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JuneyGirl

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Sorry JuneyGirl but you are just way too deep into religion IMO. I don't think God would spare some and send others to hell because they were BORN with something diffrent. I don't think God would force us humans to obey such strict rules in any given situations.

Your only arguments are: it's against God, it's not natural and worst of all, they can't reproduce. So what? God Himself told you that it was against him? Oh what, the Bible? Sorry but this book is man-made so unless you proove me that God himself approves it all, I won't take it in consideration. Didn't you think that maby the Bible was altered by some influent people over the years so they could take better advantage of it? Think about it... it's been over 2000 years...

Who cares if they can't reproduce? It's not as if we were in danger of extinction and it's not as if there are 50% gay people on earth. Clones? Haha, I think you are getting paranoid a bit there... there are not more and more gays on earth, only more gays that go out of the closet. Finally people start to be tolerant...

I have no religion. My philosophy? Here it goes: Listen to yorself. Do what YOU like  in life. Don't force yourself to go against your feelings just to obey some rules or to please others. The only real rule there is is to respect others and to let them be as is, whatever they do or whoever/whatever they are. If you do this, you'll be happy and others will ba happy around you. If you keep telling poeple what's wrong and what's good by following some man-made books or such, chances are you won't be fully happy and some people might find this frustrating.

Simple eh? I'm happy with that and yet have no real ennemy.

Sorry if it sounds harsh but I hate it when people think they have the ultimate anwser... there are none, do what YOU like, RESPECT others and you'll be happy. No need to follow the Bible or such. I beleive in God but IMO he just want us to be happy and to respect eachother. That's all. I don't think he minds if you sleep with many girls/boys just for fun (or else he wouldn't have made us that way) or anything like that. As long as you respect others and are happy it's ok. Dosen't it make sense?

I thought only quebec had gay people?

Hahaha. Very funny... damn americans... Québec rocks... more than the USA at least... you haven't seen our woman haven't you? Nah you didn't *drools*.

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Sorry JuneyGirl but you are just way too deep into religion IMO. I don't think God would spare some and send others to hell because they were BORN with something diffrent. I don't think God would force us humans to obey such strict rules in any given situations.

Sin is Sin and I would say samething about adultery, lying.,, ect. It is not right and you all know it. Homosexuals know it to. Why it was in the closet so long.

Peace, JuneyGirl

Edited by JuneyGirl
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Ok, well can you tell me a positive thing?

if a "great man" contributes something wonderful to the betterment of society, does it matter whether his "soul-mate" is male or female?

homosexuals do contribute to society every day. just becuase you don't know they are gay does not mean they are not in society. since they are in society, contributing to society, is it not only fair that they be treated equally in society?

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Then I ask you the same question "how can homosexuality be good for society?" And I never said that you were a child molester.

How can it hurt it? Society is all about differences. If you don't learn to accept people for who they are, we'll continue to have all the violence, the hate crimes, wars, etc.

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Well, then my comment remains. Lets just let all the people do what they want and molest who they want. Why discriminate?

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Because molestation, violence, hate crimes, wars, and the etc, all are about hate, fear, anger. You're blowing it all out of proportion, as gays are out to kill straights or something. This is the main reason why I quit my beliefs in the Catholic Church, they act as though everything that is written in their little book is right, and everything else is wrong. Homosexuality isn't about any of that, they love each other.

You tell them that they sin, that they are bound to hell, so once your judgement condemns you, you'll see them there.

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Sin is Sin and I would say samething about adultery, lying.,, ect. It is not right and you all know it. Homosexuals know it to. Why it was in the closet so long.

And love is love. I'm sorry you feel the way you do. By the way I don't think it's wrong. Never have. And it was in the closet so long because we didn't want to be set on fire, or beaten to death, or tied up in the wilderness and left to die.

That really shows that love all kinda thing doesn't it?

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No way. A Catholic priest molesting boys?

I don't see what it has to do with our subject. But you're right. It happens...

Yes, and neither do I mean to offend God when I have pre-marital sex. But, it is a sin nonetheless. I just don't see why a union is necessary here.

Ok. So why is it such a sin? Because God supposedly said it?

Do you really want to talk about God and gays? All this will lead to is a flame war, and eventually I will be left alone trying to prove how God exists and then the thread will probably be closed.

I don't mind talking about God and gays. I won't flame you or disrespect you for the matter. I think we're having a good discussion actually... and BTW no need to proove God exist because first, you can't and second, I already beleive in him (don't know for others though).

So now we are going to talk about the bible? Please! God no!!

Actually you talked about it in the first place and in this very topic. That's why I'm saying this.

Well, thats fantastic. But which God do you believe in?

