whistle-blowers

[Obviousman]

Just how long can one post be? Wow!

Anyway, I notice that most of the people are involved in theology / religion. Only a couple of people with scientific expertise - and their statements are either outside their field of expertise, or have been rejected by other experts in the same field.

Sorry - I am far from being convinced it was an "inside job".

[Sunofone]

its been a while since i have updated this ongoing expose'-- Rosie O'Donnell has thrown her hat into the 9/11 truth fight-- questioning the collapse of bldg 7 on air and sparking debate in front of 30 million viewers-- as soon as she returns from vacation this week the word is ex BYU physics prof steven jones will be on arguing FOR controlled demolitions-- here are a couple of related links

you tube of "the view" promoting 9/11 truth

[Sunofone]

billionaire owner of the dallas mavericks throws hit hat in the ring-- he will be financing a truth dvd to be released from the producers of loose change and will have martin sheen narrating--

Cuban not backing down regarding 9/11 film

Billionaire Mark Cuban, a determined backer of an in process feature film, "Loose Change" remake of a film indicating factions of the US Government were complicit in creating, backing, and fulfilling attacks against the United States on September 11, 2001.

trailor

[Sunofone]

ooohh!! the level of credentials here is way beyond the norm-- a storm is brewing

Patriots Question 9/11 gets the catch.

Former combat fighter pilot (F-15E and F-111). Former President, U.S. Air Force Accident Investigation Board. Also served as Pentagon Weapons Requirement Officer and as a member of the Pentagon's Quadrennial Defense Review. Awarded Distinguish Flying Cross for Heroism, four Air Medals, four Meritorious Service Medals, and nine Aerial Achievement Medals. 20-year Air Force career. Currently commercial airline pilot. Lt. Col. Jeff Latas.

• Member: Pilots for 9/11 Truth

Association Statement: "Pilots for 9/11 Truth is an organization of aviation professionals and pilots throughout the globe that have gathered together for one purpose. We are committed to seeking the truth surrounding the events of the 11th of September 2001. Our main focus concentrates on the four flights, maneuvers performed and the reported pilots. We do not offer theory or point blame. However, we are focused on determining the truth of that fateful day since the United States Government doesn't seem to be very forthcoming with answers."

link

[Redtail]

billionaire owner of the dallas mavericks throws hit hat in the ring-- he will be financing a truth dvd to be released from the producers of loose change and will have martin sheen narrating--

"I don't believe the movie. Not at all," Mr. Cuban explained. "But I do believe that lies in the shadows are far more dangerous than lies you can confront and refute. There probably will be a movie that responds to this one, and we would be more than happy to distribute it as well, for the very same reason."

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...n2.447e560.html

[Sunofone]

"I don't believe the movie. Not at all," Mr. Cuban explained. "But I do believe that lies in the shadows are far more dangerous than lies you can confront and refute. There probably will be a movie that responds to this one, and we would be more than happy to distribute it as well, for the very same reason."

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...n2.447e560.html

actions speak louder than words-- i cant wait for the response

[Sunofone]

this is going to be the straw that breaks the camels back or should i say the one that will burst the proverbial damn-- i am seriously going to love seeing luke from wearechange.org corner silverstein on this issue it will be hillarious especially if it happens in NY and some bystanders actually HEAR what luke has to ask silverstein because then he will surely be lynched!! i have a feeling the mainstream reaction to this reality is going to be much different than that of the dilligent conspiracy theorist that knew all along-- 9/11 truth is likely to enrage the public and i dont think it will be long before we hear about MOB "JUSTICE"-- in fact recently in austin there was a brutal case of lynching where a man hit a child and a crowd from the scene commenced to street justice and yes folks the symbolism here is powerful... the mob ended up killing a bystander that tried to protect the man from the mob(a vigilante mob is a scary incarnation that entails an approach i would never condone as i feel everything can be delegated in a diplomatic manner and the guilty can be incarcerated to suit their crime and serve their time and yes folks a life sentence is just as bad as the death penalty which is criminal and makes us complicit to treason against humanity but at the same time is an unstoppable force-- REVOLUTION FOR LIBERATION!!!)

