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Saw a being of light (angel/demon?) as a kid and witnessed part of an exorcism as a pre-adolescent.


Antivalue

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3 hours ago, Hammerclaw said:

How do you deal with a friend who starts talking woo? The best course of action is to nod politely, think twice and say nothing. What matters is that it was real for them. Condescension or medical advice won't help anything.

That’s wise advice.  I haven’t really even broken out my woo.  I don’t want to either.  The reason is, that even after allI have experienced through the years, since I have lost my faith and practice rationalism and science as my primary source for truth……in my own mindset today, I wouldn’t necessarily believe my own “stories.”  But, since my own stories are real events that happened to me, they are truth.

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19 minutes ago, Guyver said:

That’s wise advice.  I haven’t really even broken out my woo.  I don’t want to either.  The reason is, that even after allI have experienced through the years, since I have lost my faith and practice rationalism and science as my primary source for truth……in my own mindset today, I wouldn’t necessarily believe my own “stories.”  But, since my own stories are real events that happened to me, they are truth.

It's the same way with Faith. You don't have to "prove" it, not even to yourself. It only has to validate your sense of personal wellbeing. The problem with apostasy, pushing God out of one's life, is not realizing what one might be letting in. It leaves a void of spiritual need one may fill with something dangerous, without realizing it. I found this out for myself, much to my chagrin or dismay.  I decided if I was going to believe in something, I might as well go for the really big one, the one that has withstood the test of time. I've done it in my own, unique, personal and private way. If you should so choose, you may find it benefits you with the ones you love in a very fulfilling way. You have to do the heavy lifting on your own and after your own fashion. Most of all you have to decide privately and for yourself that you are not beyond reclamation.

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5 hours ago, XenoFish said:

I did a spirit evocation on halloween night in a graveyard. Only to wake up the next morning to all the kitchen cabinets open. I drop that on the forum and people would rip it apart. Especially if it was under a different account (no I don't have one). I figure it was my wife and kids having a go at me. Still. It's not like I don't get it. 

When it comes to a lot of this, I figure the motivations might be resentment towards the paranormal, supernatural, spiritual, etc. Resentment, disappointment, doubt, fear, etc. My drive was disappointment and regret. I did a lot of magical practices. Had a ton of results from sigils and even runes, especially runes. Even the psychokinetic events were too inconsistent to convince me it was true. I never really had much of "Oh, hell a ghost/spirit/demon/angel." Weird dreams almost prophetic, sure. But I can not in any way, shape or form prove any of that. It's just a story to everyone. 

I have never had an experience like yours, but my first response would be to neither believe it or disbelieve it.  I believe it could be a real event because there are several possible rational explanations.  It’s not hard to believe that you did what you claimed, nor is it impossible to think that all cupboard doors could be left open one night.  You live with a family right?  Maybe someone else in your family was sleep walking in the middle of the night and they opened all the doors and went back to bed without ever knowing it.  Such things are known to occur.  Or, no disrespect, but maybe you got so drunk you opened them up and forgot about it?  But….the claim that the doors opened by themselves is obviously not something easy to accept since it defies science and rationality.  There’s no mechanism, aside from an earthquake that could “open doors” from a cupboard.

But, many people do claim this does occur.  I sometimes watch a television show called Paranormal Caught on Camera I believe it is, and people send in videos of things moving in their kitchen, seemingly by themselves.  Some of the videos and stories are compelling and convincing, but at the same time….they could be faked…so many people, myself included, just assume they are fake.

But, what if one is real?  Only one real one out of the whole bunch shows something unknown is in fact occurring on occasion.

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5 minutes ago, Guyver said:

no disrespect, but maybe you got so drunk you opened them up and forgot about it?

I do not drink. Neither do I smoke. 

 

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8 hours ago, Guyver said:

But, what if one is real?  Only one real one out of the whole bunch shows something unknown is in fact occurring on occasion.

I understand the hope such a thing would bring. There being a different reality outside our own. The hope of an afterlife. I supposed I'm either jaded or stubborn, but I need something greatly profound in order to engage in a sliver of belief. Don't misunderstand me. Our reality is painfully boring. It would be nice if there was something more than the cerebral layer of it. 

