Israel airstrike on Gaza school kills more than 100, Hamas-run media office says

[+and-then]

12 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Yea we will never know because Israel won’t allow the corespondents to actually see what is going on. It seems like they are afraid of what they will see, if they are doing everything you think they are, then it shouldn’t be an issue!

If you were fighting for your life and the lives of all those you love and it was obvious that media corporations were skewing all of their coverage to blame you for everything that is happening, and to uncritically print or report the obvious paropaganda from your enemy, would you enable that?  Most people wouldn't even consider it.  The reality is that Gazans and Lebanese should be extremely grateful that Israel does not fight like Hamas and Hizballah.  If Israel is forced into a full-on war in the north, those measures of restraint will not continue.  

[Grim Reaper 6]

44 minutes ago, Claira said:

Not all reports coming out of Gaza support Hamas, but yes, the anti-Israeli bias is omnipresent, regardless of the facts. But to be fair, there is an anti-Palestinian bias as well.

I totally agree with you, it is a two way street thanks for your candor.

44 minutes ago, Claira said:

You really do need to get out more. Here's an article that lists the names of some of the journalists embedded with the IDF at one point or another. I selected this one as the journalists also discuss the restrictions placed on them.

Thank you for providing that article, however it is 9 months old and according to the article this was a more of less a special situation and not a daily operation. In addition while I realize the need for Operational Security, according to the article Israel edits everything that these corespondents produce so it appears to be a bit bias..

Oh and by the way, I get out every day and on a regular basis I get together with friends from NATO, 8th US Army, and US Forces Command  Korea and we discuss this and many other topics. 

44 minutes ago, Claira said:

There, I've killed two birds with one stone. You'll probably say it was with a 2,000 lb bomb, but I can assure you it was a low-yield, high precision stone, but I bet it felt like a 2,000 pounder didn't it.

https://newrepublic.com/article/176919/cnn-abc-nbc-reporters-embedding-israeli-military-gaza

I have already said I don’t believe that 2000lb bombs were used, I believe that precision aircraft fired missiles were used sorry to disappoint you!?

Maybe you should read my comments more carefully.

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 hour ago, and-then said:

If you were fighting for your life and the lives of all those you love and it was obvious that media corporations were skewing all of their coverage to blame you for everything that is happening, and to uncritically print or report the obvious paropaganda from your enemy, would you enable that?  Most people wouldn't even consider it.  The reality is that Gazans and Lebanese should be extremely grateful that Israel does not fight like Hamas and Hizballah.  If Israel is forced into a full-on war in the north, those measures of restraint will not continue.  

Relax dude you’re wrapped far too tight and it certainly isn’t healthy, but thanks to your response even though it doesn’t address my comments!

[Claira]

1 hour ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Oh and by the way, I get out every day and on a regular basis I get together with friends from NATO, 8th US Army, and US Forces Command  Korea and we discuss this and many other topics. 

Oh look at you hanging out with your cool friends discussing current affairs. Meanwhile here I am trying to have a similar conversation with a close friend who drops me midway through the conversation because her married lover is on his way over. We both think he's with the Mossad but she has yet to go through his pockets or put a tail on him. 

2 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Thank you for providing that article, however it is 9 months old and according to the article this was a more of less a special situation and not a daily operation. In addition while I realize the need for Operational Security, according to the article Israel edits everything that these corespondents produce so it appears to be a bit bias..

There's no bias. The article makes it clear that most of the restrictions are reasonable and nothing no other army wouldn't also make. The IDF does not otherwise interfere with the final version of the story. There are journalists currently there but I don't know their names and haven't the desire to search. As much as I enjoy winning an argument, I don't want to break a nail in the process.

2 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

I have already said I don’t believe that 2000lb bombs were used, I believe that precision aircraft fired missiles were used sorry to disappoint you!?

That was one of my most brilliant put downs and it was clearly wasted on you.

[Grim Reaper 6]

3 hours ago, Claira said:

Oh look at you hanging out with your cool friends discussing current affairs. Meanwhile here I am trying to have a similar conversation with a close friend who drops me midway through the conversation because her married lover is on his way over. We both think he's with the Mossad but she has yet to go through his pockets or put a tail on him.

Claira, your terrible it’s really mean putting tails on people, it’s like slapping a kick me sign on someone’s back.