Hanging Around WTC 7

by amy de miceli Page 1 of 1 page(s)

http://www.opednews.com

The Alex Jones Radio Show had Jason Bermas back on to go over the latest news about World Trade Center Tower 7. Although Bermas slipped and said his first name on national radio, (with an international Internet audience) he is still refusing to confirm the identity of his source, or release the full 20 minute interview (until the unscheduled release of the Final Cut). Some people do not believe a movie release date is the proper timetable for truth. It is clear that the man on the tape is Barry Jennings, Deputy Director, Emergency Services Department, New York City Housing Authority. Mr. Jennings has already gone on the record. On 911 he was on the news covered with debris, like many survivors seen on television that day. Barry Jennings has put his full story on the record with Loose Change, and wanted to remain anonymous until the movie is released. If Jason Bermas had not said his name, that may have been possible, but that is no longer the case.

On the morning of 911 Barry Jennings with Mr. Hess, one of Rudy Giuliani's highest ranking appointed officials, New York city's corporation counsel, (Hess is a Yale and Harvard graduate, a lawyer who has represented the United States in numerous major cases).

It was just after the first attack on the North tower, but before the second plane hit the South Tower, when Barry Jennings escorted Michael Hess to the World Trade Center Tower 7. Mr. Jennings recalls a large number of police officers in the lobby of WTC 7 when they arrived. The two men went up to the 23rd floor, but could not get in, so they went back to the lobby and the police took them up in the freight elevator for a second try. When they arrived on level 23, at the Office of Emergency Management they found it had been recently deserted, "coffee that was on the desk, smoke was still coming off the coffee, I saw half eaten sandwiches".

At that point he made some phone calls, and an un-named individual told them to "leave, and leave right away". Jennings and Hess then proceeded to the stairs, and made it to level 6, when there was an explosion, and the stairwell collapsed from under their feet, Mr. Jennings was actually hanging, and had to climb back up. They made it back up to level 8, where Barry Jennings had a view of the twin towers, both buildings were still standing. This is an important detail, as many debunkers have used Mr. Jennings statements out of context to claim the damage came to WTC 7 from the towers collapsing, not the case according, to Mr. Jennings.

The interview has been cut off where they say how they made it to the lobby, but when they did make it down, Mr. Jennings found it destroyed and littered with dead bodies. He said it looked like, "King Kong had came through it and stepped on it, so destroyed, I didn't know where I was. So destroyed that they had to take me out through a hole in the wall, that I believe the fire department made to get me out." Shortly after he made it out, he was seen on several news channels telling his story.

Mr. Jennings is still confused as to why Building 7 had to come down at all, and does not accept the official reason that the noises he heard were from a fuel oil tank, "I know what I heard, I heard explosions". Michael Hess has not made any public statements about that morning with Barry Jennings, perhaps we can call on wearechange.org to document Michael Hess's account of the events on 911.link

Edited June 24, 2007 by Sunofone

[An Urban Legend]

this is going to be the straw that breaks the camels back or should i say the one that will burst the proverbial damn-- i am seriously going to love seeing luke from wearechange.org corner silverstein on this issue it will be hillarious especially if it happens in NY and some bystanders actually HEAR what luke has to ask silverstein because then he will surely be lynched!! i have a feeling the mainstream reaction to this reality is going to be much different than that of the dilligent conspiracy theorist that knew all along-- 9/11 truth is likely to enrage the public and i dont think it will be long before we hear about MOB "JUSTICE"-- in fact recently in austin there was a brutal case of lynching where a man hit a child and a crowd from the scene commenced to street justice and yes folks the symbolism here is powerful... the mob ended up killing a bystander that tried to protect the man from the mob(a vigilante mob is a scary incarnation that entails an approach i would never condone as i feel everything can be delegated in a diplomatic manner and the guilty can be incarcerated to suit their crime and serve their time and yes folks a life sentence is just as bad as the death penalty which is criminal and makes us complicit to treason against humanity but at the same time is an unstoppable force-- REVOLUTION FOR LIBERATION!!!)

