UFOs 'took control of Russian nukes' and 'entered launch codes'

[Saru]

2 hours ago, skyeagle409 said:

I find it very interesting that debunkers deny verified and documented data and documentation relating to UFO evidence

I don't think anyone is denying that there are unidentified objects in our skies, but typically 'UFO' doesn't automatically translate to 'extraterrestrial'.

[Grey Area]

4 hours ago, skyeagle409 said:

I find it very interesting that debunkers deny verified and documented data and documentation relating to UFO evidence and yet, they have embraced without evidence all three of the Air Force's Roswell cover stories that have since been proven as false, one of which was debunked by the Air Force itself in its 1994 Roswell Report, which course, was the 47-year-old weather balloon cover story that debunkers had claimed was undeniable proof that the Roswell incident was caused by a weather balloon. 

I have been providing evidence and I have challenged those to provide man-made evidence that refutes my extraterrestrial evidence and what have I received as credible man-made evidence? Absolutely nothing!  The most common non-answer I receive is that the UFOs are caused by atmospheric phenomena (AP), which doesn't fit by the very nature of the radar contacts alone, which is very obvious the radar contacts are under intelligent control as noted by the way they interact with aircraft, which is why multiple  Air Force studies have concluded from behind closed doors the objects are "interplanetary spaceships' while convincing skeptics the objects are nothing more than weather balloons when those same doors are then open to the public. 

Question is, when are skeptics going to wake up and understand that the government has been taking them for rides for decades and made them victims of its own deformation and misinformation campaigns?

All you are doing is drawing conclusions based on what these encounters aren’t.  This is further confounded by the rarity of these encounters.

There have been some interesting discussions with the recent UAP hearings in congress, but even these are just words, no factual evidence has been presented, and as for Grusch, who seems to have been the catalyst for much of the recent formalities, his testimony is all second hand, and much of the testimony has been given behind closed doors, so… so much for whistle-blowing.

The UFO crowd have got really excited recently, and rightly so, but they are jumping the gun.  These recent hearings are not about discovering the truth about alleged ET visitation, they are brought by ranking military and ex-military officials, the focus is on the defence of the United States, and threat analysis.

Sadly, and I use that word sincerely, nothing you bring to the table is new or concrete, and thus we are still having this debate.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

1 hour ago, Grey Area said:

These recent hearings are not about discovering the truth about alleged ET visitation, they are brought by ranking military and ex-military officials, the focus is on the defence of the United States, and threat analysis.

We agree on that, Gray Area. Defense of the United States. Don't you think the military first worried about that at the Battle of LA in 1943? 
Or 1952 when a two-week UFO flap in Washington DC saw UFO's over the State House and the White house...?

They've had a long long time to think it over and I am sure they know better than all of us that the some of the UFO's that we see are clearly
of intelligent design, and are flown rather intelligently, too. They can fly at high speed and take a 90 degree turn, something we can never do.
If one of our adversaries had this kind of technology, the US/allied spy network would clearly know at least that much.

So, it the military and politicians *don't* consider these crafts being Alien crafts, they simply aren't doing their job. It is the most *logical* consideration.
Not doing so is like putting your head in the sand. My opinion. 

[+joc]

9 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

We agree on that, Gray Area. Defense of the United States. Don't you think the military first worried about that at the Battle of LA in 1943? 
Or 1952 when a two-week UFO flap in Washington DC saw UFO's over the State House and the White house...?

They've had a long long time to think it over and I am sure they know better than all of us that the some of the UFO's that we see are clearly
of intelligent design, and are flown rather intelligently, too. They can fly at high speed and take a 90 degree turn, something we can never do.
If one of our adversaries had this kind of technology, the US/allied spy network would clearly know at least that much.

So, it the military and politicians *don't* consider these crafts being Alien crafts, they simply aren't doing their job. It is the most *logical* consideration.
Not doing so is like putting your head in the sand. My opinion. 

Whoa....  hang on a second Wild Earl! 

We as a planet have zero indication from all of the searching we've done in the last 50+ years that there is any kind of a civilization anywhere.  The Hubble and Webb Telescopes plus, plus, plus.  Nothing...no civilizations anywhere...not even a remote indication of living anything...All we really have is a 'dream'  of a hope that there might be microbial life on Europa. 

