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Chicago is so unpleasant migrants are fleeing BACK to Venezuela after being dumped in shelters


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1 hour ago, Gromdor said:

Because we have places with thousands of jobs, cheap homes, schools merging because of dwindling rural population, and empty decaying towns?

It doesn't sound like y'all don't have the resources to support thousands of people with food and schools. Or you could put them in decaying, dead towns that are probably not still up to code.

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1 hour ago, Gromdor said:

her solution to our labor shortage was to reduce the age and restrictions on child labor. Iowa governor signs bill to loosen child labor laws | CNN Politics

 

47 minutes ago, spartan max2 said:

Why use immigrants for labor shortages when you could just use children 

 

There’s nothing negative about reducing restrictions on child labor for children who want to work. As the CNN article points out, Blue states also are changing their laws to make it easier for younger workers to get a job. 

CNN:

“The law is part of a broader effort by states to loosen child labor laws. Arkansas’s governor signed a bill in March that allows youth under the age of 16 to be employed without a work certificate, and New Jersey and New Hampshire have enacted laws to extend work hours. Several states, including Minnesota and Missouri, have also recently introduced similar bills, according to the Economic Policy Institute.”

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On 11/12/2023 at 6:24 PM, Tatetopa said:

That Chicago is worse than Venezuela?

No, that some are leaving.   

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16 minutes ago, simplybill said:

 

 

There’s nothing negative about reducing restrictions on child labor for children who want to work. As the CNN article points out, Blue states also are changing their laws to make it easier for younger workers to get a job. 

CNN:

“The law is part of a broader effort by states to loosen child labor laws. Arkansas’s governor signed a bill in March that allows youth under the age of 16 to be employed without a work certificate, and New Jersey and New Hampshire have enacted laws to extend work hours. Several states, including Minnesota and Missouri, have also recently introduced similar bills, according to the Economic Policy Institute.”

You make a fair point.

It still seems silly for Iowa to turn immigrants away when they have labor shortages problems though. 

I suppose we'd need to see what sort of jobs have the labor shortages though.

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29 minutes ago, Michelle said:

It doesn't sound like y'all don't have the resources to support thousands of people with food and schools. Or you could put them in decaying, dead towns that are probably not still up to code.

We have resources and jobs.  I have to facepalm with the food statement.  We feed most of the country and a good chunk of the rest of the world.  Heck, half those jobs unfilled in Iowa would be for stuff like the pork industry.  We just don't have people.

Been to the grocery market lately?  Complained about high food prices?  Eggs?  Pork?  Wish they were cheaper?  They probably could be if we had the workers to fill the empty job slots here in Iowa where we produce it, workers to package it, and workers to truck it.  

 

My company has been on overtime for over a year now and has been forced to turn down jobs.  (Construction, not agriculture)  There just isn't enough people to hire to get the work done.  Heck, there is talk of building a ethanol jet fuel plant (using ethanol) up north of my town and Cargill is doing a multi-billion dollar upgrade to make fabric out of corn to the southeast of my town. 

 

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25 minutes ago, Gromdor said:

We have resources and jobs.  I have to facepalm with the food statement.  We feed most of the country and a good chunk of the rest of the world.  Heck, half those jobs unfilled in Iowa would be for stuff like the pork industry.  We just don't have people.

*facepalm* Are people going to donate the food to them or are they going to eat crops raw while they are picking? Where are they going to cook and serve it when thousands come in without even a place to live? I doubt you have big hotels that you can clear out in the middle of nowhere so they don't need transportation. The ones in New York are complaining their new shelters, which are illegally being built on federal park property, are too far out of town. If they've already found jobs they have no way to get there now.

Logistics doesn't seem to be your forte.

Edited by Michelle
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10 minutes ago, Michelle said:

*facepalm* Are people going to donate the food to them or are they going to eat crops raw while they are picking? Where are they going to cook and serve it when thousands come in without even a place to live? I doubt you have big hotels that you can clear out in the middle of nowhere so they don't need transportation. The ones in New York are complaining their new shelters, which are illegally being built on federal park property, are too far out of town. If they've already found jobs they have no way to get there now.

Logistics don't seem to be your forte.

They would have jobs and could buy their own food and could buy or rent in the area.  I know it's a radical idea.  

Ironically, part of my jobs is logistics for the company.  We divvy up our workers to the appropriate jobs and arrange hotels.  It's part of project management. We could do the same for the migrants.

I like your New York example- it demonstrates the cruelty.  Even with jobs,  because of the high cost of living and population density they have to live in tents so far away that they can't get to their jobs. 

