4 college students found murdered In Idaho.

[docyabut2]

I still think that killer could be  Ethan`s ex psycho girl friend who slaughtered him and his girlfriends 

 but  the police  can`t find the evidence

[Likely Guy]

2 minutes ago, docyabut2 said:

I still think that killer could be  Ethan`s ex psycho girl friend who slaughtered him and his girlfriends 

 but  the police  can`t find the evidence

 

Is there any evidence of an ex psycho girlfriend?

[Raptor Witness]

3 hours ago, jmccr8 said:

For all we know they kids were seen partying by the killer ….

That’s not a motive for this sort of crime. There is no apparent motive, yet it’s “targeted?” It makes zero sense, and that’s a credibility problem for the police, because of the type of violence involved. 

The witnesses to the crime scene are still in hiding. Why? Obviously they were told not to talk, because they know who the target likely was, based on something they observed. My guess is, there was a message left at the scene, which made them hesitate calling the police, or this 911 call has been fabricated for some reason.

People don’t generally call friends first, even in the Greek System, when multiple people are non-responsive, and you could be sure that all four were not responding, at noon the next day. As I recall, the kitchen is on the second floor. No one wanted any breakfast? The girls downstairs just stayed in their rooms?

No one saw or smelled any blood, yet it was pouring out the foundation wall of the house!  

These girls downstairs were in fear of their own government. Why?

 

Edited November 30, 2022 by Raptor Witness

[+susieice]

7 hours ago, Raptor Witness said:

So why did the authorities share information about whether the victims were bound or not? Doesn’t that potentially compromise the investigation, also?

To stop rumors including internet ones. It's in just about every link.

[jmccr8]

32 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

That’s not a motive for this sort of crime. There is no apparent motive, yet it’s “targeted?” It makes zero sense, and that’s a credibility problem for the police, because of the type of violence involved. 

The witnesses to the crime scene are still in hiding. Why? Obviously they were told not to talk, because they know who the target likely was, based on something they observed. My guess is, there was a message left at the scene, which made them hesitate calling the police, or this 911 call has been fabricated for some reason.

People don’t generally call friends first, even in the Greek System, when multiple people are non-responsive, and you could be sure all four were at noon the next day. As I recall, the kitchen is on the second floor. No one wanted any breakfast? The girls downstairs just stayed in their rooms?

No one saw or smelled any blood, yet it was pouring out the foundation wall of the house!  These girls downstairs were in fear of their own government. Why?

 

Hi Raptor

I didn’t say it was a motive I said they could have been followed home. I don’t know what reason the killer had and have not offered one.

I did do a cursory look at crime stats for Moscow and violent crimes are from what I have seen seem to indicate that it is the norm. I looked to see what gang activity was like but didn’t get much in that aspect although Boisie does have some and did see that the one city seems to have meth lab activity so until I look a little deeper don’t see reason for concern in that aspect.

Edited November 30, 2022 by jmccr8

[jmccr8]

10 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

The witnesses to the crime scene are still in hiding. Why? Obviously they were told not to talk, because they know who the target likely was, based on something they observed. My guess is, there was a message left at the scene, which made them hesitate calling the police, or this 911 call has been fabricated for some reason.

Hi Raptor

The witnesses are not in hiding and yes it is standard procedure to have them not talk about the case so nothing unusual there.

Did they hesitate calling the police, they thought their room mate was unconscious so that would tend to indicate that there wasn’t anything immediately obvious. I don’t know if the friends were called by the room mates or that they had come to pick up the victim or just came to visit and were there already when they thought she was unconscious. Just because the roommates phone was used to call 911 doesn’t mean much as the girl whose phone it was may have lost composure so one of the friends made the call. This has already been checked out and cleared by the police.

20 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

People don’t generally call friends first, even in the Greek System, when multiple people are non-responsive, and you could be sure that all four were not responding, at noon the next day. As I recall, the kitchen is on the second floor. No one wanted any breakfast? The girls downstairs just stayed in their rooms?

No one saw or smelled any blood, yet it was pouring out the foundation wall of the house!

Yes they were out partying the night before so may not have felt like eating or found it unusual that the others were still in their rooms. Did they call their friends to come over or did the friends just show up looking for one of the other girls? I don’t know but will look later when not using my phone.

