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Trump is off the Colorado ballot


susieice

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1 hour ago, and-then said:

No luck needed on this one.  It isn't even close to being viable.  The point of law will be around 1A but also the fact that a state's judicial body used their own OPINIONS of what a citizen was guilty of even without that citizen having ANY due process of law.  It will be overturned and the ruling is likely to leave no room for other states to attempt to subvert our elections in this way.  Colorado is essentially a blue state that he almost certainly would not have won, anyway.  He actually loses nothing other than the need to stop this election interference in its tracks before swing state democrats try to exclude him there, as well.

You’ve missed the mark. It’s not an opinion anymore, it’s a legal ruling that will be challenged or else it will spread. This signals Trump and his MAGA crew are fighting not just the democrats but the GOP since they have not come out to defend him. No one wants their finger prints on the murder weapon so instead they want Trump to pull the trigger himself by contesting the ruling, because he will lose.
 

Now a little on overturning the ruling. Not as familiar with American politics and law but to overturn a legal ruling needs more than a liar liar pants on fire rebuttal. Trump’s lawyers will have to prove January 6 was a first amendment right and not a violation of the insurrection act to stop this from spreading. Wondering how many republicans were on the hill on January 6 and are willing to defend Trump?

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2 hours ago, Paranoid Android said:

He was never charged, let alone convicted! 

I wonder how long it will be before Mike Pence gets to make a statement? 

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2 hours ago, Paranoid Android said:

Guilty until proven innocent! Truth, justice and the American way!

Yes indeed.  However if you read the law, it does not say convicted of insurrection, but it does include  providing aid and comfort to insurrectionists.  He has sung with them, directed their march, promised them pardons and touted them as heroes on  the media.  That is aid and comfort.  The law maintains that nobody who attempts to illegally overthrow the government should then be allowed to lead it.

Yes, Trump like everybody else is innocent until proven guilty. Read the laws, follow the trials, read the legal factual reports not sensational media.  Just because Trump say he did nothing wrong doesn't me it is so (except for some of the far gone who believe every word he says.

No other American would have been treated with such deference.  Anybody else would be long since in jail.

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8 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

No other American would have been treated with such deference.  Anybody else would be long since in jail.

Well i guess it must be true when Trump says, "They're not after me . They're after you. I'm just in the way!"  

🤣 

22434602-7808431-image-a-31_1576728368122.thumb.jpg.0f85cc5871f07faa9525c95329c9e437.jpg

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2 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Well i guess it must be true when Trump says, "They're not after me . They're after you. I'm just in the way!"  

🤣 

22434602-7808431-image-a-31_1576728368122.thumb.jpg.0f85cc5871f07faa9525c95329c9e437.jpg

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS7n0gXdagjXpSDFSsj4DL

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1 hour ago, Katniss said:

Oh that's because right wing MAGA populism hijacks some of the political conservative ideas from Libertarians. It's nothing new. Some conservatives have been doing that for years in the Republican party. Listen, if you are going to support Orange Jesus and defend or agree mostly with everything Orange Jesus says, it's obvious you are MAGA and fit into the category of right wing populism. Otherwise you wouldn't waste your time here. If you don't like the sound of that label, I understand, but it's really illogical to try and separate yourself from that label when you are on the "Go Trump" team. :D Trump is MAGA - MAGA is right wing populism.

The shoe fits, and he's wearing it. He'll deny it, but the shoe is there for all to see. 

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Conservative former Judge Luttig, who served on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit for 15 years, on today's ruling in Colorado:

"The individual justices of the Colorado supreme court brought honor to their court and as well to the state and federal judiciaries with their opinion tonight in this historic case...Their opinion is unassailable under the objective law of the federal Constitution and Section 3 of the 14th Amendment. The Supreme Court of the United States ought to affirm this decision today."

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23 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

However if you read the law, it does not say convicted of insurrection, but it does include  providing aid and comfort to insurrectionists.

If you read the 14th Amendment section 3 you would notice that the position of president and of vice president is not mentioned.

Even though it's been posted already might as well post it again.

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

There is debate among legal scholars on if the 14th Amendment section 3 even applies to running for the president or vice president as it mentions rather specific positions can a person can be disqualified for for insurrection and those positions are senators, representatives, and electors.  By strict letter of the 14th Amendment section 3 only elected positions in the legislature are mentioned and nothing from the executive branch is mentioned.  

This is definitely going to go to the Supreme Court and they will rule on this.  My guess is in an attempt to avoid making a contentious decision the Supreme Court will side with Trump by arguing the 14th Amendment doesn't apply to this situation since being president isn't explicitly stated when other positions are.  That way they avoid the issue of if Trump was guilty of insurrection or not and of messing with the election by holding Trump being removed from a state's ballot.

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Vivek Ramaswamy takes himself off the Colorado ballot in protest until the decision is reversed, calling it an "unconstitutional maneuverer, which is a bastardisation of the 14th amendment to our Constitution". Apologies if someone's already posted something about this:

 

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1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

Yes indeed.  However if you read the law, it does not say convicted of insurrection, but it does include  providing aid and comfort to insurrectionists.  He has sung with them, directed their march, promised them pardons and touted them as heroes on  the media.  That is aid and comfort.  The law maintains that nobody who attempts to illegally overthrow the government should then be allowed to lead it.

