Reform UK deputy leader says Britain should ‘absolutely’ let migrants drown (Independent)

[pellinore]

Just a day after a seven-year-old girl was among five migrants who died after being crushed on an overcrowded boat during an attempt to cross the English Channel, Mr Habib was questioned about the small boats issue by TalkTV’s Julia Hartley-Brewer.

“Let’s not infantilise these people, they have free will,” Mr Habib said. “I’m not going to be held to ransom by their claim that they deserve protection as soon as they get into our territorial waters.

“If they choose to scupper that dinghy, then yes, they have to suffer the consequences of their actions.”

Ms Hartley-Brewer asked: “Then you would leave them to drown?”

“Absolutely,” he replied. “They cannot be infantalised to the point that we become hostage to fortune.”

Responding to his comments, Ms Hartley-Brewer said: “I have no doubt, Ben, that is a policy that would work quite well, however that is not a policy that a civilised country should endorse.”

Outrage as Reform UK deputy leader says Britain should ‘absolutely’ let migrants drown in the Channel (msn.com)

Edited April 24 by pellinore

[+susieice]

Oh no. Return them back to where they left but don't just stand there and watch them drown. A policy of swiftly returning them will work to discourage. Letting them drown will only anger.

[OpenMindedSceptic]

Don't let them drown. Pick them up. Handcuff them. Get dockside in the UK. Straight to Gatwick. Deposit in South of France.

[pellinore]

18 minutes ago, OpenMindedSceptic said:

Don't let them drown. Pick them up. Handcuff them. Get dockside in the UK. Straight to Gatwick. Deposit in South of France.

What would stop them from going to Calais and crossing the channel again?

[OpenMindedSceptic]

5 minutes ago, pellinore said:

What would stop them from going to Calais and crossing the channel again?

Money.

Lack of money.

The French.

They may finally twig that it is their issue to deal with firmer.

[quiXilver]

The character of a society is revealed unerringly in two aspects.

How they treat their old, infirm, their prisoners and the weakest among them in society.

How they treat animals and by proxy, the earth.

 

On a side note: If you find yourself nauseated and ostracized by the actions of your fellows in control of the temper of your society, take heart.

"It is no good thing to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."  ~ Krishnamurti

[L.A.T.1961]

Ryanair CEO Says He’d ‘Happily’ Offer Rwanda Deportation Flights.

O’Leary, known for his controversial takes on issues from obesity to climate change, shrugged off warnings from the United Nation, which has said that airlines facilitating the removals could be complicit in violating international law. 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-24/ryanair-ceo-says-he-d-happily-offer-rwanda-deportation-flights

[L.A.T.1961]

2 hours ago, pellinore said:

What would stop them from going to Calais and crossing the channel again?

Lack of cash to pay the criminal gangs. 😉

[Duke Wellington]

34 minutes ago, quiXilver said:

The character of a society is revealed unerringly in two aspects.

How they treat their old, infirm, their prisoners and the weakest among them in society.

How they treat animals and by proxy, the earth.

 

On a side note: If you find yourself nauseated and ostracized by the actions of your fellows in control of the temper of your society, take heart.

"It is no good thing to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."  ~ Krishnamurti

Illegal immigrants should be treated as criminals as there is no war going on with our neighbours.

We don`t need to let them drown, we need to lock them up. The prison sentence should last until we find someone to take them off us. In the mean time hard labour to make them pay their keep.

[pellinore]

7 hours ago, Duke Wellington said:

Illegal immigrants should be treated as criminals as there is no war going on with our neighbours.

We don`t need to let them drown, we need to lock them up. The prison sentence should last until we find someone to take them off us. In the mean time hard labour to make them pay their keep.

It would be impossible to do as we already have a shortage of prisons for our own domestic prisoners. There was an outcry a year or so ago as prisoners were being released early and people convicted of serious crimes (rape, assaults, etc) were getting deferred or suspended sentences as they could not be incarcerated. Image the public outcry if, instead of building schools, homes and hospitals, the govt diverted the money to build prisons especially for asylum seekers. There is enough of an outcry over hotels being used.

[pellinore]

7 hours ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

Lack of cash to pay the criminal gangs. 😉

How could they be landed in France without an agreement with the French or the cooperation of the asylum seekers? Throw men, women and children onto beaches in manacles and then quickly scoot off? The only sensible solution is Starmer's, go after the gangs directly.

[pellinore]

10 hours ago, OpenMindedSceptic said:

Don't let them drown. Pick them up. Handcuff them. Get dockside in the UK. Straight to Gatwick. Deposit in South of France.

Cameron recently admitted this is a problem caused by leaving the EU. He also pointed out leaving the ECHR wouldn't provide a solution:

 

[Duke Wellington]

4 hours ago, pellinore said:

It would be impossible to do as we already have a shortage of prisons for our own domestic prisoners. There was an outcry a year or so ago as prisoners were being released early and people convicted of serious crimes (rape, assaults, etc) were getting deferred or suspended sentences as they could not be incarcerated. Image the public outcry if, instead of building schools, homes and hospitals, the govt diverted the money to build prisons especially for asylum seekers. There is enough of an outcry over hotels being used.

I`m not referring to entering them into our existing prison system.

Set up some prison camps. Keep them alive with food, water, and a blanket when it gets cold. Make them work 12 hours a day to pay the cost, and they are effectively stuck in limbo until someone else agrees to take them off us.

With the first batch, no more will follow.

