Chicago is so unpleasant migrants are fleeing BACK to Venezuela after being dumped in shelters

[Doc Socks Junior]

2 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Yes- more specifically Governor Abbot of Texas.   The article specifically about those 20,700 that Abott shipped.

"Since August last year, 20,700 migrants have arrived in Chicago from Texas. The Lone Star State's Governor Greg Abbott sent migrants to Chicago and other Democrat-run cities because of their proud status as 'sanctuary cities."- from the article the OP linked.

Ever since Oregon lowered their reading standards, we've seen all too sad evidence if it.

[Edumakated]

3 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Yes- more specifically Governor Abbot of Texas.   The article specifically about those 20,700 that Abott shipped.

"Since August last year, 20,700 migrants have arrived in Chicago from Texas. The Lone Star State's Governor Greg Abbott sent migrants to Chicago and other Democrat-run cities because of their proud status as 'sanctuary cities."- from the article the OP linked.

Many are coming from El Paso which has a Democrat Mayor...

If Democrats don't want to shut the border down, then they need to deal with the consequences.  I think Abbott shipping them blue cities is a great.  If you are going to brag about being a sanctuary city, then we will send you some illegal immigrants for sanctuary....

This is a federal issue and Democrats at the federal level have decided they don't want to secure the border.

[spartan max2]

18 minutes ago, Edumakated said:

Many are coming from El Paso which has a Democrat Mayor...

If Democrats don't want to shut the border down, then they need to deal with the consequences.  I think Abbott shipping them blue cities is a great.  If you are going to brag about being a sanctuary city, then we will send you some illegal immigrants for sanctuary....

This is a federal issue and Democrats at the federal level have decided they don't want to secure the border.

Bidens admin has had more deportations than Trump.

The ones who lost out in this situation was the migrant family who had decided that being poor in socialist Venezuela was better than being poor in the US 

Edited November 13, 2023 by spartan max2

[Doug1066]

19 minutes ago, Edumakated said:

This is a federal issue and Democrats at the federal level have decided they don't want to secure the border.

We don't want to break up families.  We don't want to tear gas little kids.  We don't want to put up saw blades to kill people in the middle of the river.

But you Republicans - cruelty is the point.

Doug

[Doug1066]

2 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Bidens admin has had more deportations than Trump.

The ones who lost our in this situation was the migrant family who had decided that being poor in socialist Venezuela was better than being poor in the US 

Open Border

“Open borders are the last thing we want – but we do want them.”  --John Powelson, Professor of Economic Development and Economic History, University of Colorado, Boulder.

           

There is no harm in open borders if immigrants’ country of origin has a strong economy and peace such that families can live there without fearing for their lives.  In those circumstances people will want to visit the United States, but will return home afterward.

 

So how do we solve this problem?  The solutions will be unique to each country refugees come from.  Venezuela is in imminent danger of complete collapse.  The Maduro government is incompetent.  Its current situation has not been improved by draconian U.S. sanctions aimed at over-turning it.

 

Venezuela is a mirror-image of what Donald Trump and his MAGAs envision for the United States.  It is left-wing rather than right-wing, but otherwise, the results are about the same.  Nicolás Maduro is a dictator who has control of the Supreme Court and much of the military.  He was elected in what many consider to be corrupt polls.  His current six-year term began in 2018 and is due to expire next year (2024).  The opposition-controlled National Assembly has declared him a “usurper” and declared the Presidency vacant.  Juan Guaidó, as leader of the National Assembly, has declared himself President.  More than 50 countries, including the United States, recognize Guaidó as the legitimate President of Venezuela, but China and Russia recognize Maduro.  Security forces have remained loyal to Maduro, owing in part to frequent pay raises (BBC News 2021).

 

While some of Venezuela’s problems go back a long way, most stem from the Presidency of Maduro and his predecessor, Hugo Chávez.  Elected in 1999, Chávez promised to drive down Venezuela’s inequality.  To make goods more affordable, he capped prices on flour, cooking oil and toiletries.  Unable to cover costs, businesses stopped production.  A loosening of currency controls eased shortages, but did not benefit those without access to foreign currency.  U.S. sanctions on oil crippled Venezuela’s key industry.  Inflation during 2021 is estimated at 2597%.

