louie Posted June 13, 2006 #326 Share Posted June 13, 2006 or it could be just another rock, why do we always look for things that arent there? We have no reason to beleive that this is anything other than a rock, so why do we immediately jump to the conclusion that this is something man made? If it were shaped by humans wouldnt there be some tool marks or evidence that it had been chipped to form a particular shape. I know the arrow heads and stone tools I have seen have definate markings on them showing how they were shaped, this rock has no such markings that I can see. Not only that but it doesnt look like anything other than it has sort of a point at one end. If I saw that rock on the ground it wouldnt interest me in the least. The only reason we are talking about it is someone cleaned it and took a picture of it. Am I the only on that just sees a rock? ok but the question is why did they feel it was worth taking a photo of it conserdring where it was found i presume the photo came from tyhe web site or somebody at the excavation site, i cant see them just sending out pictures of what they thing are pretty stones for us to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Bundy Posted June 13, 2006 #327 Share Posted June 13, 2006 is there any scale? how big is the 'stone'? Scale don't know. I think it's 45cm. ok but the question is why did they feel it was worth taking a photo of it conserdring where it was found i presume the photo came from tyhe web site or somebody at the excavation site, i cant see them just sending out pictures of what they thing are pretty stones for us to look at. If it's found in the pyramid chamber, then this is a artifact. It is not just a stone. But a special one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pax Unum Posted June 13, 2006 #328 Share Posted June 13, 2006 Scale don't know. I think it's 45cm. Thanks Vernes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted June 14, 2006 #329 Share Posted June 14, 2006 If it was at one of the dig sites, then it should be photographed and documented. All the stones should be documented. That just seems like good archeology to me. With digital cameras there is no reason not to take a picture of it. Why it was on the website? Well, I don't know. It does kind of look like a fish or even a snake head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halo_slightly_askew Posted June 14, 2006 #330 Share Posted June 14, 2006 if it were shaped by humans wouldnt there be some tool marks or evidence that it had been chipped to form a particular shape. I know the arrow heads and stone tools I have seen have definate markings on them showing how they were shaped, this rock has no such markings that I can see. Hi, new here. I've been keeping up with this thread, find it all very interesting. Trying the quote for the first time ^, sorry if it doesn't come out Not sure what the significance of the stone is but, yes, you are right. If it had been shaped by people there would be percussion marks on the stone where it had been struck by another implement in order to shape it. "Flint knapping" would be a good example to look up for those unfamiliar with the technique. On arrow heads, points, bifaces, tools and what have you, found in a variety of sites around the world and of a variety of materials, percussion marks are a major determining factor as to whether a piece of stone from the prehistoric period has been worked or not. When we come across anything having these marks, on site, it's normally logged in if only as debitage, for further study. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louie Posted June 14, 2006 #331 Share Posted June 14, 2006 if it was found in the tomb sitr the rock has signifance. it dosent nessecelary have to have chisel marks they can be cleand off using abrasives and water granted its a b**** of a job and time consuming but its not that hard to get a smooth surface. have we any statements from the site saying what they think it may be... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragon Posted June 14, 2006 #332 Share Posted June 14, 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavie Posted June 14, 2006 #333 Share Posted June 14, 2006 WOW I think I like this pic the best .... so far anyways ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragon Posted June 14, 2006 #334 Share Posted June 14, 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosanchero Posted June 14, 2006 #335 Share Posted June 14, 2006 Damn these NATURAL hills (Sarcastic) lol man this is my favorite pic so farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr it loookkkksss soooo realllll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmurdock36 Posted June 14, 2006 #336 Share Posted June 14, 2006 Damn these NATURAL hills (Sarcastic) lol man this is my favorite pic so farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr it loookkkksss soooo realllll that looks man mad yes, but it still doesnt look anything like a pyrimid, looks more like somebody made a stone pathway, I just want to see one picture that looks anything like it might be part of a pyramid. I havent seen it yet. I dont think anyone disputes that there have been people there for a long time that could have made a stone path. They are saying it is a pyramid though so i want to see something that looks like part of a pyramid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halo_slightly_askew Posted June 14, 2006 #337 Share Posted June 14, 2006 if it was found in the tomb sitr the rock has signifance. it dosent nessecelary have to have chisel marks they can be cleand off using abrasives and water granted its a b**** of a job and time consuming but its not that hard to get a smooth surface. have we any statements from the site saying what they think it may be... Oh, for sure it has significance, I wasn't trying to imply that it didn't, simply that it didn't appear to be worked by a human. Haven't seen photos of all sides of it either though. At this stage in their excavation anything showing the slightest bit of curiosity or interest will be logged in as an artifact to be further studied. If they are running their site as most are run, then there