WOW, well damn you Sunfone lol! You found the guy who Loose Change is interviewing ay?! Good work! Like I said in my topic, this is the nail in the coffin. 9/11 being an inside job has now became an axiom! There is nothing any debunker can say which would refute Barry's testimony, because he was there, and neither tower had collapsed, so there was no damage to the building! Read it and weep. Edited June 24, 2007 by An Urban Legend

[Sunofone]

a demolition expert who was also an iraqi veteran and real life hero details the lies of the official govt myth and lays down the law concerning the conclusive evidence for demolition used at the WTC on 9/11--

******************************************************************

Iraq war veteran and experienced demolitions expert blows the cover on 9/11 inside job

National Writer's Syndicate | July 31, 2007

Gibbwake

Meet Torin Wolf. He has a broad and varied background as a US Army Combat Nurse during Operation Iraqi Freedom

building construction contractor, certified structural welder, certified asbestos and hazardous materials worker, experienced demolitions expert, teacher, radio show host, and well studied 9/11 truth activist. Torin knows how to put a building up, and bring the same building down in its own footprint. Torin's free presentation, “Taking the Red Pill” was hosted by Brave New Books on 1904 Guadalupe in Austin last Saturday, June 23rd at 7 pm.

Torin is proud of his native Cherokee heritage and his mother is the Band Historian of the White River Band Cherokee from the central United States. Since he received his GED at age 14, saying he is a smart guy is putting it lightly. For over 12 years he worked as a hazardous materials contractor specializing in asbestos abatement and concrete construction sampling. Add to his resume the fact that he designed and implemented well over 100 controlled demolitions. He was not just helping at a lower level in the demolitions - he was the guy responsible for calling the shots. Afterwards, he became a certified structural steel welder and worked in heavy and mega construction for over 5 years in locations around the world including several skyscrapers.

Ironically, Torin signed his papers to join the army on September 11th, 2000. He knew something was wrong with the official 9/11 story when his army handlers took his squad into a room just in time to watch the buildings collapse. With his demolitions experience, he immediately knew those towers could not have fallen like that without explosives. He went on to serve “with honor and distinction” with the 21st Combat Support Hospital in Mosul, Iraq during the first part of Operation Iraqi Freedom and earned the Bronze Star with V device for valor in combat.

While saving over 120 lives, Torin earned the Combat Medical Badge by providing medical care to US, allied, enemy soldiers, and civilians under combat conditions. Torin's arms display Samoan life saving tattoos, each line and symbol representing a group of lives saved. The army would like you to think he wasn't in Iraq, but unfortunately for them, Torin appears in a recent documentary filmed there. A true hero helping save lives in the middle east, Torin can be seen in section 4 of a PBS documentary called “Life and Death in the War Zone.”

With Torins impressive list of qualifications, his unwavering voice holds a power that shatters the lies of 9/11 sold to us by the government and mainstream media, “The official story we've been told about 9/11 is absolutely, physically impossible.”

Those words are not just backed up with his qualifications because his presentation goes through the hard physics as well. The presentation starts out with a serious warning that reminds us the state our country is in after the false flag attack and ensuing tyrannical hijacking of the government on that September morning. A hijacking not by Bin Laden, not by Al Qeada, but by a group of tyrants that orchestrated and benefited from 9/11. “Unless you want to be charged as a terrorist, I suggest you leave the room now. This is technically seditious material and you can be charged under section 802 of the Patriot Act just for being here.”

This upsets a few people near the front row. Everyone looks around to see if that will scare anyone off but luckily no one leaves and the presentation continues. The bookstore is now filled with former American citizens, now terrorists, simply because they want to learn the truth of what happened on 9/11. If you think...continued here

This is a PowerPoint presentation written by Torin Wolf who has an extensive resumee in controlled demolition, heavy construction, and hazardous materials. It is fully sourced and pulls no punches regarding the lies of 9/11. It is the basis upon which a 9/11 Truth film is being produced. It is copyrighted but please download it and share it freely so long as the content is not changed in any way.

POWER POINT PRESENTATION

[Sunofone]

apparently torin and jennings testimonies are sparking an academic rebellion! its time to expose the LIE-- 9/11 was an inside job to get the natural gas pipeline forced through afghanistan and then steal iraqs oil all the while orchestrating a "manufactured scarcity" hoax with opec-- these fake wars enabling the suppression of technology and seperation of classes are CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY -- REVOLUTION FOR LIBERATION!