If the military and politicians don't consider these crafts as possible Alien crafts they aren't doing their jobs?  Why?;  when there isn't an ounce of evidence whatsoever of any civilization anywhere else in the whole entire universe.  Why is it logical to assume that  anomalies on radar are Aliens from Space.  I'm missing the logic here somewhere.  They are after all Unidentified.  And...they are making moves that seem to violate the laws of physics...and...we don't see anything else in the universe violating any of the laws of physics...so why the assumption on the part of the Military Industrial Complex?

I will just go ahead and tell you what I think.  What I think is every bit as baseless as the assumption of ET UAPs.  Probably more...Of course...keep in mind that I'm that guy that thinks the pandemic was a hoax...

But this is the Military Industrial Complex we are talking about...and there is a war going on in Europe where our 'friend' Russia, of USSR fame, is threatening to use tactical nukes.  There are also  stories out there of UAPs taking over control of Russian Nukes.  

I think this might all be cover for a red flag operation involving Russia and the Ukraine and the United States.  I have no idea what that might be, but what would anyone do IF Russia used a tactical nuke?  Think Biden would set off a Nuclear Holocaust just to say, I told you so?  I don't.  I think they'd get away with it...Now, I have no idea what UAPs and all this UFO interest by the military establishment is about, but I think they are linked because they are both happening right now and ...just kind of a gut feeling...but...this world has to change...it has to change because the current financial scenarios are a house of cards.

Or maybe this UFO stuff is to take the worlds eyes off of the war in the Ukraine ...but somethings up and it ain't the war and it ain't Aliens...

And I will just leave you with this as well...The Vanguard Group and Blackrock...do you think that they think they have a vested interest in either UFOs or Ukraine?  Who has the most power?  The guys sitting around the Blackrock table or Putin?  Just thinking outloud...

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

@joc, I;ll get to you next time out, bud.

[skyeagle409]

 I also saw a UFO over my base in Vietnam that was definitely not an aircraft as it approached from over the sea, which was covered up by the Air Force, and then, I was sent to another base that was involved in an investigation of another incident regarding the 1967 Malmstrom AFB incident where a UFO disabled Minuteman missiles because we were a depot for the Minuteman missile. Eventually, I found that just about every SAC base reported UFOs affecting their missiles and years later, I became aware that our DSP satellites were tracking UFOs as they approached Earth from deep space and enter the atmosphere where is some cases, the objects simply returned back into space. 

I was also aware that those grainy Navy videos were not the clear images that the aircrew and sailors back on the ships were observing. I might add that those clear UFO images are classified. In addition, the aircraft carried multiple dissimilar sensors, in other words, the UFOs that were tracked on radar were also captured by cameras as well as by infrared sensors that corroborated what the radar was tracking. In other words, optical and infrared sensors confirming that the UFOs were intelligently controlled craft as noted by their maneuvering capabilities. Add to the fact that another radar system detected some of those UFOs in low earth orbit before they descended to 80,000 feet. 

 

 

Edited August 13, 2023 by skyeagle409

[skyeagle409]

10 hours ago, Saru said:

I don't think anyone is denying that there are unidentified objects in our skies, but typically 'UFO' doesn't automatically translate to 'extraterrestrial'.

I understand, and I am also on the record for stating that the majority of UFO cases can be explained in down-to-earth terms.

[Grey Area]

6 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

We agree on that, Gray Area. Defense of the United States. Don't you think the military first worried about that at the Battle of LA in 1943? 
Or 1952 when a two-week UFO flap in Washington DC saw UFO's over the State House and the White house...?

Of course, and not least because there’s a correlation between those dates and major conflicts that involved the US.

 

6 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

They've had a long long time to think it over and I am sure they know better than all of us that the some of the UFO's that we see are clearly
of intelligent design, and are flown rather intelligently, too. They can fly at high speed and take a 90 degree turn, something we can never do.
If one of our adversaries had this kind of technology, the US/allied spy network would clearly know at least that much.

Perhaps some of these objects are intelligently controlled, and here’s my point, the data does not PROVE this.  I know that RADAR systems were checked and seemed to be working, and that there were some eye-witness reports (talking mainly about the 52 incident), but that is it, beyond this we only have conjecture.

And let’s be honest, no systems, military or otherwise are infallible.  Ask any aviator, or engineer how often hardware is taken offline for maintenance to upgrade or bug fix hardware, or install software updates, these systems are not perfect today let alone over 70 years ago.

6 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

So, it the military and politicians *don't* consider these crafts being Alien crafts, they simply aren't doing their job. It is the most *logical* consideration.
Not doing so is like putting your head in the sand. My opinion. 

