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Sea Peoples and the Phoenicians: A Critical Turning Point in History


Abramelin

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It’s a contingent from Libya, from the islands off Cyrenaica, It’s close, I don’t buy any of it is from anywhere else.

They are the ones, who at this time, intruded into Egypt. Sais is built by the Libyan Pharoahs. Amasis for example.

Which connects them, in classic writings, to Athenians.

They took the western nomes of the Nile delta at this time is my guess.

They most likely intruded themselves into at least Israel. Possible Aethiopian kingdom connections.

Libyans and Ethiopians were allied, and we know Egypt had Ethiopian Pharoahs from the beginnings of the age after the collapse of the Bronze Age, possibly with those who became Phoenicians at this time, through the Siwa Oasis and Phoenician influence in Thebes, in Egypt.

Edited by The Puzzler
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21 hours ago, Abramelin said:

IN YOUR OWN WORDS.

 

 

15673325-E72F-4299-92B0-189C87DA7366.jpeg

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7 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

Yeah the Celts are the Sea People…

Nobody was suggesting that. But the hairstyle of those Tartessian masks (or whatever the things were) do resemble the hairstyle of Celtic warriors. Those masks may not even represent Tartessians, but the Celt-Iberians who lived close to the Tartessians.

However... about Celts being one of the Sea Peoples: Celts were very present in Europe around 1200 BCE.

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1 hour ago, The Puzzler said:

 

15673325-E72F-4299-92B0-189C87DA7366.jpeg

ChatGPT sucks. And I proved it for myself a page or so back.

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4 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

The carts with women and children, the records actually tell us these are the families of the wretched chief, from Libya.

They are not refugees from the Baltic Sea or Spain.

Even though I’d love it if they were, they are not.

The people with carts of course didn't travel across the Med. Although it is possible they went on board of ships, carts and all.

Btw., may the Garamantes have played a role? Their name doesn't show up in the Egyptian records of the time of the Sea Peoples.

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8 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

Yeah the Celts are the Sea People…

Isn’t anyone recognising the statement of the Nine Bows…The Egyptians know these people, they are Libyan allies. They are not Tartessos inhabitants, nor Philistines, nor Celts….

It is bloody obvious it weren't only people on boats that attacked Egypt.

Egypt was attacked from both land and sea.

But the Shardana, Seceli and others who lived on islands in the Med may have hooked up with the Tehenu/Libyans.

Edited by Abramelin
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18 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

What REASON  for the sea Peoples attacking Egypt?

Ah, good question!

They were driven by hunger, and wanted Egypts graneries?

Even during Roman times Egypt was known as the granary of the Roman Empire.

The Nile made Egypt very fertile for crops.

Edited by Abramelin
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The confederation of the sea peoples had to be further in the western Mediterranean sea then the Tyrrhenian sea.

 Tyrrhenian Sea map.png

 

Western Mediterranean 2023 — American Classic Tours

Edited by docyabut2
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Again, i transcribe ChatGPT take on attack methods, duration and consequences of the attacks of the Sea Peoples against Egypt, why they attacked at all, or how was it different from the other nations attacks. This can't be fake news...

So you all said that there is nothing positive coming from Chatgpt? nothing good will ever come out from the big flop that is Chatgpt. Get used to it...

Quote
Can you state the attack methods of the Sea Peoples?
 
ChatGPT

The specific attack methods employed by the Sea Peoples varied depending on the particular group and their objectives. While the historical records are limited and fragmented, some general patterns and methods have been inferred from the available evidence. Here are a few examples of the attack methods attributed to the Sea Peoples:

  1. Naval Raids: The Sea Peoples were known for their maritime skills and had a formidable naval presence. They conducted naval raids along the coastlines of various regions, including Egypt. They would sail in their ships, land on coastal areas, and launch surprise attacks on settlements and cities near the shore. Their mobility and naval prowess allowed them to bypass traditional land-based defenses and strike vulnerable coastal targets.

