Spiritualist healer who was clinically dead for 3 days says a 'Golden age' is coming soon

[openozy]

55 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

It's still a placebo. 

Whatever.

[XenoFish]

2 minutes ago, openozy said:

Whatever.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/mental-health/the-power-of-the-placebo-effect

 

[openozy]

1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

https://www.health.harvard.edu/mental-health/the-power-of-the-placebo-effect

 

How is it placebo when the guy checked over my mother and told her where the pain was? It was an old injury he knew nothing about, he does this all the time with people, it's not placebo.

[XenoFish]

Just now, openozy said:

How is it placebo when the guy checked over my mother and told her where the pain was? It was an old injury he knew nothing about, he does this all the time with people, it's not placebo.

Then it's a guess or reading body language. Believe whatever you want. It's the belief he's doing something, not that he's actually doing anything that has the effect. The complete opposite of this is can be seen in pointing the bone curse. A nocebo effect. 

 

[openozy]

20 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Then it's a guess or reading body language. Believe whatever you want. It's the belief he's doing something, not that he's actually doing anything that has the effect. The complete opposite of this is can be seen in pointing the bone curse. A nocebo effect. 

 

I don't think so. I'm talking about him pinpointing the affected area and he is spot on without previous knowledge. I will believe this because I've seen it, same as all my stuff. The chances of him guessing are next to none and he is not putting things into people's minds at all.

[+Desertrat56]

12 hours ago, XenoFish said:

It's still a placebo. 

Sometimes if you don't have an experience you can't understand or have never had it is not useful to denigrate someone who has and in this case many people have had the experience that @openozy describes.   It may not make any ssense to you in your current nuts and bolts purley physical perspective but there were days when you thought otherwise.   If your beliefs betrayed you somehow does it really help you to deny anyone else's non-physical experiences?  

[+Desertrat56]

10 hours ago, openozy said:

I don't think so. I'm talking about him pinpointing the affected area and he is spot on without previous knowledge. I will believe this because I've seen it, same as all my stuff. The chances of him guessing are next to none and he is not putting things into people's minds at all.

There is a practic called Reiki, attributted to a Japanese man (stories about who he actually was are distorted) and there are clinics in Japan where people are trained to do what your friend does.   In the U.S. there are lots of people "training" others to do this as well, I have had some of that training and the trick is the perspective of the person giving the healing.   If they take credit for it they are not worth a handfull of salt, if they say they are just a conduit and the person recieving the energy is the healer that is Reiki.   I have met several people who have found they can scan someone else and identify "hot spots" or "cold spots" that indicate there is a health issue, it isn't much different than dowsing, just using hands instead of rods.  We are all more than the sum of our physical parts.   But it isn't required that anyone believe anything.   We are all here for different reasons.  

Edited June 20 by Desertrat56

[XenoFish]

31 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

Sometimes if you don't have an experience you can't understand or have never had it is not useful to denigrate someone who has and in this case many people have had the experience that @openozy describes.   It may not make any ssense to you in your current nuts and bolts purley physical perspective but there were days when you thought otherwise.   If your beliefs betrayed you somehow does it really help you to deny anyone else's non-physical experiences?  

You know, when you have an experience the first damn thing a person should do is try to understand it. I grew past my stupid days. It helps a lot in denying another experience. People are dumb, gullible animals. If all it takes is belief for some placebo/nocebo effect to work. It's all pretend. That's it. A psychodrama. It's no different than faith healing and luck charms. 

[papageorge1]

The near Death Experience is known to be transformative in its effect on people's perspective. Sounds like one more case here.

[Piney]

33 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

The near Death Experience is known to be transformative in its effect on people's perspective. Sounds like one more case here.

Coming close to dying has that effect period...

[papageorge1]

4 minutes ago, Piney said:

Coming close to dying has that effect period...

I think it’s much greater with an NDE. Most with no memories probably soon return to normal. NDEs are more permanently transformative..

[Piney]

11 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

I think it’s much greater with an NDE. Most with no memories probably soon return to normal. NDEs are more permanently transformative..

A near death experience is a near death experience. It's transformative period. 

 

[Piney]

3 hours ago, Desertrat56 said:

There is a practic called Reiki, attributted to a Japanese man (stories about who he actually was are distorted) and there are clinics in Japan where people are trained to do what your friend does.   In the U.S. there are lots of people "training" others to do this as well, I have had some of that training and the trick is the perspective of the person giving the healing.   If they take credit for it they are not worth a handfull of salt, if they say they are just a conduit and the person recieving the energy is the healer that is Reiki.   I have met several people who have found they can scan someone else and identify "hot spots" or "cold spots" that indicate there is a health issue, it isn't much different than dowsing, just using hands instead of rods.  We are all more than the sum of our physical parts.   But it isn't required that anyone believe anything.   We are all here for different reasons.  

It was founded by Mikao Usui then taught in Hawaii by his student, Hawayo Takata ( My oldest sister took her course remember) who lied about his religious doctorate and how it originated trying to make it "Christian". 

[papageorge1]

23 minutes ago, Piney said:

A near death experience is a near death experience. It's transformative period. 

 

I was contrasting those that have a spiritual experience and return close to death with those that just experienced unconsciousness.

[XenoFish]

1 minute ago, papageorge1 said:

I was contrasting those that have a spiritual experience and return close to death with those that just experienced unconsciousness.

Which is near death. 🙄

[Piney]

Just now, papageorge1 said:

I was contrasting those that have a spiritual experience and return close to death with those that just experienced unconsciousness.

