Thailand Tsunami Parallel

[Mr Slayer]

I'm from Sweden.

Sweden's most popular nation for tourists is Thailand (sometimes described as a "sister-nation" of ours (?)). Anyway, over 300 000 people are believed to have died in the tsunami at the beginning of 2005, about 600 of them Swedes.

Now, 600 might not be a large number, but since there's only 9 milion of us, and most of the dead came from the milion city of Stockholm, it was a big deal.

So you can say that the tsunami disaster affected us as well, and a lot, especially since we (then) still had 1500 people "over there" without proper medical assistande, contact with swedish authorities, etc.

The swedish help arrived one week (!) later. Of course there was a debate and fury towards the government which had "everything under control".

I draw a parallel to New Orleans, and the American government's obvious lack of organisation, but foremost the lack of will to listen to old warnings. People are angry, frustrated, scared..."Dubya" has no control whatsoever.

What is it that makes one's government so vulnerable in such situations? So powerless, unorganized...stupid?

What would happen if Al-Qaida took advantage of the American situation?

[bboy]

I draw a parallel to New Orleans, and the American government's obvious lack of organisation, but foremost the lack of will to listen to old warnings. People are angry, frustrated, scared..."Dubya" has no control whatsoever.

What is it that makes one's government so vulnerable in such situations? So powerless, unorganized...stupid?

What would happen if Al-Qaida took advantage of the American situation?

823522[/snapback]

Oh, so you are from Sweden? And you think you know everything that is going on over here, because you watch CNN? I love the Bush haters on this board from Europe. They think they know what's going on over here, because they watch the news. THE AREA IS FLOODED. During the Tsunami the area didn't stay flooded. It is a little tough to get through deep water to give help. They have to fly in with helicopters with supplies. I'm sure no one had any idea that mobs would develop and prevent rescue efforts. I think the situation is going as good as it can. There are thousands of idiots down there taking advantage of the situation obviously. I think you should be calling THEM stupid and unorganized, not the administration...

[bluelight]

I say it's different than the tsunami. They never had a chance. It was unexpected, katrina was expected and they had the chance to evacuate.

they should have send trucks, buses, whatever vehicle that is prior Katrin's touch down, for the rest of the ones that don't have any transportation out of New Orleans when the warning was set out. But they didn't, did they?

Edited September 3, 2005 by bluefenix211

[bathory]

they weren't expecting a cat 5 storm until t was too late

[bluelight]

It went down to category 4 when it touch down btw.

but they have been expecting category 4. It was enough warning to evacuate, which people had cars actually did. They had enought time for evacuation. Most of them stayed because they had no transportation out of New Orleans. If somebody had offered a ride, I guess they would have taken it.

Even on Category 3 they should have evacuated.

Edited September 3, 2005 by bluefenix211

[Essan]

they weren't expecting a cat 5 storm until t was too late

824408[/snapback]

They've been expecting it for years. Just as they're expecting a big quake in California.

However, for Katrina itself there was only 72 hours warning. Which is 72 hours more than the people of Thailand got.

[Mr Slayer]

Yes, I understand that it is a different situation. People are more stranded that they were in Thailand. But still...

In Thailand the mentality was "solidarity", "let's help each other". Of course, there were looters even there, like in N.O.

But at large, the mentality in New Orleans, triggered by panic and desperation is "every man for himself".

I surely hope these people get some help soon!

[Conspiracy]

they weren't expecting a cat 5 storm until t was too late

824408[/snapback]

They've been expecting it for years. Just as they're expecting a big quake in California.

However, for Katrina itself there was only 72 hours warning. Which is 72 hours more than the people of Thailand got.

824446[/snapback]

true california should be getting that quake sometime within the next 1-4 years i hear

[Faeden]

What is also scary about this thing is the Bush lovers will refuse to see the truth no matter how much Bush messes up again and again.

It took the army only one day to get into and help the people in the Asian disaster, where its governments are mostly poor, it took the richest most powerful country in the world 5 days. American army helicopters could have drooped water proof packages with supplies.

On the evil people raping and robbing thing I find it hideous, but I never saw none of the tsunami victims doing that, not to the extent its happening in America anyway, and they say the east is a less civilised society.

All the best

Faeden

[The Caspian Hare]

They might well have screwed up, we'll know in the coming weeks, but I don't think some of you guys appreciate how hard it is to manage an operation like this.

[LarryOldtimer]

I say it's different than the tsunami. They never had a chance. It was unexpected, katrina was expected and they had the chance to evacuate.

they should have send trucks, buses, whatever vehicle that is prior Katrin's touch down, for the rest of the ones that don't have any transportation out of New Orleans when the warning was set out. But they didn't, did they?