Not sure how strong the smell of blood is or would be in those temperatures within the time frame but doubt that it would be noticeable at that time. If they were inside the house then it’s likely they wouldn’t have seen blood on the outside and when the friends came they wouldn’t have noticed either if the are entering from a different part of the house. Blood pouring out is not and accurate description to start with and just sensationalizing media speak.

 

[+susieice]

2 hours ago, jmccr8 said:

Blood pouring out is not and accurate description to start with and just sensationalizing media speak.

There were pictures of that in the links. Here's one. Police said the scenes were very messy. I don't understand why no one would have seen blood either. It was on the walls. It's possible they only went to one room and it wasn't there. Here's the picture's caption...

Blood drips down the outside of the wall of the house the four students shared. Investigators describe it as the worst crime scene they have ever seen

Edited November 30, 2022 by susieice

[+susieice]

16 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11461727/Retracing-murderers-steps-Blueprints-Idaho-student-stabbed-death.html

It shows a twin bed on the second floor .

 

From this link docy. You just aren't going to accept this docy. That's ok.

Kaylee Goncalves, 21, and Madison Mogen, 21, were found on the top floor, knifed to death in their beds.

The young college lovers, Ethan Chapin, 20, and Xana Kernodle, 20, were found in the front second floor bedroom.

The floor layout shows that the murderer would have taken a winding route through the kitchen, the foyer and into the living room. 

From there the killer could have climbed the steps to the top floor and attacked Goncalves in the front bedroom and Mogen in the back, or walked through the laundry room, which leads to the room where Chapin and Kernodle slept, the building schematic shows. 

 

Edited November 30, 2022 by susieice

[+susieice]

That was a good link docy. This picture and the caption makes sense. Police thought it was the sliding door to the second floor that the killer entered through. If he was watching from the rear of the house.....

From the back of the house, it appears to have only two stories. It is possible the killer might haven not have known about the  first floor if entrance was made from the rear 

[jmccr8]

22 minutes ago, susieice said:

There were pictures of that in the links. Here's one. Police said the scenes were very messy. I don't understand why no one would have seen blood either. It was on the walls. It's possible they only went to one room and it wasn't there. Here's the picture's caption...

Blood drips down the outside of the wall of the house the four students shared. Investigators describe it as the worst crime scene they have ever seen

Hi Susieice

Thanks for the picture, yes there is a 2’ area that shows the blood below the siding so it would likely go un-noticed by someone just passing by

[Raptor Witness]

25 minutes ago, susieice said:

…..From the back of the house, it appears to have only two stories. It is possible the killer might haven not have known about the  first floor if entrance was made from the rear 

Excellent observation and theory….

[Raptor Witness]

The survivors or the 911 callers, should have smelled that crime scene. Crime scenes like this, especially those involving multiple victims, smell very bad. We hear this over and over, and it's an odor that most suvivors say they can't forget. People usually release more than just blood when they die like this. It's awful. That entire house would have smelled putrid. So the official story we're hearing of merely an unconscious person, raising concerns, is ludicrous.

The authorities are reducing life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for tens of thousands of local citizens to zero; in exchange for preserving and protecting a case which they may never solve. They claim they are afraid of causing more fear, by releasing more information, but that's for The People to decide, since doing a poor job can be covered up, using the same ratoionale.  

People need more basic information, in order to feel safe, even if it compromises the investigation. If "Death" is indeed at the door, in response to our foreign policy, we need to know about that, so that the correct decisions can be made by The Congress, not the Executive Branch.

[jmccr8]

48 minutes ago, Raptor Witness said:

The survivors or the 911 callers, should have smelled that crime scene. Crime scenes like this, especially those involving multiple victims, smell very bad. We hear this over and over, and it's an odor that most suvivors say they can't forget. People usually release more than just blood when they die like this. It's awful. That entire house would have smelled putrid. So the official story we're hearing of merely an unconscious person, raising concerns, is ludicrous.

The authorities are reducing life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for tens of thousands of local citizens to zero; in exchange for preserving and protecting a case which they may never solve. They claim they are afraid of causing more fear, by releasing more information, but that's for The People to decide, since doing a poor job can be covered up, using the same ratoionale.  

People need more basic information, in order to feel safe, even if it compromises the investigation. If "Death" is indeed at the door, in response to our foreign policy, we need to know about that, so that the correct decisions can be made by The Congress, not the Executive Branch.

