Unusual Tournament Posted June 11, 2023 #1 Share Posted June 11, 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 11, 2023 Author #2 Share Posted June 11, 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 11, 2023 Author #3 Share Posted June 11, 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 11, 2023 Author #4 Share Posted June 11, 2023 (edited) Ukrainian media is saying that the current Western equipped units dedicated to the counterattacks will last no more than 2-3 weeks at the current rate of operation. Also, thou Ukrainian forces have opened up some areas and pushed through lines of defence they have failed, so far to sweep aside Russian troops. Edited June 11, 2023 by Unusual Tournament 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 11, 2023 Author #5 Share Posted June 11, 2023 According to Russian sources, Ukrainian troops have captured Neskuchnoye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 11, 2023 Author #6 Share Posted June 11, 2023 Ukrainian sources claim that their forces have captured also Blagodatne in the Donetsk region Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Occult1 Posted June 11, 2023 #7 Share Posted June 11, 2023 (edited) I expect Ukraine to retake some settlements but no major gains. What the counteroffensive will demonstrate is that there is a core 20% of Ukraine's territory that the Ukrainian military will not be able to get back. It would take overwhelming firepower, air support and at least a 3-to-1 ratio in manpower. The Russians have been entrenched for over a year in the east and south and have corrected the deficiencies in their positions. How many people will need to die before the West realize the only way to resolve this conflict is negotiation? Edited June 11, 2023 by Occult1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 11, 2023 #8 Share Posted June 11, 2023 ⚡️Putin wants to take PMC Wagner troops from Prigozhin The conflict is gaining momentum, now, before July 1, all volunteer units must sign a contract with the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation - this also applies to Wagner PMC. What it does is the complete transition of the Wagnerites to the RF Ministry of Defense. Prygozhyn reacted to the order from Ruzzian defence ministry. He stated that the Wagnerites would not be subordinate to the RF Ministry of Defense. “Those orders and decrees that Shoigu forms, they apply to employees of the Ministry of Defense and military personnel. PMC "Wagner" will not sign any contracts with Shoigu. PMC "Wagner" is organically built into the overall system, PMC "Wagner" coordinates its actions with the generals on the right, left, with unit commanders. What can happen after this order - we will not be given weapons and ammunition - we will figure it out, as they say, when the thunder strikes, they will come running and bring everything, ”said the leader of the mercenaries. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 11, 2023 Author #9 Share Posted June 11, 2023 47 minutes ago, Occult1 said: I expect Ukraine to retake some settlements but no major gains. What the counteroffensive will demonstrate is that there is a core 20% of Ukraine's territory that the Ukrainian military will not be able to get back. It would take overwhelming firepower, air support and at least a 3-to-1 ratio in manpower. The Russians have been entrenched for over a year in the east and south and have corrected the deficiencies in their positions. How many people will need to die before the West realize the only way to resolve this conflict is negotiation? It’s being reported the Russians are abandoning towns and villages outside their defensive networks and once occupied by Ukrainian forces, they attack with air power and artillery and when the Ukrainians leave they re-occupy and rinse repeat. These towns and villages are changing hands. Russian tactics are changing and they’re more interested in punishing and being fluid than entrenched and holding land. Interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Occult1 Posted June 11, 2023 #10 Share Posted June 11, 2023 (edited) The Russian fortifications Ukraine needs to break through in its counter-offensive [...]The defences, according to a Ukrainian intelligence officer, are constructed in a “three-line system”, with varying levels of fortifications, the depths of which can exceed around 19 miles on some axes. “They have unbelievable trenches and unbelievable fortifications, it will be hard to break their lines of defence” Serhii, a commander in Ukraine’s National Guards, told The Telegraph. “There are also minefields and they have good artillery - more than us unfortunately.” [...] British intelligence officials have described the Russian efforts to fortify their positions as “some of the most extensive systems of military defensive works seen anywhere in the world”. