USAID order to delete classified records sparks flurry of litigation

[+OverSword]

Quote

 

U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID) employees and outside groups are fighting an order from the agency’s leadership to shred and burn its classified documents as well as personnel records.

An email obtained by The Hill sent by USAID’s acting executive secretary instructs remaining employees at the dismantled agencies to “shred as many documents as possible first, and reserve the burn bags for when the shredder becomes unavailable or needs a break.”

The move alarmed those fighting to restore the agency — who stressed the destruction could run afoul of public records laws and hinder any efforts to rehire employees.

It has also raised questions over whether it will impact the ability of the public to scrutinize the role the Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) played at USAID.

 

Link

 

Edited March 12 by OverSword

[pellinore]

It is such a tragedy that there is no legal mechanism to stop Musk and Trump trashing the US. If this goes on much longer (it has only been a month) the USA will be on life-support.

[+Link of Hyrule]

12 minutes ago, pellinore said:

It is such a tragedy that there is no legal mechanism to stop Musk and Trump trashing the US. If this goes on much longer (it has only been a month) the USA will be on life-support.

So tragic that a democracy makes democratic choices, if only there was a way to thwart the will of the people (edit: I originally had a laugh emoji, but I don't know whether it's a laughing or crying matter - you're literally advocating the death of democracy because you don't like the decisions people made). 

Edited March 12 by Link of Hyrule

[pellinore]

4 minutes ago, Link of Hyrule said:

So tragic that a democracy makes democratic choices, if only there was a way to thwart the will of the people (edit: I originally had a laugh emoji, but I don't know whether it's a laughing or crying matter - you're literally advocating the death of democracy because you don't like the decisions people made). 

Democracy and Populism are quite different. Democracy is governing by the 'will of the people' through legal mechanisms; and Populism is governing by the 'will of the people'- but they are very different and not knowing the difference is dangerous.

[+and-then]

Once these issues have been litigated, and if the clear law is upheld regarding the preservation of government documents, the employees and their chain of command responsible for the actual physical destruction of these records, need to face trial.  The Left in DC has gotten quite casual about simply "losing" or even refusing to provide documents to anyone outside their party.  FBI/DOJ are some of the worst.  ONE law for all or NO law for any.

[+OverSword]

14 minutes ago, pellinore said:

Democracy and Populism are quite different. Democracy is governing by the 'will of the people' through legal mechanisms; and Populism is governing by the 'will of the people'- but they are very different and not knowing the difference is dangerous.

You may be right but I'm not feeling very doomed yet.  My entire life I've been calling for smaller government and less regulation and for the first time someone is doing something about it.  It may not be how I envisioned but it's a start.

[+and-then]

16 minutes ago, pellinore said:

governing by the 'will of the people' through legal mechanisms

Who is stopping them from legal challenges?  As long as the bench's rulings are respected or overturned, we are going through the "legal mechanisms".

[+OverSword]

1 minute ago, and-then said:

Once these issues have been litigated, and if the clear law is upheld regarding the preservation of government documents, the employees and their chain of command responsible for the actual physical destruction of these records, need to face trial.  The Left in DC has gotten quite casual about simply "losing" or even refusing to provide documents to anyone outside their party.  FBI/DOJ are some of the worst.  ONE law for all or NO law for any.

Read the article, I think it's the administration that is responsible for the mass destruction of physical documents.

[+and-then]

1 minute ago, OverSword said:

It may not be how I envisioned but it's a start.

I agree and I also believe that his administration will respect any legal rulings, just as he did in his first term.  What we're witnessing here is the panic of the party that is out of power.  That party set a lot of precedents over the last few years and they finally seem to be realizing that it can bite them in the backside, as well.

[+OverSword]

1 minute ago, and-then said:

I agree and I also believe that his administration will respect any legal rulings, just as he did in his first term.  What we're witnessing here is the panic of the party that is out of power.  That party set a lot of precedents over the last few years and they finally seem to be realizing that it can bite them in the backside, as well.

I bet they're thankful they didn't get rid of the filibuster and will not bring that up again next time they are in charge. 

[+and-then]

5 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Read the article, I think it's the administration that is responsible for the mass destruction of physical documents.

From the article:

“The removed classified documents had nothing to do with this litigation. They were copies of documents from other agencies or derivatively classified documents, where the originally classified document is retained by another government agency and for which there is no need for USAID to retain a copy.”

The White House has said USAID’s move out of the Ronald Reagan Building spurred the need to destroy the records, saying all physical records have still been maintained electronically.

Whoever is responsible for this had better be sure that there are electronic copies, or they should be held legally accountable.  As I said earlier, one law for all or no law for any.

[+and-then]

3 minutes ago, OverSword said:

I bet they're thankful they didn't get rid of the filibuster and will not bring that up again next time they are in charge. 