 

All this caused 5.6 million Venezuelans to leave the country.  Most went to Columbia, Ecuador, Peru, Brazil, Chile or Argentina.  A few have come to the United States (BBC News 2021).  At least part of the Venezuelan refugee problem is of the United States’ own making.

 

The preferable outcome for everybody is the ouster of the Maduro government.  But that may take awhile.  In the meantime, the U.S., in consultation with Guaidó, should consider re-structuring or reducing its oil sanctions.  Improved life in Venezuela will reduce refugees coming to the U.S.  We could also grant Venezuelans temporary refugee status.

 

Similar situations, though not as extreme, beset other Latin American and Caribbean countries.

Doug

 

 

BBC News.  2021.  Venezuela crisis:  how the political situation escalated.  BBC News (12 Aug. 2021).  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-36319877 2 Nov. 2023.

 

 

[+OverSword]

55 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Schools have ratios too but you can't really like end school if the ratio isn't able to be met by the school district. And arguably schools always have other staff that can come assist when needed. 

Thats a whole other problem that would take it's own thread though. 

I was really kidding as taking care of infants and pre-shcoolers is not comparable

[+OverSword]

46 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

Yes- more specifically Governor Abbot of Texas.   The article is specifically about those 20,700 that Abott shipped.

"Since August last year, 20,700 migrants have arrived in Chicago from Texas. The Lone Star State's Governor Greg Abbott sent migrants to Chicago and other Democrat-run cities because of their proud status as 'sanctuary cities."- from the article the OP linked.

The federal government run by a democratic administration has dropped the ball which has enabled that.  Or maybe Texas should simply absorb the hundreds of thousands of people who cross illegally and continue to let the rest of our states pay lip service without actually helping out?  It is weak federal policy at fault here, not Texas.

edit: Elect me president and I will fix the problem in no time with a few executive orders (which would probably get me assassinated by the CIA) 

Edited November 13, 2023 by OverSword

[Gromdor]

1 hour ago, OverSword said:

The federal government run by a democratic administration has dropped the ball which has enabled that.  Or maybe Texas should simply absorb the hundreds of thousands of people who cross illegally and continue to let the rest of our states pay lip service without actually helping out?  It is weak federal policy at fault here, not Texas.

edit: Elect me president and I will fix the problem in no time with a few executive orders (which would probably get me assassinated by the CIA) 

Texas is literally the ones that put them on the bus and picked where they went. 

I doubt you could fix the issue with an executive order.  Congress is the only one that can fix the broken system by passing laws to correct it.  The current law is that you have to come here as an illegal alien to claim legal asylum.  If you get caught you go back to go and start all over again till you don't get caught.

[+OverSword]

Just now, Gromdor said:

Texas is literally the ones that put them on the bus and picked where they went. 

 

And they literally sent them to declared sanctuary cities, no?

[Gromdor]

1 hour ago, Edumakated said:

Many are coming from El Paso which has a Democrat Mayor...

If Democrats don't want to shut the border down, then they need to deal with the consequences.  I think Abbott shipping them blue cities is a great.  If you are going to brag about being a sanctuary city, then we will send you some illegal immigrants for sanctuary....

This is a federal issue and Democrats at the federal level have decided they don't want to secure the border.

Weird, you must be reading a different article than the one the poster linked.  Because the El Paso mayor isn't paying/doing the bus rides to Chicago.

[Gromdor]

Just now, OverSword said:

And they literally sent them to declared sanctuary cities, no?

Yup.  It doesn't make what I said any less true.  

[+susieice]

Migrants are also refusing to stay in a tent city in Brooklyn. They want to be taken back to the Roosevelt Hotel in Manhattan..

Back to the hotel! Furious migrants REFUSE to stay in tent shelter after being bused to Brooklyn and head back to plush Manhattan accommodation (msn.com)

Furious migrants are refusing to stay in tent shelters set up for them in New York City - at great expense to the taxpayer - as they prefer their plush hotels in Manhattan.

A group of asylum seekers were seen being bused to Floyd Bennett Field in Brooklyn on Sunday. The site, part of a national park located in southeast of the New York City borough, is expected to hold 2,000 people.

But they were immediately loaded on a bus back to Manhattan as they complained that they had jobs back in the city - and their kids had schools to attend.