  2. Siege Warfare: The Sea Peoples also engaged in siege warfare when confronted with fortified cities. They would surround cities and employ various techniques to breach the city walls and gain entry. This could involve building siege ramps, using battering rams, or employing other siege equipment to weaken the defenses of the targeted city.

  3. Mass Invasions: In some instances, the Sea Peoples conducted large-scale, coordinated invasions involving multiple groups. They would launch simultaneous attacks on multiple fronts, overwhelming the defenders and causing widespread chaos. These mass invasions often involved land forces marching alongside their naval counterparts, coordinating their efforts to conquer and plunder the targeted territories.

  4. Use of Chariots and Warriors: The Sea Peoples were known to have employed chariots as a significant component of their military forces. Chariots provided them with mobility and firepower during battles. They also fielded skilled warriors armed with various weapons such as swords, spears, and bows. Their armies likely utilized a combination of infantry, charioteers, and possibly mercenaries.

It is important to note that the information regarding the specific attack methods employed by the Sea Peoples is limited, and our understanding is derived from fragmented historical records and archaeological evidence. The Sea Peoples' attacks were characterized by their maritime capabilities, mobility, and coordinated military strategies, which allowed them to pose a significant threat to settled civilizations in the Eastern Mediterranean during the Late Bronze Age.

 

Quote
How long did the Sea Peoples attacks last and what happened after in Egypt?
 
 
ChatGPT

The attacks by the Sea Peoples on Egypt occurred during the late 13th and early 12th centuries BCE. The duration of these attacks varied, as they were not a continuous or unified campaign but rather a series of incursions by different groups over a span of several decades.

The primary wave of Sea Peoples' attacks took place around the reign of Pharaoh Merneptah (r. 1213-1203 BCE) and continued during the subsequent reign of his successor, Ramesses III (r. 1186-1155 BCE). Ramesses III, in particular, faced multiple Sea Peoples invasions during his reign.

Ramesses III successfully repelled the Sea Peoples' attacks and thwarted their attempts to invade Egypt. He defeated them in a decisive battle known as the Battle of the Delta, fought near the Nile Delta region. Ramesses III's victory marked a significant turning point, effectively halting the major threat posed by the Sea Peoples to Egypt.

After the successful defense against the Sea Peoples, Egypt entered a period of relative stability and continued to exert its influence in the region. However, the attacks by the Sea Peoples and other external pressures contributed to the overall decline of the Late Bronze Age civilizations in the Eastern Mediterranean, including Egypt. The region experienced political upheaval, economic disruption, and the collapse of several major powers in the aftermath of these events.

It's worth noting that the Sea Peoples' attacks were not the sole cause of Egypt's decline, as internal factors and other external pressures also played a role. Nevertheless, the attacks by the Sea Peoples were a significant historical event that had lasting effects on the region, contributing to shifts in power and the geopolitical landscape of the Late Bronze Age.

 
Can you link papers and books about the subject of the Sea Peoples attack on Egypt?
 
ChatGPT

Certainly! Here are some scholarly papers and books that discuss the subject of the Sea Peoples' attacks on Egypt and the Late Bronze Age collapse:

  1. "The Sea Peoples and Their World: A Reassessment" edited by Eliezer D. Oren.

    • This book provides a collection of essays by various scholars exploring different aspects of the Sea Peoples phenomenon, including their origins, motivations, and the impact of their attacks. It offers a comprehensive overview of current research and theories.
  2. "The End of the Bronze Age: Changes in Warfare and the Catastrophe Ca. 1200 B.C." by Robert Drews.

    • This book examines the collapse of Bronze Age civilizations, including the Sea Peoples' attacks, from a military perspective. It explores changes in warfare, weaponry, and tactics during this period and their role in the downfall of empires.
  3. "1177 B.C.: The Year Civilization Collapsed" by Eric H. Cline.

