SETI found ET, but did not tell you.

[Hazzard]

5 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I'll take the eyewitness accounts in all of them. 

I have no idea what you are talking about anymore!

Are you saying that these 5 cases (The Phoenix Lights, Battle of LA, Salem Harbor 1952, Roswell and the Westall School...) were all alien spaceships??

... because thats what some people said they were?

[Grey Area]

10 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I'll take the eyewitness accounts in all of them. 

and I won't bet something against nothing.

Good for you.  Does nothing to provide any semblance of truth, but you are free to believe.

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

40 minutes ago, Golden Duck said:

Stop projecting for once Earl.  You've been presented with the facts of how that Program was run.  Government employees from The Department Of Supply chased the balloons as they landed.

The balloon really is the best guess and alligns with the records of the time.

You chose to listen to storiea from a lifetime later because that feeds your fantasies.

Real investigators know the importance of taking notes closest to the time of the event.

Oh, so I am playing to my fantasies...? LOL, no, *you* are. you have NO evidence at all that a HIBAL balloon came into the area.
The government was not there, and would have no idea that their balloon came in and went out. So the government shows up and everyone says that they saw
objects that were 10-15 feet in diameter. Again, where is their evidence that a HIBAL came in?? And the government said that the records for balloon #292 were lost. Imagine that!
two more facts for you:

1) Balloons land, and they don't take off again. period. quit bending the facts.
2) the 200 lb. black box with the scientific equipment in it was NOT present in the area, meaning, the HIBAL could never take off again. 

Face the facts. The HIBAL is HUGE and all the eyewitnesses would recognize that immediately. But none of them did.

 

[Earl.Of.Trumps]

59 minutes ago, Hazzard said:

I have no idea what you are talking about anymore!

Are you saying that these 5 cases (The Phoenix Lights, Battle of LA, Salem Harbor 1952, Roswell and the Westall School...) were all alien spaceships??

... because thats what some people said they were?

yes

[Dejarma]

4 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

yes

oh joy

[Golden Duck]

33 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

Oh, so I am playing to my fantasies...? LOL, no, *you* are. you have NO evidence at all that a HIBAL balloon came into the area.
The government was not there, and would have no idea that their balloon came in and went out. So the government shows up and everyone says that they saw
objects that were 10-15 feet in diameter. Again, where is their evidence that a HIBAL came in?? And the government said that the records for balloon #292 were lost. Imagine that!
two more facts for you:

1) Balloons land, and they don't take off again. period. quit bending the facts.
2) the 200 lb. black box with the scientific equipment in it was NOT present in the area, meaning, the HIBAL could never take off again. 

Face the facts. The HIBAL is HUGE and all the eyewitnesses would recognize that immediately. But none of them did.

 

The balloon matches the drawing published in 1966. 

The people that worked on the project said gusts of wind could carry these things for milea while they were chasing them.

I've given you all the information and other Australian have given yiu cultural insights to the impact this has had.

It is simply rude to dismiss the effort that has gone in the research pf the information that has been givem to you.

[Golden Duck]

26 minutes ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

No it doesn't. the drawing showed a round object with no train and a box hanging from it and, there is no way to say how big the drawn object is in reality.
The drawing more accurately describes a disk UFO,  just as the students and others described. GD,, nobody ever said they saw a huge balloon. That's a fact. 
 

operative word... COULD, but did it??? Did anybody ever find the balloon? no.

 

It's no more rude than your totally ignoring the testimony of all the eyewitnesses, not to mention that you won't accept the fact that no HIBAL landed there that day. 

and that's a fact

The testimony you are listening to is almost a lifetime after the incident.  You are chosing utterances of distant memories of the reports from the time. 

It's obvious you want to support a dogmatic faith.  Afterall this is a disc an not at all a balloon.

[Essan]

7 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

The testimony you are listening to is almost a lifetime after the incident.  You are chosing utterances of distant memories of the reports from the time. 

It's obvious you want to support a dogmatic faith.  Afterall this is a disc an not at all a balloon.

Looks more like a flying cup than a flying saucer     The one thing it definitely isnt is a disc!

[Saru]

Thread cleaned 

Let's keep things civil please.

[Hazzard]

13 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

yes

Are there more paranormal phenomenon that you also believe in... I mean there has been some seriously outlandish claims over the years!

They cant all be real, can they?

How do you separate fact from fiction based only on people saying something??

Edited August 3 by Hazzard

[Green Devil]

14 hours ago, Earl.Of.Trumps said:

I'll take the eyewitness accounts in all of them. 

and I won't bet something against nothing.

Eyewitness accounts 

Forget the skeptics

[Hazzard]

24 minutes ago, Green Devil said:

Eyewitness accounts 

Forget the skeptics

 

Do you have any idea how horrible this planet would be, if all the eyewitness accounts and stories about the paranormal was real!!?? 

The world would be filled with every reported crypto creature, magic, monsters, dinosaurs, demons, ghosts, alien spaceships, people with superpowers... flat earth (and hollow at the same time).

