Jews were Exiles from Crete

[The Puzzler]

1 minute ago, cormac mac airt said:

And the relevant haplotypes of the greater MtDNA Haplogroup K are relatively negligible in quantity to the whole. Doesn’t leave you with much of a point. 
 

cormac

It’s not my point, take it up with the people who did the testing

that the Ashkenazi are more similar to the Cretans than to the two Levantine Semiticpopulations.

[cormac mac airt]

2 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

It’s not my point, take it up with the people who did the testing

that the Ashkenazi are more similar to the Cretans than to the two Levantine Semiticpopulations.

Nothing to take up. Ashkenazi Jews specifically only date to the first millennium AD making them irrelevant to the origins of the Jews. 
 

cormac

[Kenemet]

2 hours ago, The Puzzler said:

It’s not my point, take it up with the people who did the testing

that the Ashkenazi are more similar to the Cretans than to the two Levantine Semiticpopulations.

Because the Jewish families who lived on Crete (here's a Jewish source on this https://www.etz-hayyim-hania.org/the-jews-of-crete/the-history-of-the-jews-of-crete/#:~:text=The Jewish presence in Crete,%2C that is%2C culturally Greek.) came there after 300 BC.  By the time that the war occurred that pushed the Jewish families out of Crete, they'd lived in Crete for over 400 years.

Although Jewish groups generally marry only other Jews, this isn't a mandate.  Many of them must have married people from Crete and brought them into the Jewish faith.

So we're not talking about something ancient.  They were apparently part of the group of families who went to work in Egypt under the Persians (at the earliest, 500-600 BC), then moved to Crete and lived there for several hundred years, got caught up in a war, moved around Europe for awhile (after 200 AD -- and at this time marrying outside the faith was not as well tolerated), and formed their own sub-sect of Judaism around 1000 AD (and marrying outside the faith at that time was pretty much forbidden.)

Edited August 25 by Kenemet

[Jon101]

Thank you to Piney, Cormac and Kenemet for replying to this topic. 

I think this is yet another attempt to rather shallowly suggest that 'The Jews' are a people from other than those modern, disputed, lands. 

 

[The Puzzler]

8 hours ago, Kenemet said:

Because the Jewish families who lived on Crete (here's a Jewish source on this https://www.etz-hayyim-hania.org/the-jews-of-crete/the-history-of-the-jews-of-crete/#:~:text=The Jewish presence in Crete,%2C that is%2C culturally Greek.) came there after 300 BC.  By the time that the war occurred that pushed the Jewish families out of Crete, they'd lived in Crete for over 400 years.

Although Jewish groups generally marry only other Jews, this isn't a mandate.  Many of them must have married people from Crete and brought them into the Jewish faith.

So we're not talking about something ancient.  They were apparently part of the group of families who went to work in Egypt under the Persians (at the earliest, 500-600 BC), then moved to Crete and lived there for several hundred years, got caught up in a war, moved around Europe for awhile (after 200 AD -- and at this time marrying outside the faith was not as well tolerated), and formed their own sub-sect of Judaism around 1000 AD (and marrying outside the faith at that time was pretty much forbidden.)

OK I’ll take it onboard.

[Abramelin]

Haven't read everything yet, or clicked on all the posted links, but...

It is almost certain that the Philistines came from Crete, and settled on the west coast of what is now Israel. It were probably males only, and after several centuries of 'contact' with the Canaanite women, they became indistingishable from the Canaanites surrounding them. That's concerning culture, language, religion and genetics.

So you can say that part of the Canaanites, here Hebrews, originally came from Crete.

[Piney]

53 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

Haven't read everything yet, or clicked on all the posted links, but...

It is almost certain that the Philistines came from Crete, and settled on the west coast of what is now Israel. It were probably males only, and after several centuries of 'contact' with the Canaanite women, they became indistingishable from the Canaanites surrounding them. That's concerning culture, language, religion and genetics.

So you can say that part of the Canaanites, here Hebrews, originally came from Crete.

There were also the Greek Romaniote. Who lived in Greece since about 500 BC and created a lot of back and forth gene swapping with Palestinian ones. 

[Coil]

On 8/25/2024 at 1:50 PM, The Puzzler said:

I just can’t get past this…“It is said that the Jews were originally exiles from the island of Crete who settled in the farthest parts of Libya at the time when Saturn had been deposed and expelled by Jove.