    • This book discusses the collapse of several Bronze Age civilizations, including the Sea Peoples' attacks on Egypt. It provides an accessible account of the events leading to the Late Bronze Age collapse, incorporating archaeological evidence and historical sources.
  4. "The Aegean and the Orient in the Second Millennium: Proceedings of the 50th Anniversary Symposium, Cincinnati, 18-20 April 1997" edited by Eric H. Cline and Diane Harris-Cline.

    • This collection of papers focuses on the interaction and conflicts between the civilizations of the Aegean and the Near East during the Late Bronze Age, including the impact of the Sea Peoples on Egypt and neighboring regions.
  5. "The Mediterranean in the Ancient World" by Fernand Braudel.

    • While not solely focused on the Sea Peoples, this influential work by Braudel provides a comprehensive examination of the Mediterranean region's history, including the Late Bronze Age collapse and its consequences on the civilizations of the time.

Please note that access to some academic papers may be restricted and require subscriptions or institutional access. However, the titles provided should serve as starting points for further research on the subject.

 

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Why was Egypt attacked by the Sea peoples and why the attack was different from other attacks?
 
 
ChatGPT

The precise reasons for the attacks by the Sea Peoples on Egypt are not definitively known, as historical records from that period are limited and often fragmented. However, several factors have been proposed by scholars to explain the Sea Peoples' assault on Egypt and why it was distinct from other attacks:

  1. Migration and Displacement: One theory suggests that the Sea Peoples were a conglomerate of various groups who were displaced or seeking new lands due to political unrest, economic factors, or environmental changes in their homelands. Their migration and search for new territories could have led them to clash with settled civilizations, including Egypt.

  2. Economic Motivations: Another hypothesis proposes that the Sea Peoples may have been driven by economic reasons. They could have been seeking resources, such as arable land, trade routes, or valuable goods that Egypt possessed. The prosperous and well-developed Nile Delta region could have been an attractive target for plunder and conquest.

  3. Power Vacuum: The Late Bronze Age, during which the Sea Peoples' attacks occurred (around the 12th century BCE), witnessed the collapse of several major powers in the Eastern Mediterranean, including the Hittite Empire, Mycenaean Greece, and the Canaanite city-states. This power vacuum could have created an opportune moment for the Sea Peoples to launch their assaults.

  4. Naval Capabilities: The Sea Peoples were known for their seafaring skills and naval prowess. They possessed advanced maritime technologies and could launch coordinated attacks from the sea. Their naval capabilities allowed them to bypass traditional defense systems and strike coastal regions, including Egypt, with speed and surprise. This distinguished their attacks from more conventional land-based invasions.

  5. Conflicts with Egypt: Egypt had established itself as a major power in the region, controlling strategic trade routes and exerting influence over neighboring territories. The Sea Peoples' attacks on Egypt could be seen as a result of clashes between the established Egyptian hegemony and the Sea Peoples' desire for control and expansion.

It's important to note that the specific identities and origins of the Sea Peoples remain debated among scholars, as historical records are limited and interpretations vary. The Sea Peoples' attacks on Egypt were notable for their scale, impact, and the challenges they posed to established powers in the region, which distinguishes them from some earlier conflicts and invasions.

 

Edited by Mario Dantas
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4 hours ago, Mario Dantas said:

Again, i transcribe ChatGPT take on attack methods, duration and consequences of the attacks of the Sea Peoples against Egypt, why they attacked at all, or how was it different from the other nations attacks. This can't be fake news...

So you all said that there is nothing positive coming from Chatgpt? nothing good will ever come out from the big flop that is Chatgpt. Get used to it...