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10 hours ago, XenoFish said:

I do not drink. Neither do I smoke. 

 

That is healthy.

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9 minutes ago, Guyver said:

That is healthy.

My father and his father were alcoholics. Both my parents smoked. I didn't want that. 

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4 hours ago, XenoFish said:

I understand the hope such a thing would bring. There being a different reality outside our own. The hope of an afterlife. I supposed I'm either jaded or stubborn, but I need something greatly profound in order to engage in a sliver of belief. Don't misunderstand me. Our reality is painfully boring. It would be nice if there was something more than the cerebral layer of it. 

Just for you :P

 

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On 6/29/2023 at 8:58 PM, Sherapy said:

. We are biologically wired to survive from potential predators 
 

Yup!   so I just wanted to respond to this part because I’ve been thinking about it lately.    Survival required Domination!!   Since most potential predators are gone now…we replace that powerful eat or be eaten need to be dominant, with trying to outdo each other in all sorts of silly ways. ?  We try to outdress each other…out own each other..($$$$). .out hairdo each other..outsmart each other..and on&on.  It’s  more than big ego, or self image , I think,  ..I think these behaviors spring from our basic inborn, and now, less utilized Survival Skills.?
     Or, maybe that’s a huge oversimplification …it’s what I do,   I’m a simpleton.   :P    I dunno, just been observing human behavior and thinking and wondering why so many people constantly display such a powerful obsessive need to  best  each other.   ???   

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7 hours ago, XenoFish said:

My father and his father were alcoholics. Both my parents smoked. I didn't want that. 

Same, I don’t smoke or drink with that being said I am in bartender school these days. Why, you ask? My youngest is working towards being a chef and once culinary school is done he wants to do his own thing, possibly catering. So, he has assembled the avengers mom will bartend, Dad will take care of the electrical. :D

Edited by Sherapy
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4 hours ago, lightly said:

Yup!   so I just wanted to respond to this part because I’ve been thinking about it lately.    Survival required Domination!!   Since most potential predators are gone now…we replace that powerful eat or be eaten need to be dominant, with trying to outdo each other in all sorts of silly ways. ?  We try to outdress each other…out own each other..($$$$). .out hairdo each other..outsmart each other..and on&on.  It’s  more than big ego, or self image , I think,  ..I think these behaviors spring from our basic inborn, and now, less utilized Survival Skills.?
     Or, maybe that’s a huge oversimplification …it’s what I do,   I’m a simpleton.   :P    I dunno, just been observing human behavior and thinking and wondering why so many people constantly display such a powerful obsessive need to  best  each other.   ???   

That is certainly one way to look at things. I lean towards a broader perspective of human society, I think it relies heavily on cooperation, collaboration and mutual support more than dominion. I think it is empathy, and cooperation that have gone along way in allowing humans to thrive. 

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6 hours ago, lightly said:

I dunno, just been observing human behavior and thinking and wondering why so many people constantly display such a powerful obsessive need to  best  each other.   ???   

It's a product of the human condition and very much alive, today. One need only look to the posturing and saber-rattling of nation-states, jostling and shoving one-another on the world stage, as well as humanities frightful predilection for war.

Edited by Hammerclaw
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On 7/4/2023 at 1:28 PM, Guyver said:

That’s wise advice.  I haven’t really even broken out my woo.  I don’t want to either.  The reason is, that even after allI have experienced through the years, since I have lost my faith and practice rationalism and science as my primary source for truth……in my own mindset today, I wouldn’t necessarily believe my own “stories.”  But, since my own stories are real events that happened to me, they are truth.

I think you can still exist quite fine on both sides of the fence. Why do we need to rationalize everything anyway? To look sane or intelligent? To me life would be pretty boring without the unproved either way paranormal aspect.

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6 hours ago, openozy said:

I think you can still exist quite fine on both sides of the fence. Why do we need to rationalize everything anyway? To look sane or intelligent? To me life would be pretty boring without the unproved either way paranormal aspect.

One of the things most don't consider is that an experience is just an experience. Personally I can not prove "the weird" that I've experienced. Some need to see the world as black and white. Others are disappointed that the paranormal/supernatural/spiritual didn't meet their expectations. 

