+OverSword Posted August 12 #1 Share Posted August 12 Quote The European Union sent a warning letter to X owner Elon Musk on Monday reminding him of the bloc’s rules against promoting “harmful content” ahead of the billionaire tech mogul’s interview with former President Trump on the social platform. “With great audience comes greater responsibility,” wrote Thierry Breton, the EU’s commissioner for Internal Market, in a post on X. “As there is a risk of amplification of potentially harmful content in in connection with events with major audience around the world, I sent this letter to @elonmusk.” The letter reminded Musk that X is subject to the EU’s Digital Services Act (DSA), the bloc’s relatively new law regulating illegal content and disinformation on large social media platforms. Link This is ridiculous **** (imo) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Wearer of Hats Posted August 12 #2 Share Posted August 12 I predict that thry’ll find “something” and say “we warned you…” and fine Twit-X and Melon Tusk and probably try and levy a fine against Trump too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Reaper 6 Posted August 12 #3 Share Posted August 12 13 minutes ago, OverSword said: Link This is ridiculous **** (imo) I disagree, Musk is an idiot he runs his mouth with no regard whatsoever for the consequences. I hope they shut him down because he needs a wake up call. JIMHO 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Reaper 6 Posted August 12 #4 Share Posted August 12 2 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said: I predict that thry’ll find “something” and say “we warned you…” and fine Twit-X and Melon Tusk and probably try and levy a fine against Trump too. It doesn’t surprise me at all, Melon Tusk certainly deserves it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+OverSword Posted August 12 Author #5 Share Posted August 12 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Grim Reaper 6 said: I disagree, Musk is an idiot he runs his mouth with no regard whatsoever for the consequences. I hope they shut him down because he needs a wake up call. JIMHO Because the adults in EU countries can't be allowed to hear things? Keep in mind tuning in to X is completely optional. Edited August 12 by OverSword 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Reaper 6 Posted August 12 #6 Share Posted August 12 18 minutes ago, OverSword said: Because the adults in EU countries can't be allowed to hear things? Keep in mind tuning in to X is completely optional. No, because Musk creates drama and conspiracy theories with his uniformed ridiculous comments. Not all speech is free and when you cross that line there can be consequences. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+OverSword Posted August 12 Author #7 Share Posted August 12 41 minutes ago, Grim Reaper 6 said: No, because Musk creates drama and conspiracy theories with his uniformed ridiculous comments. Not all speech is free and when you cross that line there can be consequences. I guess I would have to see the wording in the EU regulation and determine if I thought it was reasonable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Reaper 6 Posted August 12 #8 Share Posted August 12 1 minute ago, OverSword said: I guess I would have to see the wording in the EU regulation and determine if I thought it was reasonable. Thats fair, when you check it out let me know. Thanks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destination Unknown Posted August 13 #9 Share Posted August 13 (edited) 15 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said: I disagree, Musk is an idiot he runs his mouth with no regard whatsoever for the consequences. I hope they shut him down because he needs a wake up call. JIMHO And who suddenly made the EU the judge, jury and executioner of what should be broadcast around the world? Predictably, here's Elon Musk's middle finger response to the EU. Edited August 13 by Saru Removed due to profanity 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Reaper 6 Posted August 13 #10 Share Posted August 13 12 hours ago, Destination Unknown said: And who suddenly made the EU the judge, jury and executioner of what should be broadcast around the world? Predictably, here's Elon Musk's middle finger response to the EU. Elon Musk is just another entitled rich guy with big mouth, who thinks that rules don’t apply to him. So, while your welcome to your opinion, I certainly disagree with it. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destination Unknown Posted August 13 #11 Share Posted August 13 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Grim Reaper 6 said: Elon Musk is just another entitled rich guy with big mouth, who thinks that rules don’t apply to him. So, while your welcome to your opinion, I certainly disagree with it. And who's "rules" are they claiming he's even breaking exactly, the ones the EU took it upon themselves to create in order to stop people from deciding for themselves? Strange how when the pre-Musk era Twitter was a left leaning platform the mantra was that it was a privately owned company and could do what it likes, but now that it's been bought out and is a privately owned right leaning platform, somehow now it can't. 