Jaime Williams, a New York Assemblywoman who represents the district where the field is located, sounded stunned as she filmed the puzzling scene. The migrants are seen getting off the blue Metropolitan Transportation Authority bus, walking past the main entrance of the tent, before walking straight onto another bus.

One migrant said he was going to head back to the Roosevelt Hotel - which has been commandeered by the Democrat mayor - while another told the New York Post: 'My kids go to school in the Bronx. For us to live out here is ridiculous.'

 

It's not the ideal location for anyone to live. There's no supermarket. There's no infrastructure.'

A bus driver said he was 'shocked' when the migrants turned and left and said that 'only a few people stayed.' 

A spokesperson for New York City Mayor Eric Adams said that some migrants did reject the site, but some from both the initial bus and another that arrived two hours later stuck it out. 

The city has signed over $5billion in nearly 200 contracts for migrant services since last year when he declared a state of emergency. Adams has said the crisis will cost the city $12billion over three years, and has warned New Yorkers will see their services affected by budget cuts to deal with the situation. 

In May, Adams made major changes to the 40-year-old 'Right to Shelter' law that guarantees a bed for anyone who needs it in the city, as his government asked for federal and state help to deal with the surge of migrants that he now says could destroy New York as we know it.

'This issue will destroy New York City,' Adams has said of the influx of asylum seekers.

 

 

[+Link of Hyrule]

5 hours ago, Doug1066 said:

Venezuela is a mirror-image of what Donald Trump and his MAGAs envision for the United States.

I must admit I didn't expect to see someone try to legitimately compare the socio-political system in Venezuela with America. It was surprising. But it did give me a laugh, so thanks for the merriment  

Edited November 14, 2023 by Paranoid Android

[Edumakated]

17 hours ago, Gromdor said:

Weird, you must be reading a different article than the one the poster linked.  Because the El Paso mayor isn't paying/doing the bus rides to Chicago.

El Paso is a city in Texas is it not?  They are in fact busing migrants to Chicago and New York as they support the Governor despite the El Paso mayor being a Democrat.  Sometimes you have to do what works instead of march in lock step with your ideology.

[Gromdor]

2 minutes ago, Edumakated said:

El Paso is a city in Texas is it not?  They are in fact busing migrants to Chicago and New York as they support the Governor despite the El Paso mayor being a Democrat.  Sometimes you have to do what works instead of march in lock step with your ideology.

<Shrugs> Well, if you say busing migrants to Chicago is working to solve the problem and not just an attempt at cruelty, then I will take you word for it.  

[Edumakated]

12 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

<Shrugs> Well, if you say busing migrants to Chicago is working to solve the problem and not just an attempt at cruelty, then I will take you word for it.  

What it is doing is making the border issue relatable to Democrats in large northern cities who have been mostly insulated from the real cost of having an unsecure border.   So now when this policy comes up, Democrats will have a much harder time virtue signaling and blocking efforts to secure the border now that their constituents have experienced the fustercluck of having to deal with economic migrants.

[Gromdor]

8 minutes ago, Edumakated said:

What it is doing is making the border issue relatable to Democrats in large northern cities who have been mostly insulated from the real cost of having an unsecure border.   So now when this policy comes up, Democrats will have a much harder time virtue signaling and blocking efforts to secure the border now that their constituents have experienced the fustercluck of having to deal with economic migrants.

Ah, so it is about the cruelty and not helping the migrants.  My earlier statement about Republicans deliberately sending them to places to harm as opposed to helping them stands.  

[Michelle]

I don't know why people think it's cruel. These border states have run out of resources. No jobs, overcrowded schools and no places to live. It's only logical to send them somewhere that welcomes illegal immigrants and offered them everything they need...until they got them.

[Cho Jinn]

On 11/12/2023 at 7:26 PM, Occupational Hubris said:

It's a conservatives wet dream to imagine democratically run cities as literal hell on earth.

Imagine?

[simplybill]

On 11/13/2023 at 10:23 AM, Gromdor said:

Those migrants were never sent there to succeed.  They were deliberately sent to a high cost of living and densely populated area to suffer and fail.  That was the whole point of the migrant buses.  If they sent them here to Iowa where there were jobs waiting and cheap empty rural homes, it wouldn't fit the narrative or inflict the cruelty that is desired.  If Republicans sent them someplace and everyone got a happy ending, it would ruin their message of fear and ruination.  How would they win votes? 