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/06/11/russian-fortifications-ukraine-counter-offensive-war/ It's hard to see how Ukraine will be able to push Russian forces out of these territories. Edited June 11, 2023 by Occult1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 11, 2023 #11 Share Posted June 11, 2023 47 minutes ago, Occult1 said: The Russian fortifications Ukraine needs to break through in its counter-offensive [...]The defences, according to a Ukrainian intelligence officer, are constructed in a “three-line system”, with varying levels of fortifications, the depths of which can exceed around 19 miles on some axes. “They have unbelievable trenches and unbelievable fortifications, it will be hard to break their lines of defence” Serhii, a commander in Ukraine’s National Guards, told The Telegraph. “There are also minefields and they have good artillery - more than us unfortunately.” [...] British intelligence officials have described the Russian efforts to fortify their positions as “some of the most extensive systems of military defensive works seen anywhere in the world”. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/06/11/russian-fortifications-ukraine-counter-offensive-war/ It's hard to see how Ukraine will be able to push Russian forces out of these territories. Hi Occult Likely the plan is to disrupt supppy lines first while keeping the Russians in defence. Once supply routes have been closed the Russians won't be able to defend positions.. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 12, 2023 #12 Share Posted June 12, 2023 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 12, 2023 Author #13 Share Posted June 12, 2023 3 hours ago, Occult1 said: The Russian fortifications Ukraine needs to break through in its counter-offensive [...]The defences, according to a Ukrainian intelligence officer, are constructed in a “three-line system”, with varying levels of fortifications, the depths of which can exceed around 19 miles on some axes. “They have unbelievable trenches and unbelievable fortifications, it will be hard to break their lines of defence” Serhii, a commander in Ukraine’s National Guards, told The Telegraph. “There are also minefields and they have good artillery - more than us unfortunately.” [...] British intelligence officials have described the Russian efforts to fortify their positions as “some of the most extensive systems of military defensive works seen anywhere in the world”. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/06/11/russian-fortifications-ukraine-counter-offensive-war/ It's hard to see how Ukraine will be able to push Russian forces out of these territories. The Ukrainians telegraphed this counterattack for so long is it any wonder why the Russians are so well entrenched 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 12, 2023 Author #14 Share Posted June 12, 2023 Russian ‘barrier’ troops are firing on retreating troops. It’s having an effect as those troops, they are now moving forward and counterattacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 12, 2023 #15 Share Posted June 12, 2023 9 minutes ago, Unusual Tournament said: Russian ‘barrier’ troops are firing on retreating troops. It’s having an effect as those troops, they are now moving forward and counterattacking. Hi UT The Russians are firing on their own retreating troops? Oh well that has been orders from the krumblin for the last year now so nothing new there. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Occult1 Posted June 12, 2023 #16 Share Posted June 12, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, jmccr8 said: Hi UT The Russians are firing on their own retreating troops? Oh well that has been orders from the krumblin for the last year now so nothing new there. Both sides are probably using 'barrier troops' to some extent. Do you think the forced Ukrainian conscripts or Russians want to die on the frontline? Edited June 12, 2023 by Occult1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 12, 2023 #17 Share Posted June 12, 2023 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Occult1 said: Both sides are probably using 'barrier troops' to some extent. Do you think the forced Ukrainian conscripts want to die on the frontline? Hi Occult Forced conscripts in the Ukraine, hmm never heard that one before. Nobody wants to die however the reality is the people of the Ukraine are willingly fighting for their freedom and not just good time freeloaders. I do think that Ukraine military planners along with their western advisors are lookiing to keep their casualties to a miminum and doing prep work by taking out transport routes and ammo depots to hamper Russias ability to get men and equiipmment to the front lines of defence then move in from weak points. Doesn't seem like they are being careless or wasting resources in the manner that Russia has been. Edited June 12, 2023 by jmccr8 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 12, 2023 #18 Share Posted June 12, 2023 Auto translate of original text: War Takes the Best Heavy fighting all through yesterday (June 12) was almost along the entire line of contact group Vostok, especially at the so-called Vremjevsky outpost. The situation was difficult in the defense belt of the 60th and 37 Motorized Rifle Brigades. As a result of the enemy's rocket attack the chief of staff of the 35th Combined Arms Brigade was killed. Chief of Staff of the 35th Combined Arms Army Maj. Major-General Sergei Goryachev. