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If a Lost Civilization Built the Great Pyramid(s) How did the AE Build the Rest?


Thanos5150

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There are many who believe the Great Pyramid of Giza was built by a lost civilization thousands if not tens of thousands of years before the Dynastic period. The other great pyramids of the 4th Dynasty are often ignored, even the other two at Giza unless they are needed for some fringe scheme or another, despite the fact there is no doubt they were all made by the same methods and culture. Which should include at least the 3rd Dynasty pyramid and complex of Djoser as well. And then there are the inferior "rubble pyramids" of the rest of the Old Kingdom that came after Giza which are agreed were made by the lowly Egyptians which the disparity between the two eras are hailed as proof they could not have been built by the same people.

But the question ignored, assuming this is true, how then did the DE build "their" pyramids?

For example, the pyramid of the early 5th Dynasty pharaoh Sahure located at Abusir near Saqqara:

0501vptombe1.jpg

As unimpressive as it may look today due to it being heavily pillaged for stone in ancient times including most of its fine white casing stones, it is estimated to have originally been approximately 154ft high with a base of 258ft.

The core is made of steps of rough cut limestone blocks often held together with mortar with the largest blocks weighing upwards of 2 tons each. Most impressive is the interior whose descending passage was clad in fine cut granite with massive limestone roof beams. The burial chamber, however, contains several of the largest stones known in the ancient world estimated to weigh upwards of 200 tons each.

320px-Sahure_Pyramid.png

The temple complex is one of the most impressive in ancient Egypt employing many large granite pillars and blocks including a large basalt floor like the mortuary temple at G1.

How did the AE build these pyramids? How did they cut, transport, and lift the blocks? What tools did they use to shape the interior stones and temple blocks, including granite, no different than the lost civilization did with the great pyramids?

We are told the AE did not use ramps, cranes, or any kind of mechanical advantage- so how then did build a pyramid 154ft high including cladding it in finely cut limestone casing stones? How did they cut and move the granite to line the inner passage and roof it with massive blocks? As we are also told the AE could not cut granite and all granite was pilfered from this lost civilization, which if so, still does not answer the question how they moved them to line the chamber with the same precision as seen in the great pyramids. How did they move and erect a series of 200 ton limestone blocks configured like the QC, RC, and entrance of G1?

These later pyramids all exhibit the same "inexplicable" features in one form or another often claimed could only have been accomplished by a Lost Civilization, but there they are.  Another example, the 5th Dynasty pyramid of Neferirkare (239' x 344'):

Neferefres-Pyramid-667x500.jpg

(As an aside, note the step pyramid core) Again, massive chamber ceiling blocks:

 

320px-Neferirkare-Pyramide.png

The same can be seen in one form or another for all the these later OK pyramids. How did they raise these stones nearly 240ft in the air? 

Since none apparently can explain how any of the stone pyramids were built we can focus on the even "simpler" mudbrick ones found in the 12th Dynasty.

12th Dynasty, pyramid (cenotaph) of Amenemhat III at Hawara:

Hawara-Pyramid-1.jpg

The first in a short line of mud brick pyramids from the MK.

While the exterior core is mud brick its entrance and chamber core are made once again of numerous massive limestone blocks upwards of 100 tons including gable roof:

amenemhet-iii-hawara-entrance_640.jpg

amenemhet%20III%20hawara%20vault.jpg

Interior, mud brick pyramid of Senuseret III 12th Dynasty:

D-KA4ykWkAMovvy.jpg

Fine cut what appears to be granite interior with with arched gabled roof using blocks weighing upwards of 30 tons. Granite sarcophagus.
They also used metal cramps to fasten the exterior casing stones together:

pyrsenusret3a.jpg

 

Granite fine cut chambers with granite sarcophagus and arched gabled roof using blocks upwards of 30 tons? Inside a mudbrick pyramid that was originally sheathed in fine cut casing stones as well?

As we can see, just like the "rubble pyramids" talked about above, even the lowest of the low mudbrick pyramids display elements of the same exact level of stone working found in the great pyramids. So how did they build these chambers using 100ton blocks? Make gabled roofs? Yet another granite sarcophagi pilfered from a lost civilization? Is it any wonder all the focus is only on G1 as if it were the only one...? 