Recounting an event, no matter how small can shake the naysayers. 

Personally it's all stories to me. 

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13 hours ago, Sherapy said:

That is certainly one way to look at things. I lean towards a broader perspective of human society, I think it relies heavily on cooperation, collaboration and mutual support more than dominion. I think it is empathy, and cooperation that have gone along way in allowing humans to thrive. 

I was just speaking of my personal examination of one slice of human behavior, I agree with your broader perspective of the human pie. :)

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1 hour ago, XenoFish said:

Personally it's all stories to me.

They are all stories but they are interesting or frightening to some people. I rarely if ever mention my stuff in normal life except if I find a person with similar experiences. Most people don't want to know because they are scared by this or just think I'm a looney. It can be a good way to rid yourself of unwanted people in your space though, lol. 

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7 minutes ago, openozy said:

They are all stories but they are interesting or frightening to some people. I rarely if ever mention my stuff in normal life except if I find a person with similar experiences. Most people don't want to know because they are scared by this or just think I'm a looney. It can be a good way to rid yourself of unwanted people in your space though, lol. 

In my case I never got what was claimed to happen. Kept reading about crazy evocation experiences, etc. Nope, nothing. Outside of a few lucid dreams afterwards. In terms of results based magick, yeah, a lot of results. Even some "psychic" things. It was the lack of consistency that keeps me at odd with "the weird". 

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On 6/28/2023 at 11:26 PM, Antivalue said:

 

What does the knowledge of these memories/experiences mean for me, what do I do with it?

I am a believer that these angel-like and demon-like entities do objectively exist on the non-physical planes, but I would suggest you just focus on living a happy, loving and peaceful life. Calling on angel-like entities for assistance can be a comfort and I believe they can really intervene in your experience if you are so inclined to prayer.

Best wishes.

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On 6/29/2023 at 7:02 PM, Hammerclaw said:

Subjective experience is not the same as the reality of objective experience--it's all in your head.

This is true..

The objective is the objective, but how one views that object will determine how one experiences life.

Happy, sad, angry, or blissed-out.

And surely, that is the important thing here?

Not having to rely upon outside objects for ones happiness, (or peace) but to take control of ones thoughts and perceptions, and simply make the most of life!!

Life is a choice.

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1 hour ago, Crazy Horse said:

This is true..

The objective is the objective, but how one views that object will determine how one experiences life.

Happy, sad, angry, or blissed-out.

And surely, that is the important thing here?

Not having to rely upon outside objects for ones happiness, (or peace) but to take control of ones thoughts and perceptions, and simply make the most of life!!

Life is a choice.

CH, I get your position holds that humans can attain happiness and peace through solely managing thoughts and perceptions, implying that human’s possess significant control over their emotions.  However, there are some inaccuracies I would like to touch upon:

 

1. “Life is a choice”: while this statement is empowering, it also oversimplifies the complexity of human experiences. Emotions and reactions to events are often involuntary – they emerge from intricate processes involving our neurobiology, past experiences, genetics, and current situation. For example, severe traumas or mental health conditions such as PTSD or depression are not simply about choosing a positive mindset.

2. “Not relying on outside objects”: this viewpoint excludes the fact that many people obtain happiness and peace from healthy relationships, meaningful careers, hobbies, and other external factors, such as social engagement, humans are social creatures. According to psychological and sociological research the latter can be integral for ones mental health too.

3. “Complete control over thoughts and perceptions”: mental control is a complex process, heavily influenced by cognitive abilities, which themselves are shaped by various factors such as neurobiology, upbringing, education, and environment.

 

In other words, your position is an oversimplification.


 

Edited by Sherapy
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1 hour ago, Sherapy said:

CH, I get your position holds that humans can attain happiness and peace through solely managing thoughts and perceptions, implying that human’s possess significant control over their emotions.  However, there are some inaccuracies I would like to touch upon:

 

1. “Life is a choice”: while this statement is empowering, it also oversimplifies the complexity of human experiences. Emotions and reactions to events are often involuntary – they emerge from intricate processes involving our neurobiology, past experiences, genetics, and current situation. For example, severe traumas or mental health conditions such as PTSD or depression are not simply about choosing a positive mindset.

