King Arthur left an ancient trail across Britain. Experts say it offers clues about the truth behind

[docyabut2]

https://www.cnn.com/travel/king-arthur-tintagel-wales-cornwall-celtic-britain/index.html

[Abramelin]

On 11/16/2024 at 11:25 PM, docyabut2 said:

https://www.cnn.com/travel/king-arthur-tintagel-wales-cornwall-celtic-britain/index.html

I think King Arthur is as real as Plato's Atlantis. Or Bigfoot. Or Nessie.

[+DieChecker]

Thing with King Arthur is just about any local warlord in British history has a few traits that match, and can be lumped into the mythos.

[The Puzzler]

On 11/19/2024 at 8:02 AM, Abramelin said:

I think King Arthur is as real as Plato's Atlantis. Or Bigfoot. Or Nessie.

King Arthur, with Guinevere, Vanessa Redgrave, Atlantis, be still my time lord heart, Nessie, many people call me that, shortened from Vanessa of course,! and I do have quite big feet for my size, I have a stupid long big toe which makes me a size 8 shoe…like…so yeah..

This topic could be quite interesting and very real, once I get over all that…

Edited November 20, 2024 by The Puzzler

[cormac mac airt]

Top two contenders for King Arthur in my book are Rigotamos and Owain Ddantgwyn. 
 

To add: with Einion Yrth as a contender for Uther Pendragon. 😁

cormac

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

There’s also a lot of unsurprisingly appropriated by Christian missionaries symbolism from Irish mythology in the Arthur legends (like shining, invincible swords).

[The Puzzler]

There was a show on like the History Channel recently, a round table was found, in like some castle….but it wasn’t Arthurs, downer, I know, I watched the whole show then was really let down….

[The Puzzler]

On 11/21/2024 at 2:10 AM, cormac mac airt said:

Top two contenders for King Arthur in my book are Rigotamos and Owain Ddantgwyn. 
 

To add: with Einion Yrth as a contender for Uther Pendragon. 😁

cormac

Very good, I think you could be right there.
Since cormac gave no link, here it is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riothamus (not saying I’m not guilty of the no link procedure) 

(Ri) probably Latin….Oath-er….def Anglo…mus…back to Latin, it’s a Latised use of the name Arthur…imo.

He is called "King of the Britons" by the 6th-century historian Jordanes, but the extent of his realm is unclear. Some Arthurian scholars identify Riothamus as one of the possible sources of the legendary King Arthur.

Edited November 22, 2024 by The Puzzler

[Abramelin]

Long ago we also discussed the Alans/Alani, a Sarmatian tribe from Iran, as a possible source for the legend of king Arthur.

They had a thing with swords in stone, and dragons. They spread all over Europe from east to west.

https://iranicaonline.org/articles/alans-an-ancient-iranian-tribe-of-the-northern-scythian-saka-sarmatian-massagete-group-known-to-classical-writers-from

Edited November 22, 2024 by Abramelin

[Piney]

18 hours ago, Abramelin said:

Long ago we also discussed the Alans/Alani, a Sarmatian tribe from Iran, as a possible source for the legend of king Arthur.

They had a thing with swords in stone, and dragons. They spread all over Europe from east to west.

https://iranicaonline.org/articles/alans-an-ancient-iranian-tribe-of-the-northern-scythian-saka-sarmatian-massagete-group-known-to-classical-writers-from

That was Atilla Joseph and another guy in Hungary then they made the Clive Owen movie. 

[Piney]

18 hours ago, Abramelin said:

Long ago we also discussed the Alans/Alani, a Sarmatian tribe from Iran, as a possible source for the legend of king Arthur.

They had a thing with swords in stone, and dragons. They spread all over Europe from east to west.

https://iranicaonline.org/articles/alans-an-ancient-iranian-tribe-of-the-northern-scythian-saka-sarmatian-massagete-group-known-to-classical-writers-from

They weren't from Iran. They were from the Yellow River area and spoke Eastern Iranian. Not Western 

They later became the Ossetians in the Caucasus and the Jazi in Hungary. A smaller group adopted Slavic and became the Croats.

