[Merged] The Bosnian Pyramid Thread

[Irna]

And Irna let me guess. Guy that claimed to make that wheel had to be your father or uncle right. He made the claim to help you make a point.

You should have read a little before making such a stupid statement. The guy who took the picture of the uncomplete wheel here is a Zoran Kocic, manager of a Serbian company Aqua Mundi: http://www.aquamundilife.com/engleski/board.html. They claim to have invented a "revolutionary" device, able to find absolutely anything from gas and oil to missing planes and persons . Here is the device: http://www.aquamundilife.com/engleski/device.html, and a page where they present it: http://www.topix.com/forum/business/metals/TQG90SUUEAVRTDK18 (if you can read Bosnian, you may also find this article quite hilarious: http://arhiva.kurir-info.co.yu/Arhiva/2007...-27072007.shtml). Mr. Kocic came to Visoko in March 2007 at Mr. Osmanagic's request, and it's at that time he made the photos presented in their gallery, including the one of the uncomplete wheel.

HATERS!!!

Not everyone with a different opinion hates Bosnia. I am not an expert in many things but nationalism and hatered I can smell miles away. This is why I named a person here in this topic.

Could you please, one of you Edo or Odas, provide a single post from me, either here or on my website or on any forum, where I am supposed to show "hatred" to Bosnia or Bosnians? or any nationalistic trend? Please give us a quotation and a link, or else shut up on this subject. And let me say that the lack of respect for Bosnia is more on the side of the ones who have slandered its intellectuals and scientists for more than two years.

As for Mr. Osmanagic, I do not hate him at all, I just despise him as I despise all the people who lie and play on other people's credulity.

Irna

[odas]

I do not think that this is the right place for any kind of national arguments.

Anyway, as Edo has stated before, Bosnia is full of unexplained history. Unfortunately, those who wrote Bosnias history in the past (which is a false history written by Serbs and Croats dening everything that Bosnia had to offer prior to their arrival) continue to minimize it's historic roots.

For a long time history said that the first to come to this place were Serbs and Bosnians are a part of it. Well, the truth is that Bosnians were there thousands of years before the Slavic people came to this area.

Harte, Essan, as I said before, it is not about the pyramids or Osmanagic, it is way more complex and it is not easy to understand.

That is why I appriciate Osmanagic.

[Irna]

I do not think that this is the right place for any kind of national arguments.

I agree. So please be kind - the same applies to Edo - not to bring it up again when you are at a loss for scientific arguments.

Anyway, as Edo has stated before, Bosnia is full of unexplained history. Unfortunately, those who wrote Bosnias history in the past (which is a false history written by Serbs and Croats dening everything that Bosnia had to offer prior to their arrival) continue to minimize it's historic roots.

I totally agree 1) that Bosnian history is not known enough, 2) that history and archaeology have been used, not for the sake of scientific knowledge, but rather as tools for nationalistic agendas, by too many people in the Balkans, including Serbian, Croatian, and, if I may say, some Bosnian historians (like Mr. Enver Imamovic for instance); if you are interested in these aspects, the blogger Stultitia has collected in a good article in English some instances of this misuse of archaeology.

But, I do not think that replacing this nationalistically biased history by Mr. Osmanagic's fantastic and pseudo-scientific one is a good idea, nor do I think that the Bosnian authorities should give any authorization for excavations to a man who claims that the stecci found on Visocica west side are "huge blocks that rolled from the top of the pyramid"...

Irna

[edo bg]

I agree. So please be kind - the same applies to Edo - not to bring it up again when you are at a loss for scientific arguments.

I totally agree 1) that Bosnian history is not known enough, 2) that history and archaeology have been used, not for the sake of scientific knowledge, but rather as tools for nationalistic agendas, by too many people in the Balkans, including Serbian, Croatian, and, if I may say, some Bosnian historians (like Mr. Enver Imamovic for instance); if you are interested in these aspects, the blogger Stultitia has collected in a good article in English some instances of this misuse of archaeology.