3 hours ago, Claira said:

There's no bias. The article makes it clear that most of the restrictions are reasonable and nothing no other army wouldn't also make. The IDF does not otherwise interfere with the final version of the story. There are journalists currently there but I don't know their names and haven't the desire to search. As much as I enjoy winning an argument, I don't want to break a nail in the process.

Well Claira, I took the risk of breaking a finger nail, I have done the research this what I have found. Apparently, I was correct that the article you presented was not the norm, but a special case where foreign media correspondents were allowed in. It’s pretty clear that foreign media corespondent censorship is prevalent across the Gaza Strip.

While I can’t understand why this is being done, (has little to do with security) I think it is certainly more detrimental to Israel than anyone else. Because the only consistent media coverage coming out of Gaza is from Palestinian Media Correspondents who have been trapped in Gaza since the conflict started. However I think the reports by these Palestinian Correspondents support the Hamas side, this is why Israel should allow foreign Media Correspondents into Gaza so they can set the record straight.

“In the letter, the 55 journalists write that "foreign reporters are still being denied access to the territory, outside of the rare and escorted trips with the Israeli military".  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68423995

‘The grey zone’: how IDF views some journalists in Gaza as legitimate targets: https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jun/25/grey-zone-how-hamas-linked-journalists-legitimate-targets

How Israel continues to censor journalists covering the war in Gaza: https://theconversation.com/how-israel-continues-to-censor-journalists-covering-the-war-in-gaza-228241.

Israeli blockade on journalists is fueling an 'information war': https://www.msnbc.com/the-reidout/reidout-blog/israel-gaza-blockade-journalists-rcna147493

3 hours ago, Claira said:

That was one of my most brilliant put downs and it was clearly wasted on you.

Thats ok Claira, I hold no grudges but thanks for your comments because they made me do some research which makes your entire argument about foreign media correspondents mute. Because now it’s very obvious that foreign journalists are being censored and blocked from entry in Gaza.

Edited August 15 by Grim Reaper 6

[+and-then]

5 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Relax dude you’re wrapped far too tight and it certainly isn’t healthy, but thanks to your response even though it doesn’t address my comments!

I guess the point was lost on you.  I'll try it with simpler language.  You trust media that tells you that Israel massacred 100 people and did so using ordnance that had to be much larger than that Israel claims was used.  You with me so far?  I do not believe Israel is responsible for that number of deaths and I support Israel's choice to attack that location as a LEGITIMATE TARGET in a war that was thrust upon them by a global terror organization.  You seem to suffer pangs of conscience over the death of any civilian in Gaza even though you know that civilian deaths cannot be avoided when combatants intentionally embed themselves among the innocent.

You claim to support Israel yet you also blame them for "excessive" civilian deaths while not really offering any other option except the use of IDF troops being intentionally fed into kill boxes.  The bottom line is that you are more concerned with protecting Gaza civilians than is Hamas and you also expect Israel to embed "reporters" that wouldn't be above spreading anti-Israel, pro-Hamas propaganda.  

[Grim Reaper 6]

1 hour ago, and-then said:

I guess the point was lost on you.  I'll try it with simpler language.  You trust media that tells you that Israel massacred 100 people and did so using ordnance that had to be much larger than that Israel claims was used.  You with me so far?  I do not believe Israel is responsible for that number of deaths and I support Israel's choice to attack that location as a LEGITIMATE TARGET in a war that was thrust upon them by a global terror organization.  You seem to suffer pangs of conscience over the death of any civilian in Gaza even though you know that civilian deaths cannot be avoided when combatants intentionally embed themselves among the innocent.

And-then you’re the last person who needs to break anything down for me. Here again you’re unable to contain yourself, and you’re putting words in my mouth. I never said that the reported casualties were accurate, in fact I said that I thought the numbers were far less. I don’t suffer pangs of anything, however unlike you I have seen the death of women and children up close more than once and sometimes it keeps me awake at night.

My comments unlike yours are not based upon religious beliefs which give me the right to wear blinders that only let you see things from a single perspective. Last, I really don’t need you to tell me what causes civilian casualties I am far more aware of it than you are. For me it’s not the fact civilian casualties occur, it’s the over all number that have occurred in Gaza. The civilians in Gaza are Trapped and they have no safe place to hide, I could make a comparison but I won’t at this time, so no matter your opinion the reality of the situation is very obvious. 

1 hour ago, and-then said:

You claim to support Israel yet you also blame them for "excessive" civilian deaths while not really offering any other option except the use of IDF troops being intentionally fed into kill boxes.  The bottom line is that you are more concerned with protecting Gaza civilians than is Hamas and you also expect Israel to embed "reporters" that wouldn't be above spreading anti-Israel, pro-Hamas propaganda.  