🤔 Edited August 13 by Destination Unknown 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Reaper 6 Posted August 13 #12 Share Posted August 13 6 hours ago, Destination Unknown said: And who's "rules" are they claiming he's even breaking exactly, the ones the EU took it upon themselves to create in order to stop people from deciding for themselves? Strange how when the pre-Musk era Twitter was a left leaning platform the mantra was that it was a privately owned company and could do what it likes, but now that it's been bought out and is a privately owned right leaning platform, somehow now it can't. 🤔 Politics has nothing to do with this, it’s all about the comments Musk has made please get real! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destination Unknown Posted August 13 #13 Share Posted August 13 (edited) 5 hours ago, Grim Reaper 6 said: Politics has nothing to do with this, it’s all about the comments Musk has made please get real! Politics has everything to do with this though. The EU is asserting the right to censor or block 'X/Twitter', or punish it after the fact, for broadcasting a live interview between Elon Musk and Donald Trump, conducted outside its own territory, and in that of a friendly allied country. They also have the nerve to cite as part of their justification 'the context of the recent riots in the UK', a country over which they also have no jurisdiction. If the EU get away with this, it won't stop there. Any interview they consider "harmful" in some way will be at risk of the same treatment, even those conducted in this country. We are rapidly descending into a very alarming situation as regards to freedom of speech, so it's certainly not me that needs to get real. Edited August 13 by Destination Unknown 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted August 13 #14 Share Posted August 13 26 minutes ago, Destination Unknown said: We are rapidly descending into a very alarming situation as regards to freedom of speech, so it's certainly not me that needs to get real. Does the dominance of privately owned social media platforms not represent a threat to freedom of speech ? Should a small number of untouchable, unaccountable, billionaire platform owners get to dictate what the world sees, hears and thinks ? Musk is known for peddling lies and propaganda on Twitter which influences the opinions of millions around the world. It's not surprising that the EU is concerned about it. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destination Unknown Posted August 13 #15 Share Posted August 13 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Saru said: Does the dominance of privately owned social media platforms not represent a threat to freedom of speech ? Musk has already said he is open to host an interview with Kamala Harris, so how is that a threat to freedom of speech exactly? 20 minutes ago, Saru said: Should a small number of untouchable, unaccountable, billionaire platform owners get to dictate what the world sees, hears and thinks ? No, but that's not what's happening though is it, people aren't being forced to watch it are they, so why should an untouchable, unaccountable political entity in Brussels get to dictate what the world sees, hears and thinks by trying to shut it down? 20 minutes ago, Saru said: Musk is known for peddling lies and propaganda on Twitter which influences the opinions of millions around the world. It's not surprising that the EU is concerned about it. That goes back to my earlier point, isn't it strange how when the pre-Musk era Twitter was a left leaning platform the mantra was that it was a privately owned company and could do what it likes, so where was the EU's concern then? Edited August 13 by Destination Unknown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted August 13 #16 Share Posted August 13 56 minutes ago, Destination Unknown said: Musk has already said he is open to host an interview with Kamala Harris, so how is that a threat to freedom of speech exactly? A strawman, I never even made any reference to the US elections - I was speaking generally. Quote No, but that's not what's happening though is it, people aren't being forced to watch it are they Nobody is forcing you to pay any attention to what the EU is doing either. 56 minutes ago, Destination Unknown said: why should an untouchable, unaccountable political entity in Brussels get to dictate what the world sees, hears and thinks? They don't and they aren't. Quote That goes back to my earlier point, isn't it strange how when the pre-Musk era Twitter was a left leaning platform the mantra was that it was a privately owned company and could do what it likes, but now that it's been bought out and is a privately owned right leaning platform, somehow now it can't. Previously Twitter had safeguards to protect against misinformation etc - Musk has since removed these, so it's a much bigger issue now than it was before. