UK strike days calendar – the public service stoppages planned for December

[Still Waters]

The wave of strikes sweeping the country reaches a peak this week, threatening to bring Britain to a standstill as workers across the transport network, NHS, Royal Mail and civil service take industrial action in ongoing rows over pay and conditions.

Further unrest could beset the government in the new year as strike ballots for firefighters and teachers close in January, while junior doctors are scheduled to vote next month, and London Underground have approved a mandate for another six months of industrial action.

Here are the main public service strikes planned before the end of the year:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/dec/12/uk-strike-days-calendar-the-public-service-stoppages-planned-for-december

[Still Waters]

The government is to discuss contingency plans for upcoming strikes, including using the military and civil servants to cover Border Force staff, at an emergency Cobra meeting later.

The armed forces will also be deployed to hospital trusts ahead of an ambulance strike, the government says.

But Downing Street warned there would still be "serious disruption".

Cobra is an emergency response committee made up of ministers, civil servants and others.

It comes amid a wave of strikes over pay this month from nurses, paramedics, rail workers, and Border Force staff.

Cabinet Office minister Oliver Dowden, who will chair the meeting on Monday, has urged unions to call off the "damaging" strikes.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63939396

[OpenMindedSceptic]

Sack the lot of them.

"We've got no other option but to strike"... really?

If you don't want to strike, then don't. Find better ways to resolve the issues. 

Everybody knows the NHS is a broken system. More money doesn't fix it. It needs an overhaul. That'd free up the money for salaries and guess what... nobody needs to strike. So those on the picket lone should be the first to go as they lack the gumption to be of true value.

[pellinore]

2 hours ago, OpenMindedSceptic said:

2 hours ago, OpenMindedSceptic said:

 

 

If you don't want to strike, then don't. Find better ways to resolve the issues. 

 

 

I agree. Pensioners obviously can't strike, yet they will be getting the full triple lock rise of 10% in April. Why? Because they negotiated in a reasonable way.

Edited December 12, 2022 by pellinore

[+and-then]

The price of saving the planet.  Normally I'm against work stoppages, especially in critical service areas but it sounds like these people are being financially crushed by inflation and have reached the point of risking their jobs.  Pay them and let them stay on the job.

[pellinore]

19 minutes ago, and-then said:

The price of saving the planet.  Normally I'm against work stoppages, especially in critical service areas but it sounds like these people are being financially crushed by inflation and have reached the point of risking their jobs.  Pay them and let them stay on the job.

The problem for the workers is that the UK government is now recruiting workers from Africa, the Middle East and the Far East, and fast tracking training for them to do previously skilled jobs. Ambulance and nursing and medical staff are starting to be replaced (well, nursing and medical, but paramedic training for overseas staff could be started once the demand is there).50,000 of UK’s newest nurses recruited from poor countries with shortages | openDemocracy

Edited December 12, 2022 by pellinore

[OpenMindedSceptic]

11 minutes ago, and-then said:

The price of saving the planet.  Normally I'm against work stoppages, especially in critical service areas but it sounds like these people are being financially crushed by inflation and have reached the point of risking their jobs.  Pay them and let them stay on the job.

The NHS is the obvious place to say, sack them. I say that because almost anybody could make 15 to 20% savings with ease. That'd mean their pay can rise while taxpayers contribution falls. but they should forgo their fat pensions too and fund it themselves as pay will surpass the private sector. That'd then give them real power in the eyes of the public but... unions, 'we got no option', we are underfunded... bore off. 

[pellinore]

2 minutes ago, OpenMindedSceptic said:

The NHS is the obvious place to say, sack them. I say that because almost anybody could make 15 to 20% savings with ease. That'd mean their pay can rise while taxpayers contribution falls. but they should forgo their fat pensions too and fund it themselves as pay will surpass the private sector. That'd then give them real power in the eyes of the public but... unions, 'we got no option', we are underfunded... bore off. 

How? Successive governments have tried and failed. Where do you suggest the savings are made? About 30% of the costs to the NHS is that there is no where to discharge patients to. Most users of the NHS are elderly (due to having more diseases and illnesses)  and there is no social provision to send them to. We can't fix the NHS while we are still using it to provide social care. 

[+Desertrat56]

I hope this doesn't get as ugly as the miners strikes in the 80's.   

[L.A.T.1961]

Essential services paid for by tax payers should not have an option to strike. 

Prison officers and the Police cannot strike in the UK due to the implications, the NHS should be in the same category. 

Train workers are struggling to make headway as unlike years ago there are other options than go into work for work. 

Their union is living in the past and causing more long term problems for staff than they are solving. 

 

[+Desertrat56]

2 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

Essential services paid for by tax payers should not have an option to strike. 

Prison officers and the Police cannot strike in the UK due to the implications, the NHS should be in the same category. 