********************************************************************************

**************

National Academy Of Sciences

Member Calls For New 9/11

Investigation Says Official

Explanation A 'Fraud'

8-28-7

World renowned scientist, Lynn Margulis, Ph.D., today severely criticized the official account of 9/11 and called for a new investigation, "I suggest that those of us aware and concerned demand that the glaringly erroneous official account of 9/11 be dismissed as a fraud and a new, thorough, and impartial investigation be undertaken."

One of America's most prominent scientists, Dr. Margulis is Distinguished University Professor in the Department of Geosciences, University of Massachusetts - Amherst. She was elected to the National Academy of Sciences in 1983 and served as Chairman of the Academy's Space Science Board Committee on Planetary Biology and Chemical Evolution. In 1999, President Bill Clinton presented Dr. Margulis with the http://www.nsf.gov/od/nms/recip_details.cfm?recip_id=228

National Medal of Science, America's highest honor for scientific achievement, "for her outstanding contributions to understanding of the development, structure, and evolution of living things, for inspiring new research in the biological, climatological, geological and planetary sciences, and for her extraordinary abilities as a teacher and communicator of science to the public."

In her statement on

http://www.patriotsquestion911.com/professors.html#Margulis

PatriotsQuestion911.com, Dr. Margulis referred to 9/11 as "this new false-flag operation, which has been used to justify the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq as well as unprecedented assaults on research, education, and civil liberties". She compared 9/11 to several self-inflicted attacks that had been used in the past to arouse people's fear and hatred and justify war, including the sinking of the USS Maine in Havana Harbor, the Reichstag Fire, and Operation Himmler, which Germany used to justify the invasion of Poland, the trigger for World War II.

Dr. Margulis credited "the research and clear writing by

http://www.patriotsquestion911.com/professors.html#Griffin

David Ray Griffin in his fabulous books about 9/11" for providing much of the information that formed her opinion about 9/11. She specifically lauded http://www.interlinkbooks.com/product_info.php?products_id=

1326&osCsid=5a22b94fffd724962a118f454c5d7194

The New Pearl Harbor and http://www.interlinkbooks.com/product_info.php?products_

id=983&osCsid=5a22b94fffd724962a118f454c5d7194

The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions, "which provides overwhelming evidence that the official story is contradictory, incomplete, and unbelievable."

Internationally acclaimed for her ground-breaking scientific work, Dr. Margulis is an elected member of http://www.worldacademy.org/

The World Academy of Art and Science, an organization of 500 of the world's leading thinkers, chosen for eminence in art, the natural and social sciences, and the humanities. And in 2006, she was selected as one of "The 20th Century's 100 Most Important Inspirational Leaders" by the editors of http://www.resurgence.org/index.htm

Resurgence magazine.

Dr. Margulis' full statement can be read at

http://www.patriotsquestion911.com/professors.html#Margulis

[Sunofone]

where are theskeptics??

[Sunofone]

i hope a VIGILANTE LYNCH MOB will not impede in the lock up for life of the scum responsible for 9/11 and the corrupt global financial mafia--

********************************************************************************

**

Joel S. Hirschhorn, PhD

September 6, 2007 at 20:48:25

Former Congressional Office of Technology Assessment Senior Staff Member Calls for New Investigation of 9/11

Sept. 5, 2007 –

In an online editorial yesterday, Joel S. Hirschhorn, PhD, former Senior Staff Member of the Congressional Office of Technology Assessment (OTA), called for a new investigation of 9/11. “First, let the technical truth emerge. Then, if necessary, cope with the inevitable political, conspiracy and other questions. But let us not allow a possible painful truth block the primary task of determining once and for all what caused the collapse of the WTC towers and building no. 7.”

Dr. Hirschhorn is a nationally recognized engineer who has testified before Congress more than 50 times on technology, science, and environmental issues. In addition to his work for the OTA, Dr. Hirschhorn also served as Director of Environment, Energy and Natural Resources for the National Governors Association.