Hi Raptor

Running off the edge again with sidetrack and exaggeration. Possibly there was some odour the body’s had only been dead a few hours so there would be no smell of decomposition and there may have not been body fluids or excrement although they may have passed gas. I had to go into an apartment to check on the tenants as their neighbour told me there was a smell and had not seen them for a while. It was a hot July and both of them had been dead for more than a couple of weeks and when the door opened the smell was overpowering to say the least.

It was not hot outside at the students house at the time of the killings so the cooler temps don’t enhance odours like heat does. 
 

Pretty sure most people in Moscow are going about their daily lives so not sure how anyone’s life, liberty or pursuing happiness is being hampered in anyway by this investigation.

You are the one demanding everything here the rest of us are interested and waiting for proper disclosure and due process.

[Raptor Witness]

1 hour ago, jmccr8 said:

You are the one demanding everything here the rest of us are interested and waiting for proper disclosure and due process.

I understand the needs of the state, and the needs of my friends in law enforcement. 

I also understand the needs of the U.S. People, and when this happens again and/or escalates, there won’t be room for this much debate.

Taking peace from the Earth is a job, not a game played by men to further their ambition.

The father who put his daughter in an urn, instead of having a funeral, isn’t foolish. He knows something….

Edited November 30, 2022 by Raptor Witness

[docyabut2]

6 hours ago, susieice said:

From this link docy. You just aren't going to accept this docy. That's ok.

Kaylee Goncalves, 21, and Madison Mogen, 21, were found on the top floor, knifed to death in their beds.

The young college lovers, Ethan Chapin, 20, and Xana Kernodle, 20, were found in the front second floor bedroom.

The floor layout shows that the murderer would have taken a winding route through the kitchen, the foyer and into the living room. 

From there the killer could have climbed the steps to the top floor and attacked Goncalves in the front bedroom and Mogen in the back, or walked through the laundry room, which leads to the room where Chapin and Kernodle slept, the building schematic shows. 

 

The young college lovers, Ethan Chapin, 20, and Xana Kernodle, 20, were found in the front second floor bedroom.?

we don't know which  bedroom Ethan Chapin, 20, and Xana Kernodle,was in , it could the first bedroom off the living room.

 

 

+17

View gallery

and  a double bed was in that bedroom 

 

Edited November 30, 2022 by docyabut2

[docyabut2]

The killer could not have entered  the front door,  the surviving girls would have been killed

.I know the killer came through  that  sliding  back door. a kitchen stool was knock over 

Edited November 30, 2022 by docyabut2

[Myles]

4 hours ago, Raptor Witness said:

 

People need more basic information, in order to feel safe, even if it compromises the investigation. If "Death" is indeed at the door, in response to our foreign policy, we need to know about that, so that the correct decisions can be made by The Congress, not the Executive Branch.

I totally disagree with that statement.  Catching the killer is, and should be, the number 1 priority.   

[+Not A Rockstar]

People making claims about smells of dead bodies here are not very experienced with death scenes, I surmise. Let me bore those who wonder with a few facts. If you do not wonder, skip this post. (edit to add as it posted while i was typing, that jmmcr8 has it correctly)

Really generally:

By about 9-12 hours after a death it depends on temperature, if there was air conditioning in the house or not, that sort of thing. One detail I always had to include in my initial report upon finding the body was the temperature and conditions in the room or location it was found at, if at all possible. Inside, cool morning hours, pre-noon, possibly with air conditioning, a body laying there is not likely to smell much yet. Decay is setting in through rigor mortis and such to begin in earnest however.

Now, the smell of DECAYING human is unforgettable, true. That will start around 12 hours or so, and rapidly increase, in the average circumstances, hence why they are kept cold to slow it down drastically in morgues. Out in heat, everything moves faster, of course. There are also exceptions but I won't go into that as Docy is distraut already and it serves no purpose here. The bloody room would also be a different situation. Copious amounts of blood smells metallic, for lack of a better word, when fresh. It becomes more dull as it dries. Think meat cuts you buy at the store and the blood in the package, its kind of dull if it smells much at all before decay sets into it.

Based on the 911 call, we know the first victim found had so little evident fluid released they believed the person was unconscious (or claimed so). From photos outside, we know at least one other death scene beyond the first person found were a very different story, or at least one room was for so much to flow outside the house. Perhaps that room was so severely more violent that it has fed the police perception of a targeted kill. 

Just a guess, which is all anyone can do, really, not being privy to the details and facts.