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We actually have learned how to build a pyramid.  You drag the blocks along a low friction surface made from wet sand and seaweed that secretes a slippery mucus.  Incidentally the Puma Punku H blocks in the Tiwanaku site are made of an indigenously invented and ingenious concrete-like amalgam, and I feel so happy that is explained too.

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3 hours ago, Piney said:

Well, that's not actually how it happened. A blond haired blue eyed guy from Anatolia.....or was it Atlantis? named Ra Ta came and taught the AE how to stack rocks the proper way using Crystal Power. He was later deifide....deified.....goddheaded???? As the god Ra. 

He was later reincarnated into a Kentucky rube named Eddy Casey.  :yes:

 

lol Anatolia, Atlantis…most likely from Australia….

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Let's try to keep things on topic please folks. 

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Those who only focus on G1 or the three main Gizamids alone do so because it allows them to indulge in fantasy without having to account for the evidence provided by the rest of the pyramids. Context is fatal to wild speculation. 

I think it’s important to stress the fact that, this thread and the others of Thanos’ which he linked to are not about “fringe vs mainstream” or taking sides or anything else of the like. Rather, they’re about focusing on what the actual archaeology is telling us, which is that the ancient Egyptians built G1 just as they built the other pyramids which came before and after its construction.

Nothing illustrates this better than the architectural details provided here of the so called “rubble pyramids”, which in essence demonstrate that the same abilities were utilized to build the monumental architecture seen in G1 and G2.

Also, another connection never addressed by the “lost civilization built G1” believers is that there are corbel vaulted ceilings not only in G1, but also the Meidum, Red, Bent and Bent’s satellite pyramid. This undeniably binds them together in terms of time, place, and most significantly to point of this thread, the builders.

Just as important is what the archaeology is NOT telling us, which is that there is no one else responsible for the structures attributed to the ancient Egyptians except the ancient Egyptians themselves.

 

Edited by Antigonos
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One of the things I find hardest to believe about "lost advanced civilization" is how all the evidence they point to represents some very crude methodologies.  The blocks for the pyramids are of many different sizes (they had not yet gotten to Akhenaten's conclusion that you can build faster if all the blocks are the same size and shape) - which means a lot of mortar infill or a lot of bits of rock being jammed into spaces to make things fit.  

 

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Thanks for starting an interesting thread, @Thanos5150, and I look forward to it growing.

I think that the G1 was built way ahead of its time. It was the tallest building in the world for almost four thousand years. (2560 bce - 1311 ad)

And then the art of pyramid building appears to have regressed, which is odd. There's lots to discuss!

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Seems we really don't know how the pyramids were built.  We have supposition, assumption and projection, but nothing definitive.

Japan tried in the 70's to make a small scale version of a pyramid of a mere 20 meters in height using only 4 ton blocks and failed.  If I recall correctly they then scaled down that attempt to half the height using only 1 ton blocks and still couldn't manage it, even when they began using rails, cranes and even a helicopter.

 

 

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On 10/15/2023 at 2:51 AM, Piney said:

Well, that's not actually how it happened. A blond haired blue eyed guy from Anatolia.....or was it Atlantis? named Ra Ta came and taught the AE how to stack rocks the proper way using Crystal Power. He was later deifide....deified.....goddheaded???? As the god Ra. 

He was later reincarnated into a Kentucky rube named Eddy Casey.  :yes:

 

Ra Ta (Casey) was a priest back then....so he said! And he must have also been a great inventor/engineer, since he invented the anti-gravity ray gun. And that's not all he invented, especially when he was sleeping. 

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1 minute ago, Pettytalk said:

Ra Ta (Casey) was a priest back then....so he said! And he must have also been a great inventor/engineer, since he invented the anti-gravity ray gun. And that's not all he invented, especially when he was sleeping. 

I bought early copies of his works just to see how far the A.R.E. moved the goalposts. They moved them to another field. 

Then again I bought a deceased Seventh-Day Adventist minister's books off of my local bookseller to see where their net is now and hit a Jehovah Witness goldmine. When the Millerites first split he must of been unsure of where he stood. 🤯

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10 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

And then the art of pyramid building appears to have regressed, which is odd. There's lots to discuss!