824397[/snapback]

As a matter of fact, they didn't. And the "they" was the local government. There is a really nice picture (not) of a huge number of buses, municipal and school, which are standing mostly underwater. The question to ask the mayor, and not President Bush, is why those wasted buses weren't utilized for the purpose of evacuating those who had no means to do so for themselves. I hate to tell all of you, but Bush really didn't have control of those buses . . . the locals did.

[LarryOldtimer]

they weren't expecting a cat 5 storm until t was too late

824408[/snapback]

They've been expecting it for years. Just as they're expecting a big quake in California.

However, for Katrina itself there was only 72 hours warning. Which is 72 hours more than the people of Thailand got.

824446[/snapback]

Not only was there only 72 hours warning, but no one knew for sure where Katrina would make landfall . . . about 100 miles either way, or more, from where it did, was possible, and 72 hours before landfall, no one knew how strong it would be.

[LarryOldtimer]

What is also scary about this thing is the Bush lovers will refuse to see the truth no matter how much Bush messes up again and again.

It took the army only one day to get into and help the people in the Asian disaster, where its governments are mostly poor, it took the richest most powerful country in the world 5 days. American army helicopters could have drooped water proof packages with supplies.

On the evil people raping and robbing thing I find it hideous, but I never saw none of the tsunami victims doing that, not to the extent its happening in America anyway, and they say the east is a less civilised society.

All the best

Faeden

825218[/snapback]

Once again . . . the President has no authority whatsoever to use regular armed forces or even National Guard forces domestically in any way . . . in fact, it would be unlawful for him to do so, unless the legislature of the affected state met in session and passed a bill requesting such aid. The legislature of Louisiana didn't do so, and any deployment of National Guard forces are the purview of the governor, not the President.

[tarabull]

They might well have screwed up, we'll know in the coming weeks, but I don't think some of you guys appreciate how hard it is to manage an operation like this.

825666[/snapback]

HELLLOOOOOOOO Redneck - are you kidding or what?!??!

Don't you find it astonishing that Bush can order the attack of another country and have the troops 'on it' in hours but the reaction to this has taken days!!!!!!!!!!! And you think we should "appreciate how hard it is to manage an operation like this" !!!!!!!!!!!!! To me, that's appauling!

Bush has been too busy fighting wars to have a 'plan' to save his country in case of an emergency!>???? A State of Emergency could very well have been another terrorist attack, it just happen to be the result of an act of nature. This day and age, in the times we are living and the man never planned for a disaster!?!?!?!?!?!!?!

It's all what nightmares are made of.

And now we have the media abuzz with chatter about the borders being left somewhat 'unguarded' with only 7 days until 09-11-05!!!!!!!!!!

The US is more vulnerable now more than ever and the entire world knows it!!!!!!!

It's all just too much - too frightening - too much like a Spielberg flick!!!

[bathory]

Don't you find it astonishing that Bush can order the attack of another country and have the troops 'on it' in hours but the reaction to this has taken days!!!!!!!!!!! And you think we should "appreciate how hard it is to manage an operation like this" !!!!!!!!!!!!! To me, that's appauling!

have you even read anything thats been said in the various threads?

Bush isn't a dictator, he can't legally deploy those troops until the state requests them

how many idiots are going to keep repeating the same stupid talking points over and over? don't like the response time of the federal government? make Bush dictator, there isn't really any other way.

[tarabull]

Don't you find it astonishing that Bush can order the attack of another country and have the troops 'on it' in hours but the reaction to this has taken days!!!!!!!!!!! And you think we should "appreciate how hard it is to manage an operation like this" !!!!!!!!!!!!! To me, that's appauling!

have you even read anything thats been said in the various threads?

Bush isn't a dictator, he can't legally deploy those troops until the state requests them

how many idiots are going to keep repeating the same stupid talking points over and over? don't like the response time of the federal government? make Bush dictator, there isn't really any other way.

826465[/snapback]

Hey Bathroy....Amongst other things, your grade 6 education is showing.

[Faeden]

how many idiots are going to keep repeating the same stupid talking points over and over? don't like the response time of the federal government? make Bush dictator, there isn't really any other way.

As long as idiots continue to ignore the facts and bury there heads in the sand.

Bush was not seen for ages now he is being criticised he’s all over the devastated areas hugging kids, and looking sympathetic for the cameras How many times has he done that one? What’s scary is the public more than not buy it

[Nxt2Hvn]

Don't you find it astonishing that Bush can order the attack of another country and have the troops 'on it' in hours but the reaction to this has taken days!!!!!!!!!!! And you think we should "appreciate how hard it is to manage an operation like this" !!!!!!!!!!!!! To me, that's appauling!

have you even read anything thats been said in the various threads?

Bush isn't a dictator, he can't legally deploy those troops until the state requests them

how many idiots are going to keep repeating the same stupid talking points over and over? don't like the response time of the federal government? make Bush dictator, there isn't really any other way.

826465[/snapback]

Hey Bathroy....Amongst other things, your grade 6 education is showing.