But, I do not think that replacing this nationalistically biased history by Mr. Osmanagic's fantastic and pseudo-scientific one is a good idea, nor do I think that the Bosnian authorities should give any authorization for excavations to a man who claims that the stecci found on Visocica west side are "huge blocks that rolled from the top of the pyramid"...

Irna

You misunderstood my post. I didn't say you hated bosnians. I called people on this forum who want excavations to stop haters. It's an american term and doesn't have as much to do with hate as it does with jealousy.

[edo bg]

I agree. So please be kind - the same applies to Edo - not to bring it up again when you are at a loss for scientific arguments.

I totally agree 1) that Bosnian history is not known enough, 2) that history and archaeology have been used, not for the sake of scientific knowledge, but rather as tools for nationalistic agendas, by too many people in the Balkans, including Serbian, Croatian, and, if I may say, some Bosnian historians (like Mr. Enver Imamovic for instance); if you are interested in these aspects, the blogger Stultitia has collected in a good article in English some instances of this misuse of archaeology.

But, I do not think that replacing this nationalistically biased history by Mr. Osmanagic's fantastic and pseudo-scientific one is a good idea, nor do I think that the Bosnian authorities should give any authorization for excavations to a man who claims that the stecci found on Visocica west side are "huge blocks that rolled from the top of the pyramid"...

Irna

As I've said before, Osmanagic does say some crazy stuff from time to time, however, if he didn't start the excavations, who would've?!! Me? You? Our countries "scientists" who have left hundreds of historic monuments unexplored over the last century? It had to be someone like Osmanagic. He isn't afraid to fail. And please don't tell me Osmanagic is doing it for the money. He was not struggling here in the US by any means.

[louie]

Has there been any developments on the dig this year. the threads have been very quite here on um this year about the dig.

[edo bg]

The biggest problem I see with this whole thing is that in an effort to push forward and prove that these are in fact man made pyramids, they may have destroyed precious archaeological resources.

People have been saying since the beginning that the hills are natural, but may have been "modified" over the centuries. So any evidence of this would be on the surface and sub-surface, not inside the hills. Did they take the time to record and preserve what was overlaying the slopes?

Actually, Osmanagic believes that inside the hills is where he needs to look. From what I understand there are miles of tunels dug inside the hills and they connect the "pyramids" or hills whatever you want to call it. Also all of the tunels are connected and have supply of fresh air. I don't know if they preserved everything that was overlaying the slopes, but i understand why they are in such a hurry. If they don't find proof fast enough they will loose support of people. Bosnians are notoriously inpatient. This type of project should've taken decades, but it is what it is.

[Shaftsbury]

Actually, Osmanagic believes that inside the hills is where he needs to look. From what I understand there are miles of tunels dug inside the hills and they connect the "pyramids" or hills whatever you want to call it. Also all of the tunels are connected and have supply of fresh air. I don't know if they preserved everything that was overlaying the slopes, but i understand why they are in such a hurry. If they don't find proof fast enough they will loose support of people. Bosnians are notoriously inpatient. This type of project should've taken decades, but it is what it is.

If the hills/pyramids were "constructed" by man would it have been necessary to "dig" tunnels between them?

You would think that it might have been easier to simply lay out the tunnels as the pyramids were going up.

I have seen several reports that say the tunnels were constructed by linking natural caves, so if this is the case they could have been dug at any time in the past.

[odas]

If the hills/pyramids were "constructed" by man would it have been necessary to "dig" tunnels between them?

You would think that it might have been easier to simply lay out the tunnels as the pyramids were going up.

I have seen several reports that say the tunnels were constructed by linking natural caves, so if this is the case they could have been dug at any time in the past.

No doubt about that. They could have been duged ten years ago, or a hundred or a thousand or ten thousand....

There is only one thing that I do not understand in regards to the bosnian pyramids. Why, whenever there is a contra-pyramid post, people use comparison to other pyramids?

Was there or is there a unique Blueprint on how a pyramid is supposed to be build? Does this mean that any step away from this blueprint is herecy an therefore not to be described as a pyramid?

Who sets those standards? Is there a difference in a skyscraper and a hut? Yes.. is there a different purpose for them? Yes....But still, both are housing people and therefore, primitively can be called homes.