 

There is a point of view of Blavatsky that Jews are a very long time ago separated (or exiled) people of Hindus, just like Gypsies. Jews are characterized by strong faith and mysticism and Hindus have this too.

[The Jews] are a tribe descended from the Chandala of India, from outcasts, many of whom were ex-Brahmins who had sought refuge in Chaldea, Sind and Arya (Iran), and were, in fact, born of their father A-Brahm (Non-Brahmin), about 8000 years B.C.

The reason for the difference in the views of these two races is easily explained. The Hindu-Aryan belongs to the oldest Race now on Earth; the Jew-Semite to the latest. The former has behind it an antiquity of about a million years; the latter is a small sub-race, having behind it not more than 8000 years.

Strictly speaking, the Jews are an artificial Aryan race, born in India, and belong to the Caucasian subdivision. No one who is familiar with the Armenians and the Parsees will fail to recognize in these three the same Aryan, Caucasian type.

As Professor W. G. Flower rightly put it in 1885: “I cannot help the conclusion so often reached by different anthropologists, that primitive man, whoever he may be, has in the course of ages been divided into three extreme types, represented by the Caucasian peoples of Europe, the Mongols of Asia, and the Ethiopians of Africa, and that all the existing individuals of these genera may be distributed around these types.

[Ell]

There are various populations that have a high frequency of inherited genetic diseases - and I suspect also high percentages of sociopaths, psychopaths, narcissists and other mentally incomplete minds. Most populations that practise the sexual perversion of the circumcision of the penis appear to be such afflicted populations.

If there lived such sexual perverts on Crete, their high frequency of psychological aberrations was likely the reason they were expelled from the island. 

Edited August 27 by Ell

[The Puzzler]

23 hours ago, Abramelin said:

Haven't read everything yet, or clicked on all the posted links, but...

It is almost certain that the Philistines came from Crete, and settled on the west coast of what is now Israel. It were probably males only, and after several centuries of 'contact' with the Canaanite women, they became indistingishable from the Canaanites surrounding them. That's concerning culture, language, religion and genetics.

So you can say that part of the Canaanites, here Hebrews, originally came from Crete.

I’ll check the timeframe again of the DNA testing I quoted….

Article….https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3806353/

The Hebrews were a sect of Canaanites…people cannot say oh the Hebrew (Jews) were not because they were Canaanite…

Am I not Australian because I’m English…?

I know you’re not totally agreeing with me, but can see the implications, Its a certainty.

Edited August 27 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

3 hours ago, Coil said:

 

There is a point of view of Blavatsky that Jews are a very long time ago separated (or exiled) people of Hindus, just like Gypsies. Jews are characterized by strong faith and mysticism and Hindus have this too.

[The Jews] are a tribe descended from the Chandala of India, from outcasts, many of whom were ex-Brahmins who had sought refuge in Chaldea, Sind and Arya (Iran), and were, in fact, born of their father A-Brahm (Non-Brahmin), about 8000 years B.C.

The reason for the difference in the views of these two races is easily explained. The Hindu-Aryan belongs to the oldest Race now on Earth; the Jew-Semite to the latest. The former has behind it an antiquity of about a million years; the latter is a small sub-race, having behind it not more than 8000 years.

Strictly speaking, the Jews are an artificial Aryan race, born in India, and belong to the Caucasian subdivision. No one who is familiar with the Armenians and the Parsees will fail to recognize in these three the same Aryan, Caucasian type.

As Professor W. G. Flower rightly put it in 1885: “I cannot help the conclusion so often reached by different anthropologists, that primitive man, whoever he may be, has in the course of ages been divided into three extreme types, represented by the Caucasian peoples of Europe, the Mongols of Asia, and the Ethiopians of Africa, and that all the existing individuals of these genera may be distributed around these types.

Aristotle quotes the Jewish priests  come from India, yes

And elsewhere another ancient writer quoted of Egypt sent priests to Susa…

 We know less than my pinky finger what was going on with this priestly class…

Edited August 27 by The Puzzler

[Alchopwn]

On 8/25/2024 at 11:50 PM, The Puzzler said:

“It is said that the Jews were originally exiles from the island of Crete

Oh no, they were ex-Creted.

[The Puzzler]

22 minutes ago, Alchopwn said:

Oh no, they were ex-Creted.