Edit to add:  I'll let you in on a dirty little secret.  There are employers already in Iowa that exploit illegal aliens and have set up a system to intergrate them into the company.  They have doing this for decades.  Trump even pardoned one of the most famous ones: Postville raid - Wikipedia  Heck, Nunes from Truth Social even has some employed at his family dairy here in Iowa:Judge Says Nunes Not Defamed by Story About Iowa Dairy Farm (usnews.com)

We just have to use a similar but legal system.

Edited by Gromdor
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1 minute ago, spartan max2 said:

It still seems silly for Iowa to turn immigrants away when they have labor shortages problems though. 

It’s complicated. In the rural area of Iowa where I live, we’re sometimes tolerant of illegals to the point of being protective toward them. The owner of the roofing company that shingled my house and garage hired a hard-working crew of Mexican workers, even though it was obvious their work permits were falsified. Every season, for years, they returned to Iowa (from Mexico) and lived in the owner’s home along with the owner’s family (it’s a big house). Unfortunately, he had to let them go when the Federal government began cracking down on illegal workers.

In the mid-sized town 20 miles from my home, I think everyone in town is aware that the employees at the Mexican restaurant are here illegally, but to my knowledge they’ve never been reported to the USCIS (U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services). 

In rural Iowa, just like every other sparsely populated area in the US, high-paying jobs are almost nonexistent. Low wages and low population numbers translate to a small tax base that’s inadequate to support a sudden influx of immigrants. Fortunately for us, the small numbers of illegals that are here contribute to the tax base, and don’t require taxpayer assistance.

If our current Federal government would make an attempt to achieve that kind of balance nationwide, I’m sure more US citizens would be willing to accept relaxed immigration laws. As it is, the Feds appear to be focused on crippling the ability of even our major cities to achieve that balance.

 

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10 minutes ago, simplybill said:

It’s complicated. In the rural area of Iowa where I live, we’re sometimes tolerant of illegals to the point of being protective toward them. The owner of the roofing company that shingled my house and garage hired a hard-working crew of Mexican workers, even though it was obvious their work permits were falsified. Every season, for years, they returned to Iowa (from Mexico) and lived in the owner’s home along with the owner’s family (it’s a big house). Unfortunately, he had to let them go when the Federal government began cracking down on illegal workers.

In the mid-sized town 20 miles from my home, I think everyone in town is aware that the employees at the Mexican restaurant are here illegally, but to my knowledge they’ve never been reported to the USCIS (U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services). 

In rural Iowa, just like every other sparsely populated area in the US, high-paying jobs are almost nonexistent. Low wages and low population numbers translate to a small tax base that’s inadequate to support a sudden influx of immigrants. Fortunately for us, the small numbers of illegals that are here contribute to the tax base, and don’t require taxpayer assistance.

If our current Federal government would make an attempt to achieve that kind of balance nationwide, I’m sure more US citizens would be willing to accept relaxed immigration laws. As it is, the Feds appear to be focused on crippling the ability of even our major cities to achieve that balance.

 

They contribute to the taxes but not as much as they would if we fixed the system and make it legal.  Companies get away with it here by using them as 1099 employees (I.E. Independent contractors).  They basically pay them cash and can legally skip all the verifications needed.  Many unscrupulous companies use their illegal status to supress their wages, avoid paying overtime, and other abuses.  Correcting that abuse but using the same methodology those people used to intergrate the immigrants would go a long way to solving the immigration issue.

The biggest problem is how are system is broken in the legal way to come over and the "sugar" that all these unscrupulous companies wave to bring them over.  We've had a Texas company come build a hotel up here in Ames.  It used all illegal labor and they were actually living in the hotel as they built it.  Needless to say, it wasn't anywhere near up to code.  If I recall there is a liquidated damages clause for that job and it's already six months past the finish date.  So perhaps this company will be fined into non-existence.  Unfortunately, the owner can just declare bankruptcy, start a new company, and do the same thing all over again.  

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We have jobs that need to be done but may be unpleasant, dangerous, or low pay.  Not everybody wants to do them and yet they are a necessary part of the supply chain.

We have a group of people that are willing to take those jobs, pay taxes and  live as peaceful contributing members of society.

We Congress that can restructure the immigration laws to provide for residence and work permits.

If politics didn't get in the way, I think we could solve this problem.

 

 

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5 hours ago, Gromdor said:

They would have jobs and could buy their own food and could buy or rent in the area.  I know it's a radical idea.

That takes time. You don't get paid for a week maybe two. They would have to save up to pay a deposit on housing and utilities not to mention furnishings and general household items. They would also have to live close enough to a city that has resources for immigrants if they want to stay here legally. 