Yea right! 😄

 

Sockpuppet anyone **You have a new account, and just jumped in here in the UFO section trolling like there is no tomorrow! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 3 by Hazzard

[MrAnderson]

On 8/2/2024 at 11:42 PM, Hazzard said:

I have no idea what you are talking about anymore!

Are you saying that these 5 cases (The Phoenix Lights, Battle of LA, Salem Harbor 1952, Roswell and the Westall School...) were all alien spaceships??

... because thats what some people said they were?

And they are not the only ones who have said these were of alien origin. What do you find so surprising?

[MrAnderson]

22 hours ago, Golden Duck said:

The testimony you are listening to is almost a lifetime after the incident.  You are chosing utterances of distant memories of the reports from the time. 

It's obvious you want to support a dogmatic faith.  Afterall this is a disc an not at all a balloon.

I dint think he wants to support a dogmatic faith as you said. I don't know how you come to these conclusions.

There is nothing wrong with testimonies and reports.  As I said in other threads they are part of the verification process and part of the evidence mo matter how many of you want to exclude them.

[Grey Area]

11 hours ago, MrAnderson said:

I dint think he wants to support a dogmatic faith as you said. I don't know how you come to these conclusions.

If anyone is sighting an object that they cannot explain and claim it to be an alien spacecraft, that is wholly dogmatic.

Even if the object was sighted by multiple witnesses, verified to be a solid object, the claim it is extra terrestrial is still dogmatic.

11 hours ago, MrAnderson said:

There is nothing wrong with testimonies and reports.  As I said in other threads they are part of the verification process and part of the evidence mo matter how many of you want to exclude them.

As part of an investigation, of course.  In isolation, as in, we are simply being told something by someone, it’s simply a story.  And a line drawing that a 2 year old could produce does not add anything into it.

So when we have a story, which someone claims is evidence of an alien encounter, that’s Dogma, pure and simple.

[L.A.T.1961]

More from Prof Simon on the search for ET. 

 

[Trelane]

On 8/3/2024 at 9:42 AM, Hazzard said:

Are there more paranormal phenomenon that you also believe in... I mean there has been some seriously outlandish claims over the years!

They cant all be real, can they?

How do you separate fact from fiction based only on people saying something??

He generally doesn't. That's why he gets so wound up when he's proven wrong.

[Hazzard]

23 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

More from Prof Simon on the search for ET. 

 

😄 wow!

[MrAnderson]

On 8/4/2024 at 12:56 PM, Grey Area said:

If anyone is sighting an object that they cannot explain and claim it to be an alien spacecraft, that is wholly dogmatic.

Even if the object was sighted by multiple witnesses, verified to be a solid object, the claim it is extra terrestrial is still dogmatic.

As part of an investigation, of course.  In isolation, as in, we are simply being told something by someone, it’s simply a story.  And a line drawing that a 2 year old could produce does not add anything into it.

So when we have a story, which someone claims is evidence of an alien encounter, that’s Dogma, pure and simple.

You have misunderstood what dogma means and religious beliefs. Observing strange objects in the skies and trying to make sense of them is not dogma even when you come to the conclusion that they could be of alien origin. It's personal opinion often because of personal experience (sighting) and knowledge.

Someone like a radar operator, pilot, or ground observer doesn't just tells everyone else whatever comes to their minds and makes random claims but rather describes what they have seen. They don't just have an opinion but knowledge of an event even if they can't explain it fully.

You are wrong and it's not dogma to say that some of these objects could be of alien origin given their capabilities and the inability of humans to understand the phenomenon well.

Edited August 8 by MrAnderson

[Grey Area]

3 hours ago, MrAnderson said:

You have misunderstood what dogma means and religious beliefs. Observing strange objects in the skies and trying to make sense of them is not dogma even when you come to the conclusion that they could be of alien origin. It's personal opinion often because of personal experience (sighting) and knowledge.

Someone like a radar operator, pilot, or ground observer doesn't just tells everyone else whatever comes to their minds and makes random claims but rather describes what they have seen. They don't just have an opinion but knowledge of an event even if they can't explain it fully.

You are wrong and it's not dogma to say that some of these objects could be of alien origin given their capabilities and the inability of humans to understand the phenomenon well.

EoT was asked if he thought 5 specific historical cases were ET.  He replied yes.  It may be personal opinion but that does not automatically mean it’s not a dogmatic faith, and he categorically did not use your handy little trick of inserting an ‘if’ or a ‘could’.  He gave a straight answer to a straight question.

I know that’s something you might find… a little alien (pun intended).

I have to add, that while I quite admire EoT for having a position, given their relative hostility to any who disagree with their ‘opinion’, this opinion also comes with an expectation that others should share the belief.

So we have someone who believes in something without any conclusive evidence, and also carries an expectation that others should also believe.  That’s fairly dogmatic.

But of course you are right in that not all people who have seen a UFO subscribe to a dogmatic view.  Those that seek genuine enquiry without bias are to be applauded.  However those that believe aliens are here on Earth do not fall into the category of genuine inquiry because they already know the conclusion they are looking for, they are just trying to figure out how to convince others they are right.