2. “Not relying on outside objects”: this viewpoint excludes the fact that many people obtain happiness and peace from healthy relationships, meaningful careers, hobbies, and other external factors, such as social engagement, humans are social creatures. According to psychological and sociological research the latter can be integral for ones mental health too.

3. “Complete control over thoughts and perceptions”: mental control is a complex process, heavily influenced by cognitive abilities, which themselves are shaped by various factors such as neurobiology, upbringing, education, and environment.

 

In other words, your position is an oversimplification.


 

You may call it an oversimplification, but I would suggest that there is no need to complicate the issue. Life is a choice. The matter of perspective, and a given/chosen attitude, in which one sees the different nuances of life. For example, yes, emotions are more spontaneous in the sense that we don't have to think about them too much, but they are mostly habitual reactions, learnt, or inflicted pressure from outside forces. In other words, one may choose to deprogrammed oneself, if they want to!!

You talk of healthy relationships as a source of happiness, and that's true, but did you stop to ask yourself, how do a couple "abide! consistently, in a healthy relationship? 

The short answer, by choosing to work at it.

Either consciously, or even subconsciously.

Either way, life is still a choice..:yes:

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3 hours ago, Crazy Horse said:

Not having to rely upon outside objects for ones happiness, (or peace) but to take control of ones thoughts and perceptions, and simply make the most of life!!

And just to add. I never said that one cant, or shouldn't take some joy, or happiness from and outside objects, but that its just a wee bit silly to rely upon such things. 

And besides, the inner peace and the inner joy, is like an ocean without end.

Personally, shinny trinkets and sparkly things hold little sway over my mind.

 

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2 hours ago, Sherapy said:

 

3. “Complete control over thoughts and perceptions”: mental control is a complex process, heavily influenced by cognitive abilities, which themselves are shaped by various factors such as neurobiology, upbringing, education, and environment.
 

For one to have mental control, there has to be a desire first, then a goal, and then an idea or theory or a teaching to follow.

And then one irons-out as many of the wrinkles as they go along..

Until one has found a way to be mindful, wise,  and humble enough to be mentally aware - all the time.

And, at every turn, there is a choice to make.

If you knew how powerful you are.

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2 hours ago, Crazy Horse said:

For one to have mental control, there has to be a desire first, then a goal, and then an idea or theory or a teaching to follow.

And then one irons-out as many of the wrinkles as they go along..

Until one has found a way to be mindful, wise,  and humble enough to be mentally aware - all the time.

And, at every turn, there is a choice to make.

If you knew how powerful you are.

This is erroneous, addressing, changing, unhelpful thoughts, emotions and behaviors does not require the specific sequence you are claiming. 
 

The actual tools or a solid basic understanding of CBT include: cognitive awareness this aids in recognizing patterns, biases, distortions in one’s thinking, cognitive restructuring involves reframing thoughts. Can you tell me the 3 basics to use? Another basic tool is behavioral activation taking action to change behaviors can you tell me how you would do this? the steps?  Another tool is skill building that is developing skills to cope with challenging situations. 
 

There are mostly unrealistic expectations in your approach, it is highly unlikely that anyone is or could be mindful every moment because the human mind fluctuates it isn’t static. If you are going to work with your thoughts /your mind it isn’t the worst idea to cultivate an attitude of acceptance towards its natural fluctuations. It isn’t about suppressing or controlling your thoughts. 
 

Come on CH you’re cherry picking with no real context or practice, not that you couldn’t or wouldn’t be successful if you had some knowledge and a solid practice right now you simply do not know what you are talking about. If I can be of help, ask. 
 

While self awareness can be empowering, ( I will give you this) but, claiming mindfulness will lead to special powers is complete nonsense, what one can gain is self awareness, an ability to manage stress, improved focus and enhanced emotional resilience which in turn lends to personal growth and a balanced life.

Edited by Sherapy
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10 hours ago, Sherapy said:

CH, I get your position holds that humans can attain delusion and illusion through solely managing thoughts and perceptions, implying that human’s possess significant control over their emotions.  However, there are some inaccuracies I would like to touch upon

Hi Sherapy

Just my personal take on his objectivity

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