[L.A.T.1961]

9 hours ago, pellinore said:

Cameron recently admitted this is a problem caused by leaving the EU. He also pointed out leaving the ECHR wouldn't provide a solution:

 

The problem with the Cameron argument is he tried to bring down immigration as PM while we were in the EU and failed. I don't remember any migrants being put back on a ferry to France at the time. Only fences built in Calais and checks on trucks heading for the UK. 

[Duke Wellington]

6 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

The problem with the Cameron argument is he tried to bring down immigration as PM while we were in the EU and failed. I don't remember any migrants being put back on a ferry to France at the time. Only fences built in Calais and checks on trucks heading for the UK. 

It was also one of the things he failed to renegotiate leading to the Brexit referendum.

He has the memory of a gold fish, or the Twitter poster is miss representing him.

[pellinore]

14 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

The problem with the Cameron argument is he tried to bring down immigration as PM while we were in the EU and failed. I don't remember any migrants being put back on a ferry to France at the time. Only fences built in Calais and checks on trucks heading for the UK. 

he tried to bring down immigration as PM- No Tory Govt has tried to bring down immigration - why would they, they are the lifeblood of industry? It has gone up and up each year, to 1.2 million in 2022 and is predicted to remain at about 400-500k annually.  What they have done, quite successfully, is to persuade the electorate they are tough on immigration and are trying to bring it down. They have just swapped EU immigrants for immigrants from Africa, Fifi, the Philippines, etc. Because they know that for some reason the Red Wall hates their fellow Europeans but loves people from further afield.

I don't remember any migrants being put back on a ferry to France at the time - it wasn't necessary, we had the Dublin Agreement and other smaller agreements which acted as a deterrent. It was an actual deterrent, because it worked.

Edited April 25 by pellinore

[L.A.T.1961]

3 minutes ago, Duke Wellington said:

It was also one of the things he failed to renegotiate leading to the Brexit referendum.

He has the memory of a gold fish, or the Twitter poster is miss representing him.

Yes, the reason he wanted changes to payments for new migrants was to act as a deterrent. IF he could have controlled immigration due to EU membership rules, send them back to France, there would have been no reason to go to Brussels and asking for rule changes.

[L.A.T.1961]

Just now, pellinore said:

he tried to bring down immigration as PM- No Tory Govt has tried to bring down immigration - why would they, they are the lifeblood of industry? It has gone up and up each year, to 1.2 million in 2022 and is predicted to remain at about 400-500k annually.  What they have done, quite successfully, is to persuade the electorate they are tough on immigration and are trying to bring it down.

I don't remember any migrants being put back on a ferry to France at the time - it wasn't necessary, we had the Dublin Agreement and other smaller agreements which acted as a deterrent. It was an actual deterrent, because it worked.

There was no deterrent if UK population expansion is a measure. When the 2021 census was completed it was found an extra 6 million living in the UK since the 2011 census. The UK population has almost no growth from birth rates, net growth for UK population is almost entirely from those coming in, significantly from the EU, helped by free movement of people. 

[L.A.T.1961]

21 MAY 2015

David Cameron's pledge on migrants flops as 318,000 pour into UK. 

David Cameron’s immigration policies were in tatters today as shocking new official figures showed a near-record 318,000 people poured into the UK last year.

The figure - equivalent to the population of an entire city the size of Cardiff swelling Britain’s population in one year - is the biggest ever recorded under a Conservative government.

The huge rise is an embarrassing blow to the Prime Minister who gave a “no ifs, no buts” election pledge in 2010 to bring net migration down to the “tens of thousands”. 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/david-camerons-pledge-on-migrants-flops-as-318-000-pour-into-uk-10266650.html

[pellinore]

54 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

21 MAY 2015

David Cameron's pledge on migrants flops as 318,000 pour into UK. 

David Cameron’s immigration policies were in tatters today as shocking new official figures showed a near-record 318,000 people poured into the UK last year.

The figure - equivalent to the population of an entire city the size of Cardiff swelling Britain’s population in one year - is the biggest ever recorded under a Conservative government.

The huge rise is an embarrassing blow to the Prime Minister who gave a “no ifs, no buts” election pledge in 2010 to bring net migration down to the “tens of thousands”. 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/david-camerons-pledge-on-migrants-flops-as-318-000-pour-into-uk-10266650.html

I think we are in agreement. They say one thing, do another, because not to have immigrants damages the economy. All developed economies are suffering the same demographic dilemma- China has a severe problem.

[Ozymandias]

On 4/24/2024 at 6:40 PM, pellinore said:

“If they choose to scupper that dinghy, then yes, they have to suffer the consequences of their actions.”

Ms Hartley-Brewer asked: “Then you would leave them to drown?”

“Absolutely,” he replied. “They cannot be infantalised to the point that we become hostage to fortune.”

Shades of Priti Patel's reported comment to 'let Ireland starve' by using food shortages as leverage against the backstop.

[pellinore]

10 hours ago, Ozymandias said:

Shades of Priti Patel's reported comment to 'let Ireland starve' by using food shortages as leverage against the backstop.

What the likes of the people cheering on the likes of Ben Habib don't realise is that he would turn his guns on them in an instant if it served his purposes. He is the CEO of a property company investing in Eastern Europe and became a multi-millionaire on the back of Brexit -so much for patriotism: First Property's Ben Habib Looks for Brexit Bargains Outside London (archive.ph)

And Priti Patel promised the Indian diaspora in the UK that Brexit would mean more visas granted to India (and she was right).

These people care about money, not the UK.

Edited April 27 by pellinore