Unconsciousness is not a "near death experience". You have to literally be near death. Like bleeding out until your gamma waves spike or barely being missed by a RPG rocket. 

[XenoFish]

Trauma induced unconsciousness. Like a near heart attack. In which you see the crash cart right at the door to your room as you feel the hard clenching of your heart while drift in and out of consciousness. 

[Piney]

1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

Trauma induced unconsciousness. Like a near heart attack. In which you see the crash cart right at the door to your room as you feel the hard clenching of your heart while drift in and out of consciousness. 

I don't remember my stroke because it hit too fast. Just waking up confused with a big headache. But I remember bleeding out. Your sight is literally fading like in a movie and your body feels like melting jello.

My transformative lesson was. *Well, I'm not nearly as good as I thought I was. Not even close*. 😬

[Piney]

On 6/18/2024 at 3:00 PM, and-then said:

I don't seek "angels" to give me inside info on what's coming.  Scripture does that sufficiently.  I agree that a "golden age" will come - Christians call it the Millennial Reign of Christ - but the horrors that precede it do not bear thinking overlong about.  It's depressing and frankly, I hope my time here is over before that begins.

You know that idea was from Charles Taze Russell, founder of the Jehovah's Witnesses don't you? 

"Millennialism is a fiction that is too childish either to need or to be worth a refutation." -John Calvin

[+Desertrat56]

1 hour ago, Piney said:

It was founded by Mikao Usui then taught in Hawaii by his student, Hawayo Takata ( My oldest sister took her course remember) who lied about his religious doctorate and how it originated trying to make it "Christian". 

That was the part that irked me the most, the need to make it a story about a "christian", when in fact it was not.   The first manual I got was really a mess, written by a couple who paid Takata thousands to learn what she had been taught, there were symbols but Takata never finished the training and made up the third symbol.   The first teacher I had taught us all about that and that the philosophy was that the person recieving the healing was the healer, or not, if they chose not to heal anything.   I have watched the metamorphasis of the teachings of Reiki in the U.S. turn in to more guru crap than you can imagine.   Some people took the "Theraputic Touch" teachings and pretended like it was Reiki, and that is one place where "Reiki healers" got the idea that they were actually healing others, when in fact they were doing nothing.  All ego, nothing else.  A way to make money without doing any real work.   So @openozy's friend is doing a service without charge, that is admirable, and anyone can choose to heal or not.

Edited June 20 by Desertrat56

[Piney]

10 minutes ago, Desertrat56 said:

That was the part that irked me the most, the need to make it a story about a "christian", when in fact it was not.   The first manual I got was really a mess, written by a couple who paid Takata thousands to learn what she had been taught, there were symbols but Takata never finished the training and made up the third symbol.   The first teacher I had taught us all about that and that the philosophy was that the person recieving the healing was the healer, or not, if they chose not to heal anything.   I have watched the metamorphasis of the teachings of Reiki in the U.S. turn in to more guru crap than you can imagine.   Some people took the "Theraputic Touch" teachings and pretended like it was Reiki, and that is one place where "Reiki healers" got the idea that they were actually healing others, when in fact they were doing nothing.  All ego, nothing else.  A way to make money without doing any real work.   So @openozy's friend is doing a service without charge, that is admirable, and anyone can choose to heal or not.

We talked about it before.

 My stepsister blew thousands of her college fund on Takata's stupid thinking it resembled Quaker Light Work. 

[Antigonos]

1 hour ago, Piney said:

Unconsciousness is not a "near death experience". You have to literally be near death. Like bleeding out until your gamma waves spike or barely being missed by a RPG rocket. 

That’s scientism talk.

[Piney]

12 minutes ago, Antigonos said:

 scientism

Definition: Dog whistle for having no critical thinking skills and being clueless on how science works. 

[XenoFish]

1 hour ago, Piney said:

But I remember bleeding out. Your sight is literally fading like in a movie and your body feels like melting jello.

I did that at age 7. You're right.

Quote

I don't remember my stroke because it hit too fast. Just waking up confused with a big headache.

I couldn't breath. Heart kept clinching. Lost all my strength. Got to the ER and my BP as on the very edge of stroke/heart attack. That didn't wake me to anything spiritual. 

[XenoFish]

1 hour ago, Desertrat56 said:

That was the part that irked me the most, the need to make it a story about a "christian", when in fact it was not.   The first manual I got was really a mess, written by a couple who paid Takata thousands to learn what she had been taught, there were symbols but Takata never finished the training and made up the third symbol.   The first teacher I had taught us all about that and that the philosophy was that the person recieving the healing was the healer, or not, if they chose not to heal anything.   I have watched the metamorphasis of the teachings of Reiki in the U.S. turn in to more guru crap than you can imagine.   Some people took the "Theraputic Touch" teachings and pretended like it was Reiki, and that is one place where "Reiki healers" got the idea that they were actually healing others, when in fact they were doing nothing.  All ego, nothing else.  A way to make money without doing any real work.   So @openozy's friend is doing a service without charge, that is admirable, and anyone can choose to heal or not.

My main issues isn't exactly ego in all this energy healing business. It's the idea that it'll cure cancer. It treats symptoms with a placebo, nothing wrong with that and if it is used in assistance to proper medical care, fine. It might be the same thing that makes me so very angry when someone tells an obvious schizophrenic they're communing with spirits. That enrages me. I've seen too many people show up on a psionics and occult forum with a mental illness and people just tell them it's 'psychic vision'. 

Edited June 20 by XenoFish