I hate to mention it as I cannot recall now where I read it today or who said it, but one of the fathers who got his daughter's remains back already stated to the reporter that he was relieved his daughter and another girl who died there died instantly and never knew anything had happened and that was his comfort. That really got me wondering how the heck they knew that unless we do have one room a blood bath and the other two deaths swift. It was an article talking about the first funerals or something as I recall. I was also surprised to read in it that he got her ashes. Already released and cremated... I was surprised. If I find it again I shall post it but honestly my research on other things takes me far and wide. For me to trip over this it was probably MSN.

I wonder if the roommates may have feared the victim they found had OD'd or died from alcohol to call friends versus ambulance. To me a dead body seems pretty obvious after an hour or so. I think they were panicked, if what we are told is as it really was to that point. I have no idea why they did not go and try to roust out one of the others for help first though. This is why those witnesses are not talking to the press or the public, I suspect. What they know and did is pivotal in the case so they are being silent for now. I also expect an arrest or two in another week or so myself, one forensics comes back, but that is just me and my opinion. 

I guess we shall see. All we have are guesses. I have a lot of questions, but, hey, all we can do is wait and see.

love ya Saint Susieice  always the patient one.

Edited November 30, 2022 by Not A Rockstar

[docyabut2]

 Ethan Chapin, 20, and Xana Kernodle, 20 were first ones killed 

[Raptor Witness]

2 hours ago, Not A Rockstar said:

love ya Saint Susieice  always the patient one.

Speaking of “patience,” there has been a host of criticism by pundits and experts for why the authorities are just now towing the vehicles from in front of the house.

 

This clearly defies common sense and evidence practices. 

Oh wait, it’s because the state has reportedly appropriated $1 million, for the investigation.

So why would they already be assuming that there’s no useful evidence in those vehicles that needs to be preserved and protected?

In the second clip, the prosecutor, says drugs are not involved, and there were no messages were left on the walls, that he is aware of.

That’s helpful, but I’ve doubted drugs were the motive, because that should have been an obvious check mark, from the start.

As for no messages left at the scene, perhaps the crime itself is the message. A message of fear.

Edited November 30, 2022 by Raptor Witness

[jmccr8]

1 hour ago, Raptor Witness said:

That’s helpful, but I’ve doubted drugs were the motive, because that should have been an obvious check mark, from the start.

Hi Raptor

It is possible that there were no drugs present at the scene or found in the victim’s bodies which does not exclude the possibility that someone sold and did not use drugs personally. Not saying that it was drug related but will not exclude it from consideration. Drug are sold in schools from grade school through university or any college and smart dealers don’t do the product because it cuts into profits.

[Raptor Witness]

Expert explains the likely motive, without realizing it.

“It’s the stuff of nightmares”

At the 6:50 minute mark:

The question then must be asked, who would want, or be motivated to send “the stuff of nightmares” to Moscow USA?

[+susieice]

6 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

The young college lovers, Ethan Chapin, 20, and Xana Kernodle, 20, were found in the front second floor bedroom.?

we don't know which  bedroom Ethan Chapin, 20, and Xana Kernodle,was in , it could the first bedroom off the living room.

 

 

+17

View gallery

and  a double bed was in that bedroom 

 

Docy, they do know.

[docyabut2]

27 minutes ago, susieice said:

Docy, they do know.

DailyMail was just guessing.

Blueprints and layout plans of the Moscow, Idaho. home obtained by DailyMail.com reveal the three-story property has two bedrooms on each floor -

Edited November 30, 2022 by docyabut2

[+susieice]

5 hours ago, Not A Rockstar said:

I wonder if the roommates may have feared the victim they found had OD'd or died from alcohol to call friends versus ambulance. To me a dead body seems pretty obvious after an hour or so. I think they were panicked, if what we are told is as it really was to that point. I have no idea why they did not go and try to roust out one of the others for help first though. This is why those witnesses are not talking to the press or the public, I suspect. What they know and did is pivotal in the case so they are being silent for now. I also expect an arrest or two in another week or so myself, one forensics comes back, but that is just me and my opinion. 

At the very beginning of this I wondered. We know from Xana's father that she had defensive wounds. She fought back and I'm sure Ethan did too. We know that more than one had defensive wounds. It is possible that they did some damage before they were overcome. Especially if the knife was wet and slippery like it most likely was. There's going to be DNA there and it will come back in the forensics.