Train workers are struggling to make headway as unlike years ago there are other options than go into work for work. 

Their union is living in the past and causing more long term problems for staff than they are solving. 

 

So why are there unions for groups that supply essential services?   The union must not be doing their job if it gets to the point of strikes.   

[OpenMindedSceptic]

2 hours ago, pellinore said:

How? Successive governments have tried and failed. Where do you suggest the savings are made? About 30% of the costs to the NHS is that there is no where to discharge patients to. Most users of the NHS are elderly (due to having more diseases and illnesses)  and there is no social provision to send them to. We can't fix the NHS while we are still using it to provide social care. 

Sack the NHS and PCT management and make them reapply. Pay auxiliary nurses and carers more and degree educated nurses less. Fund social care more favourably than health care. Make people in hospital pay a subsidy for food and heat of £1 a day. Look at the booking system as something isn't working. Train advanced nurse practitioner over GP's. Ban unions in healthcare. Ban PFI, make it possible to pay off those PFI deals early. Shidt emphasis of national health onti true dietary advice. I mean, this for starters before we get into real strategy stuff. The whole thing currently is broken and the NHS has allowed it. The NHS is only political when it suits them bit it's the taxpayers who get hit 

[pellinore]

5 hours ago, OpenMindedSceptic said:

Sack the NHS and PCT management and make them reapply. Pay auxiliary nurses and carers more and degree educated nurses less. Fund social care more favourably than health care. Make people in hospital pay a subsidy for food and heat of £1 a day. Look at the booking system as something isn't working. Train advanced nurse practitioner over GP's. Ban unions in healthcare. Ban PFI, make it possible to pay off those PFI deals early. Shidt emphasis of national health onti true dietary advice. I mean, this for starters before we get into real strategy stuff. The whole thing currently is broken and the NHS has allowed it. The NHS is only political when it suits them bit it's the taxpayers who get hit 

I agree with a lot you say, except for two things: the NHS has allowed it. I reckon successive governments have allowed it. Everything is done piecemeal. Also: it's the taxpayers who get hit, is wrong imo. If the NHS was dissolved and private healthcare was introduced entirely, the tax payer would be hit a lot harder. You just have to look at the US- people with expensive operations or chronic conditions are made bankrupt. People say, we don't want the US model, we want a European model. But European countries pay a larger proportion of their GDP to fund health care than we do.

Edited December 13, 2022 by pellinore

[Eldorado]

14 hours ago, OpenMindedSceptic said:

Sack the lot of them.

 

You can’t be dismissed for industrial action if:

• it’s called as a result of a properly organised ballot
• it’s about a trade dispute between workers and their employer (eg about your terms and conditions)
• a detailed notice about the industrial action (which is legally required) has been given to the employer at least 7 days before it begins

You can claim unfair dismissal at an employment tribunal if you’re dismissed for taking industrial action at any time within the 12 weeks after the action began.

After 12 weeks, you can be dismissed if you take industrial action and your employer has tried to settle the dispute. For example, your employer may bring in advisers from Acas to help find a solution.

https://www.gov.uk/industrial-action-strikes/your-employment-rights-during-industrial-action

Edited December 13, 2022 by Eldorado

[OpenMindedSceptic]

1 minute ago, Eldorado said:

You can’t be dismissed for industrial action if:

• it’s called as a result of a properly organised ballot
• it’s about a trade dispute between workers and their employer (eg about your terms and conditions)
• a detailed notice about the industrial action (which is legally required) has been given to the employer at least 7 days before it begins

You can claim unfair dismissal at an employment tribunal if you’re dismissed for taking industrial action at any time within the 12 weeks after the action began.

After 12 weeks, you can be dismissed if you take industrial action and your employer has tried to settle the dispute. For example, your employer may bring in advisers from Acas to help find a solution.

https://www.gov.uk/industrial-action-strikes/your-employment-rights-during-industrial-action

Personally, I feel like, if you want to strike then find another job. If you want to adult then talk, find bether ways, not strike.

[+Desertrat56]

8 hours ago, pellinore said:

I agree with a lot you say, except for two things: the NHS has allowed it. I reckon successive governments have allowed it. Everything is done piecemeal. Also: it's the taxpayers who get hit, is wrong imo. If the NHS was dissolved and private healthcare was introduced entirely, the tax payer would be hit a lot harder. You just have to look at the US- people with expensive operations or chronic conditions are made bankrupt. People say, we don't want the US model, we want a European model. But European countries pay a larger proportion of their GDP to fund health care than we do.

Just ask people in the U.S. how the private healthcare works, it doesn't unless you have butt loads of money.   You do pay for your healthcare with your taxes, but that is a drop in the bucket compared to what we pay, and the service we get depends on what state and city we live in.  In New Mexico it is horrible, sometimes almost non-existent care, in Texas and Arizona they have access to decent care, but it isn't always the best.   Doctors can make double the money in those two states than they can in New Mexico.  I suspect there are states in the south and midwest that have the same problem as New Mexico.