I don’t buy that.  Aliens are absolutely not the most logical conclusion, unless your bias tells you that they are.

Put simply, there’s not enough evidence and without a Time Machine there never will be.

[Grey Area]

13 minutes ago, skyeagle409 said:

Question is, why did skeptics dismiss the verifiable and documented evidence that I had presented to them that proved the videos were real?

Because your evidence is all copied and pasted stuff from the web, that is the catcall of every UFO believer for the last century.

Add into that your assertion that the true evidence, clear pictures etc are withheld by the military:

17 minutes ago, skyeagle409 said:

was also aware that those grainy Navy videos were not the clear images that the aircrew and sailors back on the ships were observing. I might add that those clear UFO images are classified.

My question is, how can one not be skeptical in the face of so little evidence? 

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

12 hours ago, Grey Area said:

<SNIP> 

Perhaps some of these objects are intelligently controlled, and here’s my point, the data does not PROVE this.  

Yes, GA, it *does* prove that these crafts, in many cases, are intelligently controlled. Several times I have read about a group of UFO's
flying perfectly in unison, like they were of one construction. They all go up or down, or anywhere... together. That is intelligence, sorry.

Do you recall, as an example, the USS Princeton (in Go Fast), recording many tic-tac's all dropping in the sky at frightful accelerations?
And then they just stop together above the water, all in perfect harmony. Sorry, GA, these objects *are* intelligently controlled.

Or when Pilot David Fravor and his group came across a tic-tac hovering over the water. As Fravor moved in on it, it took off "like it was shot out of a gun",
only to return when Fravor's group was leaving the area, per the Princeton. And again, intelligent control is self evident here. as it is in many cases.

Tell me, GA, with all the UFO's that are sighted, and that are *not* intelligently controlled, where do they crash land? 

 

12 hours ago, Grey Area said:

I know that RADAR systems were checked and seemed to be working, and that there were some eye-witness reports (talking mainly about the 52 incident), but that is it, beyond this we only have conjecture.

Not sure what you are driving at here. There were radar installations at two USAF bases in Washington DC, and at Washington National Airport as well. 
Jets were dispatched to chase the strange crafts. One such chase pilot said to the press, "The seem to know when I am running out of fuel because just when
I am ready to return to base, they reenter the area". And GA, you should know that there are many many cases that the UFO's display intelligent control. 

 

 

12 hours ago, Grey Area said:

And let’s be honest, no systems, military or otherwise are infallible.  Ask any aviator, or engineer how often hardware is taken offline for maintenance to upgrade or bug fix hardware, or install software updates, these systems are not perfect today let alone over 70 years ago.

Please, GA, you're really digging. there are many cases where radar images are backed with photos and/or eyewitness. 
Take 1952 Washington again. A military Air Traffic Controller for Andrews AFB went on a morning TV show and said that he saw a blip on the screen of an object
that was hovering close by. He looked out the window, and it was visible and where it should be, according to radar. He called his workmate over and the two watched it
on the screen and live.

There us no doubt that the radar was in working order. You have no choice but to accept this.

 

 

12 hours ago, Grey Area said:

I don’t buy that.  Aliens are absolutely not the most logical conclusion, unless your bias tells you that they are.

Put simply, there’s not enough evidence and without a Time Machine there never will be.

You're entitled to your opinion,,, which is...? what do you think is the root cause of these UFO's?

 

 

 

Edited August 13, 2023 by Earl.Of.Trumps

[Grey Area]

55 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Yes, GA, it *does* prove that these crafts, in many cases, are intelligently controlled. Several times I have read about a group of UFO's
flying perfectly in unison, like they were of one construction. They all go up or down, or anywhere... together. That is intelligence, sorry.

Do you recall, as an example, the USS Princeton (in Go Fast), recording many tic-tac's all dropping in the sky at frightful accelerations?
And then they just stop together above the water, all in perfect harmony. Sorry, GA, these objects *are* intelligently controlled.

Or when Pilot David Fravor and his group came across a tic-tac hovering over the water. As Fravor moved in on it, it took off "like it was shot out of a gun",
only to return when Fravor's group was leaving the area, per the Princeton. And again, intelligent control is self evident here. as it is in many cases.

Tell me, GA, with all the UFO's that are sighted, and that are *not* intelligently controlled, where do they crash land? 