Yes, Trump like everybody else is innocent until proven guilty. Read the laws, follow the trials, read the legal factual reports not sensational media.  Just because Trump say he did nothing wrong doesn't me it is so (except for some of the far gone who believe every word he says.

No other American would have been treated with such deference.  Anybody else would be long since in jail.

Let's see what the Supreme Court says. If all this is true then they'll have to side with you. Trump probably wasn't going to win Colorado anyway (at least that's what the internet tells me), but such a ruling would provide precedent for Trump to be removed from other ballots in other States. This could (no, would) change the landscape of America, at least for the 2024 election cycle, and likely much longer. 

If you're right. I suspect this whole thing will be reversed by the Supreme Court. Which could backfire and make Trump even more popular. Although if that happens I will stop calling it a "backfire" and suggest that the democrats are trying to ensure Trump becomes the Republican candidate - Biden's only hope is someone as controversial as Trump turning off Independent voters. If DeSantis or Haley are the candidate you can say with fair certainty that 2025 will be a Red Dawn (is that a phrase yet, can I anoint a Haley/DeSantis victory a Red Dawn :P )

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59 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Well i guess it must be true when Trump says, "They're not after me . They're after you. I'm just in the way!"  

Only if you have recently stolen government documents, been charged with inciting a riot, defamed a person, lost the case and did it again, submitted false business and tax records for personal profit, and interfered in a state election with co-conspirators. There are indictments for breaking a number of civil and criminal laws wrapped up in there.  We do have a code of laws.  No special new laws were written to handle Trump.  He has to abide by the Constitution and the laws Congress has passed  just like the rest of us.

If you did all of that, maybe they should come after you and let a couple of judges and juries decide your fate based on those same laws.

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10 minutes ago, Paranoid Android said:

Let's see what the Supreme Court says.

Exactly.  This is just like "Owning the Libs"  Its an article to rile up conservatives.

The Colorado vote was 4-3, that say something right there.  Very small chance it will be upheld by the Supreme Court.  So, much ado about nothing.

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1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

Yes indeed.  However if you read the law, it does not say convicted of insurrection, but it does include  providing aid and comfort to insurrectionists.  He has sung with them, directed their march, promised them pardons and touted them as heroes on  the media.  That is aid and comfort.  The law maintains that nobody who attempts to illegally overthrow the government should then be allowed to lead it.

Yes, Trump like everybody else is innocent until proven guilty. Read the laws, follow the trials, read the legal factual reports not sensational media.  Just because Trump say he did nothing wrong doesn't me it is so (except for some of the far gone who believe every word he says.

No other American would have been treated with such deference.  Anybody else would be long since in jail.

It says this too.

or hold any office…who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States…to support the Constitution of the United States

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2 hours ago, Katniss said:

Oh that's because right wing MAGA populism hijacks some of the political conservative ideas from Libertarians. It's nothing new. Some conservatives have been doing that for years in the Republican party. Listen, if you are going to support Orange Jesus and defend or agree mostly with everything Orange Jesus says, it's obvious you are MAGA and fit into the category of right wing populism. Otherwise you wouldn't waste your time here. If you don't like the sound of that label, I understand, but it's really illogical to try and separate yourself from that label when you are on the "Go Trump" team. :D Trump is MAGA - MAGA is right wing populism.

In the Church of Trump we prefer the pejorative Bad Orange Man, or BOM for short.  Orange Jesus is too messianic,  this way is we're wrong we can just say he's not the messiah, he's just a very naughty boy :lol:

image.png.252ae78d2ba62a2bd2bb23102c0fd6ef.png

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1 hour ago, Paranoid Android said:

Vivek Ramaswamy takes himself off the Colorado ballot in protest until the decision is reversed, calling it an "unconstitutional maneuverer, which is a bastardisation of the 14th amendment to our Constitution". Apologies if someone's already posted something about this:

 

Well, that’s certsinly one way to ensure no one stands opposition to your party on a ballot.

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1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

Only if you have recently stolen government documents, been charged with inciting a riot, defamed a person, lost the case and did it again, submitted false business and tax records for personal profit, and interfered in a state election with co-conspirators. There are indictments for breaking a number of civil and criminal laws wrapped up in there.  We do have a code of laws.  No special new laws were written to handle Trump.  He has to abide by the Constitution and the laws Congress has passed  just like the rest of us.

If you did all of that, maybe they should come after you and let a couple of judges and juries decide your fate based on those same laws.

Wow! I've been living under a rock. I had no idea Trump's been convicted of all those crimes. Why isn't he in jail already?  

😲

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40 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Well, that’s certsinly one way to ensure no one stands opposition to your party on a ballot.

Or a calculated play for votes considering the Supreme Court will almost certainly overturn the decision and putting Vivek on Trump's supporters good books while also going back on the ballot. 

