McCarthy tries to get out of his box on debt ceiling

[+OverSword]

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House Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) is pressing for Democrats to come to the bargaining table and begin negotiations to address the nation’s debt limit, as he faces pressures within his party to make good on significant fiscal reform.  

McCarthy called on the White House to start discussions this week. But as both sides gear up for the fight over the country’s borrowing limit, the GOP leader is getting the cold shoulder from Democrats, who have characterized ideas floated on the other side as nonstarters. 

“Republicans are creating a crisis that need not exist,” Rep. Brendan Boyle (Pa.), top Democrat on the House Budget Committee, said on Thursday, while decrying what he called “political games.” 

The impasse has heightened public concern in recent days, particularly as the Treasury Department has begun what it calls “extraordinary measures” to keep the U.S. government from defaulting on its debt. 

The standoff comes as House Republicans have ramped up calls to tie spending cuts to any bill raising or suspending the debt limit — legislation that caps how much outstanding national debt the government can hold to fulfill its financial duties. Democrats, by contrast, have instead insisted on a clean bill to address the debt ceiling. 

 

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So tighten the belt and sacrifice some spending or just double down on insurmountable debt? 

[cormac mac airt]

I'd like to see our government grow a pair and get out of this constantly increasing the debt ceiling phase, finally learning to live within their means. It's not really doing anyone any good in the long run. 

cormac

[+OverSword]

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

[Piney]

42 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

I'd like to see our government grow a pair and get out of this constantly increasing the debt ceiling phase, finally learning to live within their means. It's not really doing anyone any good in the long run. 

cormac

Common people can't even do that anymore and it's not hard. The number one rule is credit is for emergencies and necessity. That's it.

One of my Mexican employees said to me "You cook your own food, make your own coffee and don't drink or smoke. That's why you have money" and I said I also don't take vacations at resorts using credit and the only reason I have vehicle loans is to keep my score up. 

[Gromdor]

The problem is- instead of addressing the issue before hand, everyone waits until it is time to pay the bills.  

 

And seriously, why would you vote someone who calls himself, "The King of Debt" into office: U.S. National Debt Under Trump Rose to $7.8 Trillion, Explained (marketrealist.com)

By December 21, 2020, with just a few weeks left in Trump’s one-term presidency, the national debt had climbed to $27.76 trillion—a 39-percent jump from the $19.95-trillion debt the country had four years prior when this self-described “king of debt” was sworn into office.

Edited January 20, 2023 by Gromdor

[Agent0range]

Raising the debt ceiling doesn't authorize more spending.  That's what the spending bill is for...that was already agreed upon by Republicans.  The debt ceiling is about paying the bills.  Republicans don't want their followers to understand that, though.  They want you to think they are doing something valiant to lower the deficit.  Not the case.  Here's the real question.  Why is it when there is a Republican President, Republicans don't have a single qualm about the debt ceiling?  When it was raised under Trump, not a single word.  And notice how Democrats didn't try some childish BS when it had to be raised?  Because they know if taken too far, these antics can absolutely crush the economy.

Edited January 20, 2023 by Agent0range

[Michelle]

2 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

Raising the debt ceiling doesn't authorize more spending.

Source, please.

 

[Gromdor]

9 minutes ago, Michelle said:

Source, please.

Spending bills are called appropriation bills: Appropriations 101 | Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget (crfb.org)

  Those are the bills where Congress approves spending money.

Debt ceiling bills are just that: Debt Ceiling Defined: What Is the U.S. National Debt Ceiling? (investopedia.com)

  These are bills that basically increase our "credit card" limit.  It does that by issuing more bonds.

Edit to add:  The reason why they are seperate is because congress often pass multiple appropriation bills without bothering to see if we can pay for it in a given year.

Edited January 20, 2023 by Gromdor

[Agent0range]

13 minutes ago, Michelle said:

Source, please.

 

Raising the debt limit is not about new spending; it is about paying for previous choices policymakers legislated. https://www.brookings.edu/2023/01/19/7-things-to-know-about-the-debt-limit/

[Michelle]

I know what the debt ceiling is, Gromdor. It was AO that was giving misinformation.

[Agent0range]

2 minutes ago, Michelle said:

I know what the debt ceiling is, Gromdor. It was AO that was giving misinformation.

What misinformation?  It does not authorize new spending.  