The regression can be attributed to the workers joining a union, and then going on strike, demanding higher wages, and lesser burdens, along with the 40 hrs work week, overtime and holiday pay, and a 3 weeks, yearly paid vacation. The strike lasted a very long time, because the workers also demanded working with much smaller and lighter blocks, to be quarried from local Egyptian sources, since the blocks' builders also became unionized. It then became too expensive for the pharaohs' grand burial monuments, and therefore resorted to simple cremation on a funeral pyre.

Another theory is that all the workers were Hebrew slaves, and pyramid building stopped when God freed his chosen people from Egyptian bondage, since the Egyptian themselves did not have the expertise and know-how for building pyramids.     

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15 minutes ago, Piney said:

I bought early copies of his works just to see how far the A.R.E. moved the goalposts. They moved them to another field. 

Then again I bought a deceased Seventh-Day Adventist minister's books off of my local bookseller to see where their net is now and hit a Jehovah Witness goldmine. When the Millerites first split he must of been unsure of where he stood. 🤯

What is now A.R.E. is even more farfetched than anything Edgar put out while he was alive. It's now commercial peddling of sheer nonsense. What was unique about Cayce is how he tried to resolve his Christian beliefs with all the science fiction he gave in his readings, as well as reincarnation and Atlantis. You must also be familiar with his claims that even Jesus Christ has reincarnated numerous times into various personalities, starting with being Adam.   

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9 minutes ago, Pettytalk said:

What is now A.R.E. is even more farfetched than anything Edgar put out while he was alive. It's now commercial peddling of sheer nonsense. What was unique about Cayce is how he tried to resolve his Christian beliefs with all the science fiction he gave in his readings, as well as reincarnation and Atlantis. You must also be familiar with his claims that even Jesus Christ has reincarnated numerous times into various personalities, starting with being Adam.   

They are poisoning people with his "vitamin" B17 (laetrile) and "electrified atomic" iodine. His do nothing Radiac is also used to "treat" autism.

I find the Jesus claim really silly because if that flake could really see the past he would of saw that the only historically documented Jesus from that era was a doomsday prophet who was killed by a Roman trebuchet and the Roman author of Mark's passion narrative describes his arrest and beating perfectly. 

And I don't want any mention of Josephus. That was a obvious edit by Eusebius of Caesarea, historical liar extraordinaire. Then again I can't really hate Constantine's personal " Liar for Jesus". He did call bull**** on Revelations. 

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12 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Thanks for starting an interesting thread, @Thanos5150, and I look forward to it growing.

I think that the G1 was built way ahead of its time. It was the tallest building in the world for almost four thousand years. (2560 bce - 1311 ad)

And then the art of pyramid building appears to have regressed, which is odd. There's lots to discuss!

I highly recommend all of his threads. 

Don’t forget G2 sitting right next to G1. Their internal construction is vastly different, a fascinating mystery in and of itself.

 Egypt went through several periods of decline throughout its long history due to drought, famine, climate deterioration, invasion, struggling economy. Lack of state strength, resources and will were likely the reason for the later pyramids being less grand in size.

However, there were still marvels of complexity that were being built. For example, several 5th dynasty pharaohs built water works within their pyramid complexes. In Nyserre’s sun temple and Sahure’s mortuary temple, archaeological excavations have revealed elaborate drainage systems made of copper piping which led to self contained basins beneath them.

Edited by Antigonos
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On 10/14/2023 at 8:21 PM, Thanos5150 said:

These later pyramids all exhibit the same "inexplicable" features in one form or another often claimed could only have been accomplished by a Lost Civilization, but there they are.  Another example, the 5th Dynasty pyramid of Neferirkare (239' x 344'):

Neferefres-Pyramid-667x500.jpg

(As an aside, note the step pyramid core) 

When it comes to how they did it, another reality no one wants to acknowledge for some reason, is that every OK and MK pyramid we have been able to ascertain its core make up is without exception a stepped/tower core. This is how pyramids were made. 

Pyramides-reines-satellite-kheops.jpg

pic07242006.jpg

On and on. If one wants to understand how they built these things, G1 included, it has to revolve around the construction model of a stepped/tower core in which the pyramid layer is added later. These series of 5th Dynasty pyramids are a road map of pyramid construction:

HERE

HERE

What we do know is whether the great pyramids or the later rubblers they were built the same so the question is how did they do it? 

