Why bury Gobekli Tepe and who did it?

[flying squid]

The city closest to Göbekli Tepe - Urfa - is called the "City of Prophets"(Abraham). Is there a clue there, maybe?

Imagine if a prophet foretold of a cataclysm. If he said the temple/site has to be buried so it can survive. The 'cataclysms' comes and goes, but the GT people who used to burie and rebuild the temples are all deceased. Hence it was forgotten for the next 12,000 years.

Edited February 10, 2023 by flying squid

[Abramelin]

On 2/8/2023 at 11:02 AM, Piney said:

The closest you can come to the pre-Zoroastrian religion of the Indo-Iranians is the Mittani stuff and the Rig Veda which was written before or during the Iranian-Aryan split.

Piney, you mentioned the Zoroastrian religion a couple of times now. And everytime it rang a bell, but I didn't know what that bell told me.

Then I remembered this:

1 - Towers of Silence: The Zoroastrian Sky Burial Tradition

https://slate.com/human-interest/2014/10/towers-of-silence-in-yazd-a-zoroastrian-sky-burial-site.html

2 -

What is believed to be the world's oldest pictograph has been discovered at the 12,000-year-old archaeological site of Göbekli Tepe in the Anatolia Region of Turkey.

The scene on the obelisk shows a human head in a vulture wing with the rest of the body below – experts believe it is an image of a sky burial.

https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/worlds-oldest-pictograph-discovered-gobekli-tepe-shows-decapitated-head-vulture-wing-1511137

3 - Zoroaster/Zaratustra

Classical scholarship in the 6th to 4th century BC believed he existed 6,000 years before Xerxes I's invasion of Greece in 480 BC (Xanthus, Eudoxus, Aristotle, Hermippus), which is a possible misunderstanding of the Zoroastrian four cycles of 3,000 years (i.e. 12,000 years).[4][31][32][33] This belief is recorded by Diogenes Laërtius, and variant readings could place it 600 years before Xerxes I, somewhere before 1000 BC.[24] However, Diogenes also mentions Hermodorus's belief that Zoroaster lived 5,000 years before the Trojan War, which would mean he lived around 6200 BC.[24]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroaster

 

Edited February 11, 2023 by Abramelin

[ShadowSot]

5 hours ago, flying squid said:

The city closest to Göbekli Tepe - Urfa - is called the "City of Prophets"(Abraham). Is there a clue there, maybe?

Imagine if a prophet foretold of a cataclysm. If he said the temple/site has to be buried so it can survive. The 'cataclysms' comes and goes, but the GT people who used to burie and rebuild the temples are all deceased. Hence it was forgotten for the next 12,000 years.

I think we should backtrack to the question of was the site buried on purpose? 

 It's seeming like it wasn't. 

[Abramelin]

9 minutes ago, ShadowSot said:

I think we should backtrack to the question of was the site buried on purpose? 

 It's seeming like it wasn't. 

People here try to find reasons why it was buried on purpose.

Why do you think it wasn't?

[ShadowSot]

Just now, Abramelin said:

People here try to find reasons why it was buried on purpose.

Why do you think it wasn't?

Because I linked to a video where the Archaeoligst in charge of the site explained why they're moving away from the site being intentionally buried. 

[Abramelin]

33 minutes ago, ShadowSot said:

Because I linked to a video where the Archaeoligst in charge of the site explained why they're moving away from the site being intentionally buried. 

Ah, ok, this video:

But isn't Göbekli Tepe located on top of a hill? Or maybe it's Karahan Tepe? (I think it's the latter one).

So, not on a slope, and it couldn't have been filled in by a landslide.

Edit:

Photo of Karahan Tepe:

Edited February 11, 2023 by Abramelin

[Thanos5150]

8 hours ago, Tom1200 said:

That's the full extent of the source.  I clipped it to save on space, not to misrepresent the content. 

I was pointing out that this source is rather out of date, and quite fanciful in its details and interpretations.  I stand by my opinion: the word 'bewilderingly' seems inappropriate in the context.  I suspect the author is using it to hint at a Handcockian earlier advanced civilization, and the oldest enclosures are the product of 'forgotten' technologies.  Which is all well & good for fringe sources, but not National Geographic.  Or maybe I'm wrong?  Are peeps out there bewildered that, with 90% of GT still underground, we don't yet know everything, there just might be more to uncover and learn?

You wrote: 

Quote

With particular reference to post #61:

it's the word 'bewilderingly'.  Why would we be 'bewildered' to learn that the quality of building techniques deteriorated over time?  We see it most obviously in Egypt: after the gradual evolution of the pyramids to their apex at Giza, subsequent pyramids were smaller and inferior in scale and construction.  Are we 'bewildered' by this, or are there perfectly obvious reasons?  

 

Again, this is not the source of their bewilderment but rather the lack of "gradual evolution, apex, and decline" as you note. Its not that it got worse over time but that it started out at the best, a considerably high level for a first, then got worse. 

