Theses for the Reconstruction of Ancient History

[The Puzzler]

Didn’t Abraham buy land from a Hittite?

So Hittites were settled there in his time…

Isn’t Uriah a Hittite? He who is King David’s main man.

Long time between Abraham and David apparently…1000 years….but the Hittites are there in both…seems a bit of a stretch.

Abraham leaving from Chaldea is a giveaway to the timeframe being mentioned.

Edited March 21 by The Puzzler

[Kenemet]

9 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

I’m not sure he did “extensive repairs”….he shifted some sand off its limbs….as far as I know and sand moves pretty quick in those places.

And replaced some of the Old Kingdom blocks that had fallen off as well as rebuilt the wall and so forth: https://guardians.net/hawass/sphinx2.htm

It wasn't just "scrape the sand away."

[Thanos5150]

10 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

I know you’re not saying what ever, but I found your response interesting.

.....

Out of morbid curiosity, what is the reason you are so determined to believe these things, like the Sphinx and pyramids and whatnot, are nonsensically younger than they actually are? 

[The Puzzler]

41 minutes ago, Thanos5150 said:

.....

Out of morbid curiosity, what is the reason you are so determined to believe these things, like the Sphinx and pyramids and whatnot, are nonsensically younger than they actually are? 

Hmm…maybe because there are other explanations that can challenge the status quo…I’m a bit like that…always got to argue for the other side…in a fair way. 
As for this topic in particular, I’ve always found it interesting and have covered the Trojan War at 900BC and don’t think I even mentioned Dr V in that, just my own perceptions and other discrepancies enthrall me..why is there so many instances where just a few hundreds years change can align them…do we really know archaeologically speaking, chronological speaking as much as we assume…it’s only been around about 150 years it became a science yet we rely on its basis for absolute truth. I’m not so sure.

I see this same pattern over and over when I’m reading ancient history. Things not fitting right in the timeframe they are meant to belong.

The way Plato has this same discrepancy is what I’ve noticed, “9000 years ago”..describing more the Bronze Age…is this even a jibe at how terribly in chaos the ages were perceived even in his time…? 

Edited March 21 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

1 hour ago, The Puzzler said:

Didn’t Abraham buy land from a Hittite?

So Hittites were settled there in his time…

Isn’t Uriah a Hittite? He who is King David’s main man.

Long time between Abraham and David apparently…1000 years….but the Hittites are there in both…seems a bit of a stretch.

Abraham leaving from Chaldea is a giveaway to the timeframe bein

The nonsense they make up to explain this instead of accepting Abraham actually came from Chaldea and all this occurred in Neo-Hittite times is even more ridiculous than what Velikovsky claims.

[The Puzzler]

1 hour ago, Kenemet said:

And replaced some of the Old Kingdom blocks that had fallen off as well as rebuilt the wall and so forth: https://guardians.net/hawass/sphinx2.htm

It wasn't just "scrape the sand away."

Nice link.

[Antigonos]

7 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

1 hour ago, The Puzzler said:

The nonsense they make up to explain this instead of accepting Abraham actually came from Chaldea and all this occurred in Neo-Hittite times is even more ridiculous than what Velikovsky claims.

No it really isn’t.

Like the rest of the figures in the biblical Old Testament, there’s zero evidence for Abraham’s existence outside of the bible. It’s hard to accept where someone came from who’s never been proven to exist in the first place.

Who exactly is “they” ? What sources other than the Bible are you using to answer this question? Why do you approach ancient history from a biblical point of view?

 

[Antigonos]

7 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

Nice link.

Yeah, but what is your takeaway from the actual information it provides?

[cormac mac airt]

2 hours ago, Antigonos said:

No it really isn’t.

Like the rest of the figures in the biblical Old Testament, there’s zero evidence for Abraham’s existence outside of the bible. It’s hard to accept where someone came from who’s never been proven to exist in the first place.

Who exactly is “they” ? What sources other than the Bible are you using to answer this question? Why do you approach ancient history from a biblical point of view?

It's even worse than that IMO. Even if Abraham existed, hypothetically speaking and from circa 2000 BC, he's Chaldean/Mesopotamian in origin worshipping their gods and in no way can be the patriarch of the Israelites who were Canaanite in origin from circa 3500 BC. Nor would he ever have known of Yahweh the Midianite god who isn't attested before circa 1200 BC. The phrase "Oh what a tangled web we weave, when we practice to deceive" comes to mind concerning ancient Biblical writers. 

cormac

[Abramelin]

17 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

If we bring the archaeology down at least 300 years, it’s right on target…but then we need to bring Agamemnon down 300 years and the Trojan War…which might be the Sea People’s, not in 1200BC but 850BC…

 

All we need to do is acknowledge that the mask was nòt of Agamemnon. And Agamemnon could still have lived around 1200 bce.

[The Puzzler]

16 hours ago, Antigonos said:

No it really isn’t.

Like the rest of the figures in the biblical Old Testament, there’s zero evidence for Abraham’s existence outside of the bible. It’s hard to accept where someone came from who’s never been proven to exist in the first place.

Who exactly is “they” ? What sources other than the Bible are you using to answer this question? Why do you approach ancient history from a biblical point of view?

 

I’m approaching this particular topic with a Biblical  point of view because that’s what it’s all about…reconstructing history to align with Biblical sources…I’m not sure why Velikovsky initiated his work.

Ive quoted many non-Biblical references here, like the Mycenaeans…no one said nothing, .except Abe there… II borrowed this book from the library in 2008, but I pretended I lost it and paid the $30 fee, and kept it..because not only did it pique my interest in Atlantis but I could never hand back the incredibly intriguing Mask of Agamemnon. It’s my book now. 