[L.A.T.1961]

15 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

So why are there unions for groups that supply essential services?   The union must not be doing their job if it gets to the point of strikes.   

Its not just pay that unions deal with but employment maters like unfair dismissal, having union representation for this and similar is perfectly reasonable.

But yes if a union decides to call a strike for those in the NHS then they have failed to consider all factors including the sick which must take priority.

 

[Setton]

5 hours ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

But yes if a union decides to call a strike for those in the NHS then they have failed to consider all factors including the sick which must take priority.

That's why they always continue to provide emergency care and care for inpatients during strike action.

[Eldorado]

Public support for strikers.

The latest poll by Savanta Comres suggests a very small drop in overall public support - 61% backed the strikes at the end of October and 32% opposed them, while the poll last weekend shows 60% supporting the strikes and 35% against.

When you break down the figures into specific jobs, nurses have more public support than those working on the railways.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63957154

[pellinore]

On 12/12/2022 at 6:50 PM, OpenMindedSceptic said:

Sack the lot of them.

Everybody knows the NHS is a broken system. More money doesn't fix it. It needs an overhaul. That'd free up the money for salaries and guess what... nobody needs to strike. So those on the picket lone should be the first to go as they lack the gumption to be of true value.

The NHS is a source of constant vociferous moaning from the small percentage of the population who either are lucky enough for them and their families not to need expensive care, or can afford private care.

The NHS should be scrapped. Seriously. Let private insurance companies fund healthcare, with their fees and excess discounts .Let people experience paying £500 per month for insulin if they have diabetes, a £1k bill for an ambulance ride to A&E, a choice in A&E whether they get a blood test for their child or pay £2.5k for it to be done and analysed. Dad has got cardiac stenosis?- cough up £30k to get his heart functioning properly again, or get a house extension?

Once people have experienced those choices, we could then have a vote on whether we want to return to paying a small percentage of our earnings each month in exchange for health care free at the point of need.

 

Edited December 15, 2022 by pellinore

[+Desertrat56]

7 hours ago, pellinore said:

The NHS is a source of constant vociferous moaning from the small percentage of the population who either are lucky enough for them and their families not to need expensive care, or can afford private care.

The NHS should be scrapped. Seriously. Let private insurance companies fund healthcare, with their fees and excess discounts .Let people experience paying £500 per month for insulin if they have diabetes, a £1k bill for an ambulance ride to A&E, a choice in A&E whether they get a blood test for their child or pay £2.5k for it to be done and analysed. Dad has got cardiac stenosis?- cough up £30k to get his heart functioning properly again, or get a house extension?

Once people have experienced those choices, we could then have a vote on whether we want to return to paying a small percentage of our earnings each month in exchange for health care free at the point of need.

 

They could just immigrate to the states and get that experience, then they would probably run home and be thankful for the NHS.

[Gromdor]

7 hours ago, pellinore said:

The NHS is a source of constant vociferous moaning from the small percentage of the population who either are lucky enough for them and their families not to need expensive care, or can afford private care.

The NHS should be scrapped. Seriously. Let private insurance companies fund healthcare, with their fees and excess discounts .Let people experience paying £500 per month for insulin if they have diabetes, a £1k bill for an ambulance ride to A&E, a choice in A&E whether they get a blood test for their child or pay £2.5k for it to be done and analysed. Dad has got cardiac stenosis?- cough up £30k to get his heart functioning properly again, or get a house extension?

Once people have experienced those choices, we could then have a vote on whether we want to return to paying a small percentage of our earnings each month in exchange for health care free at the point of need.

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but I do recall that British Citizens do have the option to purchase private insurance already.  It already has all the benefits of the American system.  It's just they don't buy it and like to complain about what they are given.   

[itsnotoutthere]

The only problem I can foresee is that the health workers have made themselves so scarce since lock-down that I'm not sure that reducing their services will have any measurable impact. 

Edited December 15, 2022 by itsnotoutthere

[+Desertrat56]

49 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Correct me if I am wrong, but I do recall that British Citizens do have the option to purchase private insurance already.  It already has all the benefits of the American system.  It's just they don't buy it and like to complain about what they are given.   

Would you if you were in the UK?   Considering how expensive it is, who ever can afford it probably does buy it.

[Still Waters]

As nurses prepare to strike for the first time, an A&E nurse and lecturer in Organisational Behaviour in Healthcare writes about the stress, fear, grief and guilt they feel every day working on the frontline of an NHS in crises.

https://theconversation.com/its-like-being-in-a-warzone-aande-nurses-open-up-about-the-emotional-cost-of-working-on-the-nhs-frontline-194197