Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -

The 1561 Nuremberg celestial incident.


Recommended Posts

I know that the old ones is hard to investigate, and the really old ones even harder.

But I thought it could be a nice change from the usual (Roswell/Rendlesham) to take a look at it anyway.

 

 

 

  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One of several broadsheets containing propaganda paid for by the Church and made and printed years after the supposed incident.

https://www-zeno-org.translate.goog/Kunstwerke/A/Glaser,+Hans?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en

Harte

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 2
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Without having looked into it to much... It feels like it might have been a combination of a meteor shower, atmospheric plasma, sundogs and a superstitious population? 🤪

Hard to say... but check this out.

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20121214172708/http://ancientaliensdebunked.com/nuremburg-ufo-battle-debunked/

 

Edited by Hazzard
  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/26/2024 at 11:51 AM, Hazzard said:

Without having looked into it to much... It feels like it might have been a combination of a meteor shower, atmospheric plasma, sundogs and a superstitious population? 🤪

Hard to say... but check this out.

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20121214172708/http://ancientaliensdebunked.com/nuremburg-ufo-battle-debunked/

 

Here is some good reading on what I considered to be a similar event however your Nuremberg event has other things to consider.

the sun

the bandwagon kids

The Nuremberg event or any event has to be taken in context of things like the era what didn't people understand of their world,
For example in that era people thought the sun and moon were entities hence why the have faces,
I have always thought parts of the Nuremberg case were out right made up or these people were really odd in this alleged event piqued their interest but collecting cashed whatever didn't? Think what a cool souvenir that would have made

Of course be it a wood craving, a tabloid or old rag of a newspaper it's very well known these news outlets lie to sell their product, something likely triggered that woodcut but the story doesn't hold water,

So yeah, likely as you say weird natural events that these people of Nuremberg simply explained best they could with what they knew.

 

 

 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

For sure they witnessed something, no argument from me there. I'm inclined it was some sort of natural , atmospheric phenomenon that they grasped to describe what they were witnessing. I don't see any need to jump to conclusions of alien craft zooming about. The line  of,  "fell from the sun down upon the earth 'as if they all burned' and they then wasted away on the earth with immense smoke. " leads me to think this.

I mean if there were crashed craft, surely they would have retained parts of the wreckage. Anything really, since it was so significant. Items that would have been held in great importance and would also likely be in some museum now. That's what seems logical and reasonable to me.

 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Trelane said:

For sure they witnessed something, no argument from me there. I'm inclined it was some sort of natural , atmospheric phenomenon that they grasped to describe what they were witnessing. I don't see any need to jump to conclusions of alien craft zooming about. The line  of,  "fell from the sun down upon the earth 'as if they all burned' and they then wasted away on the earth with immense smoke. " leads me to think this.

I mean if there were crashed craft, surely they would have retained parts of the wreckage. Anything really, since it was so significant. Items that would have been held in great importance and would also likely be in some museum now. That's what seems logical and reasonable to me.

 

I get the feeling that the artist tried to fit as much information as possible in to that woodcut... perhaps stuff that was going on for the last year or so?

With the atmospheric phenomenon as center piece... and the reason he made one at all.

Edited by Hazzard
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Trelane said:

For sure they witnessed something, no argument from me there. I'm inclined it was some sort of natural , atmospheric phenomenon that they grasped to describe what they were witnessing. I don't see any need to jump to conclusions of alien craft zooming about. The line  of,  "fell from the sun down upon the earth 'as if they all burned' and they then wasted away on the earth with immense smoke. " leads me to think this.

I mean if there were crashed craft, surely they would have retained parts of the wreckage. Anything really, since it was so significant. Items that would have been held in great importance and would also likely be in some museum now. That's what seems logical and reasonable to me.

 

Relics were a big bragging rights deal to monarchs and church's it's a bit surprising no one did save alleged debris.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/26/2024 at 11:36 AM, Hazzard said:

I know that the old ones is hard to investigate

nothing is hard to investigate when one deep down knows there's nothing worthy of investigation! 😉

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/28/2024 at 6:36 PM, Hazzard said:

I get the feeling that the artist tried to fit as much information as possible in to that woodcut... perhaps stuff that was going on for the last year or so?