Here again you think you have the moral high ground, but you have no right to preach your beliefs to me. I am not required to figure out how to prevent civilian casualties in Gaza that’s Israel’s responsibility not mine, however I have offered opinions about that issue and you paid no attention to my comments. As far as News correspondents go, Israel has a blockade on foreign journalists, why it’s unknown to me and I don’t wish to further speculate.

And-Then I will say this there are no absolutes, there is more than YOUR way to look at this you have no right to define me in the manner you have done above. Like I said in a previous post you’re too emotionally wrapped up in this conflict and you have blinders on which only allow you to see things from a single perspective. Your philosophy is very simple, either fully agree with you or you’re not a supporter of Israel which is ludicrous.

Have a drink or take a chill pill because you’re way too uptight dude!

Edited August 15 by Grim Reaper 6

[Claira]

6 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Well Claira, I took the risk of breaking a finger nail, I have done the research this what I have found. Apparently, I was correct that the article you presented was not the norm, but a special case where foreign media correspondents were allowed in. It’s pretty clear that foreign media corespondent censorship is prevalent across the Gaza Strip.

And there you go again having a free for all with goal posts. You stated that Israel does not allow journalists to embed with its forces. I and others replied they do but with restrictions. That continues to be true and goes beyond that one so-called special occasion at the outset of the war (one of your articles confirms this). The articles you list mostly discuss the IDF's refusal to allow journalists free and unfettered access to Gaza.  I could have told you that at the outset and saved you the trouble.

6 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Thats ok Claira, I hold no grudges but thanks for your comments because they made me do some research which makes your entire argument about foreign media correspondents mute. Because now it’s very obvious that foreign journalists are being censored and blocked from entry in Gaza.

I take it you mean moot not mute, not that my argument is either. What I stated was, and remains, correct. As for why Israel refuses to allow the press free access, they've openly stated their reasons. You mention in a post above this one that you won't speculate, but you've already done so, suggesting that it's because they have something to hide. Maybe they do and maybe they don't, but their explanation and rationale make perfectly good sense.

[Claira]

5 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

And-Then I will say this there are no absolutes, there is more than YOUR way to look at this you have no right to define me in the manner you have done above. Like I said in a previous post you’re too emotionally wrapped up in this conflict and you have blinders on which only allow you to see things from a single perspective.

You appear to be projecting.

5 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Have a drink or take a chill pill because you’re way too uptight dude!

Likewise.

[Grim Reaper 6]

27 minutes ago, Claira said:

You appear to be projecting.

Likewise.

I have no need to project I will leave that up to the two of you, I am not the one making accusations against fellow members! But maybe you also need a drink and chill pill yourself, anyway if the shoe fits. 

[Grim Reaper 6]

34 minutes ago, Claira said:

And there you go again having a free for all with goal posts. You stated that Israel does not allow journalists to embed with its forces. I and others replied they do but with restrictions. That continues to be true and goes beyond that one so-called special occasion at the outset of the war (one of your articles confirms this). The articles you list mostly discuss the IDF's refusal to allow journalists free and unfettered access to Gaza.  I could have told you that at the outset and saved you the trouble.

I haven’t moved any goal post, I have commented on the fact that foreign journalists have not been given access in previous posts. The source you provided was a one time deal, not a daily or even monthly event, and it has nothing to do with security concerns..

This source says it all, but you neglected to make a comment about it above because it did not fit your narrative. 

In the letter, the 55 journalists write that "foreign reporters are still being denied access to the territory, outside of the rare and escorted trips with the Israeli military".  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68423995

34 minutes ago, Claira said:

I take it you mean moot not mute, not that my argument is either. What I stated was, and remains, correct. As for why Israel refuses to allow the press free access, they've openly stated their reasons. You mention in a post above this one that you won't speculate, but you've already done so, suggesting that it's because they have something to hide. Maybe they do and maybe they don't, but their explanation and rationale make perfectly good sense.

You’re certainly welcome to your opinion, but what you stated isn’t correct it’s only what you wish to share which is fine. No, I have not speculated at all, but again that’s a moot point so I will leave it at that. Their decision makes perfect sense to you, but unfortunately the global community isn’t buying into it and that is an undisputed fact.

Sincerly I hope you have a safe and wonderful evening or day depending upon the time difference.