No, honestly, who sets the standards for pyramids for the way they have to be build?

[hetrodoxly]

Is there any artefacts yet?

[edo bg]

If the hills/pyramids were "constructed" by man would it have been necessary to "dig" tunnels between them?

You would think that it might have been easier to simply lay out the tunnels as the pyramids were going up.

I have seen several reports that say the tunnels were constructed by linking natural caves, so if this is the case they could have been dug at any time in the past.

Thoose reports can't be true since there is no limestone in the area which is needed for creation of natural caves the size of the ones in "Bosnian Pyramids". No doubt they were dug by man, but you are right when you question how long ago. Either way it had to be a while back. Look, I'm not saying that theese are pyramids no questions asked. All I'm saying is that there is something there that needs to be explored.

[edo bg]

If the hills/pyramids were "constructed" by man would it have been necessary to "dig" tunnels between them?

You would think that it might have been easier to simply lay out the tunnels as the pyramids were going up.

I have seen several reports that say the tunnels were constructed by linking natural caves, so if this is the case they could have been dug at any time in the past.

Furthermore, the fact that theese tunels were dug supports my theory that natural hills were shaped by men and then tons of rocks were added to cover up theese structures. After that the tunnels were dug. Or this could be the style of pyramid used by Native Americans in what is today USA. They were simply earth mounds that were shaped into a pyramid.

[Shaftsbury]

No doubt about that. They could have been duged ten years ago, or a hundred or a thousand or ten thousand....

There is only one thing that I do not understand in regards to the bosnian pyramids. Why, whenever there is a contra-pyramid post, people use comparison to other pyramids?

Was there or is there a unique Blueprint on how a pyramid is supposed to be build? Does this mean that any step away from this blueprint is herecy an therefore not to be described as a pyramid?

Who sets those standards? Is there a difference in a skyscraper and a hut? Yes.. is there a different purpose for them? Yes....But still, both are housing people and therefore, primitively can be called homes.

No, honestly, who sets the standards for pyramids for the way they have to be build?

The standards for pyramid building are set by the pyramid builders of course

In the history of pyramid building I think you will find lots of trial and error before they got things working right, but I would be very surprised if anyone ever tried to make a pyramid by laying down millimeter thin layers, that's why I think it's pointless to dig into the hills to show how they were constructed.

I'm not an expert so I can't say for sure, but I'm not aware of any known manmade structure that is constructed the way these apparently are. Which if you think about it, is interesting because if these are indeed the largest pyramids in the world you'd think later cultures would try and copy the technique.

[edo bg]

The standards for pyramid building are set by the pyramid builders of course

In the history of pyramid building I think you will find lots of trial and error before they got things working right, but I would be very surprised if anyone ever tried to make a pyramid by laying down millimeter thin layers, that's why I think it's pointless to dig into the hills to show how they were constructed.

I'm not an expert so I can't say for sure, but I'm not aware of any known manmade structure that is constructed the way these apparently are. Which if you think about it, is interesting because if these are indeed the largest pyramids in the world you'd think later cultures would try and copy the technique.

Native Americans in what is today Missouri, Ky, Kansas, Oklahoma, and other states have built pyramids by laying down tons of earth using only buckets hundreds even thousands of years ago.

[edo bg]

Furthermore, the fact that theese tunels were dug supports my theory that natural hills were shaped by men and then tons of rocks were added to cover up theese structures. After that the tunnels were dug. Or this could be the style of pyramid used by Native Americans in what is today USA. They were simply earth mounds that were shaped into a pyramid.

furthermore http://www.survive2012.com/america_pyramids.php

[Shaftsbury]

Native Americans in what is today Missouri, Ky, Kansas, Oklahoma, and other states have built pyramids by laying down tons of earth using only buckets hundreds even thousands of years ago.

I think it's pretty clear that the Bosnian Pyramids were not made by laying down buckets of soil, and that is the point I was trying to make. Go back and look at some of the photographs earlier in this and other threads, there is no way that the thin alternating layers in those photographs were ever put down by the hand of man.