Yeah sorry, my post should have read doesn’t prove Aliens.  That may have saved you some typing there.

58 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Not sure what you are driving at here.

Just what I said.  This is majority conjecture.  Something went on, what exactly it was remains unexplained.  Proof of Aliens, not exactly.

 

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

One such chase pilot said to the press, "The seem to know when I am running out of fuel because just when
I am ready to return to base, they reenter the area".

And this is my point here really, there’s no way to know that the return of these objects wasn’t coincidence, and unfortunately without time travel we will never know.

 

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

And GA, you should know that there are many many cases that the UFO's display intelligent control. 

There’s not many many cases.  With the amount of flights that take place daily around the globe, these incidents are a drop in the bucket, few enough that we see the same cases cropping up time and again on these boards.

We humans have a tendency to attempt to anthropomorphize things.

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Please, GA, you're really digging. there are many cases where radar images are backed with photos and/or eyewitness. 
Take 1952 Washington again. A military Air Traffic Controller for Andrews AFB went on a morning TV show and said that he saw a blip on the screen of an object
that was hovering close by. He looked out the window, and it was visible and where it should be, according to radar. He called his workmate over and the two watched it
on the screen and live.

There us no doubt that the radar was in working order. You have no choice but to accept this.

And it’s great that there was eyewitness corroboration, did they manage to catch a glimpse of the pilots?  My statement about the RADAR was a generalisation, not necessarily aimed at the 52 incident.

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

You're entitled to your opinion,,, which is...? what do you think is the root cause of these UFO's?

My point I guess is we don’t know what these things are, maybe someone does, but no one here.

I guess as a mild frustration, UFOlogy, or is UAPology?  Has become a religion, there’s very little critical thinking, people make up their minds and make the data fit their conclusions.

For the record, I have had a UFO sighting.  I really would like to believe aliens are here.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

21 hours ago, joc said:

Whoa....  hang on a second Wild Earl! 

We as a planet have zero indication from all of the searching we've done in the last 50+ years that there is any kind of a civilization anywhere.  The Hubble and Webb Telescopes plus, plus, plus.  Nothing...no civilizations anywhere...not even a remote indication of living anything...All we really have is a 'dream'  of a hope that there might be microbial life on Europa. 

We have zero indication...? Joc, what would you expect, a neon light pointing at their planet..? lol C'mon, man!  Yes, we see planets, as tiny black specks going across a star,
and there could be intelligent life on such a planet but we'd have no way to know. There are 300 million planets in the Milky Way that can support life. Did you check them all? lol

 

21 hours ago, joc said:

If the military and politicians don't consider these crafts as possible Alien crafts they aren't doing their jobs?  Why?;  when there isn't an ounce of evidence whatsoever of any civilization anywhere else in the whole entire universe.  Why is it logical to assume that  anomalies on radar are Aliens from Space.  I'm missing the logic here somewhere. 

These crafts are way superior to anything this planet can produce. You should know that, Joc. And the military should err on the side of safety and clearly expect the worst
while hoping for the best. The words of caution they are saying now *should have* been said 90 years ago, at least. 

 

21 hours ago, joc said:

<SNIP>.

But this is the Military Industrial Complex we are talking about...and there is a war going on in Europe where our 'friend' Russia, of USSR fame, is threatening to use tactical nukes.  There are also  stories out there of UAPs taking over control of Russian Nukes.  

Yes, the Russian nuke story was just in the news. I suppose that if the Brits and Yanks are revealing, other countries may, follow.

 

21 hours ago, joc said:

I think this might all be cover for a red flag operation involving Russia and the Ukraine and the United States.  I have no idea what that might be, but what would anyone do IF Russia used a tactical nuke?  Think Biden would set off a Nuclear Holocaust just to say, I told you so?  I don't.  I think they'd get away with it...Now, I have no idea what UAPs and all this UFO interest by the military establishment is about, but I think they are linked because they are both happening right now and ...just kind of a gut feeling...but...this world has to change...it has to change because the current financial scenarios are a house of cards.
Or maybe this UFO stuff is to take the worlds eyes off of the war in the Ukraine ...but somethings up and it ain't the war and it ain't Aliens...

Joc, no way you can connect them. The government released 3 videos (GoFast etc) long before the Ukraine war.

 

21 hours ago, joc said:

And I will just leave you with this as well...The Vanguard Group and Blackrock...do you think that they think they have a vested interest in either UFOs or Ukraine?  Who has the most power?  The guys sitting around the Blackrock table or Putin?  Just thinking outloud...