Dr. Hirschhorn admitted to his own personal “growing skepticism about the official WTC story”. He wrote “analyses by many experts reveal the collapse of the three WTC buildings was not caused by the two airplanes exploding into the twin towers.” He noted “the general view is that the buildings were brought down by controlled demolition.”

...cont

[Sunofone]

the truth movement tsunami cannot be held back and the fascist mental propaganda dam is about ot BLOW!!! the coming days will see the emergence of the final loosechange cut and the end of the lies being spewed by the fascist regime that has wrested control from the republic and continues a false left right paradigm in order to farm america for mindless grunts to commit genocide in our name-- end the tyranny now and expose the lie in the official wtc 9/11 lie to your neighbors,friends and family as if your life depends on it!-- another forgotton interview that will rock the foundations of the official LIES

America's Number One Collapse Expert Thought WTC Bombed

FDNY commander said south tower implosion "too even" to be caused by jet fuel

Paul Joseph Watson

Prison Planet

Monday, September 10, 2007

A man described as "the premiere collapse expert in the country" thought the collapse of the south tower of the WTC was caused by explosives and not jet fuel, before the implosion of the north tower killed him on 9/11.

Deputy Chief Ray Downey, the head of the FDNY's Special Operations Command, was also described by colleagues as "the most knowledgeable person on building collapses there was," and 9/11 Commissioner Timothy Roemer referred to Downey as a "very, very respected expert on building collapse."

According to a World Trade Center Task Force interview with FDNY' Chaplain Father John Delendick, immediately after the collapse of the south tower at 9:59am, Delendick met with Downey below the nearby World Financial Center and asked him if jet fuel had brought about the bizarre and sudden implosion of the building. According to Delendick, Downey "said at that point he thought there were bombs up there because it was too even."

Downey was a 39-year FDNY veteran and the most highly decorated firefighter in its history.

[Sunofone]

this is going to be two parts-- a change of heart and further testimony to the real reason for 9/11 and going into the middle east

********************************************************************************

************************

Mainstream Journalist: I Was Wrong On 9/11 Truth

Blogger apologizes for ill-informed faulty research after urging readers to give truthers the finger

Paul Joseph Watson

Prison Planet

Wednesday, September 12, 2007

A mainstream journalist who yesterday urged his readers to give 9/11 truth protesters in Seattle the finger has completely reversed his position, apologized to the protesters and promised to help get the word out on full disclosure of 9/11 truth.

In our article yesterday, we chastised Seattle Post-Intelligencer blogger Ron Schott for saying 9/11 truth activists were insulting the victims, heroes and family members of 9/11 when in fact many victims, first responders and family members now lead the 9/11 truth movement.

This prompted a barrage of comments on Schott's blog which was initially removed from the website altogether.

However, yesterday evening Schott posted a retraction and an apology, stating that his "Generalization of the activists was harsh and unwarranted."

"The posting of my blog was a spur of the moment decision that I now know was done without forethought and without proper research," writes Schott.

Groups like 911truth.org and many others are not the normal "9/11 was a conspiracy" people you see ranting on the street, but rather are grassroots organizations working toward full-disclosure of the facts surrounding the atrocities of Sept. 11, 2001. It was my uneducated assumptions that tied these groups to the outlying activists that I lumped them in with and I apologize for that.

I would like to personally apologize to Paul Joseph Watson of PrisonPlanet.com, Patrick St James, and John Karlo of We Are Seattle Change, as they were the only respondents to leave their names. I invite any of those men to contact me regarding future information about their organizations and the work they are doing to benefit those affected by the events of Sept. 11.

In Schott's response to the comments underneath the blog, he offers to work with 9/11 truth activists to get the word out and says he has undergone a "paradigm shift" as a consequence of his research into information presented to him by truthers.

cont here

The video employs clips from a 2004 "60 Minutes" Interview with 2001-2003 Secretary of the Treasury, Paul O'Neil. O'Neil,a Permanent Member of the then formed NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL (NSC), was eventually FIRED in 2003, for what he OPPOSED and witnessed in the Early days of the JUST elected 2001 Bush Whitehouse.

He was appalled at the Secrecy and Contradictions in the George Bush he thought he knew. It was apparent a new agenda was rolling...and he wanted NO part in it.