It would thus seem that nothing that ChatGPT generates can be considered to be the truth, the whole truth, or even a grain of truth. To any reasonable person – or attorney-at-law – it should thus be obvious that ChatGPT and kin are not reliable tools to be used with any research. Whether it’s for a case, or while doing homework as a (legal) student.

https://hackaday.com/2023/05/29/chatgpt-v-the-legal-system-why-trusting-chatgpt-gets-you-sanctioned/

Six of the submitted cases appear to be bogus judicial decisions with bogus quotes and bogus internal citations. Set forth below is an Order to show cause why plaintiff's counsel ought not be sanctioned.

https://reason.com/volokh/2023/05/27/a-lawyers-filing-is-replete-with-citations-to-non-existent-cases-thanks-chatgpt/

.

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9 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

The confederation of the sea peoples had to be further in the western Mediterranean sea then the Tyrrhenian sea.

 Tyrrhenian Sea map.png

 

Western Mediterranean 2023 — American Classic Tours

I know what you want to prove, Docy.

You think the whole Atlantis thing started with Tartessos in the west.

And the war between Athens and Atlantis was in fact the raids of the Sea Peoples starting in the western Med under the leadership of the Tartessians.

But again: why would the Tartessians start a war? It cannot have been because of metals of which they had enough.

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22 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

It’s a contingent from Libya, from the islands off Cyrenaica, It’s close, I don’t buy any of it is from anywhere else.

They are the ones, who at this time, intruded into Egypt. Sais is built by the Libyan Pharoahs. Amasis for example.

Which connects them, in classic writings, to Athenians.

They took the western nomes of the Nile delta at this time is my guess.

Puzzler,

Here is a paper about the era of those Libyan campaigns, which were aided by various Sea Peoples.  

https://scholarlypublications.universiteitleiden.nl/access/item%3A3295762/view

This paper argues that a string of major Egyptian oases, which are west of the Nile valley, had been temporarily seized by those Libyan/Sea Peoples coalitions.  I think this paper offers valuable insight into the strategy and tactics connected to the Libyan invasions.  Naturally, Egypt's pharaohs did not make inscriptions about temporarily losing control of the western oases.    

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19 hours ago, Swede said:

It would thus seem that nothing that ChatGPT generates can be considered to be the truth, the whole truth, or even a grain of truth. To any reasonable person – or attorney-at-law – it should thus be obvious that ChatGPT and kin are not reliable tools to be used with any research. Whether it’s for a case, or while doing homework as a (legal) student.

https://hackaday.com/2023/05/29/chatgpt-v-the-legal-system-why-trusting-chatgpt-gets-you-sanctioned/

Six of the submitted cases appear to be bogus judicial decisions with bogus quotes and bogus internal citations. Set forth below is an Order to show cause why plaintiff's counsel ought not be sanctioned.

https://reason.com/volokh/2023/05/27/a-lawyers-filing-is-replete-with-citations-to-non-existent-cases-thanks-chatgpt/

.

Can you state the inaccuracies on the texts that i posted? It seems like your afraid of even comment. I found the information provided exceptionally good for me.  Although i knew from the start the it was error prone:

Quote

Free Research Preview. ChatGPT may produce inaccurate information about people, places, or facts. ChatGPT May 24 Version

Just now i was asking about the languages the Sea Peoples spoke:

Quote
What was the languages spoken by the Sea peoples?
ChatGPT

The exact language or languages spoken by the Sea Peoples remains a subject of debate and uncertainty among scholars. The limited available evidence makes it challenging to determine their linguistic identity with certainty.

The Sea Peoples were comprised of various groups and potentially included individuals from different regions, each with their own linguistic and cultural backgrounds. The names and terms associated with the Sea Peoples mentioned in ancient texts, such as Egyptian inscriptions, provide some clues, but they do not provide a complete linguistic picture.

Some theories suggest that the Sea Peoples may have spoken various Indo-European languages, while others propose that they could have spoken Semitic or other non-Indo-European languages. The lack of extensive linguistic evidence and the diverse origins of the Sea Peoples make it difficult to reach a definitive conclusion regarding their language.