Correct me if I’m wrong, but to my knowledge our Iowa governors and mayors have never declared Iowa as a ‘Sanctuary’ destination for illegal immigrants.
The busloads of illegal immigrants from Texas and Florida were sent only to those cities where the Mayors had publicly declared their Sanctuary status and their willingness to accept them with open arms. 

 

[+susieice]

4 hours ago, Edumakated said:

What it is doing is making the border issue relatable to Democrats in large northern cities who have been mostly insulated from the real cost of having an unsecure border.   So now when this policy comes up, Democrats will have a much harder time virtue signaling and blocking efforts to secure the border now that their constituents have experienced the fustercluck of having to deal with economic migrants.

That's exactly what's happening. As long as Texas, Florida and Arizona just absorbed all these migrants, northern cities were happy. Now they know what it's like to not have the resources to accommodate all these people. They had no clue or care what 30-40,000 migrants a day meant. It's going to take everyone to absorb that kind of an impact. You would hope they understand now but it doesn't sound like it.

I don't have a problem with migrants. We're a big place. I do have a problem with politicians using them as tools for division.

Edited November 14, 2023 by susieice

[Gromdor]

1 hour ago, simplybill said:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but to my knowledge our Iowa governors and mayors have never declared Iowa as a ‘Sanctuary’ destination for illegal immigrants.
The busloads of illegal immigrants from Texas and Florida were sent only to those cities where the Mayors had publicly declared their Sanctuary status and their willingness to accept them with open arms. 
 

No, you are right.  Our governor is most certainly on team cruelty.  She sent our National Guard for Opeeration Lonestar and her solution to our labor shortage was to reduce the age and restrictions on child labor. Iowa governor signs bill to loosen child labor laws | CNN Politics

But Iowa can use 75,000 more workers Iowa Labor Shortage Causes Immigration Problem for Republicans - Bloomberg

One would think it was a no brainer to send them where they can be productive and solve the problem.  But that isn't the goal.  The goal is to try and increase suffering so that voters can be more "relatable" to Republican ideology.

Meanwhile, places like Kansas are trying to pay people to come:These Cities And States Will Pay You As Much As $15,000 To Move There (forbes.com)

 

[Gromdor]

3 hours ago, Michelle said:

I don't know why people think it's cruel. These border states have run out of resources. No jobs, overcrowded schools and no places to live. It's only logical to send them somewhere that welcomes illegal immigrants and offered them everything they need...until they got them.

Because we have places with thousands of jobs, cheap homes, schools merging because of dwindling rural population, and empty decaying towns?  Logical would be to send them there.  Cruel would be to send them someplace where the cost of living is high, it is over populated, and to just plain treat them like livestock.

[spartan max2]

43 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

No, you are right.  Our governor is most certainly on team cruelty.  She sent our National Guard for Opeeration Lonestar and her solution to our labor shortage was to reduce the age and restrictions on child labor. Iowa governor signs bill to loosen child labor laws | CNN Politics

But Iowa can use 75,000 more workers Iowa Labor Shortage Causes Immigration Problem for Republicans - Bloomberg

One would think it was a no brainer to send them where they can be productive and solve the problem.  But that isn't the goal.  The goal is to try and increase suffering so that voters can be more "relatable" to Republican ideology.

Meanwhile, places like Kansas are trying to pay people to come:These Cities And States Will Pay You As Much As $15,000 To Move There (forbes.com)

 

Why use immigrants for labor shortages when you could just use children 

[Michelle]

1 hour ago, Gromdor said:

No, you are right.  Our governor is most certainly on team cruelty.  She sent our National Guard for Opeeration Lonestar and her solution to our labor shortage was to reduce the age and restrictions on child labor. Iowa governor signs bill to loosen child labor laws | CNN Politics

Sounds like my life in an upper middle class home. You make it sound like forced labor. I did it because my family owned a restaurant/bar, I babysat and worked at the local amusement park besides going to school. I wanted to be independent as quickly as possible. My mother still paid for everything and I got to keep every dime I made to spend however I wanted.