[lerocket]

Phil Schneider was one of the best ever.

[badeskov]

the truth movement tsunami cannot be held back and the fascist mental propaganda dam is about ot BLOW!!! the coming days will see the emergence of the final loosechange cut and the end of the lies being spewed by the fascist regime that has wrested control from the republic and continues a false left right paradigm in order to farm america for mindless grunts to commit genocide in our name-- end the tyranny now and expose the lie in the official wtc 9/11 lie to your neighbors,friends and family as if your life depends on it!-- another forgotton interview that will rock the foundations of the official LIES

From the Ray Downey interview quoted:

...was also described by colleagues as "the most knowledgeable person on building collapses there was,"...

And in what sense was that? Was he a structural engineer? Or was he just the best among his piers? Funny that architects and engineers in that field almost all agree that the official story is the correct one and the demolition story is absurd.

Honestly, it is hard to put any credibility in that story when others have presented detailed numerical analysis showing exactly what happened...

Best,

Badeskov

[Sunofone]

Funny that architects and engineers in that field almost all agree that the official story is the correct one and the demolition story is absurd.

Honestly, it is hard to put any credibility in that story when others have presented detailed numerical analysis showing exactly what happened...

Best,

Badeskov

great then you will have no problem locating the names of these architects and engineers and even better the "alledged" detailed numerical analysis and posting them here-- i can assure you nothing you can find will adequately account for the tower cores or the perfectly symetrical implosion of bldg 7-- i await your attempt to prove me wrong

[badeskov]

great then you will have no problem locating the names of these architects and engineers and even better the "alledged" detailed numerical analysis and posting them here-- i can assure you nothing you can find will adequately account for the tower cores or the perfectly symetrical implosion of bldg 7-- i await your attempt to prove me wrong

How about taking a look at flyingswan's post?! He did the job for me It is a detailed peer reviewed paper on the causes for the collapse. It tells you how and why, and with plenty of detail. Thus, it is not only physically possible, but also a very likely event to happen under the given circumstances. That explanation is in my point of view a lot more likely than the building was rigged with explosives (in my honest opinion, rather absurd) or directed energy weapons (outright impossible) were used. Now, if you still believe that explosives were used, then I would challenge you to explain to me how two buildings this complex could:

1) Be rigged without nobody noticing it

2) An estimate of the amount of explosives required (no, those calculations have for obvious reasons not been made; or, rather, I couldn't find them - but it is a lot)

3) Why they would need to bring down WTC in the first place

You can also find some good links here. That is the civil engineering portal, and very saying, you don't find anybody mentioning explosives or otherwise as the cause. Also, a little from University of Sydney here.

Best,

Badeskov

[badeskov]

great then you will have no problem locating the names of these architects and engineers and even better the "alledged" detailed numerical analysis and posting them here-- i can assure you nothing you can find will adequately account for the tower cores or the perfectly symetrical implosion of bldg 7-- i await your attempt to prove me wrong

By the way, I never did manage to figure out why this Ray Downey was considered an expert on demolition. Any information on this would be most helpful.

Best,

Badeskov

[Sunofone]

How about taking a look at flyingswan's post?! He did the job for me It is a detailed peer reviewed paper on the causes for the collapse. It tells you how and why, and with plenty of detail. Thus, it is not only physically possible, but also a very likely event to happen under the given circumstances. That explanation is in my point of view a lot more likely than the building was rigged with explosives (in my honest opinion, rather absurd) or directed energy weapons (outright impossible) were used. Now, if you still believe that explosives were used, then I would challenge you to explain to me how two buildings this complex could:

1) Be rigged without nobody noticing it

2) An estimate of the amount of explosives required (no, those calculations have for obvious reasons not been made; or, rather, I couldn't find them - but it is a lot)

3) Why they would need to bring down WTC in the first place

You can also find some good links here. That is the civil engineering portal, and very saying, you don't find anybody mentioning explosives or otherwise as the cause. Also, a little from University of Sydney here.