Quote

Which is all well & good for fringe sources, but not National Geographic.  Or maybe I'm wrong?  Are peeps out there bewildered that, with 90% of GT still underground, we don't yet know everything, there just might be more to uncover and learn? 

I agree it is not "bewildering" but again just that the progenitor has yet to be found. What would be bewildering is if there was none. 

Edited February 11, 2023 by Thanos5150

[Unusual Tournament]

1 hour ago, ShadowSot said:

Because I linked to a video where the Archaeoligst in charge of the site explained why they're moving away from the site being intentionally buried. 

The pillars and stone walls have remained vertical and intact. Natural processes would have damaged these 

[ShadowSot]

2 hours ago, Abramelin said:

Ah, ok, this video:

But isn't Göbekli Tepe located on top of a hill? Or maybe it's Karahan Tepe? (I think it's the latter one).

So, not on a slope, and it couldn't have been filled in by a landslide.

Edit:

Photo of Karahan Tepe:

I would recommend watching the video or reading the transcript where Dr Clare explains it, unless you are stating you know more than he does. 

Ah hell I fully understand why people don't want to spend time watching fringe and pseudoscientific videos but I figured an interview with the closest thing that currently exists to an expert on the site would be something people would watch. 

 I'd really recommend either reading the transcript in full or watching the interview. 

 Now as he states this can't be applied to each building yet, but these are also the main building that have been excavated and where the basis for the intentional burial comes from. 

 But don't take my word for it, I'm an idiot. Listen to the fellow who actually works on the site. 

25 minutes ago, Unusual Tournament said:

The pillars and stone walls have remained vertical and intact. Natural processes would have damaged these 

Actually also covered in the video. There's evidence of the buildings being repaired and shored up while also getting extra support from the nesting pattern. 

[Swede]

9 hours ago, Piney said:

I subscribe to Nat Geo Magazine and they've gone down the tubes.

Especially with their Bible archaeological bull**** and letting that Sam clown lie his ass off on Atlas of Cursed Places on the telly. 

What do you expect? They are now owned by Disney, which also owns ABC, ESPN, etc. Dear Walt is likely spinning in his grave.

Circa 2005-2006 had a series of personal run-ins with Nat Geo. They would repeatedly misquote me. After three calls to their "reporter", correcting their errors, they finally managed to get their story almost correct. They were looking for as much sensationalism as they could extract from the information regarding an interesting new site. Have since refused to deal with Nat Geo on any level.

Word in the markets is that Disney's various antics are resulting in declining market strength. No tears on my part.

.

.

[Abramelin]

10 hours ago, flying squid said:

The city closest to Göbekli Tepe - Urfa - is called the "City of Prophets"(Abraham). Is there a clue there, maybe?

I wonder what's left of all these locations in Turkey:

https://earthquaketrack.com/p/turkey/sanliurfa/recent

[Abramelin]

3 hours ago, ShadowSot said:

I would recommend watching the video or reading the transcript where Dr Clare explains it, unless you are stating you know more than he does. 

I watched the video from the point you told us to watch.

And I know landslides don't go uphill.

But maybe I better read the transcript.

Edited to add:

Where ìs that transcript??

Edited February 11, 2023 by Abramelin

[The Puzzler]

12 hours ago, Piney said:

I subscribe to Nat Geo Magazine and they've gone down the tubes.

Especially with their Bible archaeological bull**** and letting that Sam clown lie his ass off on Atlas of Cursed Places on the telly. 

In 2011 they were quite reputable.

[The Puzzler]

11 hours ago, flying squid said:

The city closest to Göbekli Tepe - Urfa - is called the "City of Prophets"(Abraham). Is there a clue there, maybe?

Imagine if a prophet foretold of a cataclysm. If he said the temple/site has to be buried so it can survive. The 'cataclysms' comes and goes, but the GT people who used to burie and rebuild the temples are all deceased. Hence it was forgotten for the next 12,000 years.

Haran is very close too and the site is also referenced as one built by the people who built Jericho, lived in the Levant and Mesopotamia. Could it actually be a sanctuary of Yahweh? The God who reigned before he disappeared from memory, only to be bought back to life in the time of Abraham….

[Piney]

7 hours ago, Abramelin said:

Piney, you mentioned the Zoroastrian religion a couple of times now. And everytime it rang a bell, but I didn't know what that bell told me.

Then I remembered this:

1 - Towers of Silence: The Zoroastrian Sky Burial Tradition

https://slate.com/human-interest/2014/10/towers-of-silence-in-yazd-a-zoroastrian-sky-burial-site.html

2 -

What is believed to be the world's oldest pictograph has been discovered at the 12,000-year-old archaeological site of Göbekli Tepe in the Anatolia Region of Turkey.