A small group also settled Normandy.

[The Puzzler]

King Arthur may be a lot older than he seems….with Merlin the Magician building Stonehenge…many fairy tales are ages older than the common telling of them.

Edited November 25, 2024 by The Puzzler

[Piney]

On 11/25/2024 at 2:26 AM, The Puzzler said:

King Arthur may be a lot older than he seems….with Merlin the Magician building Stonehenge…many fairy tales are ages older than the common telling of them.

Merlin building Stonehenge isn't. It's Medieval. 

[The Puzzler]

13 minutes ago, Piney said:

Merlin building Stonehenge isn't. It's Medieval. 

Quick Google search paste….bit tired, worked tonight, anyway..

I know it’s Medieval…but since these POETS recorded it, imo, again, the origins might be older and have true roots in the times Stonehenge was built….

Historians and poets wove the mysterious circle into their tales of King Arthur, with one lushly illustrated book depicting the wizard Merlin as the architect. The manuscript is a 14th-century edition of Roman de Brut, a literary history written in verse by the poet Wace in the 12th century.

 

An Exquisite Medieval Manuscript Shows Merlin Building ...

[cormac mac airt]

9 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

Quick Google search paste….bit tired, worked tonight, anyway..

I know it’s Medieval…but since these POETS recorded it, imo, again, the origins might be older and have true roots in the times Stonehenge was built….

Historians and poets wove the mysterious circle into their tales of King Arthur, with one lushly illustrated book depicting the wizard Merlin as the architect. The manuscript is a 14th-century edition of Roman de Brut, a literary history written in verse by the poet Wace in the 12th century.

 

An Exquisite Medieval Manuscript Shows Merlin Building ...

Unlikely as there is no evidence that the story of Merlin or King Arthur significantly precedes the 6th century, Merlin having more in common with Myrddin Wyllt and Arthur having more in common with Rigotamos and Owain Ddantgwyn. Trying to place Merlin at the beginning of Stonehenge is pretty much akin to a pious fraud. 
 

cormac

[Abramelin]

24 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

Quick Google search paste….bit tired, worked tonight, anyway..

I know it’s Medieval…but since these POETS recorded it, imo, again, the origins might be older and have true roots in the times Stonehenge was built….

Historians and poets wove the mysterious circle into their tales of King Arthur, with one lushly illustrated book depicting the wizard Merlin as the architect. The manuscript is a 14th-century edition of Roman de Brut, a literary history written in verse by the poet Wace in the 12th century.

 

An Exquisite Medieval Manuscript Shows Merlin Building ...

Radiocarbon dating of the site indicates that the building of the monument at the site began around the year 3100 BC and ended around the year 1600 BC. This allows the elimination of a few of the theories that have been presented. The theory that the Druids were responsible may be the most popular one; however, the Celtic society that spawned the Druid priesthood came into being only after the year 300 BC. Additionally, the Druids are unlikely to have used the site for sacrifices, because they performed the majority of their rituals in the woods or mountains, areas better suited for "earth rituals" than an open field.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theories_about_Stonehenge

 

[The Puzzler]