Archaeological and epigraphic research, along with ongoing advancements in linguistic analysis, may provide further insights into the linguistic identities of the Sea Peoples. However, as of now, the specific language spoken by the Sea Peoples remains uncertain and subject to scholarly investigation and interpretation.

It is not exactly known what languages they spoke, but it is known the languages of all the Mediterranean groups of peoples attacked.

Quote
What were the languages spoken by the Mediterranean peoples that were attacked?
ChatGPT

The Mediterranean peoples who were attacked by the Sea Peoples during the Late Bronze Age spoke a variety of languages, reflecting the diverse civilizations and cultures of the region during that time. Here are some of the prominent languages spoken by the civilizations that faced Sea Peoples' attacks:

  1. Ancient Egyptian: The Egyptians, who were one of the primary targets of the Sea Peoples, spoke the ancient Egyptian language. This language belonged to the Afro-Asiatic language family and had several stages of development throughout Egyptian history.

  2. Hittite: The Hittites, an influential Anatolian civilization, spoke the Hittite language, which was an Indo-European language belonging to the Anatolian branch. The Hittite Empire was severely impacted by the Sea Peoples' attacks.

  3. Mycenaean Greek: The Mycenaeans, an ancient Greek civilization centered in mainland Greece, spoke the Mycenaean Greek language. Mycenaean Greek was an early form of Greek and is attested in the Linear B script.

  4. Canaanite: The Canaanite civilization encompassed various city-states along the eastern Mediterranean coast, including cities like Ugarit, Sidon, and Tyre. Canaanite languages, such as Ugaritic and Phoenician, were spoken in this region.

  5. Luwian: The Luwians were an ancient Anatolian people who inhabited regions of modern-day Turkey. They spoke the Luwian language, which was another branch of the Anatolian branch within the Indo-European language family.

  6. Amorite: The Amorites were a Semitic-speaking people who settled in several locations in the ancient Near East, including parts of Mesopotamia and Syria.

  7. Philistine: The Philistines, who were likely part of the Sea Peoples coalition, were an Aegean-originated people who settled in the coastal region of ancient Canaan. It is believed that they spoke a non-Semitic language, although the specific details of their language are uncertain.

These are just a few examples of the languages spoken by the Mediterranean peoples who faced the Sea Peoples' attacks. The linguistic landscape of the region was diverse and complex, reflecting the rich tapestry of civilizations and cultures that existed during the Late Bronze Age.

If they emerged there (supposedly) in the eastern Mediterranean why is it not known which languages they spoke (apart from the Philistines Sea Peoples, which spoke Phoenician)?

i am going to post the answer regarding where did they first emerged

Quote
Where did the Sea Peoples first emerged?
ChatGPT

The origins of the Sea Peoples, like their precise identities, remain a subject of ongoing scholarly debate and speculation. The Sea Peoples are believed to have emerged from various regions around the Eastern Mediterranean and neighboring areas. While their exact place of origin is uncertain, several theories have been proposed based on historical records, archaeological evidence, and linguistic analysis. Here are a few prominent theories:

  1. Aegean Region: Some scholars suggest that the Sea Peoples originated from the Aegean Sea and its surrounding regions, including the Greek mainland and the islands. This theory is supported by similarities between certain Sea Peoples' names mentioned in ancient texts and names found in Aegean inscriptions.

  2. Western Anatolia (Asia Minor): Another theory posits that the Sea Peoples had connections to western Anatolia, which is present-day Turkey. This theory is based on archaeological evidence of destruction and migrations in the region during the Late Bronze Age, which could be linked to the Sea Peoples.

  3. Cyprus: There is speculation that Cyprus might have been a significant hub for the Sea Peoples, serving as a gathering point or staging area for their activities. The island's strategic location in the Eastern Mediterranean makes it a plausible base for maritime expeditions.

  4. Unknown Eastern Mediterranean Regions: Some theories propose that the Sea Peoples may have emerged from regions that are not well-documented or known to us due to gaps in historical records. These regions could include coastal areas of Syria, Palestine, or other neighboring territories.

