United States to defend itself;

Whereas United Nations Security Council Resolution 678 authorizes the use of all

Necessary means to enforce United Nations Security Council Resolution 660 and

subsequent relevant resolutions and to compel Iraq to cease certain activities that threaten

international peace and security, including the development of weapons of mass

destruction and refusal or obstruction of United Nations weapons inspections in violation

of United Nations Security Council Resolution 687, repression of its civilian population

in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 688, and threatening its

neighbors or United Nations operations in Iraq in violation of United Nations Security

Council Resolution 949;

Whereas Congress in the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq

Resolution (Public Law 102-1) has authorized the President "to use United States Armed

Forces pursuant to United Nations Security Council Resolution 678 (1990) in order to

achieve implementation of Security Council Resolutions 660, 661, 662, 664, 665, 666,

667, 669, 670, 674, and 677";

Whereas in December 1991, Congress expressed its sense that it "supports the use

of all necessary means to achieve the goals of United Nations Security Council

Resolution 687 as being consistent with the Authorization of Use of Military Force

Against Iraq Resolution (Public Law 102-1)," that Iraq's repression of its civilian

population violates United Nations Security Council Resolution 688 and "constitutes a

continuing threat to the peace, security, and stability of the Persian Gulf region," and that

Congress, "supports the use of all necessary means to achieve the goals of United Nations

Security Council Resolution 688";

Whereas the Iraq Liberation Act (Public Law 105-338) expressed the sense of

Congress that it should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove

from power the current Iraqi regime and promote the emergence of a democratic

government to replace that regime;

Whereas on September 12, 2002, President Bush committed the United States to

"work with the United Nations Security Council to meet our common challenge" posed

by Iraq and to "work for the necessary resolutions," while also making clear that "the

Security Council resolutions will be enforced, and the just demands of peace and security

will be met, or action will be unavoidable";

Whereas the United States is determined to prosecute the war on terrorism and

Iraq's ongoing support for international terrorist groups combined with its development of

weapons of mass destruction in direct violation of its obligations under the 1991 ceasefire

and other United Nations Security Council resolutions make clear that it is in the

national security interests of the United States and in furtherance of the war on terrorism

that all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions be enforced, including

through the use of force if necessary;

Whereas Congress has taken steps to pursue vigorously the war on terrorism

through the provision of authorities and funding requested by the President to take the

necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including

those nations, organizations or persons who planned, authorized, committed or aided the

terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001 or harbored such persons or

organizations;

Whereas the President and Congress are determined to continue to take all appropriate

actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations,

organizations or persons who planned, authorized, committed or aided the terrorist

attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored such persons or organizations;

Whereas the President has authority under the Constitution to take action in order to deter

and prevent acts of international terrorism against the United States, as Congress

recognized in the joint resolution on Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law

107-40); and

Whereas it is in the national security of the United States to restore international peace

and security to the Persian Gulf region;

Now, therefore, be it

Resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in

Congress assembled,

SEC. 1. SHORT TITLE.

This joint resolution may be cited as the "Authorization for the Use of Military Force

Against Iraq".

SEC. 2. SUPPORT FOR UNITED STATES DIPLOMATIC EFFORTS

The Congress of the United States supports the efforts by the President to?

(a) strictly enforce through the United Nations Security Council all relevant Security

Council resolutions applicable to Iraq and encourages him in those efforts; and

(cool.gif obtain prompt and decisive action by the Security Council to ensure that Iraq

abandons its strategy of delay, evasion and noncompliance and promptly and strictly

complies with all relevant Security Council resolutions.

SEC. 3. AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF UNITED STATES ARMED FORCES.

(a) AUTHORIZATION. The President is authorized to use the Armed Forces of the

United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to

(1) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed

by Iraq; and

(2) enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council Resolutions regarding Iraq.

(cool.gif PRESIDENTIAL DETERMINATION.

In connection with the exercise of the authority granted in subsection (a) to use force the

President shall, prior to such exercise or as soon there after as may be feasible, but no

later than 48 hours after exercising such authority, make available to the Speaker of the

House of Representatives and the President pro tempore of the Senate his determination

that

(1) reliance by the United States on further diplomatic or other peaceful means alone

either

(A)will not adequately protect the national security of the United States against

the continuing threat posed by Iraq or

(cool.gif is not likely to lead to enforcement of all relevant United Nations Security

Council resolutions regarding Iraq, and

(2) acting pursuant to this resolution is consistent with the United States and other

countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and

terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations or persons who planned,

authorized, committed or aided the terrorists attacks that occurred on September 11,

2001.

© WAR POWERS RESOLUTION REQUIREMENTS.