are alot of things being tossed aside, just your average stones with nothing unusual about them. They kept this one for a reason. Whether it turns out to to be anything special will eventually be determined. It's more difficult than you think to wipe out the percussion marks on stone. Simple cleaning, abrasives or not, wouldn't have polished it to that degree. Nor, if it did contain percussion marks, would they allow the marks to be smoothed during cleaning. Most artifacts are cleaned with plain water and a soft sort of toothbrush in order to not cause damage. Abrasives aren't normally used. I've handled prehistoric chipped artifacts that have been polished by water for hundreds of years. The artifact overall is polished and smooth, but the percussion marks remain in place, though with less distinct edges. Whatever it is that they're excavating is man made, in my opinion. Those look like specifically placed stones to form a type of flagstone pathway. Whether it's a pyramid or not, I'm still undecided, even a step pyramid. But I don't really care if it's a pyramid or not, it's something and I can't wait to see what it is as it's uncovered! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halo_slightly_askew Posted June 14, 2006 #338 Share Posted June 14, 2006 (edited) The photos that show what looks to be a man-made flagstone path could very well be natural. I’m hoping it is man-made, any new potential archaeological discovery is exciting. But there is such a thing as orthogonal joints created in bedrock and plates due to natural stress. The appearance of what seems to be mortar between the stones have been tested and explained as the underlying sediment pushing up between the cracks of the joints in similar instances. This would be why the archaeologist in England claimed it to be nothing more than natural geologic formations. Photos here: http://images.statelibrary.tas.gov.au/Full...TAS001126183516 http://www.gjsentinel.com/news/content/new...atural_WWW.html http://www.pe.utexas.edu/~jolson/utig-talk...29_image011.jpg http://www.pe.utexas.edu/~jolson/utig-talk...27_image014.jpg http://www.australienbilder.de/serien/seiten/e-tas21.htm I have more doubts now about what is there, but I’m still keeping my fingers crossed that they will uncover something, pyramid or not. I apologize if these links have already been provided. Edited June 15, 2006 by halo_slightly_askew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosanchero Posted June 15, 2006 #339 Share Posted June 15, 2006 The photos that show what looks to be a man-made flagstone path could very well be natural. I’m hoping it is man-made, any new potential archaeological discovery is exciting. But there is such a thing as orthogonal joints created in bedrock and plates due to natural stress. The appearance of what seems to be mortar between the stones have been tested and explained as the underlying sediment pushing up between the cracks of the joints in similar instances. This would be why the archaeologist in England claimed it to be nothing more than natural geologic formations. Photos here: http://images.statelibrary.tas.gov.au/Full...-0016-125142836 http://images.statelibrary.tas.gov.au/Full...TAS001126183516 http://www.gjsentinel.com/news/content/new...atural_WWW.html http://www.pe.utexas.edu/~jolson/utig-talk...29_image011.jpg http://www.pe.utexas.edu/~jolson/utig-talk...27_image014.jpg http://www.australienbilder.de/serien/seiten/e-tas21.htm I have more doubts now about what is there, but I’m still keeping my fingers crossed that they will uncover something, pyramid or not. I apologize if these links have already been provided. i have never knew this, and thank you for the links and pictures, but when i look at your pictures, hmhm, they are picture of Straight land, there is no levels to them (if you know what i am saying) if you could provide pictures of natural orthogonal joints that are made in stair like levels i would really like to see them thanks again for the links and images, i learned something new today lol,,,, ohh and how big are the fields that are presented in the pictures ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halo_slightly_askew Posted June 15, 2006 #340 Share Posted June 15, 2006 i have never knew this, and thank you for the links and pictures, but when i look at your pictures, hmhm, they are picture of Straight land, there is no levels to them (if you know what i am saying) if you could provide pictures of natural orthogonal joints that are made in stair like levels i would really like to see them thanks again for the links and images, i learned something new today lol,,,, ohh and how big are the fields that are presented in the pictures ??? I'm not sure how big the fields are, Bosanchero, I wondered myself. I've been browsing for articles on orthogonal joints with references to these specific places in the photos. If I find out, I'll post it. I also noticed that all the pics contained only flat areas. I came across a few that were in terrace form that resembled some of what they are uncovering, but not specifically the ones that appear to be a flagstone type path, which is what I was most interested in. My main question is...why are the walls in between each level dirt? If it were a step, wouldn't the walls also be rocked in? Right now it is resembling levels of strata, bedrock with a strata of dirt underneath, then another strata of bedrock, if you get what I mean. But my fingers remain crossed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosanchero Posted June 15, 2006 #341 Share Posted June 15, 2006 I'm not sure how big the fields are, Bosanchero, I wondered myself. I've been browsing for articles on orthogonal joints with references to these specific places in the photos. If I find out, I'll post it. I also noticed that all the pics contained only flat areas. I came across a few that were in terrace form that resembled some of what they are uncovering, but not specifically the ones that appear to be a flagstone type path, which is what I was most interested in. My main question is...why are the walls in between each level dirt? If it were a step, wouldn't the walls also be rocked in? Right now it is resembling