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destination Unknown Posted August 13 #17 Share Posted August 13 1 hour ago, Saru said: A strawman, I never even made any reference to the US elections - I was speaking generally. No, but you made reference to Musk's social media platform representing a threat to freedom of speech, so how is it a threat to freedom of speech exactly, when anyone can have an "X" account, including Donald Trump, whose account was banned when it was formerly Twitter? If anything, "X" is now a champion of freedom of speech. 1 hour ago, Saru said: Nobody is forcing you to pay any attention to what the EU is doing either. Now who is using a strawman? If the EU decides certain content is "harmful" in their opinion, and they decide to shut it down, I certainly will be forced to pay attention to what the EU is doing, as should anyone else who is concerned about them trying to suppress freedom of speech as well, because that's the sort of thing Communist China gets up to. 1 hour ago, Saru said: They don't and they aren't. So Thierry Breton's letter to Musk asserting the right to censor or block 'X/Twitter', or punish it after the fact, for broadcasting a live interview conducted outside its own territory isn't the EU dictating what the world sees, hears and thinks then? 1 hour ago, Saru said: Previously Twitter had safeguards to protect against misinformation etc - Musk has since removed these, so it's a much bigger issue now than it was before. He hasn't removed them at all. He's changed them and introduced 'Community Notes', which is specifically designed to protect against misinformation etc. So the only misinformation here is your own comment. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Notes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted August 13 #18 Share Posted August 13 1 hour ago, Destination Unknown said: No, but you made reference to Musk's social media platform representing a threat to freedom of speech, so how is it a threat to freedom of speech exactly, when anyone can have an "X" account, including Donald Trump, whose account was banned when it was formerly Twitter? If anything, "X" is now a champion of freedom of speech. You don't want everyone, everywhere relying on social media monopolies from which they can be restricted or banned at a moment's notice. Also regarding "free speech", I only mentioned it because I was responding to your use of the term with a rhetorical question. No online community-driven social media platform offers true "free speech". Quote Now who is using a strawman? The comment you quoted was not a strawman, I did not attack an argument that you didn't make, I posted a simple statement of fact. Quote So Thierry Breton's letter to Musk asserting the right to censor or block 'X/Twitter', or punish it after the fact, for broadcasting a live interview conducted outside its own territory isn't the EU dictating what the world sees, hears and thinks then? What is posted on Twitter impacts everyone in all corners of the globe - sometimes very negatively. Look at what happened with the recent riots - fake claims spread on Twitter helped to fan the flames and make things a lot worse. 1 hour ago, Destination Unknown said: He hasn't removed them at all. He's changed them and introduced 'Community Notes', which is specifically designed to protect against misinformation etc. So the only misinformation here is your own comment. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Notes "Community Notes" is a crowd-sourced moderation system, it is not an equivalent of the checks that Twitter previously had in place. It also seems to be rather limited in its effectiveness. Quote In the year since Elon Musk purchased Twitter for $44 billion, the platform now known as X has removed guardrails designed to restrict the flow of mis- and disinformation, including stripping away what was once a free account verification process designed to combat impersonation and replacing it with paid “blue check” accounts that guarantee posts will be prioritized by X’s algorithm. The platform has instituted processes that experts say elevate and encourage the spread of misleading content, including sharing ad revenue with its largest content creators — accounts that have paid money for “blue checks” to expand their posts’ reach. https://www.politifact.com/article/2023/oct/23/how-elon-musk-ditched-twitters-safeguards-and-prim/ Quote Why Twitter’s Community Notes feature mostly fails to combat misinformation An attempt to solve ‘the problem of biased fact-checkers’ has left most Notes unseen by public, fact-checking conference is told https://www.poynter.org/fact-checking/2023/why-twitters-community-notes-feature-mostly-fails-to-combat-misinformation/ There are other changes too, such as loosening the content guidelines on offensive postings, hate speech etc. And let us not forget the fact that one of the most prominent sources of false information these days is Elon Musk himself who is not subject to any of these checks. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iAlrakis Posted August 13 #19 Share Posted August 13 Personally I think Musk just sees an opportunity here. Just like a cold business man. If Trump gets elected, this so called support will be good for Musk's companies. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted August 13 #20 Share Posted August 13 23 hours ago, OverSword said: Because the adults in EU countries can't be allowed to hear things? Keep in mind tuning in to X is completely optional. Yeah that’s a good point. Don’t do X if you got a problem with the platform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destination Unknown Posted August 13 #21 Share Posted August 13 (edited) 6 hours ago, Saru said: You don't want everyone, everywhere relying on social media monopolies from which they can be restricted or banned at a moment's notice. No, you're right, I don't, and that's not happening now on "X" now that Musk owns it, because he has reinstated accounts of people like Donald Trump, who were banned at a moments notice when it was Twitter. 6 hours ago, Saru said: Also regarding "free speech", I only mentioned it because I was responding to your use of the term with a rhetorical question. Yes, you asked me "Does the dominance of privately owned social media platforms not represent a threat to freedom of speech ?" and again I ask, how on earth is it a threat to freedom of speech exactly, when anyone can have an "X" account, including Donald Trump, whose account was banned when it was formerly Twitter? If anything, "X" is now a model of freedom of speech, unlike the EU, who obviously thinks only one side of the debate is allowed free speech. 6 hours ago, Saru said: No online community-driven social media platform offers true "free speech". I have never claimed that it does, but the EU's alternative of attacking free speech by trying to shut the debate down just because it has decided certain content is "harmful" in their opinion is the exact opposite of offering true "free speech", because that's the sort of thing Communist China gets up to, but I notice you don't seem to have a hate on for that. 6 hours ago, Saru said: The comment you quoted was not a strawman, I did not attack an argument that you didn't make, I posted a simple statement of fact. Except it's not a statement of fact though is it, because if the EU decides certain content is "harmful" in their opinion, and they decide to shut the debate down, how am I not forced to pay attention to what the EU is doing? 6 hours ago, Saru said: What is posted on Twitter impacts everyone in all corners of the globe - sometimes very negatively. Look at what happened with the recent riots - fake claims spread on Twitter helped to fan the flames and make things a lot worse. And I have never claimed that it doesn't, but that also happened before Musk owned Twitter, just look at the BLM and defund the police riots that swept across the globe a few years ago, Twitter helped to fan the flames of that and made things a lot worse. https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/06/10/blacklivesmatter-surges-on-twitter-after-george-floyds-death/ 6 hours ago, Saru said: "Community Notes" is a crowd-sourced moderation system, it is not an equivalent of the checks that Twitter previously had in place. It also seems to be rather limited in its effectiveness. There are other changes too, such as loosening the content guidelines on offensive postings, hate speech etc. Yeah, because those guidelines on offensive postings, hate speech etc. worked so well during the BLM/defund the police riots eh. 6 hours ago, Saru said: And let us not forget the fact that one of the most prominent sources of false information these days is Elon Musk himself who is not subject to any of these checks. Again, that goes back to one of my original points, isn't it strange how when the pre-Musk era Twitter was a left leaning platform the mantra was that it was a privately owned company and could do what it likes. Now all of a sudden, it can't. Edited August 13 by Destination Unknown 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted August 14 #22 Share Posted August 14 10 hours ago, Destination Unknown said: No, you're right, I don't, and that's not happening now on "X" now that Musk owns it, because he has reinstated accounts of people like Donald Trump, who were banned at a moments notice when it was Twitter. It happens on every major social media platform on a daily basis for a wide range of reasons (or none at all), the reinstating of a few high profile accounts doesn't change that. Quote Yes, you asked me "Does the dominance of privately owned social media platforms not represent a threat to freedom of speech ?" and again I ask, how on earth is it a threat to freedom of speech exactly, when anyone can have an "X" account, including Donald Trump, whose account was banned when it was formerly Twitter? If anything, "X" is now a model of freedom of speech If you read that again I said "the dominance of privately owned social media platforms" - I didn't say that X, in particular, was a threat to freedom of speech. Quote because that's the sort of thing Communist China gets up to, but I notice you don't seem to have a hate on for that. What a strange comment. I could just as easily ask you why you don't have a "hate on" for censorship in North Korea. We're not discussing Communist China, so why would I be talking about it ? Quote Except it's not a statement of fact though is it, because if the EU decides certain content is "harmful" in their opinion, and they decide to shut the debate down, how am I not forced to pay attention to what the EU is doing? You no longer live in the EU, so any blocks that may be implemented by the EU will not impact what you can and can't watch. Quote Yeah, because those guidelines on offensive postings, hate speech etc. worked so well during the BLM/defund the police riots eh. How do you know how much worse it would have been if those blocks hadn't been in place or whether the current checks would have done any better ? 