Good chatting, Joc. 

[Dejarma]

3 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

what do you think is the root cause of these UFO's?

people highly exaggerating things they didn't understand because they honestly believe they've witnessed something truly weird & wonderful or full on making up stories to gain something. IMO

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

1 hour ago, Grey Area said:

UFOlogy, or is UAPology?  Has become a religion, there’s very little critical thinking, people make up their minds and make the data fit their conclusions.

<smile>  Yes, Gray Area, and when you mentioned that the three radar systems in the Washington DC incident might be faulty, I had a little chuckle.

Good posting with you, AG

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

43 minutes ago, Dejarma said:

people highly exaggerating things they didn't understand because they honestly believe they've witnessed something truly weird & wonderful or full on making up stories to gain something. IMO

People exaggerating, eh?  You must have a hard time with people who have photos that confirm the eyewitness, eh? or maybe not. 

[Grey Area]

9 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

smile>  Yes, Gray Area, and when you mentioned that the three radar systems in the Washington DC incident might be faulty, I had a little chuckle.

Good posting with you, AG

I’d love you to quote where I stated the the RADAR was faulty?

but my point there is that fully functional RADAR is still not infallible, which is why I point out the constant need for hardware and software upgrade and maintenance.  It is not a perfect system.

Honestly this is an exciting time, I am always skeptical of fantastic claims, but I do truly hope there are aliens here, I have yet to be convinced.

[Dejarma]

13 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

People exaggerating, eh?  You must have a hard time with people who have photos that confirm the eyewitness, eh? or maybe not. 

A photo confirms nothing.. you must have an easy time believing. Still, it's a bit of fun for ya- enjoy 

[Trelane]

I'd like examples where there are verifiable and non-hoaxed photos that corroborate statements. Not videos or anything. Photos.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

9 hours ago, Grey Area said:

I’d love you to quote where I stated the the RADAR was faulty?

 

On 8/13/2023 at 3:45 AM, Grey Area said:

I know that RADAR systems were checked and seemed to be working, and that there were some eye-witness reports (talking mainly about the 52 incident), but that is it, beyond this we only have conjecture.

And let’s be honest, no systems, military or otherwise are infallible.  Ask any aviator, or engineer how often hardware is taken offline for maintenance to upgrade or bug fix hardware, or install software updates, these systems are not perfect today let alone over 70 years ago.

When I said that the UFO's were on the radar systems of three airports, this is how you attempted to make that FACT disappear. You won't acknowledge this. 
What do you think the chances are that three radar systems go INOP at the same time, AND, they can't find a problem with them? Dude, you are bending common sense.

I then told you how two military ATC guys that night watched a hovering UFO right out their window, while seeing it on the radar screen at the same time.

 

9 hours ago, Grey Area said:

but my point there is that fully functional RADAR is still not infallible, which is why I point out the constant need for hardware and software upgrade and maintenance.  It is not a perfect system.

Honestly this is an exciting time, I am always skeptical of fantastic claims, but I do truly hope there are aliens here, I have yet to be convinced.

And do you still believe that UFO's were not detected in the skies over Washington DC that night? Do tell, Gray Area. 

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

6 hours ago, Dejarma said:

A photo confirms nothing.. you must have an easy time believing. Still, it's a bit of fun for ya- enjoy 

@Grey Area, are you looking at this...? this is exactly what we have both been talking about in bending truth to support an agenda. No photo is worth anything!!! 

Meanwhile, astronomers and astrophysicists know what they do about the composition of Universe... from photographs. Imagine that 

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

3 hours ago, Trelane said:

I'd like examples where there are verifiable and non-hoaxed photos that corroborate statements. Not videos or anything. Photos.

I'll get ya one. Remember now, I know you will deny everything so I won't put a lot of effort into this.

First daylight photo of - what are they? - digital file from b&w film copy neg. | Library of Congress (loc.gov)

[Trelane]

40 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I'll get ya one. Remember now, I know you will deny everything so I won't put a lot of effort into this.

First daylight photo of - what are they? - digital file from b&w film copy neg. | Library of Congress (loc.gov)

Not only are you right, but you've stepped your game up with the level of laziness. I was seriously hoping it was the D.C. photos again, but you've eclipsed that.