Like they always have been….

Two of the four graves in Mycenae show mtDNA aligning with Ashkenazi Jews. K

Edited August 27 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

Catholicism and Christianity and Islam are all offshoots of Abraham and the original worship of one God, Yahweh,….who even, maybe the Aten…or a Hittite weather God…or a fabrication of El…or Allah, we just don’t know..what we see is a distinction to rid the people of a Bull cult and a later worship in Catholicism of the Mother, Mary and Christianity of Jesus and Islam as Allah.

Its all the same, always was, just branches. 

The bringing of the Mater to Rome, was to bring its downfall…the cult of Serapis in Egypt and who, strangely, says Wiki, Alexander swore oath to in Babylon on his death bed…was really Christianity before it became a thing, in the days they ripped the skin of Hypatia and Christians burned down her library. Probably that what happened to the library of Hattusus and any others….

Edited August 27 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

On 8/26/2024 at 11:20 AM, Jon101 said:

Thank you to Piney, Cormac and Kenemet for replying to this topic. 

I think this is yet another attempt to rather shallowly suggest that 'The Jews' are a people from other than those modern, disputed, lands. 

 

I’ll get my pom poms out. 

[The Puzzler]

Perseus flies over Aethiopia…saving Anromeda…

This place is now said to be at Joppa.

Oh right, after he leaves Western Africa, where the temple of Athena is, with Medusa, Poseidon and the wisest women of all…

Notice, the ships are actually leaving Crete…

Where they going….? With white robed priestly men on board…

The real Exodus.

Is this why Crete in the Minoan Age fell, they exiled their priestly class (Jewish) and succumbed to an unruly, immoral Mycenaean class of people.

Why Greece itself fell. What Plato tells us is exactly what happened.

[Abramelin]

1 hour ago, The Puzzler said:

I’ll check the timeframe again of the DNA testing I quoted….

Article….https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3806353/

This is the title of your thread:

"Jews were Exiles from Crete

Diodorus says…."

What I said about the Philistines coming from Crete and settling in coastal Israel started around 1200 bce.

Your Ashkenazy come many centuries later, and much later than Tacitus anyway.

[The Puzzler]

7 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

This is the title of your thread:

"Jews were Exiles from Crete

Diodorus says…."

What I said about the Philistines coming from Crete and settling in coastal Israel started around 1200 bce.

Your Ashkenazy come many centuries later, and much later than Tacitus anyway.

Yes..

Other posts distract me easily.

[The Puzzler]

So, the exiles from Crete….who became Jews, do not strike me as Philistines…but

If the story of David and Goliath is just a moralistic tale, well, that can work…

Davids tribe overcame the Philistine tribe..both same people from the Aegean….how interesting.

”Most scholars agree that the Philistines were of Greek origin, and that they came from Crete and the rest of the Aegean Islands….”

Edited August 27 by The Puzzler

[Piney]

9 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

So, the exiles from Crete….who became Jews, do not strike me as Philistines…but

If the story of David and Goliath is just a moralistic tale, well, that can work…

Davids tribe overcame the Philistine tribe..both same people from the Aegean….how interesting.

”Most scholars agree that the Philistines were of Greek origin, and that they came from Crete and the rest of the Aegean Islands….”

The Jews developed in-situ in the hills of Canaan. The Philistines just happened to be a people they and other Canaanites absorbed.

[Abramelin]

12 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

So, the exiles from Crete….who became Jews, do not strike me as Philistines…but

Read again my first post in this thread.

[Antigonos]

26 minutes ago, Abramelin said:

 

quote mistake

14 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

 

”Most scholars agree that the Philistines were of Greek origin, and that they came from Crete and the rest of the Aegean Islands….”

This is true.

Edited August 27 by Antigonos

[Abramelin]

1 minute ago, Antigonos said:

 

This is true.

Ok, I missed the part where Puzz said it herself.

[The Puzzler]

5 minutes ago, Piney said:

The Jews developed in-situ in the hills of Canaan. The Philistines just happened to be a people they and other Canaanites absorbed.

I don’t buy this….developed in situ in the hills of Canaan. 

[Antigonos]

1 minute ago, Abramelin said:

Ok, I missed the part where Puzz said it herself.

No I literally quoted you by mistake before I quoted Puzzler lol. Just wrote that so you weren’t wondering why it was blank