10 hours ago, Destination Unknown said: Again, that goes back to one of my original points, isn't it strange how when the pre-Musk era Twitter was a left leaning platform the mantra was that it was a privately owned company and could do what it likes Perhaps we should try to establish whether this is actually true. Do you have a source for the EU stating that pre-Musk Twitter could do anything it likes because it's privately owned ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pellinore Posted August 14 #23 Share Posted August 14 12 hours ago, Destination Unknown said: Again, that goes back to one of my original points, isn't it strange how when the pre-Musk era Twitter was a left leaning platform the mantra was that it was a privately owned company and could do what it likes. Now all of a sudden, it can't. Pre-Musk Twitter carried out self-moderation and didn't promote conspiracy theories or incite civil war. Nothing to do with being left or right wing. It has only come under scrutiny now because it has started promoting harmful content. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pellinore Posted August 14 #24 Share Posted August 14 (edited) An interesting development. Elon Musk and JK Rowling could face five-year prison terms and fines of up to £214,000 if Paris 2024 Olympics boxer Imane Khelif wins her case against them - after she included the pair in a criminal 'cyber-bullying' lawsuit. Tech billionaire Musk and Harry Potter author Rowling were among the high-profile figures leading the outcry about Khelif taking part in this summer's Games at which the Algerian fighter won gold. Now Khelif has filed a lawsuit to French authorities alleging 'acts of aggravated cyber harassment' - and the potential penalties at stake have now been revealed, as well as the prospect of yet more famous names being targeted. Elon Musk and JK Rowling could be handed five-year prison sentences and fined up to £214,000 if Olympic boxer Imane Khelif wins criminal cyberbullying case | Daily Mail Online Edited August 14 by pellinore 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destination Unknown Posted August 14 #25 Share Posted August 14 (edited) 15 hours ago, Saru said: It happens on every major social media platform on a daily basis for a wide range of reasons (or none at all), the reinstating of a few high profile accounts doesn't change that. So where was your faux outrage when those accounts were banned at a moments notice when it was Twitter then? 15 hours ago, Saru said: If you read that again I said "the dominance of privately owned social media platforms" - I didn't say that X, in particular, was a threat to freedom of speech. But if you read the whole thread again, we are discussing "X" in particular. That's what the whole thread is about. 15 hours ago, Saru said: What a strange comment. I could just as easily ask you why you don't have a "hate on" for censorship in North Korea. We're not discussing Communist China, so why would I be talking about it ? Full marks for deliberately cropping part of what was originally a much larger comment and using the cropped bit to change the context of what I meant. You know full well the reason that I mentioned Communist China was because I was equating what the EU is doing (ie, trying to shut something down they don't like), as being the exact same thing that Communist China does. If you can't see the parallels, then maybe you need to read that again.!! 15 hours ago, Saru said: You no longer live in the EU, so any blocks that may be implemented by the EU will not impact what you can and can't watch. I'm well aware that I no longer live in the EU, but TwoTierKeir is hell-bent on aligning us as close as possible to Brussels, so how can you say for certain that any blocks that may be implemented by the EU will not impact what I can and can't watch in the future? 15 hours ago, Saru said: How do you know how much worse it would have been if those blocks hadn't been in place or whether the current checks would have done any better ? I don't, but equally, you don't know either. 15 hours ago, Saru said: Perhaps we should try to establish whether this is actually true. Do you have a source for the EU stating that pre-Musk Twitter could do anything it likes because it's privately owned ? Even the EU Commission is now trying to distance itself from Thierry Breton's letter to Elon Musk, accusing him of going rogue. https://www.ft.com/content/09cf4713-7199-4e47-a373-ed5de61c2afa Edited August 14 by Destination Unknown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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