Here I am thinking your rubbish in the BF threads couldn't be topped, wow. Back to the ignore bin with you. Hilarious

Edited August 14, 2023 by Trelane

[Grey Area]

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

When I said that the UFO's were on the radar systems of three airports, this is how you attempted to make that FACT disappear. You won't acknowledge this. 

I haven’t made any facts disappear, what are you on about?  You even quote me saying:

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I know that RADAR systems were checked and seemed to be working

 

1 hour ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

What do you think the chances are that three radar systems go INOP at the same time, AND, they can't find a problem with them? Dude, you are bending common sense.

I haven’t suggested they were.  My point about radar was a generalisation is all.

 

2 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I then told you how two military ATC guys that night watched a hovering UFO right out their window, while seeing it on the radar screen at the same time.

All good, RADAR returns and eye witness testimony.  Yet we are still having this debate… Why?

 

2 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

And do you still believe that UFO's were not detected in the skies over Washington DC that night? Do tell, Gray Area. 

My gosh Earl, where have I refuted that UFO’s were detected?  Seriously…. We’re they extra terrestrial, that is the question?

I have absolutely no doubt UFO’s have been detected, what I doubt is their alien origins, what I doubt is the judgement behind many of the claims.  I don’t know what these things are, I can’t know what they are as they are unique encounters that cannot be replicated, and most happened decades ago.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

4 hours ago, Trelane said:

Not only are you right, but you've stepped your game up with the level of laziness. I was seriously hoping it was the D.C. photos again, but you've eclipsed that.

Here I am thinking your rubbish in the BF threads couldn't be topped, wow. Back to the ignore bin with you. Hilarious

Likewise, I am sure.

 

@Grey Area, see what I mean?? And needless to say, Dejama thinks this is a meaningless photo, as well. 

Just to add a little to it,,, Yes, I did a more fitting thread here at UM on this years ago. But I am sure you folks have no need to look it up.
The photo was taken by a Coast Guard photographer who was on duty that day. Project Bluebook declared the objects were a reflection in the window.
The Coast Guard said that the window glass had been taken out for the summer. At that point, Bluebook declared it "unexplained".
Years later, the Military historical society claimed the objects in the photo were U2's, whose manufacture had yet to be approved by Congress! Now *that* is something to laugh at. 

For 3 months after the incident, various neighborhood eyewitnesses were interviewed by the local newspaper, The Salem Evening News, and their stories printed, one at a time.
But the building in the background is the Salem power plant, and about 40 workers were on duty that day. My father was one of them. His friend brought his camera
to work that day, so several guys went up to the roof of the plant to take a picture. Again, my father was one of them. 

See what I mean, FA? I put up facts and get back laughter and ridicule. And they can remain in their happy little world of no UFO's. 

LINK:

"I suppose it qualifies as an iconic photograph.  Taken at Salem, Massachusetts, on July 16, 1952, it remains more than 50 years later a stock illustration for popular journalism on UFOs.  The Guardian used it in 2011, Time magazine in 2015, the New York Times in 2019.  Just this month, attractively colorized, it leads off a long and excellent New Yorker article on UFOs by Gideon Lewis-Kraus, entitled in the print edition (May 10) “The U.F.O. Papers” and on the web, “How the Pentagon Started Taking U.F.O.s Seriously.”

Enjoy the read.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

4 hours ago, Grey Area said:

I haven’t made any facts disappear, what are you on about?  You even quote me saying:

 

I haven’t suggested they were.  My point about radar was a generalisation is all.

Well, ya, in context, you spoke of them breaking a lot, at a time when I introduced the findings of the 3 radar systems. You must admit, you made it look like you doubted the findings. 

 

4 hours ago, Grey Area said:

 

All good, RADAR returns and eye witness testimony.  Yet we are still having this debate… Why?

 

My gosh Earl, where have I refuted that UFO’s were detected?  Seriously…. We’re they extra terrestrial, that is the question?

I never raised the issue of them being ET or not. I only wanted to get agreement of their existence. 

 

4 hours ago, Grey Area said:

I have absolutely no doubt UFO’s have been detected, what I doubt is their alien origins, what I doubt is the judgement behind many of the claims.  I don’t know what these things are, I can’t know what they are as they are unique encounters that cannot be replicated, and most happened decades ago.

Whoa. You mean I have been chasing my tail round here? The big question,,, do you believe that the 1952 Washington DC incident was with real UFO's? (not necessarily Alien)

 

And good posting with you, Grey Area

 

 

Edited August 15, 2023 by Earl.Of.Trumps