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Occult1 Posted June 12, 2023 #19 Share Posted June 12, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, jmccr8 said: Hi Occult Forced conscripts in the Ukraine, hmm never heard that one before. There are videos of forced Ukrainian conscription. Whether they are authentic or not, the fact is that most Ukrainian men between 18 and 60 have been banned from leaving the country in the beginning or the war. I'm pretty sure there are a lot of young people who see this war as nonsense and would prefer not to die in it. Edited June 12, 2023 by Occult1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trelane Posted June 12, 2023 #20 Share Posted June 12, 2023 25 minutes ago, Occult1 said: There are videos of forced Ukrainian conscription. Whether they are authentic or not, the fact is that most Ukrainian men between 18 and 60 have been banned from leaving the country in the beginning or the war. I'm pretty sure there are a lot of young people who see this war as nonsense and would prefer not to die in it. Please post links to the videos you allege. I would venture you know nothing of the current desire of all Ukrainians to defend their country. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 13, 2023 #21 Share Posted June 13, 2023 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted June 13, 2023 Author #22 Share Posted June 13, 2023 Russian defence minister Shoigu ordered Russian soldiers to shoot to kill any Wagner PMC mercenaries they encounter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccr8 Posted June 14, 2023 #23 Share Posted June 14, 2023 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pellinore Posted June 14, 2023 #24 Share Posted June 14, 2023 (edited) Thoughtful article from The Economist: This week there have been frequent comparisons between D-Day in 1944 and the Ukrainian military offensive that is currently unfolding. Although both were launched in the month of June, a better comparison may be to Operation Cobra, a large ground operation launched by the United States First Army almost two months after the Normandy landings. While starting inauspiciously, with the accidental killing of Leslie McNair, an American lieutenant-general, and unfolding slowly at first, once the operation gathered pace it was highly effective. It was Cobra that broke open German defences for the Allies to exploit in subsequent offensives. Mick Ryan assesses Ukraine’s counter-offensive (archive.ph) Edited June 14, 2023 by pellinore 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trelane Posted June 15, 2023 #25 Share Posted June 15, 2023 Uh-Oh!!!! Another disaster for the Russian military. The term 'hurry up and wait" is a common theme in the US military. Well, at least it it isn't as bad as "Hurry up and wait to get blown up". This is not how to lead troops in combat. "Russian Troops Killed Waiting for Commander's Motivational Speech: Reports" https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russian-troops-killed-waiting-for-commander-s-motivational-speech-reports/ar-AA1cyCQJ?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=f356bebac4eb46b0b0ffec65df3a36e4&ei=47 "Multiple well-known pro-Kremlin military bloggers on Wednesday reported that an unspecified amount of Russian soldiers were killed by a Ukrainian HIMARS (High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems) strike while waiting for their commander to deliver a motivational speech." "If by the middle of the second year of the war there are commanders who...build personnel in one big pile, and then wait for the enemy artillery to strike, then such commanders should be shot," Starshe Eddy wrote on Telegram. "Near Kreminna, a tragic incident occurred in one of the divisions that were about to go on the offensive. For two hours, people stood in a crowd in one place and waited for the division commander to say his motivating word," Rybar wrote. The blogger continued, "But instead of him, the HIMARS and enemy artillery had their say." None of the bloggers named the division commander, who was accused of "criminal stupidity" by Rybar, nor did anyone provide an estimate of victims killed in their accounts. "Stand in a column for two hours in one place! Well, what are you doing, father commanders, you command people," the Russian Telegram channel Two Majors channel posted. The Russian military blunders continue. This could be a very hot summer indeed. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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