[MrAnderson]

On 8/8/2024 at 11:00 PM, Grey Area said:

EoT was asked if he thought 5 specific historical cases were ET.  He replied yes.  It may be personal opinion but that does not automatically mean it’s not a dogmatic faith, and he categorically did not use your handy little trick of inserting an ‘if’ or a ‘could’.  He gave a straight answer to a straight question.

I know that’s something you might find… a little alien (pun intended).

I have to add, that while I quite admire EoT for having a position, given their relative hostility to any who disagree with their ‘opinion’, this opinion also comes with an expectation that others should share the belief.

So we have someone who believes in something without any conclusive evidence, and also carries an expectation that others should also believe.  That’s fairly dogmatic.

But of course you are right in that not all people who have seen a UFO subscribe to a dogmatic view.  Those that seek genuine enquiry without bias are to be applauded.  However those that believe aliens are here on Earth do not fall into the category of genuine inquiry because they already know the conclusion they are looking for, they are just trying to figure out how to convince others they are right.

Having an opinion on the origin of UFOs isn't dogma as I explained to you a few times earlier. It's a possibility based on our knowledge which is currently incomplete. You really need to look at what dogma is and then see whether you still have the same view. You can still believe or accept something without conclusive evidence but that doesn't make you dogmatic. You just entertain the possibilities based on what you think is happening and on personal experience and knowledge.

@Earl.Of.Trumps said that he thinks she of these UFO cases are of alien origin. That's his opinion and he could be right. It's not an impossibility.

[Grey Area]

2 minutes ago, MrAnderson said:

Having an opinion on the origin of UFOs isn't dogma as I explained to you a few times earlier.

You explained?  Sorry I missed your explanation.  You told me, just like you told me now.  That’s not an explanation.  I however did explain why it is dogmatic.

9 minutes ago, MrAnderson said:

It's a possibility based on our knowledge which is currently incomplete.

And it’s highly improbable based on our knowledge, despite it being incomplete.

11 minutes ago, MrAnderson said:

You really need to look at what dogma is and then see whether you still have the same view.

I have and I do.

12 minutes ago, MrAnderson said:

You can still believe or accept something without conclusive evidence but that doesn't make you dogmatic.

And if you expect others to subscribe to your viewpoint?

14 minutes ago, MrAnderson said:

@Earl.Of.Trumps said that he thinks she of these UFO cases are of alien origin. That's his opinion and he could be right. It's not an impossibility

And we will never know, these cases are decades old and have very little supporting evidence.  without a Time Machine no way to make a determination.  But EoT has faith.

[MrAnderson]

10 hours ago, Grey Area said:

You explained?  Sorry I missed your explanation.  You told me, just like you told me now.  That’s not an explanation.  I however did explain why it is dogmatic.

And it’s highly improbable based on our knowledge, despite it being incomplete.

I have and I do.

And if you expect others to subscribe to your viewpoint?

And we will never know, these cases are decades old and have very little supporting evidence.  without a Time Machine no way to make a determination.  But EoT has faith.

You have said it's dogma and I ve shown you it's not dogma. Based on the current understanding or lack of understanding we have on the UFO phenomenon and the unusual and often extraordinary properties these objects have it's not impossible that some of them are of alien origin. If you think it's highly improbable then you project a personal opinion.

You can still make the argument these objects could be from another world without expecting others to subscribe to your worldview. You just entertain the possibilities.

According to your own logic part of science is 'dogmatic' and I am talking about the theoretical sciences such as theoretical physics which is highly speculative and entertains a range of possibilities by creating mathematicsl models to describe the universe.

[Grey Area]

42 minutes ago, MrAnderson said:

You have said it's dogma and I ve shown you it's not dogma. Based on the current understanding or lack of understanding we have on the UFO phenomenon and the unusual and often extraordinary properties these objects have it's not impossible that some of them are of alien origin. If you think it's highly improbable then you project a personal opinion.

You can still make the argument these objects could be from another world without expecting others to subscribe to your worldview. You just entertain the possibilities.

According to your own logic part of science is 'dogmatic' and I am talking about the theoretical sciences such as theoretical physics which is highly speculative and entertains a range of possibilities by creating mathematicsl models to describe the universe.

I am going to agree to disagree.  You have not shown or explained anything, and simply stating that I am wrong is not in itself an explanation anywhere other than in your head, and I don’t think this circular argument is doing anything to further the conversation.

[MrAnderson]

5 hours ago, Grey Area said:

I am going to agree to disagree.  You have not shown or explained anything, and simply stating that I am wrong is not in itself an explanation anywhere other than in your head, and I don’t think this circular argument is doing anything to further the conversation.

You can agree to disagree but I did explain to you why having an opinion on the origin of UFOs isn't dogma. You just entertain possibilities without knowing all facts or having access to all information. It's a real possibility that some of these objects are of alien origin and this isn't dogma. I have stated you are wrong to say it is dogma and I can't find anything right with your statement.