(1) SPECIFIC STATUTORY AUTHORIZATION. Consistent with section 8(a)(1) of

the War Powers Resolution, the Congress declares that this section is intended

to constitute specific statutory authorization within the meaning of section 5(cool.gif of the

War Powers Resolution.

(2) APPLICABILITY OF OTHER REQUIREMENTS. ? Nothing in this resolution

supersedes any requirement of the War Powers Resolution.

SEC. 4. REPORTS TO CONGRESS

(a) The President shall, at least once every 60 days, submit to the Congress a report on

matters relevant to this joint resolution, including actions taken pursuant to the exercise

of authority granted in section 2 and the status of planning for efforts that are expected to

be required after such actions are completed, including those actions described in section

7 of Public Law 105-338 (the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998).

(cool.gif To the extent that the submission of any report described in subsection (a)coincides

with the submission of any other report on matters relevant to this joint resolution

otherwise required to be submitted to Congress pursuant to the reporting requirements of

Public Law 93-148 (the War Powers Resolution), all such reports may be submitted as a

single consolidated report to the Congress.

© To the extent that the information required by section 3 of Public Law 102-1 is

included in the report required by this section, such report shall be considered as meeting

the requirements of section 3 of Public Law 102-1.

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wunarmdscissor
gollum...you talk like you want to halt the process. (war on terror) I understand that you all didn't have a 911, but surely you can see where all this will lead. To your front door

babs

how many bloody times?

We have been fighting terrorism for the best part of a century.

We are fighting in afghanistan and Iraq right now.

Europe has been involved in more wars than youve had hot dinners babs.

Once again your posting is based on generalisation , poor understanding and hate.

The underlying tone of your post is that you are accusing european countries of being cowardly.

Babs at least try and learn please.

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gollum

It's like flogging a dead horse. yes.gif

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Celumnaz

that's the reasons I posted, the official.

so not all the "reasons" (plural) was "WMD" (singular) and... he didn't lie about it...

saying he lied, is the lie, that is being repeated enough by the bought and paid for media, for the population to start believing...

people actually think we went in for only one reason and don't understand how enemies try to undermine

what I just posted up there, if anyone cared about anything other than making Bush look a fool, or America/Captialism as evil, or trying to hide their complicity, takes the wind out of every single argument about it.

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gollum

Can someone tell me what actual threat Iraq was to America?

Did they specifically threaten America?

Did they have missiles that could reach America?

Did they amass a huge Army to invade America?

If people can't see that this is about oil and nothing else, then, well I simply give up.

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Celumnaz

read what I posted man... it's in there.

yes

depends on delivery you're talking about but yes

in part, again, yes

it's not "just and only" about oil... but taking that meal ticket away from them sure did help

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gollum

Whereas members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks

on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on

September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

Whereas Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations,

including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of American citizens;

Whereas the attacks on the United States of September 11, 2001 underscored the

gravity of the threat posed by the acquisition of weapons of mass destruction by

international terrorist organizations;

Whereas Iraq's demonstrated capability and willingness to use weapons of mass

destruction, the risk that the current Iraqi regime will either employ those weapons to

launch a surprise attack against the United States or its Armed Forces or provide them to

international terrorists who would do so, and the extreme magnitude of harm that would

result to the United States and its citizens from such an attack, combine to justify action

by the United States to defend itself;

This section here depicts the lie that everyone believed.

Al Qaida did not and have not had dealings with Saddam. If memory serves me, Saddam hated the organization.

His army was a weak inafective collection of conscripts. Not the huge army that was portrade in the press.

There is no way Saddam could attack America with missiles. He could barely reach Isreal.

And threatening America. Why worry when you know he could'nt even attack his neighbours affectively with the clap trap army he had.

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Celumnaz

Saddam's men met with Bin Ladin, they did have an agreement.

His army, and the "army of the ideology" are not exactly the same, but he contributed to, fed the "army of ideology"... militants... they didn't wear his uniform, and many different factions contributed to these networks... connect the dots. He couldn't order them all in one mass, but through others specific things would be done on his behalf for favors. I'm not communicating this right. Think good ole boy network and it's kind of like that... no paper trail that they know each other... think mafia, sort of like that, but not exactly... now I'm distracted an not explaining it so good... meh I know what I mean... someday maybe I'll have the right words.

Saddam could give stuff to smaller organizations that he "has no ties" to for delivery.

attempted assasination is not a threat?

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gollum

I understand what you are saying but it should still have been argued to the masses like that. Not the "He has WMD and is 45 minutes away from delivering them to your doorstep" scenario we were all fed back in the beginning.