I love this question. I beleive in a God that forgives anyone and anything. I beleive in a God that loves us all. I don't beleive in a God that send people to hell. I don't beleive in a God that made us in such a way and then force us to obey rules that sometimes go against ourselves. and our feelings.

God loves everyone whether they are gay or not. I think all he really wants is us to be happy and respectfull. If making love with diffrent woman is what makes you happy, he won't care as long as everything is done respectfully.

Seriously, I prefer my vision of God over the traditionnal "obey the rules or else you go to hell". God is always there to support us whatever we do.

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All right, you're the one that brought that in.  Why?  I'm not talking about molestation.

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But you said why do we have to discriminate people with sexual preferences? A child molester has sexual preferences dont you think? Does he think what he does is wrong? Many do not.

I do want to know why, when the homosexual topic comes up, either bestiality or child molesters come up.

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Because people always bring up "why can't people have their own sexual right to do things?" Again, I'm not disputing the right for a person to be gay. I just wanted to know how a homosexual accepted world can benefit humans as a whole. I just want one reason.

It's like the safety argument for all those opposed.  You don't like homosexual marriage, then fine.  But the constant arguments that it's wrong and unnatural just don't make sense anymore.

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I'm not really disputing the fact that it could be natural. Just that I don't think its "nature-al".

I was born the way I was.  I don't think it's wrong and never will.  So like I said, I can't change your mind one way or the other. 

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Then I wish you the best of luck and hope you may live a life of complete happiness with whomever you chose to live with.

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Ok. So why is it such a sin? Because God supposedly said it?

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Again I ask...do you really want to talk about god in this matter? ( I was hoping we could discuss this matter from an atheist point of veiw).

I don't mind talking about God and gays. I won't flame you or disrespect you for the matter. I think we're having a good discussion actually... and BTW no need to proove God exist because first, you can't and second, I already beleive in him (don't know for others though).

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Ok thats cool. Its just that if we talk about God (and this subject) it will go nowhere.

Actually you talked about it in the first place and in this very topic. That's why I'm saying this.

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I hinted on it as being part of the reason as to why I think I do.

I love this question. I beleive in a God that forgives anyone and anything. I beleive in a God that loves us all. I don't beleive in a God that send people to hell. I don't beleive in a God that made us in such a way and then force us to obey rules that sometimes go against ourselves. and our feelings.

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Well, then you and I think along the same lines.

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Then I wish you the best of luck and hope you may live a life of complete happiness with whomever you chose to live with.

That's all I ask for.

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However, as far as the molestation and bestiality.

Bestiality is just sick. I seriously don't think you're born wanting to make time with the cows. (Althouth I'm from Kentucky and I've heard stories blink.gif )

tongue.gif

Molestation I think is a mental disease. The difference is homosexuality is two grown adults who know what they're doing. I'm sorry but I'll never see any similarities. To me it's a kinda offensive comparison.

Edited by Pyxis
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Again I ask...do you really want to talk about god in this matter? ( I was hoping we could discuss this matter from an atheist point of veiw).

Why are you avoiding my question? I don't mind talking about God in any matter. I just want to know why are gays sinfull and such (not only gays but for everything)? How can you be sure that it's really what God wants and thinks?

Isn't respecting others enough asked? If you do something witch is supposedly a sin but yet isn't disrespectfull or harmfull towards anyone why would God still hate it and condemn it? Dosen't he just want us to be happy? If so why then bugging us on minor things that aren't even bad, mean or disrespectfull?

Ok thats cool. Its just that if we talk about God (and this subject) it will go nowhere.

No. It's only adding a little extra something to the actuall discussion... actually, debating on our beleifs will never get any of us anywhere. It'll just make us think and that's the purpose.

Well, then you and I think along the same lines.

Yea maby but in my point of you, the only thing God dosen't like is when people are mean, disrespectfull or harm others. Nothing else.

BTW I enjoy this discussion. If you feel I'm mad, it's not the case. If you feel offended by what I said, I'm sorry it wasen't meant...

Edit: Typos

Edited by JayMark
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Boy the word of god.

That's brought alot of good to the world huh?

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I have no objections to same sex marriages/relationships. There are genetic reasons (in most cases, posers and trendoids aside) for homosexuality.

What about hermaphrodites? God created them also, and no matter which sex they choose to be with they'd still to some degree be part of a 'same sex marriage'. God made everyone, and people really shouldn't get so into the business of what two people in their private lives do.

Even if you say they are 'sinning' who here can say they have never 'sinned' themselves? No one, and if you say you can you are lying, and that is a sin in itself. Who is made to judge who sins more than another. It's not your judgement to make.

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I really don;t understand how to guys or to women getting married can hurt anyone so much as to boycot the "Sanctity of Marrige"?

There's no way it can.

I'm proud to a canadian and have this law passed.