[Gromdor]

2 minutes ago, Michelle said:

I know what the debt ceiling is, Gromdor. It was AO that was giving misinformation.

Are you certain?  Looking back at his post, he seems to be correct.

[Doug1066]

4 hours ago, OverSword said:

Link

So tighten the belt and sacrifice some spending or just double down on insurmountable debt? 

I'd like to see House Republicans go on the record about what it is they want to cut.  Who do they plan to hurt in order to get their way?

Doug

[Michelle]

Just now, Gromdor said:

Are you certain?  Looking back at his post, he seems to be correct.

He didn't explain it very well and it wasn't the whole story.

[+OverSword]

Let's be honest about how this REALLY ends up functioning.  They raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling ad infinitum.

[Gromdor]

35 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Let's be honest about how this REALLY ends up functioning.  They raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling ad infinitum.

Quite true.   Hence my, 'Why do we elect people with titles like, 'King of Debt'".  1 out of every 4 dollars we owe in the national debt came from that presidency. 

I honestly think the current plan to get rid of it is to inflation our way to the point that we can pay it off with $100 worth of year 2000 dollars.

[+OverSword]

31 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Quite true.   Hence my, 'Why do we elect people with titles like, 'King of Debt'".  1 out of every 4 dollars we owe in the national debt came from that presidency. 

I honestly think the current plan to get rid of it is to inflation our way to the point that we can pay it off with $100 worth of year 2000 dollars.

I think that would work the other way around but I like your thinking anyway. New conspiracy theory just need to iron it out

[Occupational Hubris]

Dems absouletly shoul dnot come to the table on this. Make it very clear which party is ****ing with the economy for political gain. (That would be teh republicans for the slows ones here)

[Agent0range]

14 hours ago, OverSword said:

Let's be honest about how this REALLY ends up functioning.  They raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling then they spend more then they raise the debt ceiling ad infinitum.

With Republicans in control of the House, that only happens if they pass an unbalanced spending bill when the current runs out.  That's when they get to show you how "conservative" they really are.

[preacherman76]

I don’t see how either side of this has any room to boast. This government as a whole over the last 20 years has destroyed our dollar, and has destroyed its standing as the worlds reserve currency. Chickens are coming home to roost. Soon. 
 

And like always, if anyone in government even suggests this madness has to end, it’s THEM that is “messing with the economy” like damn people, smh. 
 

 

[Portre]

15 hours ago, Gromdor said:

Quite true.   Hence my, 'Why do we elect people with titles like, 'King of Debt'".  1 out of every 4 dollars we owe in the national debt came from that presidency. 

I honestly think the current plan to get rid of it is to inflation our way to the point that we can pay it off with $100 worth of year 2000 dollars.

Funny how Republicons only threaten the economy when there's a Democrat in the White House. It almost as if it's a political stunt, except that this stunt has real world consequences: The GAO estimated that the delay in raising the debt ceiling raised borrowing costs for the government by $1.3 billion in fiscal year 2011, $18.9 billion over ten years.

[Tatetopa]

1 hour ago, preacherman76 said:

I don’t see how either side of this has any room to boast. This government as a whole over the last 20 years has destroyed our dollar, and has destroyed its standing as the worlds reserve currency. Chickens are coming home to roost. Soon. 
 

I was with you there for a moment.  But the dollar is still the reserve currency and still seems to be the coin everybody wants to get hold of.

We have debts we need to pay for what we have already promised.  We have a budget that needs to be put in check, and fewer promises made. Both true.   If you look around the world though, China is beginning to collapse and they were closest to overtaking the US.   Russia is already suffering. Britain is rather shabby and the  EU is in the same boat. 

If the chickens do come home to roost, we can sell the eggs for $4 a dozen.

[+OverSword]

On 1/21/2023 at 7:10 AM, Agent0range said:

With Republicans in control of the House, that only happens if they pass an unbalanced spending bill when the current runs out.  That's when they get to show you how "conservative" they really are.

And a prime reason that I’m not a republican. If they followed their own description of what they are supposed to represent I would probably be a republican but they seem to not actually stand for anything.

[Agent0range]

4 hours ago, OverSword said:

And a prime reason that I’m not a republican. If they followed their own description of what they are supposed to represent I would probably be a republican but they seem to not actually stand for anything.

I hear that.  I do consider myself fiscally conservative.  I would love a balanced budget, and especially a surplus.  This, however, has nothing to do with that fight...