Edited by Thanos5150
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On 10/16/2023 at 12:02 AM, Alchopwn said:

We actually have learned how to build a pyramid.  You drag the blocks along a low friction surface made from wet sand and seaweed that secretes a slippery mucus.  Incidentally the Puma Punku H blocks in the Tiwanaku site are made of an indigenously invented and ingenious concrete-like amalgam, and I feel so happy that is explained too.

Guys, this is serious information.  I'm not making this up.

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3 minutes ago, Alchopwn said:

Guys, this is serious information.  I'm not making this up.

I think it makes total sense. Really.
“How can we make this job easier?”

”Lets use snot”

 

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Just now, The Puzzler said:

I think it makes total sense. Really.
“How can we make this job easier?”

”Lets use snot”

A low friction surface really does make pushing heavy objects much easier.  Mucus has a very round and slippery molecular shape.  In practical terms it is a lot like having loads of ball bearings to roll things along.

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44 minutes ago, Thanos5150 said:

When it comes to how they did it, another reality no one wants to acknowledge for some reason, is that every OK and MK pyramid we have been able to ascertain its core make up is without exception a stepped/tower core. This is how pyramids were made. 

Pyramides-reines-satellite-kheops.jpg

pic07242006.jpg

On and on. If one wants to understand how they built these things, G1 included, it has to revolve around the construction model of a stepped/tower core in which the pyramid layer is added later. These series of 5th Dynasty pyramids are a road map of pyramid construction:

HERE

HERE

What we do know is whether the great pyramids or the later rubblers they were built the same so the question is how did they do it? 

I’m also curious if the passage of however much time which occurred between the building of the original stepped cores and the later pyramid conversion layers effected any changes as to the original methods of construction. 

Edited by Antigonos
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4 hours ago, Pettytalk said:

The regression can be attributed to the workers joining a union, and then going on strike, demanding higher wages, and lesser burdens, along with the 40 hrs work week, overtime and holiday pay, and a 3 weeks, yearly paid vacation. The strike lasted a very long time, because the workers also demanded working with much smaller and lighter blocks, to be quarried from local Egyptian sources, since the blocks' builders also became unionized. It then became too expensive for the pharaohs' grand burial monuments, and therefore resorted to simple cremation on a funeral pyre.

Another theory is that all the workers were Hebrew slaves, and pyramid building stopped when God freed his chosen people from Egyptian bondage, since the Egyptian themselves did not have the expertise and know-how for building pyramids.     

Like, that works for me.

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56 minutes ago, Alchopwn said:

Guys, this is serious information.  I'm not making this up.

I thought it was known those H-blocks were made from sandstone?

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43 minutes ago, Alchopwn said:

A low friction surface really does make pushing heavy objects much easier.  Mucus has a very round and slippery molecular shape.  In practical terms it is a lot like having loads of ball bearings to roll things along.

I know, as sarcastic as I sound, I agree. Ingenious idea.

In fact, so many words come from the concept of “ghel”..I even have a theory that is the original etymology of Gaelis and Celts…their yellow hair, but for now….on the mucus…

Many animals also can produce a mucus, I bet it certainly was used a lot for pushing, pulling moving objects and a very old concept word.

Entries linking to yellow

*ghel- (2)
 

Proto-Indo-European root meaning "to shine;" it forms words for "gold" (the "bright" metal), words denoting colors, especially "yellow" and "green," also "bile, gall," for its color, and a large group of Germanic gl- words having to do with shining and glittering and, perhaps, sliding. Buck says the interchange of words for yellow and green is "perhaps because they were applied to vegetation like grass, cereals, etc., which changed from green to yellow."

It forms all or part of: arsenic; Chloe; chloral; chloride; chlorinate; chlorine; chloro-; chloroform; chlorophyll; chloroplast; cholecyst; choler; cholera; choleric; cholesterol; cholinergic; Cloris; gall (n.1) "bile, liver secretion;" gild; glad; glance; glare; glass; glaze; glazier; gleam; glee; glib; glide; glimmer; glimpse; glint; glissade; glisten; glister; glitch; glitter; glitzy; gloaming; gloat; gloss (n.1) "glistening smoothness, luster;" glow; glower; gold; guilder; jaundice; melancholic; melancholy; yellow; zloty.

https://www.etymonline.com/word/yellow

 

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58 minutes ago, Alchopwn said:

Guys, this is serious information.  I'm not making this up.

Davidovits' claims have been debunked so many times now it's getting boring.

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