Of relevance to the interpretation of early belief systems associated with Stonehenge is the work of W A Cummings. In his book "King Arthur's Place in Prehistory - The Great Age of Stonehenge" (1992) Dr Cummings looks at ancient writings in order to provide clues to determining the role of King Arthur but more importantly for this debate, in evaluating the religious role of the structure. In particular Geoffrey of Monmouth's "Historia Regum Britanniae" of 1136 is revisited and this leads to clues about a prehistory age that had previously been recorded by word of mouth. Such works as "Historia Brittonum" by Nennius and "Annales Cambriae" or Gildas in "De Excidio Britonum" all add flesh to the bones of interpreting in modern terms the role of Stonehenge as a commanding religious centre for a dispersed society. The ancient Greek connection between the Hyperboreans (British) is debated and concludes a regular dialogue existed. This in turn leads to the link between the two locations on issues such as the cult of Apollo and the related oracular belief system. In fact it is suggested that the Hyperboreans introduced the Greeks to the worship of Apollo. A magnificent temple and sacred precinct to Apollo existed in Britain possibly referring to Stonehenge or the Temple of Ambrius as it was known in prehistory. Cummings then goes on to debate the creation and ultimate demise of Stonehenge, the role of Merlin the architect and the rise and fall of Wessex Culture. 

https://www.osborne.house/profilego.asp?ref=283B3139

[cormac mac airt]

52 minutes ago, The Puzzler said:

Of relevance to the interpretation of early belief systems associated with Stonehenge is the work of W A Cummings. In his book "King Arthur's Place in Prehistory - The Great Age of Stonehenge" (1992) Dr Cummings looks at ancient writings in order to provide clues to determining the role of King Arthur but more importantly for this debate, in evaluating the religious role of the structure. In particular Geoffrey of Monmouth's "Historia Regum Britanniae" of 1136 is revisited and this leads to clues about a prehistory age that had previously been recorded by word of mouth. Such works as "Historia Brittonum" by Nennius and "Annales Cambriae" or Gildas in "De Excidio Britonum" all add flesh to the bones of interpreting in modern terms the role of Stonehenge as a commanding religious centre for a dispersed society. The ancient Greek connection between the Hyperboreans (British) is debated and concludes a regular dialogue existed. This in turn leads to the link between the two locations on issues such as the cult of Apollo and the related oracular belief system. In fact it is suggested that the Hyperboreans introduced the Greeks to the worship of Apollo. A magnificent temple and sacred precinct to Apollo existed in Britain possibly referring to Stonehenge or the Temple of Ambrius as it was known in prehistory. Cummings then goes on to debate the creation and ultimate demise of Stonehenge, the role of Merlin the architect and the rise and fall of Wessex Culture. 

https://www.osborne.house/profilego.asp?ref=283B3139

Mario Dantas is trying to promote his hypothesis on Atlantis again, it’s just as real as the connection between Stonehenge and Arthur or Merlin. 😁

cormac

[The Puzzler]

41 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

Mario Dantas is trying to promote his hypothesis on Atlantis again, it’s just as real as the connection between Stonehenge and Arthur or Merlin. 😁

cormac

Seemingly…

(Origins of King Arthur, A Hero of the Bronze Age)

 

Edited November 27, 2024 by The Puzzler

[jethrofloyd]

I wonder what would King Arthur think of Robin Hood?

[The Puzzler]

After reading a lot on Merlin etc last night, it does seem hard to place the main story back to Stonehenge, more like the writers attributed it to Merlin because they themselves didn’t realise Stonehenge was so old at that time.

However, my eyes are still open to the plot being older….

[jethrofloyd]

What's yours thoughts guys on the ''King Arthur's Stone'' table? A supposed to be a thousand years older than Stonehenge, the Neolithic monument is said to be the place where King Arthur slew a giant.

[The Puzzler]

2 hours ago, jethrofloyd said:

What's yours thoughts guys on the ''King Arthur's Stone'' table? A supposed to be a thousand years older than Stonehenge, the Neolithic monument is said to be the place where King Arthur slew a giant.

My thoughts is……oh

Do you have a link for the slew a giant story?

Edited November 28, 2024 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]

Let’s imagine, for a moment, a blind bard wrote a story about a city, round indeed….built, by Poseidon and oh, Apollo, a defensive wall, that shouldn’t have broken, except in the case of treachery…..that apparently happened on such a realistic scale it was believed to be true….but no evidence of the story, in reality can be found….

Ill just get my shovel now…

Edited November 28, 2024 by The Puzzler

[The Puzzler]