With the atmospheric phenomenon as center piece... and the reason he made one at all.

That's what they did then. Put the whole story in one picture.

That's why you see the crowded story picture with the 10 knights who all look the same. It's one guy doing different ****.

 

  • Like 5
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nice pic of sun dogs.

Sundogs.jpg.4f78f91d9ef9341f66c79d03d47af64d.jpg

Harte

  • Like 6
  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 
1 hour ago, Harte said:

Nice pic of sun dogs.

Sundogs.jpg.4f78f91d9ef9341f66c79d03d47af64d.jpg

 

 

Understandable that the people back in the days freaked out, started praying and sacrificing virgins when they saw something like that.

That is awesome.

I saw one on my way to work back in January (not as spectacular as that one but still really cool)...

I got the urge to sacrifice someone at work that night...   but it had nothing to do with the phenomenon I just witnessed.

  • Like 6
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Harte said:

Nice pic of sun dogs.

Sundogs.jpg.4f78f91d9ef9341f66c79d03d47af64d.jpg

Harte

That is a stunning pic Harte ….thanks for sharing…

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Shadowsfall said:

That is a stunning pic Harte ….thanks for sharing…

It's definitely warning from God level.

Harte

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
On 5/26/2024 at 8:51 AM, Hazzard said:

Without having looked into it to much... It feels like it might have been a combination of a meteor shower, atmospheric plasma, sundogs and a superstitious population? 🤪

Hard to say... but check this out.

https://web.archive.org/web/20121214172708/http://ancientaliensdebunked.com/nuremburg-ufo-battle-debunked/

The people of the time were quite familiar with various solar phenomena including sun dogs. 

 QMFE: 

Nuremberg Chronicle from 1493 with the accompanying text:

Quote

"Three Suns, beside one another, were seen in the West at this time, on the Nones of September. The middle one went to rest two hours after the other two had disappeared. In the same manner three moons appeared in the following year. Upon the central one a cross appeared."


And yet in little more than 60yrs, these people of Nuremberg who had probably seen several if not many of these sun dogs in the intervening six decades, lost their minds and now depicted sun dogs like this:

FxnL8oWWcAQZzHP.jpg
Describing them like this (compare with above):

Quote

In the morning of April 14, 1561, at daybreak, between 4 and 5 a.m., a dreadful apparition occurred on the sun, and then this was seen in Nuremberg in the city, before the gates and in the country – by many men and women. At first there appeared in the middle of the sun two blood-red semi-circular arcs, just like the moon in its last quarter. And in the sun, above and below and on both sides, the color was blood, there stood a round ball of partly dull, partly black ferrous color. Likewise there stood on both sides and as a torus about the sun such blood-red ones and other balls in large number, about three in a line and four in a square, also some alone.

In between these globes there were visible a few blood-red crosses, between which there were blood-red strips, becoming thicker to the rear and in the front malleable like the rods of reed-grass, which were intermingled, among them two big rods, one on the right, the other to the left, and within the small and big rods there were three, also four and more globes. These all started to fight among themselves, so that the globes, which were first in the sun, flew out to the ones standing on both sides, thereafter, the globes standing outside the sun, in the small and large rods, flew into the sun. Besides the globes flew back and forth among themselves and fought vehemently with each other for over an hour. And when the conflict in and again out of the sun was most intense, they became fatigued to such an extent that they all, as said above, fell from the sun down upon the earth 'as if they all burned' and they then wasted away on the earth with immense smoke.