It is important to note that due to the fragmented and limited nature of the available historical and archaeological evidence, pinpointing a specific place of origin for the Sea Peoples is challenging. Their identity and movements were complex, involving multiple groups with potentially diverse origins. Further research, including ongoing archaeological discoveries and advancements in scholarship, may help shed more light on the origins of the Sea Peoples and their migrations.

And how were they perceived by the Mediterranean peoples?

Quote
How were the Sea Peoples regarded?
ChatGPT

The Sea Peoples were regarded as a formidable and mysterious threat by the civilizations of the Late Bronze Age, including the Egyptians and other powers in the Eastern Mediterranean. They were seen as a collective force of marauders, warriors, and invaders who posed a significant danger to settled societies.

In the historical accounts and inscriptions of the time, the Sea Peoples are often described as destructive and relentless in their attacks. They were depicted as fierce fighters and skilled seafarers, capable of launching naval raids and land invasions with speed and coordination. Their ability to strike coastal regions and bypass traditional defenses, such as city walls and fortifications, added to their perceived military prowess.

The Sea Peoples' reputation as a fearsome adversary was also reinforced by their impact on the geopolitical landscape of the time. Their attacks, along with other factors, contributed to the decline and collapse of several major powers in the Eastern Mediterranean, including the Hittites, Mycenaeans, and various Canaanite city-states.

Due to the limited and fragmented nature of the historical records, the specific origins and identities of the Sea Peoples remain a subject of debate and speculation among scholars. They are referred to by different names in different sources, including the Egyptians' "Peleset" and "Sherden" and other terms like "Tjeker," "Denyen," and "Weshesh." However, their collective reputation as a formidable force that threatened the stability and security of the established civilizations of the Late Bronze Age is consistently described in the surviving accounts.

Overall, the Sea Peoples were regarded with fear and awe by the ancient societies they encountered, as they disrupted trade routes, attacked coastal cities, and contributed to the collapse of established powers during a time of significant political and social upheaval in the Eastern Mediterranean.

To cut an enormously long story short, i think Baltic states might have been the various Sea Peoples.

Denyen, Danes, Sherden, Sweden, Tjeker, Tchekia or Czechia, Phoenicians Finnish?

Edited by Mario Dantas
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7 hours ago, Mario Dantas said:

To cut an enormously long story short, i think Baltic states might have been the various Sea Peoples.

Denyen, Danes, Sherden, Sweden, Tjeker, Tchekia or Czechia, Phoenicians Finnish?

Can you possibly get farther off course? This is ridiculous! :rolleyes:

 

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1 hour ago, Piney said:

Can you possibly get farther off course? This is ridiculous! :rolleyes:

 

You are right, and i am very sorry for disrupting. Don't worry i will not be posting anymore in this thread.

As a matter of fact the Baltic states are so half way across the world that they couldn't possibly be the Sea Peoples. Thanks for your input.

One more cup of coffee before i go to the valley below - Bob Dylan

Quote
What happened to the Sea Peoples?
ChatGPT

The ultimate fate of the Sea Peoples is not definitively known, as their presence gradually fades from historical records. After the peak of their incursions during the late 13th and early 12th centuries BCE, the Sea Peoples' activities and influence diminish.

Some scholars propose that some groups of the Sea Peoples assimilated into the societies they encountered, settled in new regions, and eventually integrated into the local populations. For example, the Philistines, believed to be one of the Sea Peoples, settled along the southern coastal region of Canaan (modern-day Gaza Strip) and established their own distinct culture.

Other Sea Peoples may have dispersed and merged with various communities or migrated to different areas. The available evidence suggests that their collective identity gradually faded, and their distinct presence as a unified force dissipated over time.

It's important to note that the Sea Peoples were not a homogeneous group but a coalition of different groups with diverse origins. This diversity further contributes to the complexity of tracing their specific trajectories and assimilation patterns.

