New DNA evidence gives ‘definitive proof’ that big cats are prowling UK

[Eldorado]

New DNA evidence has provided us with ‘definitive proof’ that black panthers and other big cats are living in Britain.

By 'big cats' we're not really talking about Garfield here - more like scary leopards with black fur.

It seems that the single black-haired strand which was found on a barbed wire fence at a Gloucester farm - the result of a viscous sheep attack - has suggested that there had been some 'unusual predatory' activity taking place.

Video footage of a large black animal was also captured a few miles from where the strand of hair was found.

https://www.ladbible.com/community/dna-evidence-definitive-proof-big-cats-prowling-uk-364746-20230511

[papageorge1]

If they are of a known species, it doesn't seem to me the term 'cryptozoological' is really appropriate here.

[Guyver]

46 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

If they are of a known species, it doesn't seem to me the term 'cryptozoological' is really appropriate here.

“Crypto” also means hidden right?  People have been claiming to see these big cats for a long time, and many people were skeptical and did not accept the reports as factual.  Now, the eyewitnesses have been proven correct.

[Trelane]

It will be interesting how they proceed to determine if this was a solitary animal or if there are more out and about. Enterprising hunters and trackers should be involved if this is true.

[papageorge1]

6 hours ago, Guyver said:

“Crypto” also means hidden right?  People have been claiming to see these big cats for a long time, and many people were skeptical and did not accept the reports as factual.  Now, the eyewitnesses have been proven correct.

Actually this doesn't fit the dictionary definition:

cryp·to·zo·ol·o·gy

[ˌkriptəˌzōˈäləjē, ˌkriptəˌzo͞oˈäləjē]

NOUN

the search for and study of animals whose existence or survival is disputed or unsubstantiated, such as the Loch Ness monster and the yeti.

[psyche101]

12 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

Actually this doesn't fit the dictionary definition:

cryp·to·zo·ol·o·gy

[ˌkriptəˌzōˈäləjē, ˌkriptəˌzo͞oˈäləjē]

NOUN

the search for and study of animals whose existence or survival is disputed or unsubstantiated, such as the Loch Ness monster and the yeti.

So your saying that big cats in Britain are not disputed?

[papageorge1]

7 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

So your saying that big cats in Britain are not disputed?

The definition doesn't say anything about 'in Britian'.

[psyche101]

41 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

The definition doesn't say anything about 'in Britian'.

Well that's a silly comment.

Britain isn't the only place on earth where something can be disputed. .

Do you know what "dispute" means??

[Resume]

I don't know about cryptid, but this sure is cryptic:

https://www.discoverwildlife.com/news/new-dna-evidence-confirms-presence-of-big-cats-in-the-uk/

Quote

Long-held rumours of big cats living in Britain have been inflamed by the results of a DNA test, apparently revealing strands of black animal hair from a barbwire fence belong to a big cat.

The hair was collected following a sheep attack on a farm in Gloucestershire in 2022. A forensic laboratory then analysed it using mitochondrial DNA methods to ascertain a 99.9% match to the leopard species Panthera Pardus . . .

This time, the team recovered the clumps of hair and sent them to a laboratory for Mitochondrial DNA analysis. They were found to be a 99.9% match to the leopard Panthera Pardus.

The laboratory has requested to remain anonymous.

 

Bolding mine.

Why in the world would the lab wish to remain anonymous?  What are it's credentials, it's CV? This is potentially a huge development and one would think you'd want the kudos.  Also too, and more importantly --if you're doing science-- who replicated the results by either running a blast themselves, or examined the lab's blast results if there is no sample left?

Let's not forget Sykes Yeti debacle where his initial DNA claims were novel bear hybrid but further data found it to be just a Himalayan brown bear. Or worse, Melba Ketchup's results, which were found to be "gibberish" by biologist/geneticist Dr. David Winter. 

It would have been nice if the BBC Wildlife digital editor Tanya Jackson asked these follow-up questions; maybe someone else will.

 

[Resume]

14 hours ago, Guyver said:

“Crypto” also means hidden right?  People have been claiming to see these big cats for a long time, and many people were skeptical and did not accept the reports as factual.  Now, the eyewitnesses have been proven correct.

Bolding mine.

No, they have not.  If the DNA blast is independently replicated and attested to, the best we can say is it came from Panthera; it can make no claim further than this as all the other sightings are individual, independent events.  It can be said they are possible sightings if this DNA blast holds up to scrutiny.

As of right now, a film company is claiming an "anonymous lab" said a thing; there is no information as to the chain of custody of the sample, or any indication that the blast has been confirmed independently, which is obviously important for any scientific claim.

Edited May 16 by Resume

[Chaldon]

Shouldn't it be "Panthera Britannica"?

[papageorge1]

9 hours ago, psyche101 said:

Well that's a silly comment.

Britain isn't the only place on earth where something can be disputed. .

Do you know what "dispute" means??

You totally misunderstood my comment. The definition 

the search for and study of animals whose existence or survival is disputed or unsubstantiated, such as the Loch Ness monster and the yeti.

 

It's about disputed animals not disputed locations. It is not talking about whether a foreign species might be  populating an area. Nessie and yeti are disputed animals.

[Resume]

1 hour ago, Chaldon said:

Shouldn't it be "Panthera Britannica"?