After all this there was something like a black spear, very long and thick, sighted; the shaft pointed to the east, the point pointed west. Whatever such signs mean, God alone knows. Although we have seen, shortly one after another, many kinds of signs on the heaven, which are sent to us by the almighty God, to bring us to repentance, we still are, unfortunately, so ungrateful that we despise such high signs and miracles of God. Or we speak of them with ridicule and discard them to the wind, in order that God may send us a frightening punishment on account of our ungratefulness. After all, the God-fearing will by no means discard these signs, but will take it to heart as a warning of their merciful Father in heaven, will mend their lives and faithfully beg God, that He may avert His wrath, including the well-deserved punishment, on us, so that we may temporarily here and perpetually there, live as his children. For it, may God grant us his help, Amen. By Hanns Glaser, letter-painter of Nurnberg.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

While true these people were quite fascinated and superstitious of solar and lunar phenomenon, they wrote about and depicted them often, it is obvious something more is being described here that otherwise does not appear in any of their other reporting of solar events. This does not have to mean UFO's but "sun dogs" and the like are not exactly sufficient either. 

By the by, the article you linked is from AA Debunked, an extreme evangelical Christian group whose stated mission is to turn those who believe in aliens and/or the supernatural back to Christianity. Regarding the proprietor of AAD Chris White (QMFE):

If you enjoy the work of Chris White, the writer, director, producer, and narrator of Ancient Aliens Debunked I am sure you will appreciate even more his groundbreaking work on How to Stop Sleep Paralysis.

White, who is a bat__crazy hard core evangelical Christian devoted to bringing strays back to Christianity, like the other contributor Michael Heiser, believes sleep paralysis is a form of demonic possession which among other chestnuts says:

Quote

If you are not a Christian, you can stop SP events in the middle of an attack and you can prevent SP from getting any worse using the methods I will discuss, but you won’t be able to stop sleep paralysis from coming back again. This is because the most important part of stopping sleep paralysis for good is using the authority that Jesus has given to His followers to order demons to stop. People who are not Christians should not attempt to use that authority in the way Christians do because it can be dangerous for them.


He also seems particularly hung up on these demons sexually violating their victims, which is telling.

This is not a defense of Ancient Aliens nor a complete dismissal of Ancient Aliens Debunked, but do you think it's possible that White might not be a reliable source to objectively present information against beliefs that clearly contradict his own?

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

Edited by Thanos5150
  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/2/2024 at 11:30 AM, Thanos5150 said:

The people of the time were quite familiar with various solar phenomena including sun dogs. 

 QMFE: 

Nuremberg Chronicle from 1493 with the accompanying text:

Quote

"Three Suns, beside one another, were seen in the West at this time, on the Nones of September. The middle one went to rest two hours after the other two had disappeared. In the same manner three moons appeared in the following year. Upon the central one a cross appeared."


And yet in little more than 60yrs, these people of Nuremberg who had probably seen several if not many of these sun dogs in the intervening six decades, lost their minds and now depicted sun dogs like this:

FxnL8oWWcAQZzHP.jpg
Describing them like this (compare with above):

Quote

In the morning of April 14, 1561, at daybreak, between 4 and 5 a.m., a dreadful apparition occurred on the sun, and then this was seen in Nuremberg in the city, before the gates and in the country – by many men and women. At first there appeared in the middle of the sun two blood-red semi-circular arcs, just like the moon in its last quarter. And in the sun, above and below and on both sides, the color was blood, there stood a round ball of partly dull, partly black ferrous color. Likewise there stood on both sides and as a torus about the sun such blood-red ones and other balls in large number, about three in a line and four in a square, also some alone.

In between these globes there were visible a few blood-red crosses, between which there were blood-red strips, becoming thicker to the rear and in the front malleable like the rods of reed-grass, which were intermingled, among them two big rods, one on the right, the other to the left, and within the small and big rods there were three, also four and more globes. These all started to fight among themselves, so that the globes, which were first in the sun, flew out to the ones standing on both sides, thereafter, the globes standing outside the sun, in the small and large rods, flew into the sun. Besides the globes flew back and forth among themselves and fought vehemently with each other for over an hour. And when the conflict in and again out of the sun was most intense, they became fatigued to such an extent that they all, as said above, fell from the sun down upon the earth 'as if they all burned' and they then wasted away on the earth with immense smoke.