Edited by Paranoid Android
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34 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Wow! I've been living under a rock. I had no idea Trump's been convicted of all those crimes. Why isn't he in jail already?  

😲

Didn't say anything about convictions.  He has been accused and sufficient evidence presented to a court of law to indict him.

Acid this is what happens if there is sufficient evidence presented to charge a person with a crime.  It goes to trial in the US Judicial system.  We have a code of laws and a procedure to follow.  The question is decided when both sides present evidence to a judge or jury to argue whether the defendant is innocent or guilty.  The judge or jury decides.  That is how it goes.

Trump has already been found guilty in the E Jean Carrol case, but he has appealed.  He has yet to pay a fine.  His civil court case in New York will be decided in January.  He has not paid a fine there either.  All criminal trials are just beginning.  No verdicts have been reached.

Donald Trump is not in jail or any sort of confinement.  He has violated court orders, been fined, but not imprisoned. If he is found guilty, he can appeal.  I'd make a small wager that all of the appeals won't be settled until 2025. 

All this is public record, no secrets about the charges, the arguments from both sides and the verdict when it comes.

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47 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Wow! I've been living under a rock. I had no idea Trump's been convicted of all those crimes. Why isn't he in jail already?  

😲

Just to help you out a little bit, your comments are just a tad disingenuous or you don’t know difference between an indictment and a conviction. But, thanks for the laugh it’s funny to watch all of you MAGA Fan Club members go into melt down mode, especially those of you who are not American Citizens!:lol:

5 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Didn't say anything about convictions.  He has been accused and sufficient evidence presented to a court of law to indict him.

Acid this is what happens if there is sufficient evidence presented to charge a person with a crime.  It goes to trial in the US Judicial system.  We have a code of laws and a procedure to follow.  The question is decided when both sides present evidence to a judge or jury to argue whether the defendant is innocent or guilty.  The judge or jury decides.  That is how it goes.

Trump has already been found guilty in the E Jean Carrol case, but he has appealed.  He has yet to pay a fine.  His civil court case in New York will be decided in January.  He has not paid a fine there either.  All criminal trials are just beginning.  No verdicts have been reached.

Donald Trump is not in jail or any sort of confinement.  He has violated court orders, been fined, but not imprisoned. If he is found guilty, he can appeal.  I'd make a small wager that all of the appeals won't be settled until 2025. 

All this is public record, no secrets about the charges, the arguments from both sides and the verdict when it comes.

 

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The US might as well be Russia now – it looks like Obama will use every legal and extra legal deceit to stop any kind of choice for voters on top of fixed voting methods

Edited by itsnotoutthere
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35 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Didn't say anything about convictions.  He has been accused and sufficient evidence presented to a court of law to indict him.

Acid this is what happens if there is sufficient evidence presented to charge a person with a crime.  It goes to trial in the US Judicial system.  We have a code of laws and a procedure to follow.  The question is decided when both sides present evidence to a judge or jury to argue whether the defendant is innocent or guilty.  The judge or jury decides.  That is how it goes.

Trump has already been found guilty in the E Jean Carrol case, but he has appealed.  He has yet to pay a fine.  His civil court case in New York will be decided in January.  He has not paid a fine there either.  All criminal trials are just beginning.  No verdicts have been reached.

Donald Trump is not in jail or any sort of confinement.  He has violated court orders, been fined, but not imprisoned. If he is found guilty, he can appeal.  I'd make a small wager that all of the appeals won't be settled until 2025. 

All this is public record, no secrets about the charges, the arguments from both sides and the verdict when it comes.

Thanks for all that information. The laws need to be changed to lock up people like Trump quicker. 

He's literally Hitler. Speaks exactly like him. Will probably start speaking fluent German at one of his next Rally's or maybe Russian. I just learned an hr ago he's Putin's puppet and was only friendly to North Korea because he wanted to build a Trump tower there where he could get peed on day and night from hookers.  This is all so crazy.  

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42 minutes ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Just to help you out a little bit, your comments are just a tad disingenuous or you don’t know difference between an indictment and a conviction. But, thanks for the laugh it’s funny to watch all of you MAGA Fan Club members go into melt down mode, especially those of you who are not American Citizens!:lol:

 

You're welcome Grim. Beng a card carrying fan club member isn't easy. Especially when you're a non American. We have to do that currency exchange rate thing and it gets confusing sometimes because the Canadian dollar is also called the dollar in the United States.  Why do they call them the same thing but they're worth different amounts? And it's always changing to different amounts.   Somebody should look into that. 

😭

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25 minutes ago, acidhead said:

You're welcome Grim. Beng a card carrying fan club member isn't easy. Especially when you're a non American. We have to do that currency exchange rate thing and it gets confusing sometimes because the Canadian dollar is also called the dollar in the United States.  Why do they call them the same thing but they're worth different amounts? And it's always changing to different amounts.   Somebody should look into that. 

😭

Yes, they should seriously look into it, especially since One US Dollar is worth 1.3332593 Canadian Dollars just doesn't seem fair!!

🤪

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