[edo bg]

I think it's pretty clear that the Bosnian Pyramids were not made by laying down buckets of soil, and that is the point I was trying to make. Go back and look at some of the photographs earlier in this and other threads, there is no way that the thin alternating layers in those photographs were ever put down by the hand of man.

Question was who was reallyto judge what a pyramid was supposed to look like. This is why I gave the example from USA above. Like I've said. I believe bosnian pyramids were natural hills that were reshaped by man (still a monumental task), and then had tons and tons of stone shaped and placed around it. I would tell you if i was impressed by them if i knew the age.

[Harte]

These "pyramids" are not artifacts, they are geological formations.

Nobody "constructed" them so it's not at all surprising that nobody has "excavated" them until this con man decided to try and make a buck on it.

The archaeological significance of the area has, however, been investigated. There are Roman artifacts and medieval artifacts in the area - these have been found, properly analyzed in their context and kept for subsequent study (if any.)

Because there is no clamor for archaeological artifacts from this period of the Roman era or from medieval times (given that as far as can be deduced there was nothing significant about the site) then of course nobody has completely investigated the archaeology of this particular area. Hence, it is a worry that the current bogus activity there could well be destroying forever certainly the context of any artifacts that may be there if not destroying the artifacts themselves.

Bulldozer and backhoe are not archaeological tools.

Harte

[realgreatidea]

Yeah, really. Pyramids are pretty elastic things. They change from culture to culture, but are in almost every country in the world.

[darkbreed]

Just thought some might find these new discoveries (well some are not that new but some may still not be aware of them) regarding the Bosnian pyramid(s).

Here are some tunnels in them:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Tunnels

Various artifacts:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Artifacts

Pyramid pictures:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Pyramid

From excavations:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Excavations

Notice that most of the above links have several pages with photos.

From what it seems, this pyramid has most likely indeed been used and built by people, either partially or completely. It is possible they have used a natural pyramid shaped mountain and built some upon it, made tunnels etc, and built other structures around and on it. But at least several of these photos from the site shows that it has been human activity there and that it has been performed work on and around the pyramid itself in ancient times.

[jaylemurph]

There's a perfectly good Bosnian pyramid thread to add this to already, DB.

--Jaylemurph

[Bella-Angelique]

I would not have seen the pics if they had not been up for easy browse. I like page two, third row down, second pic. It reminds me of the keyhole tunnels of Vietnam. Those were shaped to hold up under massive weight.

[Porthos1]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooo!!!! Not another muddy hill thread.

Thanks for posting all of those pics DB. The page with all the so called pavers is PERFECT evidence that it is natural stone formations. You can obviously see the stone is fractured in place giving it that look. On the pieces one can observe raised ridges that line up perfectly with the ones all around proving one large stone fractured in place, not individual pavers. Thanks for posting such good debunking aids.

[darkbreed]

I guess you didnt read my post.

It was clearly stated that it's possible it is a natural pyramid shaped mountain that have been used by some ancient unknown culture / civilization.

There is plenty of evidence for human activity and work at the mountain as mentioned in my first post, and as clearly visible from the artifacts found there, the manmade tunnels, etc.

So the research they are doing is well worth it as they are uncovering a lost part of history, doesn't matter if the pyramid is natural or not, the point is they have found evidence of an earlier culture there from ancient times and it will be interesting to see what more they find out about this.

[1.618]

Just thought some might find these new discoveries (well some are not that new but some may still not be aware of them) regarding the Bosnian pyramid(s).

Here are some tunnels in them:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Tunnels

Various artifacts:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Artifacts

Pyramid pictures:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Pyramid

From excavations:

http://www.bosnian-pyramid.com/gallery/index.php/Excavations

Notice that most of the above links have several pages with photos.

From what it seems, this pyramid has most likely indeed been used and built by people, either partially or completely. It is possible they have used a natural pyramid shaped mountain and built some upon it, made tunnels etc, and built other structures around and on it. But at least several of these photos from the site shows that it has been human activity there and that it has been performed work on and around the pyramid itself in ancient times.

All very interesting. Thanks for the links. As i only looked at the pictures, i'm curious as to whether or not anything has been dated?