Edited March 22 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

16 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

All we need to do is acknowledge that the mask was nòt of Agamemnon. And Agamemnon could still have lived around 1200 bce.

That’s a bit too easy for me lol

[The Puzzler]

12 hours ago, cormac mac airt said:

It's even worse than that IMO. Even if Abraham existed, hypothetically speaking and from circa 2000 BC, he's Chaldean/Mesopotamian in origin worshipping their gods and in no way can be the patriarch of the Israelites who were Canaanite in origin from circa 3500 BC. Nor would he ever have known of Yahweh the Midianite god who isn't attested before circa 1200 BC. The phrase "Oh what a tangled web we weave, when we practice to deceive" comes to mind concerning ancient Biblical writers. 

cormac

It’s a conundrum alright. I don’t think originally they set out to deceive…it’s all in the interpretation imo.

[The Puzzler]

16 hours ago, Antigonos said:

Yeah, but what is your takeaway from the actual information it provides?

My takeaway is…put it in my Sphinx topic just like I should put this bit in the Sea People topic…those elusive Sea People, whose identity is still unknown, who apparently bought down a Bronze Age…or were they really Persians..? Is this why we get no answers to who they really were?

”In the last two years of his life Velikovsky published a further two volumes of the series. In Peoples of the Sea he dealt with the final period of his reconstruction, the Persian invasions of Egypt.  Manetho's 20th dynasty here becomes identified with the dynasties which ruled a newly independent Egypt in the early 4th century BCE, and Nectanebo I is a ghost double of Rameses III.^[3] Rameses III fought invasions by the Sea Peoples, including the "Peleset", conventionally identified with the Philistines. According to Velikovsky, the "Peleset" are the Persians and the other Sea Peoples are their Greek mercenaries. The 21st dynasty then became a line of priest-kings who ruled in the oasessimultaneously with the Persians.”

Edited March 22 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

In fact, his legacy has shown newer scholars to be even more scrupulous on the dating…

”These scholars believe that Velikovsky did not go far enough. Under the influence of Gunnar Heinsohn they have shortened Velikovsky's timeline of ancient history even more. The 12th Dynasty of ancient Egypt has been moved almost 1500 years closer to the present, ending with Alexander the Great's invasion in 331 BCE.^[21] The Exodus has been redated to the 8th century,^[22] and the 18th Dynasty has been moved to the 8th–7th centuries.^[23] 274 years have been removed from the history of the Israelites.^[24] The Hittite Empire, which Velikovsky identified with the Neo-Babylonian Empire, has been identified with the Lydian Kingdom,^[25] while the Neo-Babylonians are now regarded as vassal kings of Babylon under the Macedonian Seleucids.^[26] The Neo-Assyrian Empire is now equated with the Persian Empire in northern Assyria and has been redated accordingly.^[27] In truth, very little of Velikovsky's chronology has been left untouched.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_in_Chaos

[docyabut2]

A Dweller on Two Planets?

https://sacred-texts.com/atl/dtp/index.htm

 

 

[Piney]

23 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

Didn’t Abraham buy land from a Hittite?

So Hittites were settled there in his time…

Isn’t Uriah a Hittite? He who is King David’s main man.

Long time between Abraham and David apparently…1000 years….but the Hittites are there in both…seems a bit of a stretch.

Abraham leaving from Chaldea is a giveaway to the timeframe being mentioned.

Hethites, often mistaken for Hittites but Uriah was a Hethite which was a Canaanite tribe. 

[docyabut2]

1 hour ago, docyabut2 said:

A Dweller on Two Planets?

https://sacred-texts.com/atl/dtp/index.htm

 

 

Just saying that Edger Cayce  got his readings on  Frederick S. Oliver  writings about Atlantis 

[Abramelin]

1 hour ago, docyabut2 said:

Just saying that Edger Cayce  got his readings on  Frederick S. Oliver  writings about Atlantis 

And both Cayce's and Oliver's writings have nothing to do with this topic.

Chanelled stuff is mere fantasy. Sometimes great, but still fantasy.

Edited March 22 by Abramelin

[Abramelin]

2 hours ago, Piney said:

Hethites, often mistaken for Hittites but Uriah was a Hethite which was a Canaanite tribe. 

The identification of these "Hethites" appears to be a lot more complicated then you think

https://biblearchaeology.org/research/divided-kingdom/2796-hittites-and-hethites-a-proposed-solution-to-an-etymological-conundrum

[Abramelin]

3 hours ago, docyabut2 said:

A Dweller on Two Planets?

https://sacred-texts.com/atl/dtp/index.htm

 

 

What has this to do with the topic?

[Piney]

1 hour ago, Abramelin said:

The identification of these "Hethites" appears to be a lot more complicated then you think

https://biblearchaeology.org/research/divided-kingdom/2796-hittites-and-hethites-a-proposed-solution-to-an-etymological-conundrum

This is a "apologist" webshite trying to prove the Bible is truth.

[Piney]

1 hour ago, Abramelin said:

The identification of these "Hethites" appears to be a lot more complicated then you think

https://biblearchaeology.org/research/divided-kingdom/2796-hittites-and-hethites-a-proposed-solution-to-an-etymological-conundrum

And Bryant Wood is a Bible literalist and young earth creationist.

[Abramelin]

59 minutes ago, Piney said:

And Bryant Wood is a Bible literalist and young earth creationist.

And only just one of the links in my post.

[Abramelin]

1 hour ago, Piney said:

This is a "apologist" webshite trying to prove the Bible is truth.

The Wikipedia page will give you nothing better.