After all this there was something like a black spear, very long and thick, sighted; the shaft pointed to the east, the point pointed west. Whatever such signs mean, God alone knows. Although we have seen, shortly one after another, many kinds of signs on the heaven, which are sent to us by the almighty God, to bring us to repentance, we still are, unfortunately, so ungrateful that we despise such high signs and miracles of God. Or we speak of them with ridicule and discard them to the wind, in order that God may send us a frightening punishment on account of our ungratefulness. After all, the God-fearing will by no means discard these signs, but will take it to heart as a warning of their merciful Father in heaven, will mend their lives and faithfully beg God, that He may avert His wrath, including the well-deserved punishment, on us, so that we may temporarily here and perpetually there, live as his children. For it, may God grant us his help, Amen. By Hanns Glaser, letter-painter of Nurnberg.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

While true these people were quite fascinated and superstitious of solar and lunar phenomenon, they wrote about and depicted them often, it is obvious something more is being described here that otherwise does not appear in any of their other reporting of solar events. This does not have to mean UFO's but "sun dogs" and the like are not exactly sufficient either. 

By the by, the article you linked is from AA Debunked, an extreme evangelical Christian group whose stated mission is to turn those who believe in aliens and/or the supernatural back to Christianity. Regarding the proprietor of AAD Chris White (QMFE):

If you enjoy the work of Chris White, the writer, director, producer, and narrator of Ancient Aliens Debunked I am sure you will appreciate even more his groundbreaking work on How to Stop Sleep Paralysis.

White, who is a bat__crazy hard core evangelical Christian devoted to bringing strays back to Christianity, like the other contributor Michael Heiser, believes sleep paralysis is a form of demonic possession which among other chestnuts says:

Quote

If you are not a Christian, you can stop SP events in the middle of an attack and you can prevent SP from getting any worse using the methods I will discuss, but you won’t be able to stop sleep paralysis from coming back again. This is because the most important part of stopping sleep paralysis for good is using the authority that Jesus has given to His followers to order demons to stop. People who are not Christians should not attempt to use that authority in the way Christians do because it can be dangerous for them.


He also seems particularly hung up on these demons sexually violating their victims, which is telling.

This is not a defense of Ancient Aliens nor a complete dismissal of Ancient Aliens Debunked, but do you think it's possible that White might not be a reliable source to objectively present information against beliefs that clearly contradict his own?

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

AAD has it's own Rationalwiki entry and talk page. White is really off the rails now with his Biblical Prophecy Talk Podcast because...."Israel".

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Piney said:

AAD has it's own Rationalwiki entry and talk page. White is really off the rails now with his Biblical Prophecy Talk Podcast because...."Israel".

So before he was just "kind of" off the rails"...? 

 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/2/2024 at 5:30 PM, Thanos5150 said:

The people of the time were quite familiar with various solar phenomena including sun dogs. 

 QMFE: 

Nuremberg Chronicle from 1493 with the accompanying text:

Quote

"Three Suns, beside one another, were seen in the West at this time, on the Nones of September. The middle one went to rest two hours after the other two had disappeared. In the same manner three moons appeared in the following year. Upon the central one a cross appeared."


And yet in little more than 60yrs, these people of Nuremberg who had probably seen several if not many of these sun dogs in the intervening six decades, lost their minds and now depicted sun dogs like this:

FxnL8oWWcAQZzHP.jpg
Describing them like this (compare with above):

Quote

In the morning of April 14, 1561, at daybreak, between 4 and 5 a.m., a dreadful apparition occurred on the sun, and then this was seen in Nuremberg in the city, before the gates and in the country – by many men and women. At first there appeared in the middle of the sun two blood-red semi-circular arcs, just like the moon in its last quarter. And in the sun, above and below and on both sides, the color was blood, there stood a round ball of partly dull, partly black ferrous color. Likewise there stood on both sides and as a torus about the sun such blood-red ones and other balls in large number, about three in a line and four in a square, also some alone.