Sure, if it were demonstrated to be a indigenous species; but the DNA claim being made is Panthera Pardus.  The production company's proposed title for their documentary is Panthera Britannia Declassified which seems a bit . . . premature.

[Gilbert Syndrome]

16 hours ago, Trelane said:

It will be interesting how they proceed to determine if this was a solitary animal or if there are more out and about. Enterprising hunters and trackers should be involved if this is true.

That's kind of my thinking. They've basically just confirmed that at least one large cat is in the UK, which isn't all that surprising seeing as they have been kept as pets by some people here, legally and illegally. This doesn't necessarily lend credence to every big cat sighting across the country, and many photographs and videos I've seen are undoubtedly just average cats.

[Gilbert Syndrome]

11 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

Actually this doesn't fit the dictionary definition:

cryp·to·zo·ol·o·gy

[ˌkriptəˌzōˈäləjē, ˌkriptəˌzo͞oˈäləjē]

NOUN

the search for and study of animals whose existence or survival is disputed or unsubstantiated, such as the Loch Ness monster and the yeti.

Wasn't the title of Bernard "H's" (Not gonna attempt to spell his name without googling and I CBA googling) book "on the trail of hidden animals"?

[Gilbert Syndrome]

51 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

You totally misunderstood my comment. The definition 

the search for and study of animals whose existence or survival is disputed or unsubstantiated, such as the Loch Ness monster and the yeti.

 

It's about disputed animals not disputed locations. It is not talking about whether a foreign species might be  populating an area. Nessie and yeti are disputed animals.

The animal is disputed as far it living in the UK. 

[Resume]

28 minutes ago, Gilbert Syndrome said:

That's kind of my thinking. They've basically just confirmed that at least one large cat is in the UK, which isn't all that surprising seeing as they have been kept as pets by some people here, legally and illegally. This doesn't necessarily lend credence to every big cat sighting across the country, and many photographs and videos I've seen are undoubtedly just average cats.

Exactly.  It is possible some big cat sightings may be credible as exotic pet escapes have been documented; also possible is that human beings are just mistaken, as has been thoroughly documented as well. We are pattern-seeking animals and it is far better to imagine a lion in the long grass that isn't there, than to miss the one that actually is.

[Jon the frog]

One University researcher got financing for years in Quebec to prove the existance of eastern cougar population in Quebec. One of his fur trap got seal DNA in the middle of the forest... possibly from a missidentified fur used to create more ''funding''.

It's possible to have an escaping pet but a greedy researcher is also a possibility.

Ah yeah... house cat have 96% DNA match to tiger and human have 90% match to a cat.

Edited May 16 by Jon the frog

[Resume]

3 hours ago, Jon the frog said:

One University researcher got financing for years in Quebec to prove the existance of eastern cougar population in Quebec. One of his fur trap got seal DNA in the middle of the forest... possibly from a missidentified fur used to create more ''funding''.

It's possible to have an escaping pet but a greedy researcher is also a possibility.

Ah yeah... house cat have 96% DNA match to tiger and human have 90% match to a cat.

Very good points.

[Gumball]

Who would have thunk that folk who released photos of big cats in the UK would actually be telling the truth?

[MysteryMike]

Exactly how many such animals are roaming wild, however, remains unclear.

Easy answer. Exotic pets that escaped or were released. Simple as that.

[psyche101]

12 hours ago, papageorge1 said:

You totally misunderstood my comment. The definition 

the search for and study of animals whose existence or survival is disputed or unsubstantiated, such as the Loch Ness monster and the yeti.

 

It's about disputed animals not disputed locations. It is not talking about whether a foreign species might be  populating an area. Nessie and yeti are disputed animals.

Is english your first language?

[Chaldon]

15 hours ago, Resume said:

Sure, if it were demonstrated to be a indigenous species; but the DNA claim being made is Panthera Pardus.  The production company's proposed title for their documentary is Panthera Britannia Declassified which seems a bit . . . premature.

Yeah. But I meant that they missed a letter, in Latin there should be an additional "c" (which I think adds to their competence, or those who reprinted it).

Edited May 17 by Chaldon

[OpenMindedSceptic]

I've had my own big cat experience in the UK. 

I used to live in a village for about 6 years. Walked the dog one night, in the dark, and there was this cat sound like no other from the other side of a chain link fence along one of the old footpaths (no longer a public right of way these days). Even my dog just froze to the spot and he was a boisterous lab. There had been sightings in the region of 1 to 5 a year within a mile of the village. One was a zoo keeper who identified the cat (I'd have to find the article again to see what he stated it was).

On mentioning my experience to one of the older villagers, his demeanour changed. After a pause, he said, come with me and I'll let you into the secret. He then takes me to one of the cat's hang outs /lair. The smell was weird. He said, matter of factly, it sleeps here often, it's why the farmer has a gun with him now. Not more than two weeks later, another local villager is in the local press stating she had seen a big cat in the fields at the back of her house - little wonder as it lived within 5 metres of the boundary fence of her garden. So frightened by the sighting, she moved.

Now I see this post about the DNA match.

They are here in the UK for sure.

 

[rjos]

I was driving and slowed down for what I thought to be a Deer, Fox or large dog. As I got closer, approx 50m It was a huge cat. It happened in midlands A5 road near Rugby. Wish I had a dash cam. This was about 2 weeks ago

Edited May 17 by rjos