I agree, and I think the only ones who were serious about that were members who were silly enough to believe they'd never be out of power again.  Harry Reid is more responsible for the overturning of Roe v. Wade than Trump is.  He refused to allow the opposition to slow walk Obama's appointments and decided to go nuclear.  

[Tatetopa]

6 minutes ago, and-then said:

As I said earlier, one law for all or no law for any.

Boy I would love to see that.  I choose one law. Which do you choose?

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

3 hours ago, Link of Hyrule said:

So tragic that a democracy makes democratic choices, if only there was a way to thwart the will of the people (edit: I originally had a laugh emoji, but I don't know whether it's a laughing or crying matter - you're literally advocating the death of democracy because you don't like the decisions people made). 

Who voted for Musk and his Chainsaw on Democracy? 

[Dejarma]

3 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Who voted for Musk

musk deer

[+Link of Hyrule]

46 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Who voted for Musk and his Chainsaw on Democracy? 

Musk isn't an elected official. 77 million people voted for Trump. Trump has the authority to appoint Musk to the position that he did. Therefore the premise of your question is faulty. Additionally, embedded in your question is an assumption that Musk has taken a chainsaw to democracy, which is also a faulty premise. So faulty premises stacked on top of faulty premises.

Ultimately the American people voted for this. If they don't like the choices they made they can vote again in 2028. That's the beauty of democracy.  

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

1 hour ago, Link of Hyrule said:

Musk isn't an elected official. 77 million people voted for Trump. Trump has the authority to appoint Musk to the position that he did. Therefore the premise of your question is faulty. Additionally, embedded in your question is an assumption that Musk has taken a chainsaw to democracy, which is also a faulty premise. So faulty premises stacked on top of faulty premises.

Ultimately the American people voted for this. If they don't like the choices they made they can vote again in 2028. That's the beauty of democracy.  

America isn’t a democracy, it’s a constitutional republic. In that constitutional republic there are three co-equal arms of government, none of which sound like the word “dodgy” when said phonetically. 

[+Link of Hyrule]

6 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

America isn’t a democracy, it’s a constitutional republic. In that constitutional republic there are three co-equal arms of government, none of which sound like the word “dodgy” when said phonetically. 

Democracy or constitutional republic, Trump appointed Musk as was his constitutional right, and 77 million Americans voted for Trump. Spin it any way you like, call it "dodgy" if you like, those are facts, and facts don't care about your feelings, as the saying goes. 

[+and-then]

5 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

Boy I would love to see that.  I choose one law. Which do you choose?

The same as I always have - ONE law for everyone.  There was a distinct lack of that over the last four years.  Get enough people jaded about equal justice and it disappears and is replaced by true rebellion.

[+and-then]

2 hours ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Who voted for Musk and his Chainsaw on Democracy? 

No one.  It was unnecessary since he had no power vested in any office and only worked as an adviser.  Advisers have always been a part of government.  The Left gets pretty lazy with its indignation at times.  For example, Valerie Jarret served in the Obama administration for both terms and was instrumental in crafting Iran policy.  She never stood for election, nor did anyone raise hell about her role even though she was native born in Iran.

[+and-then]

35 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

America isn’t a democracy, it’s a constitutional republic. In that constitutional republic there are three co-equal arms of government, none of which sound like the word “dodgy” when said phonetically. 

Yes, there are three co-equal branches, and the judiciary is already being used to resist policy decisions just as it was in his first administration.  Disagreeing with the moves of a popularly elected POTUS is perfectly legal, but that doesn't mean they get veto power over those decisions by virtue of being angry.

[Golden Duck]

6 hours ago, Link of Hyrule said:

So tragic that a democracy makes democratic choices, if only there was a way to thwart the will of the people (edit: I originally had a laugh emoji, but I don't know whether it's a laughing or crying matter - you're literally advocating the death of democracy because you don't like the decisions people made). 

Deleting government records is poor governance. 

[Tatetopa]

1 hour ago, and-then said:

The same as I always have - ONE law for everyone.  There was a distinct lack of that over the last four years.  Get enough people jaded about equal justice and it disappears and is replaced by true rebellion.

Tha's good,  its even encouraging.

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

1 hour ago, and-then said:

Yes, there are three co-equal branches, and the judiciary is already being used to resist policy decisions just as it was in his first administration.  Disagreeing with the moves of a popularly elected POTUS is perfectly legal, but that doesn't mean they get veto power over those decisions by virtue of being angry.

No, they get veto power when he’s breaking the law. 

[preacherman76]

11 hours ago, pellinore said:

It is such a tragedy that there is no legal mechanism to stop Musk and Trump trashing the US. If this goes on much longer (it has only been a month) the USA will be on life-support.

LOL, so USAID is literally shredding documents so it can’t be held accountable, but it’s Trump and Musk who are destroying the country? 
 

Shredding documents in a panic can only mean one thing. People who do things in the dark, do it so the light won’t expose what they have done.