826476[/snapback]

I don't see where anything in bathory's response makes him look like he has a grad 6 education... but you making immature replies sure makes you look that way! ... Grow up if you are going to join in!

[bathory]

Hey Bathroy....Amongst other things, your grade 6 education is showing.

of course it is, unlike you, i passed grade 6, perhaps you should head back to school to learn how to both read and work on your comprehension skills

Now considering your inability to understand that Bush isn't a dictator and is tied down by both Congress and State and Federal laws, you shouldn't be trying to critisize anyone of their level of education.

Bush was not seen for ages now he is being criticised he’s all over the devastated areas hugging kids, and looking sympathetic for the cameras sleepy.gif How many times has he done that one? What’s scary is the public more than not buy it unsure.gif

i don't understand what you want him to do?

when did he go to the Gulf coast? 2nd day in or something?

you critisize him for not going, then you critisize him for going

please oh please instead of acting like Michael Moore and telling us what he shouldn't have done, please tell us what he should have done.

[Mr Slayer]

Hey Bathroy....Amongst other things, your grade 6 education is showing.

of course it is, unlike you, i passed grade 6, perhaps you should head back to school to learn how to both read and work on your comprehension skills

Now considering your inability to understand that Bush isn't a dictator and is tied down by both Congress and State and Federal laws, you shouldn't be trying to critisize anyone of their level of education.

Bush was not seen for ages now he is being criticised he’s all over the devastated areas hugging kids, and looking sympathetic for the cameras sleepy.gif How many times has he done that one? What’s scary is the public more than not buy it unsure.gif

i don't understand what you want him to do?

when did he go to the Gulf coast? 2nd day in or something?

you critisize him for not going, then you critisize him for going

please oh please instead of acting like Michael Moore and telling us what he shouldn't have done, please tell us what he should have done.

826589[/snapback]

What he should have done? Well, I don't have the will or time to start the soon-to-be-watered-down-discussion about Iraq. Of course I think he should pull those soldiers out, but:

Make sure that the national guard makes sure to surround the whole area and secure piece by piece by establishing control and checkpoints. Make sure to disarm the people (tough, I know).

Then maybe federal help is to be called for. Use more recources for helicopters, trucks, water pumps etc.

Establish camp-hospitals, whatever, anything.

But the recources, or more, the lack of 'em, is troubling. Without money, there's little to obtain for the people of New Orleans.

[tarabull]

Hey Bathroy....Amongst other things, your grade 6 education is showing.

of course it is, unlike you, i passed grade 6, perhaps you should head back to school to learn how to both read and work on your comprehension skills

Now considering your inability to understand that Bush isn't a dictator and is tied down by both Congress and State and Federal laws, you shouldn't be trying to critisize anyone of their level of education.

Bush was not seen for ages now he is being criticised he’s all over the devastated areas hugging kids, and looking sympathetic for the cameras sleepy.gif How many times has he done that one? What’s scary is the public more than not buy it unsure.gif

i don't understand what you want him to do?

when did he go to the Gulf coast? 2nd day in or something?

you critisize him for not going, then you critisize him for going

please oh please instead of acting like Michael Moore and telling us what he shouldn't have done, please tell us what he should have done.

826589[/snapback]

Bathroy - I shouldn't criticize?? Buddy, you are obviously stund. You're the one that began this by calling out idiots! When are you going to realize, you're no different than the rest of us > aside from your opinion of yourself.

[LarryOldtimer]

how many idiots are going to keep repeating the same stupid talking points over and over? don't like the response time of the federal government? make Bush dictator, there isn't really any other way.

As long as idiots continue to ignore the facts and bury there heads in the sand.

Bush was not seen for ages now he is being criticised he’s all over the devastated areas hugging kids, and looking sympathetic for the cameras How many times has he done that one? What’s scary is the public more than not buy it

826505[/snapback]

Oh, I get it now! Bush should have been there on site to carry all the refugees off on his back. And he should have been able to feed them all with two loaves of bread and five fishes, right? And he should have personally have made the levees stronger. In case you haven't figured it out, ours is not a despotic form of government. As a matter of fact, Bush did personally recommend to Governor Blanko of LA that the state legislature meet and declare martial law, on the Friday before Katrina struck, so he could deploy federal armed forces to maintain law and order . . . the legislature considered it . . . and decided not to. It is the likes of you, wanting only to blame Bush for anything that goes wrong, who have your heads in the sand. Ours is a country of law, and Bush has to follow that law. And it is obvious that you have never been in a position of high importance . . . I have been, and when I was, I never was really on vacation, but on call to direct whatever had to be directed within my purview. The President gives orders, and can do so from where ever he happens to be. The failure in Katrina was a local and state matter, not a federal one. Even Bush can't take the law into his own hands. BTW, the levees and parapet walls were purposely designed to withstand only a catagory 3 hurricane . . . they put their money on the come line and lost.