Best,

Badeskov

the link you provided by swan is a joke-- it does not account for the 47 solid steel box columns and trie to account for the freefall collaspe by stating that the floors above the impact zone "fell" 12ft there by hammering the lower floors below with such force to overcome the resistance yet no where does he account for the 12 ft of material(core columns,elevator shafts,drywall or stairwells) completely destroying all credibility-- now on to your next link that begins with a nist and 9/11 commission analysis which has been admitted was a farce by the very investigators--

The 9/11 Commission was hamstrung by official obstruction. It never managed to ascertain the whole truth of what happened on September 11 2001.

The chair and vice chair of the 9/11 Commission, respectively Thomas Kean and Lee Hamilton, assert in their book, Without Precedent, that they were "set up to fail" and were starved of funds to do a proper investigation. They also confirm that they were denied access to the truth and misled by senior officials in the Pentagon and the federal aviation authority;

and that this obstruction and deception led them to contemplate slapping officials with criminal charges.

Despite the many public statements by 9/11 commissioners and staff members acknowledging they were repeatedly lied to, not a single person has ever been charged, tried, or even reprimanded, for lying to the 9/11 Commission.

and here the first quote from your second link

(This is an initial suggestion, originally written on Sept 11 2001 (with some minor subsequent changes) on one possible reason for failure, and should not be regarded as official advice.)

[lyoung347]

badeskov, Thank you for replying replying to my question in another post

Now, if you still believe that explosives were used, then I would challenge you to explain to me how two buildings this complex could:

1) Be rigged without nobody noticing it

George W. Bush's brother was on the board of directors of a company providing electronic security for the World Trade Center, Dulles International Airport and United Airlines, according to public records. The company was backed by an investment firm, the Kuwait-American Corp., also linked for years to the Bush family.

Marvin P. Bush, the president's youngest brother, was a director at Stratesec(Securacom) from 1993 to fiscal year 2000. But the White House has not publicly disclosed Bush connections in any of its responses to 9/11, nor has it mentioned that another Bush-linked business had done security work for the facilities attacked.

After the first attack on the World Trade Center, in 1993, the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey began a multimillion-dollar, multiyear revamping of security in and around the Twin Towers

http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0204-06.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvin_Bush

Interview with Scott Forbes a Senior Database Administrator for Fiduciary Trust and used to work in the South Tower of the WTC.

Talks about "power down" notified by the Port Authority.

http://killtown.blogspot.com/2005/12/scott...-interview.html

2) An estimate of the amount of explosives required (no, those calculations have for obvious reasons not been made; or, rather, I couldn't find them - but it is a lot)

Not too sure, I would assume alot but some people believe that thermite was used (along with explosives?)

3) Why they would need to bring down WTC in the first place

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

Operation Northwoods, or Northwoods, was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of simulated or real terrorism and violence on US soil or against US interests, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government of Fidel Castro.

Just to point out some odd coincidences

[Sunofone]

also on the record we have...

Bomb Sniffing Dogs Removed From WTC Days Before Attack

Jon Rappoport | June 28 2004

As you’ll see from the Newsday excerpt below, tight security at the Twin Towers in NYC was lightened in the days just before the 9/11 attacks.

What makes the particular removal of bomb-sniffing dogs so important are statements from firemen that they heard bombs going off in the Towers on 9/11, as they were carrying out their rescue operation.

Naturally, if people were planting bombs in the Towers, they would not have wanted those charges to be discovered by trained dogs prior to 9/11.

This matter of the dogs and the statements of firemen about bombs were completely ignored by the 9/11 commission.

Heightened Security Alert Had Just Been Lifted

By Curtis L. Taylor and Sean Gardiner

STAFF WRITERS

September 12, 2001

The World Trade Center was destroyed just days after a heightened security alert was lifted at the landmark 110-story towers, security personnel said yesterday.

Daria Coard, 37, a guard at Tower One, said the security detail had been working 12-hour shifts for the past two weeks because of numerous phone threats. But on Thursday, bomb-sniffing dogs were abruptly removed.

"Today was the first day there was not the extra security," Coard said. "We were protecting below. We had the ground covered. We didn't figure they would do it with planes. There is no way anyone could have stopped that."

Security guard Hermina Jones said officials had recently taken steps to secure the towers against aerial attacks by installing bulletproof windows and fireproof doors in the 22nd-floor computer command center...