He attempted to assasinate an ex president, that is not threatening a nation.

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Celumnaz

from what I remember Bush's speech laid out 5 or 6 reasons... it's the media and sky is falling liberals that latched onto and hounded the WMD side... and also (because I think Bush knew about the attack on us) that fear was one of the only ways to get those obstructionists and sympathizers and peaceniks... politics... to do what needed to be done for the reasons above and all that we've learned which is a great deal since.

he mentioned it along with several things... skyisfalling types started wringing their hands... like this "nuclear option" they keep talking about with this filibuster of judicial nominees... it's not a "nuclear option" in any sense of the term, but they just keep spewing that term out... and the people saying it don't even believe it... they just say it because they know their sheep will quiver in fear and repeat it and believe it and vote for them to save them from it.

If all he said was WMD I'd agree with ya totally, but from my point of view it's just a fraction of what he said and what was outlined by the UN and Congress. Media took that very narrow view and has been hammering it.

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Babs
gollum...you talk like you want to halt the process. (war on terror) I understand that you all didn't have a 911, but surely you can see where all this will lead. To your front door

babs

how many bloody times?

We have been fighting terrorism for the best part of a century.

We are fighting in afghanistan and Iraq right now.

Europe has been involved in more wars than youve had hot dinners babs.

Once again your posting is based on generalisation , poor understanding and hate.

The underlying tone of your post is that you are accusing european countries of being cowardly.

Babs at least try and learn please.

530925[/snapback]

Aye, Aye Sir. thumbsup.gif

I want to warn you, wun, that I am tired of you running around saying, "I am going to report you, Babs." And I'm tired of gollum threatening to call the 'mod squad' on me, I will report you or gollum if you are uncivil or call me a name. I didn't report you a couple of threads back when you called me a simpleton, but "Times, they are a changin'." yes.gif

Edited by Babs

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Stellar
Can someone tell me what actual threat Iraq was to America?

Did they specifically threaten America?

Did they have missiles that could reach America?

Did they amass a huge Army to invade America?

If people can't see that this is about oil and nothing else, then, well I simply give up.

Did Afghanistan?

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gollum

No they did'nt threaten them specifically, but, they did house and harbour the man/men respossible for 9/11.

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Stellar
No they did'nt threaten them specifically, but, they did house and harbour the man/men respossible for 9/11.

I'm talking about pre 9/11. Those men havent commited 9/11 yet in the sense that I'm talking.

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Babs
Whereas members of al Qaida, an organization bearing responsibility for attacks

on the United States, its citizens, and interests, including the attacks that occurred on

September 11, 2001, are known to be in Iraq;

Whereas Iraq continues to aid and harbor other international terrorist organizations,

including organizations that threaten the lives and safety of American citizens;

Whereas the attacks on the United States of September 11, 2001 underscored the

gravity of the threat posed by the acquisition of weapons of mass destruction by

international terrorist organizations;

Whereas Iraq's demonstrated capability and willingness to use weapons of mass

destruction, the risk that the current Iraqi regime will either employ those weapons to

launch a surprise attack against the United States or its Armed Forces or provide them to

international terrorists who would do so, and the extreme magnitude of harm that would

result to the United States and its citizens from such an attack, combine to justify action

by the United States to defend itself;

This section here depicts the lie that everyone believed.

Al Qaida did not and have not had dealings with Saddam. If memory serves me, Saddam hated the organization.

His army was a weak inafective collection of conscripts. Not the huge army that was portrade in the press.

There is no way Saddam could attack America with missiles. He could barely reach Isreal.

And threatening America. Why worry when you know he could'nt even attack his neighbours affectively with the clap trap army he had.

531000[/snapback]

Why worry?

post-3665-1111256136.jpg

Edited by Babs

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Babs

It's hard to look at these pictures without tearing up.

post-3665-1111256413.jpg

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Babs

And this picture, so many...

post-3665-1111256704.jpg

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Babs

Sorry, I have to put these on one at a time....even our dogs were killed in the rescue and many died, later, from cancer because of the toxic chemicals put into the air from the explosions. crying.gif

post-3665-1111257894.jpg

Edited by Babs

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morpheas

-Post removed-

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Babs

Are you getting a little worried that we are getting closer to you, morpheas? We know where your loyalties lie...

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morpheas

-Post removed-

Edited by SaRuMaN

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Babs

I can't talk like this to someone, I request a moderator.

....Thank you.

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Saru

Although we don't condone offensive language as was posted above, in this case it was hardly unprovoked.

Babs, openly suggesting that members here sponsor terrorism because they don't agree with your own views is unacceptable. This is your last warning.

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morpheas

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