[Claira]

On 8/15/2024 at 5:41 AM, Grim Reaper 6 said:

I have no need to project I will leave that up to the two of you, I am not the one making accusations against fellow members! But maybe you also need a drink and chill pill yourself, anyway if the shoe fits. 

What an amazing selective memory you have. I'm truly impressed.

[Grim Reaper 6]

3 hours ago, Claira said:

What an amazing selective memory you have. I'm truly impressed.

You should be very impressed Claira, show me where I attacked anyone, can you say the same?

[Claira]

10 minutes ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

You should be very impressed Claira, show me where I attacked anyone, can you say the same?

Have a read through the discussion and figure it out for yourself. It will be a good learning lesson.

[Grim Reaper 6]

2 minutes ago, Claira said:

Have a read through the discussion and figure it out for yourself. It will be a good learning lesson.

Claira, I don’t need to do that, unlike you and others I have made no personal attacks on other members. I think it would serve you well to read through the discussion. I could cut and paste the personal attacks made against me for sharing my opinion but that would be very redundant. If, you wish to prove me wrong then do so other than that have a wonderful night!

[Claira]

1 hour ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Claira, I don’t need to do that, unlike you and others I have made no personal attacks on other members. I think it would serve you well to read through the discussion. I could cut and paste the personal attacks made against me for sharing my opinion but that would be very redundant. If, you wish to prove me wrong then do so other than that have a wonderful night!

No need to copy and paste. I made copies of the attacks against you and framed them.

[Grim Reaper 6]

2 minutes ago, Claira said:

No need to copy and paste. I made copies of the attacks against you and framed them.

Well, that certainly proves my point, because obviously I am not the one making personal attacks against other members.

Thanks for clearing that up!

[Claira]

1 hour ago, Grim Reaper 6 said:

Well, that certainly proves my point, because obviously I am not the one making personal attacks against other members.

Continue to deny if you wish, but know this: your passive aggressiveness is here in all its glory should anyone want to be mildly entertained by it. Indeed, no one need look further than this page. What makes some of your comments especially egregious is that you weaponize kindness. I'll leave it at that as I'm done with your gaslighting.

[Grim Reaper 6]

6 minutes ago, Claira said:

Continue to deny if you wish, but know this: your passive aggressiveness is here in all its glory should anyone want to be mildly entertained by it. Indeed, no one need look further than this page. What makes some of your comments especially egregious is that you weaponize kindness. I'll leave it at that as I'm done with your gaslighting.

Claira, I will leave the personal attacks up to you, this post is only further proof. You talk about passive / aggressive comments and gaslighting your comments above are very clearly both. My, opinion on this subject is as valid as yours, however you make it very clear that either one agrees with you completely or they are the enemy. There are no absolutes Claira, and neither of us hold the moral high ground, I know that is impossible for you to understand but facts are facts. This will be my last comments to you in this thread, I have tired of the lack of substance in your comments, so please have the last word, I mean that’s what seems most important to you anyway.

[+and-then]

On 8/14/2024 at 10:44 PM, Grim Reaper 6 said:

The civilians in Gaza are Trapped and they have no safe place to hide, I could make a comparison but I won’t at this time, so no matter your opinion the reality of the situation is very obvious. 

I agree that the situation IS very obvious.  Sometimes the only choice left to honest people who mean well, is to choose the lesser of two evils.  Israel's choice is to kill their enemies where those enemies are, regardless of the fact they cower behind women and children, OR to allow that enemy to kill all of them.  Israelis make the choice they must.  I support them.  Who do you support in this war?  If your primary concern is to saave the innocent women and children then you are a de facto supporter of Hamas, whether you admit that or not.

[Grim Reaper 6]

48 minutes ago, and-then said:

I agree that the situation IS very obvious.  Sometimes the only choice left to honest people who mean well, is to choose the lesser of two evils.  Israel's choice is to kill their enemies where those enemies are, regardless of the fact they cower behind women and children, OR to allow that enemy to kill all of them.  Israelis make the choice they must.  I support them.  Who do you support in this war?  If your primary concern is to saave the innocent women and children then you are a de facto supporter of Hamas, whether you admit that or not.

So, if someone’s primary concerns are to save innocent women and children according to you they support Hamas. Well that’s a brilliant statement I really don’t even know how to answer that comment WOW!

Remember And-Then there are no absolutes!

 

Edited August 17 by Grim Reaper 6