Further research, including archaeological discoveries and interdisciplinary studies, continues to provide insights into the movements and potential legacies of the Sea Peoples. However, the full extent of their historical trajectory and ultimate fate remains a subject of ongoing scholarly investigation and interpretation.

 

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On 6/1/2023 at 3:18 AM, Abramelin said:

It is bloody obvious it weren't only people on boats that attacked Egypt.

Egypt was attacked from both land and sea.

But the Shardana, Seceli and others who lived on islands in the Med may have hooked up with the Tehenu/Libyans.

Yes, I don’t deny some movements south from Central Europe which pushed migrations around at this time but not as part of the Sea People

Yes, I think it’s possible the Sardinians joined with Libya.

 

Theres something interesting here…

As the Ugarit King is asking for help, the Cypriot vizier has a response to him.

it infers the ships at Lukka, ran by Ugarit sailors, have turned on them. The crews of the ships team up with the Lukka and not only attack Ugarit itself but also Cyprus. 

Ammurapi's [Ugarit King)

My father, behold, the enemy's ships came (here); my cities(?) were burned, and they did evil things in my country. Does not my father know that all my troops and chariots(?) are in the Land of Hatti, and all my ships are in the Land of Lukka? ... Thus, the country is abandoned to itself. May my father know it: the seven ships of the enemy that came here inflicted much damage upon us.[9]

Eshuwara, the senior governor of Cyprus, responded:

As for the matter concerning those enemies: (it was) the people from your country (and) your own ships (who) did this! And (it was) the people from your country (who) committed these transgression(s) ... I am writing to inform you and protect you. Be aware![10]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ugarit

Edited by The Puzzler
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18 hours ago, Mario Dantas said:

Can you state the inaccuracies on the texts that i posted? It seems like your afraid of even comment. I found the information provided exceptionally good for me.  Although i knew from the start the it was error prone:

Just now i was asking about the languages the Sea Peoples spoke:

It is not exactly known what languages they spoke, but it is known the languages of all the Mediterranean groups of peoples attacked.

If they emerged there (supposedly) in the eastern Mediterranean why is it not known which languages they spoke (apart from the Philistines Sea Peoples, which spoke Phoenician)?

i am going to post the answer regarding where did they first emerged

And how were they perceived by the Mediterranean peoples?

To cut an enormously long story short, i think Baltic states might have been the various Sea Peoples.

Denyen, Danes, Sherden, Sweden, Tjeker, Tchekia or Czechia, Phoenicians Finnish?

As you have aptly demonstrated in this very response,(#891), your "reference" is wholly unreliable and therefore not worthy of pursuit.

Edit: Clarification.

.

Edited by Swede
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12 hours ago, Mario Dantas said:

Don't worry i will not be posting anymore in this thread.

You will.

And you should.

But next time don't quote the chat bot.

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22 hours ago, Mario Dantas said:

Can you state the inaccuracies on the texts that i posted? It seems like your afraid of even comment. I found the information provided exceptionally good for me.  Although i knew from the start the it was error prone:

Just now i was asking about the languages the Sea Peoples spoke:

It is not exactly known what languages they spoke, but it is known the languages of all the Mediterranean groups of peoples attacked.

If they emerged there (supposedly) in the eastern Mediterranean why is it not known which languages they spoke (apart from the Philistines Sea Peoples, which spoke Phoenician)?

i am going to post the answer regarding where did they first emerged

And how were they perceived by the Mediterranean peoples?

To cut an enormously long story short, i think Baltic states might have been the various Sea Peoples.

Denyen, Danes, Sherden, Sweden, Tjeker, Tchekia or Czechia, Phoenicians Finnish?

Well, I have been through many linguistic battles in this place, but what you posted is nonsense.

"Sherden" = Sweden??

And since when do the Chechs call themselves Chechs?