And, they didn't put the illegal immigrants in tents on national park property. They are in tiny houses.

 

 

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7 hours ago, Michelle said:

That takes time. You don't get paid for a week maybe two. They would have to save up to pay a deposit on housing and utilities not to mention furnishings and general household items. They would also have to live close enough to a city that has resources for immigrants if they want to stay here legally. 

And, they didn't put the illegal immigrants in tents on national park property. They are in tiny houses.

 

None of those things that you listed are problems that haven't been solved by companies willing to relocate employees.  Most immigrants I have personally met came here with their savings.  Some even had thousands to spend on a coyote.  Again, the cruelty is when they are shipped to someplace with a high population density and high cost of living that siphons all of their savings and sets them up for failure.

Relocating an immigrant is no different than relocating an American family that has to move for a job.  We do it all the time.  Iowa has taken in refugees from Bosnia, Somalia, Vietnam, the Congo, etc.  Agencies are already set up in this state and others.  Read the link about Postville-  it shows how systems exist to take care of them.  We just need to do the same thing legally.

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On 11/13/2023 at 6:39 PM, Paranoid Android said:

I must admit I didn't expect to see someone try to legitimately compare the socio-political system in Venezuela with America. It was surprising. But it did give me a laugh, so thanks for the merriment :lol: 

Venezuela was a parliamentary democracy until 2018 when Maduro apparently rigged the election and installed himself as dictator.  That's exactly what Trump is trying to do - he says so regularly at his rallies.

Once Maduro is out (His term ends next year; it remains to be seen whether he will voluntarily step down.), Guaido will succeed him as President and restore democratic government.  The National Assembly has already declared him the legitimate President.  Venezuela still has a democratically elected National Assembly that has declared Maduro a "usurper."  Guaido is recognized by the United States, Australia and most of the world as Venezuela's President.

The U.S. Congress has more Socialists than the Venezuelan National Assembly.

Why don't you try googling "Venezuela" and learn a little bit about it?

Doug

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23 hours ago, Edumakated said:

El Paso is a city in Texas is it not?  They are in fact busing migrants to Chicago and New York as they support the Governor despite the El Paso mayor being a Democrat.  Sometimes you have to do what works instead of march in lock step with your ideology.

I wish MAGAs would learn that.

Doug

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17 hours ago, Gromdor said:

They would have jobs and could buy their own food and could buy or rent in the area.  I know it's a radical idea.  

Ironically, part of my jobs is logistics for the company.  We divvy up our workers to the appropriate jobs and arrange hotels.  It's part of project management. We could do the same for the migrants.

I like your New York example- it demonstrates the cruelty.  Even with jobs,  because of the high cost of living and population density they have to live in tents so far away that they can't get to their jobs. 

Edit to add:  I'll let you in on a dirty little secret.  There are employers already in Iowa that exploit illegal aliens and have set up a system to intergrate them into the company.  They have doing this for decades.  Trump even pardoned one of the most famous ones: Postville raid - Wikipedia  Heck, Nunes from Truth Social even has some employed at his family dairy here in Iowa:Judge Says Nunes Not Defamed by Story About Iowa Dairy Farm (usnews.com)

We just have to use a similar but legal system.

So no one wants to move to rural Iowa?  Wages should be sky rocketing if there are jobs and no takers.

If jobs are plentiful and wages commensurate, then government should be encouraging citizens to move to Iowa, particularly lower paid citizens in urban areas.   Why import economic migrants when those jobs could go to legal citizens?

 

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Oeb4cLTl_x96.jpg
 
GregAbbott_TX
 
1h
Texas has bused over 65,400 migrants to sanctuary cities to provide vital relief to overwhelmed border communities. Our busing mission will continue until Joe Biden secures the border.

Image

Edited by Zebra3
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9 hours ago, Doug1066 said:

That's exactly what Trump is trying to do - he says so regularly at his rallies.

You lost me after this sentence. I reject that claim as utterly false, therefore the rest of your premise I also reject as utterly false. Thanks for the chat. 

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7 hours ago, Edumakated said:

So no one wants to move to rural Iowa?  Wages should be sky rocketing if there are jobs and no takers.

If jobs are plentiful and wages commensurate, then government should be encouraging citizens to move to Iowa, particularly lower paid citizens in urban areas.   Why import economic migrants when those jobs could go to legal citizens?

 

They totally do offer incentives.  I'm pretty sure I linked the cash being offered to move to different rural states.  I can link sign on bonuses for here in Iowa too.  