In between these globes there were visible a few blood-red crosses, between which there were blood-red strips, becoming thicker to the rear and in the front malleable like the rods of reed-grass, which were intermingled, among them two big rods, one on the right, the other to the left, and within the small and big rods there were three, also four and more globes. These all started to fight among themselves, so that the globes, which were first in the sun, flew out to the ones standing on both sides, thereafter, the globes standing outside the sun, in the small and large rods, flew into the sun. Besides the globes flew back and forth among themselves and fought vehemently with each other for over an hour. And when the conflict in and again out of the sun was most intense, they became fatigued to such an extent that they all, as said above, fell from the sun down upon the earth 'as if they all burned' and they then wasted away on the earth with immense smoke.

After all this there was something like a black spear, very long and thick, sighted; the shaft pointed to the east, the point pointed west. Whatever such signs mean, God alone knows. Although we have seen, shortly one after another, many kinds of signs on the heaven, which are sent to us by the almighty God, to bring us to repentance, we still are, unfortunately, so ungrateful that we despise such high signs and miracles of God. Or we speak of them with ridicule and discard them to the wind, in order that God may send us a frightening punishment on account of our ungratefulness. After all, the God-fearing will by no means discard these signs, but will take it to heart as a warning of their merciful Father in heaven, will mend their lives and faithfully beg God, that He may avert His wrath, including the well-deserved punishment, on us, so that we may temporarily here and perpetually there, live as his children. For it, may God grant us his help, Amen. By Hanns Glaser, letter-painter of Nurnberg.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

While true these people were quite fascinated and superstitious of solar and lunar phenomenon, they wrote about and depicted them often, it is obvious something more is being described here that otherwise does not appear in any of their other reporting of solar events. This does not have to mean UFO's but "sun dogs" and the like are not exactly sufficient either. 

By the by, the article you linked is from AA Debunked, an extreme evangelical Christian group whose stated mission is to turn those who believe in aliens and/or the supernatural back to Christianity. Regarding the proprietor of AAD Chris White (QMFE):

If you enjoy the work of Chris White, the writer, director, producer, and narrator of Ancient Aliens Debunked I am sure you will appreciate even more his groundbreaking work on How to Stop Sleep Paralysis.

White, who is a bat__crazy hard core evangelical Christian devoted to bringing strays back to Christianity, like the other contributor Michael Heiser, believes sleep paralysis is a form of demonic possession which among other chestnuts says:

Quote

If you are not a Christian, you can stop SP events in the middle of an attack and you can prevent SP from getting any worse using the methods I will discuss, but you won’t be able to stop sleep paralysis from coming back again. This is because the most important part of stopping sleep paralysis for good is using the authority that Jesus has given to His followers to order demons to stop. People who are not Christians should not attempt to use that authority in the way Christians do because it can be dangerous for them.


He also seems particularly hung up on these demons sexually violating their victims, which is telling.

This is not a defense of Ancient Aliens nor a complete dismissal of Ancient Aliens Debunked, but do you think it's possible that White might not be a reliable source to objectively present information against beliefs that clearly contradict his own?

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

So you believe it was something paranormal like ET visitation that happened?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Hazzard said:

So you believe it was something paranormal like ET visitation that happened?

No, Lee's just pointing out AAD was run by a religious nutter. 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Hazzard said:

So you believe it was something paranormal like ET visitation that happened?

Explain how noting the uncritical citing of a wildly fringe source and the facts of the matter that contradict these claims equates to my "believing it was something paranormal like ET visitation that happened"? Or a "belief" in anything for that matter. These people can be fringe of the fringe religious kooks and sun dogs not be a valid explanation and this event still not be "something paranormal like ET visitation". They are not mutually exclusive. 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Thanos5150 said:

Explain how noting the uncritical citing of a wildly fringe source and the facts of the matter that contradict these claims equates to my "believing it was something paranormal like ET visitation that happened"? Or a "belief" in anything for that matter. These people can be fringe of the fringe religious kooks and sun dogs not be a valid explanation and this event still not be "something paranormal like ET visitation". They are not mutually exclusive. 

No.

So, what do you think happened then?

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/1/2024 at 11:51 AM, Hazzard said:

sacrificing virgins

Sounds wasteful

  • Thanks 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.