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The Sealed Book of Revelation 5:1: A NEW Theory and a challenging question!


TheOneInsideTheZero

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8 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Camping is what the discussion has been about for the last couple of hours Jay.

 

 

HI Will

And you said there would be millions of Jews there which is part of that discussion so looked it up and gave you a more realistic number. 

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2 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

My condolences. I don't envy you. I just want you to know that something tells me you'll get through it.

People keep telling me that. I'm trying. 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Camping is what the discussion has been about for the last couple of hours Jay.

 

 

From Revelation Codes to camping.....

trainn.jpg.6fe9f5e2ff005be1f904c65cf1e3c5e0.jpg

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14 minutes ago, jmccr8 said:

HI Will

And you said there would be millions of Jews there which is part of that discussion so looked it up and gave you a more realistic number. 

 

I understand why you put up the numbers. But the numbers really don't have anything to do with whether or not people were camping. If it was 10, they were camping. If it was less than a million, they were still camping. 

 

 

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imagine trying the word puzzling using the 1611 version of KJV

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4 minutes ago, Alex_Rogan said:

imagine trying the word puzzling using the 1611 version of KJV

🤣

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22 minutes ago, Piney said:

People keep telling me that. I'm trying. 

 

 

You don't ever get through it, Piney; you don't ever get over it. You learn to endure it, like any pain that never goes away. That's alright, though; people we love deserve to be grieved for and never forgotten. Along with the pain, our memories of them in life, 'though bittersweet, will always endure.

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14 minutes ago, Piney said:

From Revelation Codes to camping.....

 

The OP asked, if desired, to offer input about his statements based on the Book of Revelation.

So that's what I did. I provided input based on what is written in the UB about what the Bible's Book of Revelation addresses regarding the destruction of Jerusalem and the second coming.

I did that because of the positive nature of what's written in the UB about it and that it is far from being condemning but rather uplifting and supportive of being hopeful for the future. That we are living in a time where a beginning has been initiated for correcting the missteps of the past. And that with the cooperation of us all, things will be righted sooner, rather than later.

But I'm not naive. I do understand why all of this has to be torn into. But just not tonight okay? :)

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

You don't ever get through it, Piney; you don't ever get over it. You learn to endure it, like any pain that never goes away. That's alright, though; people we love deserve to be grieved for and never forgotten. Along with the pain, our memories of them in life, 'though bittersweet, will always endure.

I don't even take a aspirin for physical pain, but this is murder.....

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1 minute ago, Will Due said:

 

The OP asked, if desired, to offer input about his statements based on the Book of Revelation.

So that's what I did. I provided input based on what is written in the UB about what the Bible's Book of Revelation addresses regarding the destruction of Jerusalem and the second coming.

I did that because of the positive nature of what's written in the UB about it and that it is far from being condemning but rather uplifting and supportive of being hopeful for the future. That we are living in a time where a beginning has been initiated for correcting the missteps of the past. And that with the cooperation of us all, things will be righted sooner, rather than later.

But I'm not naive. I do understand why all of this has to be torn into. But just not tonight okay? :)

😄

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Posted (edited)
43 minutes ago, Piney said:

People keep telling me that. I'm trying. 

 

 

Piney, go easy on yourself the truth is Maggie isn’t someone you just get over. It has not been that long and she is the love of your life. 

Edited by Sherapy
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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

You don't ever get through it

 

I do understand what you mean. I've lost loved ones too. And you're right, you don't really ever get through it. But I decided a long time ago that losing someone I love wasn't going to stop me from getting through to the other side where life goes on without it needing to be a ball and chain. I cherish their memories and do my best to honor them by not letting their loss hold me down and keeping me from being in control of myself.

 

 

Edited by Will Due
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Just now, Piney said:

I don't even take a aspirin for physical pain, but this is murder.....

Of course it is. It's like losing an arm and being reminded of its absence every day for the rest of your life. I still grieve for a love who died 28 years ago; still dream of her. Your anguish is normal and with the passage of time, won't be so overwhelming. I wish I had words of comfort for you, but in my own experience, I found the efficacy of such solace.... questionable. At least, it never worked for me.

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6 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

I do understand what you mean. I've lost loved ones too. And you're right, you don't really ever get through it. But I decided a long time ago that losing someone I love wasn't going to stop me from getting through to the other side where life goes on without it needing to be a ball and chain. I cherish their memories and do my best to honor them by not letting their loss hold me down.

 

 

That is you, Will, it doesn’t speak for piney.  His wife was the love of his life and he misses her with every fiber of his being. 

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1 minute ago, Sherapy said:
11 minutes ago, Will Due said:

I do understand what you mean. I've lost loved ones too. And you're right, you don't really ever get through it. But I decided a long time ago that losing someone I love wasn't going to stop me from getting through to the other side where life goes on without it needing to be a ball and chain. I cherish their memories and do my best to honor them by not letting their loss hold me down.

 

 

That is you, Will, it doesn’t speak for piney.  His wife was the love of his life and he misses her with every fiber of his being. 

Hell, he didn't even bother to wait until they died! 😆

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1 minute ago, Hammerclaw said:

Hell, he didn't even bother to wait until they died! 😆

 

The mother of my children, my ex-wife, died in 2019. She was the love of my life and she still shows up in my dreams at night. I won't say anything else John.

 

 

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Does skepticism always lead a person to be as insulting as possible as often as possible? The empirical evidence seems to say so.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

The mother of my children, my ex-wife, died in 2019. She was the love of my life and she still shows up in my dreams at night. I won't say anything else John.