But, it does bring attention to a seperate problem the US has.  No one wants to live in rural areas.  They all want to live in the big liberal cities.  Even the ones that we hear about moving to Texas are all going to places like Houston.  

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14 hours ago, Paranoid Android said:

You lost me after this sentence. I reject that claim as utterly false, therefore the rest of your premise I also reject as utterly false. Thanks for the chat. 

They don't broadcast Trump's speeches in Australia, do they?  Maybe if you listened to what he's saying, you'd know what you're talking about.

Doug

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20 hours ago, Edumakated said:

So no one wants to move to rural Iowa?  Wages should be sky rocketing if there are jobs and no takers.

Try North Dakota.  The Bakken is booming.  If you can get there, there's a job for you.

Doug

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8 hours ago, Doug1066 said:

They don't broadcast Trump's speeches in Australia, do they?  Maybe if you listened to what he's saying, you'd know what you're talking about.

Doug

I've heard him make jokes about staying in office longer than 2 terms. Throwaway lines that get the crowd laughing. That is what we colloquially refer to as "humour". If you're taking that humour as real, then that's on you and shows more about your Trump Derangement Syndrome than any actual commentary of reality! 

Edited by Paranoid Android
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45 minutes ago, Paranoid Android said:

I've heard him make jokes about staying in office longer than 2 terms. Throwaway lines that get the crowd laughing. That is what we colloquially refer to as "humour". If you're taking that humour as real, then that's on you and shows more about your Trump Derangement Syndrome than any actual commentary of reality! 

Trump is saying he'll build a series of concentration camps along the Mexican border and use them to round up illegal aliens.  There are around 11 million illegal aliens in this country.  Most came in legally and overstayed their visas.  Do you have any idea how many people it takes to make 11 million?  Trump was incompetent to handle that problem last time and will blow it if he tries it again.

IF he manages to deport at least most of those illegals, he'll have a bunch of empty camps. He'll start rounding up his enemies.  He has already said he would.  Due process be damned.  Trump wants to be dictator-for-life.  He has not read the Constitution and has no clear idea what's in it.  He has said that he would ignore much of the Bill of Rights.  He tried to overthrow democratic government in this country already and is facing trial for it.  If he gets away with it, he'll try again.

As you know, I am a Quaker.  Trump has said he would send Quakers "back where they came from."  I came from Ohio, but I don't think that's what he meant.

 

Trump's play book is Mein Kampf.  He is taking his ideas and actions straight out of there.  Have you read Mein Kampf?  I have.  Hitler was a godawful writer and reading it is a struggle in itself.  But he laid out what he was going to do and Trump is saying the same things.  Maybe it is some sort of joke, but America can't risk it.  And that's not TDS; it's loyalty to my country.

Doug

Edited by Doug1066
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1 minute ago, Doug1066 said:

Trump is saying he'll build a series of concentration camps along the Mexican border and use them to round up illegal aliens.  There are around 11 million illegal aliens in this country.  Most came in legally and overstayed their visas.  Do you have any idea how many people it takes to make 11 million?  Trump was incompetent to handle that problem last time and will blow it if he tries it again.

IF he manages to deport at least most of those illegals, he'll have a bunch of empty camps. He'll start rounding up his enemies.  He has already said he would.  Due process be damned.  Trump wants to be dictator-for-life.

As you know, I am a Quaker.  Trump has said he would send Quakers "back where they came from."  I came from Ohio, but I don't think that's what he meant.

 

Trump's play book is Mein Kampf.  He is taking his ideas and actions straight out of there.  Have you read Mein Kampf?  I have.  Hitler was a godawful writer and reading it is a struggle in itself.  But he laid out what he was going to do and Trump is saying the same things.  Maybe it is some sort of joke, but America can't risk it.  And that's not TDS; it's loyalty to my country.

Doug

Your TDS is showing. Thanks for the chat but there's no reasoning with this level of hatred for Trump. It's totally irrational.

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2 minutes ago, Paranoid Android said:

Your TDS is showing. Thanks for the chat but there's no reasoning with this level of hatred for Trump. It's totally irrational.

He already tried to overthrow the Constitution.  That was no joke.

YOU are the one with Trump Derangement Syndrome.  He sure has you suckered.

Doug

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4 minutes ago, Paranoid Android said:

Your TDS is showing. Thanks for the chat but there's no reasoning with this level of hatred for Trump. It's totally irrational.

It's those tabloids he reads. That is why he never provides a source for anything he references. Well, one time he did and I laughed reading it until tears rolled down my face. :lol:

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