The scene on the obelisk shows a human head in a vulture wing with the rest of the body below – experts believe it is an image of a sky burial.

https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/worlds-oldest-pictograph-discovered-gobekli-tepe-shows-decapitated-head-vulture-wing-1511137

3 - Zoroaster/Zaratustra

Classical scholarship in the 6th to 4th century BC believed he existed 6,000 years before Xerxes I's invasion of Greece in 480 BC (Xanthus, Eudoxus, Aristotle, Hermippus), which is a possible misunderstanding of the Zoroastrian four cycles of 3,000 years (i.e. 12,000 years).[4][31][32][33] This belief is recorded by Diogenes Laërtius, and variant readings could place it 600 years before Xerxes I, somewhere before 1000 BC.[24] However, Diogenes also mentions Hermodorus's belief that Zoroaster lived 5,000 years before the Trojan War, which would mean he lived around 6200 BC.[24]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroaster

 

Sky burials were practiced in India, Tibet and Mongolia too.

And some want to practice them in Texas. 

[cormac mac airt]

24 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

Haran is very close too and the site is also referenced as one built by the people who built Jericho, lived in the Levant and Mesopotamia. Could it actually be a sanctuary of Yahweh? The God who reigned before he disappeared from memory, only to be bought back to life in the time of Abraham….

Doubtful as, depending on source, Abraham is usually given as dating somewhere between 1800 BC and 2000 BC whereas the earliest attestation for Yahweh dates to between 1400 BC and 1200 BC. There’s no evidence Yahweh disappeared from memory that far back. 
 

cormac

[ShadowSot]

1 hour ago, Abramelin said:

I watched the video from the point you told us to watch.

And I know landslides don't go uphill.

But maybe I better read the transcript.

Edited to add:

Where ìs that transcript??

I'm on mobile currently and it's part of the full transcript. 

 However he clearly states that the special buildings were built into a hollow between the hills near the slope. While the later rectangular buildings were built on top of those hills. Erosion and pressures from these structures caused what he's referring to as inundation. 

[ShadowSot]

46 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

In 2011 they were quite reputable.

Yeah but the idea the skill involved decreased is some sort of translation error between whoever they interviewed and the final article.  What happened was the Stone circles got smaller and more enclosed, but the skill involved didn't actually decrease. 

 Somehow becoming smaller turned into a decline in skill. 

[Abramelin]

40 minutes ago, Piney said:

Sky burials were practiced in India, Tibet and Mongolia too.

And some want to practice them in Texas. 

Yes, I know about India, Tibet and Mongolia.

But who was first? Where did the habit - as a ceremonial thing, not as a natural occurrence - come from?

Edited February 11, 2023 by Abramelin

[Abramelin]

27 minutes ago, ShadowSot said:

I'm on mobile currently and it's part of the full transcript. 

 However he clearly states that the special buildings were built into a hollow between the hills near the slope. While the later rectangular buildings were built on top of those hills. Erosion and pressures from these structures caused what he's referring to as inundation. 

Yes, I heard that too. And that's why I wondered: if the infills were caused by slope slides, how did Karahan Tepe, which is - as far as I know - located on top of a hill, get buried?

Edited February 11, 2023 by Abramelin

[The Puzzler]

54 minutes ago, Piney said:

Sky burials were practiced in India, Tibet and Mongolia too.

And some want to practice them in Texas. 

I often wonder if exposure of infants was a form of sky burial? I guess it was.

Paris, in mythology should have died in this way…he was left as a baby to perish on Mt Ida by memory, but he was saved, and bought the downfall of Troy.

Sleeping dogs, babies should be left to lie/die. 

All mythological stories imo have a moral or lesson within them.

I do think Gobekli Tepe could have been a sky burial site.

Edited February 11, 2023 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

19 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

 

19 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

Yes, I heard that too. And that's why I wondered: if the infills were caused by slope slides, how did Karahan Tepe, which is - as far as I know - located on top of a hill, get buried?

I’d be totally interested in any evidence of this.

I remember a thread ages ago, where someone was trying to say Gobekli was covered over naturally, through a possible big gush of water, sediment and got shafted so bad for this thought…but.

[Piney]

27 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

Yes, I know about India, Tibet and Mongolia.

But who was first? Where did the habit - as a ceremonial thing, not as a natural occurrence - come from?

Towers of Silence appeared among the BMAC, who were the earliest mass producers of bronze if I remember correctly.

[Abramelin]

6 minutes ago, Piney said:

Towers of Silence appeared among the BMAC, who were the earliest mass producers of bronze if I remember correctly.

Ok, Yaz I it was (BMAC).

But long before that (= around 2000 bce) ?

Could these practitioners of sky burials have originated in this 'Tepe area' of modern Turkey? And fled to the far east and south-east because of heavy earthquakes like we saw last week?

 

[Abramelin]

18 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

 

I’d be totally interested in any evidence of this.

I remember a thread ages ago, where someone was trying to say Gobekli was covered over naturally, through a possible big gush of water, sediment and got shafted so bad for this thought…but.

Oh no.... Noah's Flood??