 

 

I am sorry for your loss. I believe in eternal love though, I am sure she watches over you and is waiting for you, cheering you on and all of that.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Will Due said:

 

I understand why you put up the numbers. But the numbers really don't have anything to do with whether or not people were camping. If it was 10, they were camping. If it was less than a million, they were still camping. 

 

 

HI Will

So you understand that I was giving actual numbers to give some context with which to work. I don't care if tent dwellers went camping but do care about some semblance of proper numbers being presented. Just thought I would try to help you refine your presentation. 

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3 hours ago, Will Due said:

 

So cities were lit up at night. Glad you agree.

 

 

Jerusalem was a large city for those days. During normal times the population of the city was approx. 250,000. But at Passover time Jewish families came from all over the known world for the Passover celebration, and every Jew within 15 miles was required to attend. By the time of Jesus the Passover population of greater Jerusalem would swell to over 2 ½ million people.

I say “greater Jerusalem” because there simply wasn’t room in the city for all those people. So the areas around the city were thronged with pilgrims camping out, going in and out of the city each day. Villages, like Lazarus’s Bethany, only 2+ miles from Jerusalem, were full.  In other areas the pilgrims simply camped out. The garden of Gethsemane on the western flank of the Mount of Olives between Bethany and Jerusalem was the traditional camping area for the people from Galilee, with thousands of them filling the garden each year.

https://www.catalystnw.org/Articles/1000132390/Catalyst/Catalyst_Network/Resources/Life_of_Christ/April_14_The.aspx#:~:text=By the time of Jesus,over 2 ½ million people.

 

 

I know, I know. It's a BS publication and everything in it are lies. ;)

 

 

 

 

Picky point, but ancient cities were not lit up at night. 

Most folks went to bed when the sun went down because candles were expensive (you can do work by firelight if you have a nice hearth fire) and so were rushes.  Oil lamps could be used but decent quality oil was expensive. Poor quality oil was smoky and smelly and tended to leave soot around the house.  You saved the good stuff for special occasions.  

Only the wealthy (upper 1% of the population) could afford candles (torches, etc) to regularly light their houses.  

 

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3 hours ago, Will Due said:

 

 

But the celebration at Jerusalem and attending the Passover there was central to being Jewish in those days. The temple being the focal point of the Jewish people similar to Mecca being the focus of Muslims today. It was the same kind of pilgrimage for the Jews as it is for the Muslims.

So you said Piney, that you didn't have to be indoors in Jerusalem at the Passover. Then that means people were camping. 

Not sure why this is such a controversy that people in ancient times camped. Probably just like people do in modern times. And that they camped in the surrounding areas of Jerusalem during the Jewish festivals. Thanks Sheri. :lol:

(Non-OB)Citation needed, please. 

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3 hours ago, Will Due said:

 

 

But the celebration at Jerusalem and attending the Passover there was central to being Jewish in those days. The temple being the focal point of the Jewish people similar to Mecca being the focus of Muslims today. It was the same kind of pilgrimage for the Jews as it is for the Muslims.

So you said Piney, that you didn't have to be indoors in Jerusalem at the Passover. Then that means people were camping. 

Not sure why this is such a controversy that people in ancient times camped. Probably just like people do in modern times. And that they camped in the surrounding areas of Jerusalem during the Jewish festivals. Thanks Sheri. :lol:

 

 

 

You're running into some real issues here; most of the material I'm seeing is from Christians -- a derivative sect of Judaism that does NOT follow Judaic traditions and laws (it follows only some of the Judaic traditions, foregoing things like the Wave Offering and the Heave Offering and laws about cleanliness and who is allowed in the temple and who is allowed to be a priest.)  

Here's a slightly better source, written by two Jews: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Alan-Cooper-6/publication/271681093_The_Festivals_of_Israel_and_Judah_and_the_Literary_History_of_the_Pentateuch/links/5f1459eda6fdcc3ed7154efe/The-Festivals-of-Israel-and-Judah-and-the-Literary-History-of-the-Pentateuch.pdf

and this one

https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=ebe6999fbd3c98ddbc22099cc294937f5e572201

Roman sources can be a bit... iffy sometimes, and it would be wise to steer clear of Christian references (basically anything using "the Bible" as its source)  

Neither of these sources talks about pilgrimages to Jerusalem.  The one that does is this one: https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/pilgrimage-festivals/

It says, in part "While there are no verifiable numbers of yearly pilgrims, by the end of the first century B.C.E., King Herod the  Great, the Roman-appointed ruler of the vassal kingdom of Judea, apparently responded to the pilgrimage needs of the city and built a vast esplanade, or courtyard, surrounding the Temple. 

So they were housed in the area of the Temple (no camping out.)  

Again, please look for sources that are Jewish and historical (oriental studies) instead of Christian (which have completely rewritten the ceremony.)

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Piney said:

From Revelation Codes to camping.....

trainn.jpg.6fe9f5e2ff005be1f904c65cf1e3c5e0.jpg

Just like that train, this thread was hijacked.

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6 hours ago, Kenemet said:

Only the wealthy (upper 1% of the population) could afford candles (torches, etc) to regularly light their houses.  

 

The rulers of the Jews were the wealthiest of all. They controlled everything that went on in Jerusalem.

You don't think they would have paid for lighting up the temple at night during the Passover celebration when large numbers of Jews were in attendance?

 

 

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I guess the OP didn't get the affirmation they wanted. So I doubt they'll be back to discuss this topic. From here on out it'll just devolve in to a UB thread yet again.

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