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The thing about gay marriage is that it's not merely a religious issue. Since the state grants married couples certain benefits that unmarried couples do not recieve, it is neccasary for the sake of equality to extend the option of marriage to ANY loving couple.

And with the lumping together of homosexuality, bestiality, and pedophalia... There's really no comparison to be made.

Homosexuality: Sex between two consenting adults.

Bestiality: Sex between a person and an animal that has no way of consenting or declining to it.

Pedophalia: Sex between an adult and a child, where the child has either not consented, or has but has no idea what they're consenting to.

EDIT: Rock on, Ashley. Well said.

Edited by Kabutarian
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An excellent post Ashley, and a really great point that i never thought of before.

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I thought only quebec had gay people? tongue.gif

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ROFL rofl.gif

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You tell them that they sin, that they are bound to hell, so once your judgement condemns you, you'll see them there.

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And where did I say gay people were going to go to hell?

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Bravo to the people of Canada for honoring and respecting human rights.

And, as someone has pointed out: equating Homosexuality with bestiality or pedophilia is ridiculous. We are talking about two consenting adults, in a compassionate and loving relationship, who wish for recognition of their commitment to one another.

Most insurance companies, and medical insurers will not recognize 'companions' for coverage of medical or death benefits.

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First of all, I've got to hand it to Ashley for her excellent post.

There are so many reasons why same sex marriage is not wrong that I don't have enough room to write them all here, so I'll only state a few.

Someone can believe same-sex marriage is wrong. The people in a same-sex marriage can believe an opposite-sex marriage is wrong. Whose job is it to decide the laws of marriage now that it conflicts with their righteous beliefs?

What would happen if everyone had same-sex marriages and your opposite-sex marriages were frowned upon, and you tried so hard just to be lawfully bound to the member of the opposite sex that you love so much, but the oppression from the same-sex majority stops it. How would you feel if the law said you couldn't be with your mate, soul mate or whatever you find your partner to be. So instead of surpressing the beliefs of others, let them believe and follow what they want; it's not like you have to have a same-sex marriage.

Why is same-sex marriage not natural? Cellphones, PDA's, message boards, microchips, transistors, radios, televisions, watches, DVD players, MP3 players, CD players, and whatever other electronic you can think of are not natural. We didn't create the laws to love, we didn't create the laws to mating. Our bodies tell us if we are attracted to male or female, regardless if that means we are sexually attracted to those of the same gender. It's not anyones fault or choice to be sexually attracted to one of their own gender.

I say go Canada! Spread some of your acceptance to the USA. thumbsup.gif

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To all the people that fear that same-sex relationships will lead to the break down of society and the end of the human race, I say this: confront your fears and prejudice with an open mind. Realize that your own beliefs assure you that God loves you because you aren't gay; be content with that and leave others alone. Why should people be so p***ed that men want to marry men and women want to marry women? People that exhibit blind hatred towards groups of people through ignorance and religion scare the hell out of me, just thinking out loud.

To those of you that think homosexuality is unnatural for whatever reason, I say this: many relationships are built on random circumstances, unconventional media. I know people who are happily married that met in a bar; I was brought up to believe that would never work. People also form relationships with others via computer which a good deal of people find unnatural. We confuse normal with popular and that's a damn shame. People need to get off their damn high horse and leave others alone.

To all of you with a rational open mind, and loving heart and the gumption to make your voice heard against racism, blind ignorant hatred and any other form of judgemental farce I say this: Keep fighting the good fight, knock down all prejudice with knowledge and intelligence; I will be beside you all with my voice as my weapon backed up by my vote.

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By the way, good point Ashley! wink2.gif

Edited by girty1600
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*tries to take a deep calming breath*

If homosexuality was so... unnatural... then there wouldn't be other animals who displace such. And if you want to know.. There has been cases of penguins, flamingos, mice, chimps, rams, dolphins, dogs, cats... all have had documented proof of males only wanting sexual contact with other males, and or females with other females... If you're to lazy to google and look.. I've already posted links.. others have posted links.. here on the site..

Personaly, it shows that Canada is more mature then the US... same with Scotland, Belgum, and the Neatherlands... Scotland is allowing same sex couples to adopt children... I think that's a wonderous thing.

Homosexuality is as natural as blond hair and blue eyes... Or red hair and green eyes... it's as natual as heterosexuality... it's something you are born with... and being born is natural.

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girty1600 I loved what you said, Sign me up!!!!!!!!! I STAND for change, I am so proud of Canada, I mentioned earlier I wish it would of been California United States. I watched a documentary about Canada and I saw the crime rate is way lower they can keep their doors unlocked at nite and they believe in Health care for all. Am I right my Canadian Brothers and sisters?????? We can learnfrom each other and for the first time in a long time the One love for all, fairness for all is the majority. Our hearts are being our guides.

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