Edited September 14, 2007 by Sunofone

[badeskov]

the link you provided by swan is a joke-- it does not account for the 47 solid steel box columns and trie to account for the freefall collaspe by stating that the floors above the impact zone "fell" 12ft there by hammering the lower floors below with such force to overcome the resistance yet no where does he account for the 12 ft of material(core columns,elevator shafts,drywall or stairwells) completely destroying all credibility.

By all means of respect, but it is your rebuttal that is a joke. Have you ever considered how much energy the top 31 floors actually hit the 79th floor with when it collapsed? No, I thought not. But it's all in the static versus dynamic loads. But lets do a little bit of math.

The energy E in the top 31 floors can be estimated from this simple formula:

(1) E=0.5*m*V^2

where m is the mass of the 31 floors and V is the velocity that the top part had attained at the time of impact. Lets find the attained velocity first. That is given by

(2) V(t)=V(t=0)+a*t = a*t (assuming the initial velocity at t=0 is 0).

where a is the acceleration (in this case gravity = 9.82m/s/s) and t is the time under which acceleration is exerted. We know the distance is 12 feet (roughly 4m). As distance, d, traversed is found from the velocity, we have:

(3) d(t)=d(t=0) + V(t=0)*t+0.5*a*T^2 = 0.5*a*t^2 <=> t=sqrt(2*d(t)/a) (assuming V(t=0)=0 and d(t=0)=0)

Inserting numbers (a=9.82m/s/s and d=4m) we find that t=0.90s. Inserting this into (2) we get V=8.84m/s (that is 31.8km/h or 19.9mph). That is actually fairly fast. Now, lets make a mass estimate. The whole WTC weighed in around 425,000,000kg (there has been some discussion on this number, so I took a number in the lower end). The top 31 floors constituted ~28% of the whole structure, so lets assume that the top part weighed in at 119,000,000kg. We'll take 75% of that number, as more mass was in the bottom than in the top, which gives us 82,250,000kg. Please note that this is just a very rough estimate. Inserting into (1) we get:

E=0.5*82,250,000kg*(8.84m/s)^2=3,213,737,800 or roughly 3.2GJ (Gigajoule).

That is quite a lot. No, check that, that is a humongous amount of energy. A metric ton of TNT has an energy equivalent of ~4.1GJ (ref). So the energy released would correspond to about 780kg of TNT on the floor the top part fell on, with all the energy directed downwards. That is why it collapsed; no floor can ever hope of resisting such force.

Now, please tell me where I am wrong in the above and tell me how the impacted floor could withstand such force.

Best,

Badeskov

PS: I never got the answer to what makes Mr. Downey an expert and why his statement has any merit.

Edited for typo.

Edited September 14, 2007 by badeskov

[Sunofone]

regaurdless of your erroneous calculations the fact remains that no amount of force could have produced the collapses witnessed absent the use of explosives-- resistance is not something you can just write off by calculating the weight and force of the material above the alledged integrity failure-- did you know cnn and the bbc announced the collaspse of bldg 7 while it was standing behind them and witnesses have come forward testifying to a "countdown" preceding the demolition of bldg 7

[badeskov]

regaurdless of your erroneous calculations the fact remains that no amount of force could have produced the collapses witnessed absent the use of explosives-- resistance is not something you can just write off by calculating the weight and force of the material above the alledged integrity failure-- did you know cnn and the bbc announced the collaspse of bldg 7 while it was standing behind them and witnesses have come forward testifying to a "countdown" preceding the demolition of bldg 7

By all means of respect, would you please point out where my calculations are erroneous? That would be very nice to know. Something tells me that you have no idea of what I am talking about and never made it past high school physics (which the above is).

Secondly, obviously you cannot write of resistance; but overcoming that resistance is a question of applying enough force. And if you don't think 780kg of TNT is enough, in all honesty, your incomprehension of general mechanics and physics is astounding. Thus, unless you can tell me why I am wrong this discussion is pointless as you will have put this discussion beyond any reason and into the realm of futility and absurdity.

Best,

Badeskov

PS: I am still waiting for the answer to why Mr. Downey can be called a credible expert.

Edited for typo.

Edited September 14, 2007 by badeskov