 

And Phoenicians = Finnish?

Man, if that was true, it should show up in their myths, language and genetics.

And it doesn't.

 

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15 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

Well, I have been through many linguistic battles in this place, but what you posted is nonsense.

"Sherden" = Sweden??

And since when do the Chechs call themselves Chechs?

 

And Phoenicians = Finnish?

Man, if that was true, it should show up in their myths, language and genetics.

And it doesn't.

 

Finicians, from Fini "Over" and Cian "Far" 

A people so far from reality it's over. 

.......don't hit me. :unsure2:

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The unruly Sheridan statement here is PRIOR to the Battle of Kadesh. It is not a part of the Sea People attack. However they are also mentions in the Sea People context 100 years later….
 

“Possible records of sea peoples generally or in particular date to two campaigns of Ramesses II, a pharaoh of the militant 19th Dynasty: operations in or near the delta in Year 2 of his reign and the major confrontation with the Hittite Empire and allies at the Battle of Kadesh in his Year 5. The years of this long-lived pharaoh's reign are not known exactly, but they must have comprised nearly all of the first half of the 13th century BCE.[67]

In his Second Year, an attack of the Sherden, or Shardana, on the Nile Delta was repulsed and defeated by Ramesses, who captured some of the pirates. The event is recorded on Tanis Stele II.[68] An inscription by Ramesses II on the stela from Tanis which recorded the Sherden raiders' raid and subsequent capture speaks of the continuous threat they posed to Egypt's Mediterranean coasts:

the unruly Sherden whom no one had ever known how to combat, they came boldly sailing in their warships from the midst of the sea, none being able to withstand them.[69]

The Sherden prisoners were subsequently incorporated into the Egyptian army for service on the Hittite frontier by Ramesses and fought as Egyptian soldiers in the Battle of Kadesh.”

 

Edited by The Puzzler
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The Battle of Kadesh seems the whole catalyst for what seems like revenge attacks on both Egypt and Hittite lands and allies.

The power Egypt and Hattusa had were waging a bitter war for years along the coastline, fighting for territories at Amarru, up, down, taking, losing…the effect on the populations at this time must have been devastating. These were super powers sparing no troops or casualties.
Lukka later turned on the Hittites.

The attached map shows the huge expanses of land this war encompassed.

Again, my own conclusion….Lukka (Lycia) aligned with Arzawa and led an anti-Hittite rebellion. The devastation at Ugarit, a major port into Mesopotamia and Hittite lands would have been the end. 
The Lukka apparently have no writing. Writing was lost when they entered the Aegean….as the centre’s of writing, Hattusa and Ugarit were no more. Attacking Mycenaean towns, a people of Lycian/Arzawa heritage, moving themselves into Greece itself. Maybe Achaeans. Gods like Leto, Apollo, Artemis, the mythology by Greeks speaking of Lycia is very detailed.

The Cypriot is telling the King of Ugarit, whose ships are in the Lukka lands….that it’s HIS OWN people and SHIPS attacking HIS land. His ships at Lukka have turned on him. His own people are the attackers.

The thing seems a rebellion against Egypt and Hittites and allies from the Battle of Kadesh war. 

Ammurapi's [Ugarit King)

My father, behold, the enemy's ships came (here); my cities(?) were burned, and they did evil things in my country. Does not my father know that all my troops and chariots(?) are in the Land of Hatti, and all my ships are in the Land of Lukka? ... Thus, the country is abandoned to itself. May my father know it: the seven ships of the enemy that came here inflicted much damage upon us.[9]

Eshuwara, the senior governor of Cyprus, responded:

As for the matter concerning those enemies: (it was) the people from your country (and) your own ships (who) did this! And (it was) the people from your country (who) committed these transgression(s) ... I am writing to inform you and protect you. Be aware

 

 

0BEB2CC8-0DD0-4724-AE83-6EF2E7A84A89.png

Edited by The Puzzler
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