levels of strata, bedrock with a strata of dirt underneath, then another strata of bedrock, if you get what I mean. But my fingers remain crossed well if you do find more information on this please do pm me about it, ohh and what makes me wonder about this pic, is that they started digging on PREexisting road that people use dayy to day, why not dig elsewhere ??? or at least i think it looks like its a road lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mentonian Posted June 15, 2006 #342 Share Posted June 15, 2006 (edited) I think the topic of the pyramids is fascinating. I also believe that written "history" has always been in the hands of those with the most power. Because of this reality, there are many, many secrets that are slowly being revealed. This is in addition to history which is so ancient that it has simply been forgotten, or, as both Islam and Christianity imply, these discoveries may belong to other "Earth ages." I also agree with the poster, Bosnian, in that I believe that there are good people in many religions and that God loves us all. I live in a small town in Alabama and have Muslim neighbors and friends, as well as a couple of Jewish ones. It is difficult, though, because, even here, where they face so much hate by uneducated Americans, they continue to hate each other. I will never understand this. The pyramids, at the very least, are an excellent example that every culture has something to offer and that much knowledge can only be gained by open minds willing to listen, read, and discuss with as little discrimination as possible. God bless all of you who read this post. Edited June 15, 2006 by Mentonian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragon Posted June 15, 2006 #343 Share Posted June 15, 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor Posted June 15, 2006 #344 Share Posted June 15, 2006 Seeing those images recently posted by Aragon, I got more confused. At the same time it seems man made, it fits the idea of joints formed in bedrock. Now I am more curious than before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor Posted June 15, 2006 #345 Share Posted June 15, 2006 I think the topic of the pyramids is fascinating. I also believe that written "history" has always been in the hands of those with the most power. Because of this reality, there are many, many secrets that are slowly being revealed. This is in addition to history which is so ancient that it has simply been forgotten, or, as both Islam and Christianity imply, these discoveries may belong to other "Earth ages." I also agree with the poster, Bosnian, in that I believe that there are good people in many religions and that God loves us all. I live in a small town in Alabama and have Muslim neighbors and friends, as well as a couple of Jewish ones. It is difficult, though, because, even here, where they face so much hate by uneducated Americans, they continue to hate each other. I will never understand this. The pyramids, at the very least, are an excellent example that every culture has something to offer and that much knowledge can only be gained by open minds willing to listen, read, and discuss with as little discrimination as possible. God bless all of you who read this post. Mentonian! Hi! Welcome to UM. Its the first time I see you. I agree with your statements but I will ask you something. Please, avoid comments regarding Ethinics, religion and politics in this thread. Do not apoint who is uneducated or not. Refere here only to the subject please. We had a lot of problem when the matter goes off topic. Lets discuss the bosnian findings, nonetheless! Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louie Posted June 15, 2006 #346 Share Posted June 15, 2006 Oh, for sure it has significance, I wasn't trying to imply that it didn't, simply that it didn't appear to be worked by a human. Haven't seen photos of all sides of it either though. At this stage in their excavation anything showing the slightest bit of curiosity or interest will be logged in as an artifact to be further studied. If they are running their site as most are run, then there are alot of things being tossed aside, just your average stones with nothing unusual about them. They kept this one for a reason. Whether it turns out to to be anything special will eventually be determined. It's more difficult than you think to wipe out the percussion marks on stone. Simple cleaning, abrasives or not, wouldn't have polished it to that degree. Nor, if it did contain percussion marks, would they allow the marks to be smoothed during cleaning. Most artifacts are cleaned with plain water and a soft sort of toothbrush in order to not cause damage. Abrasives aren't normally used. I've handled prehistoric chipped artifacts that have been polished by water for hundreds of years. The artifact overall is polished and smooth, but the percussion marks remain in place, though with less distinct edges. Whatever it is that they're excavating is man made, in my opinion. Those look like specifically placed stones to form a type of flagstone pathway. Whether it's a pyramid or not, I'm still undecided, even a step pyramid. But I don't really care if it's a pyramid or not, it's something and I can't wait to see what it is as it's uncovered! i carve stone, and smoothing a stone by hand is tough but can be done when i said abrasives i mean any thing from sand mixed with water and any number of things, what im saying when it was orignally made it could have been smoothed by hand, ive also carved natural stone ive taken from running rivers so i know what u mean about that. but if these poeple built a pyramid they most certinaly knew how to get a smooth surface on a stone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louie Posted June 15, 2006 #347 Share Posted June 15, 2006 also we have a natural formation, THE GIANTS CAUSEWAY, northern ireland http://www.peterlanger.com/Countries/Europ...GBNIGCW0134.htm http://www.op.net/~rkane/Ireland/1994/gc1.htm http://www.op.net/~rkane/Ireland/1994/gc2.htm http://www.op.net/~rkane/Ireland/1994/gc2.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halo_slightly_askew Posted June 15, 2006 #348 Share Posted June 15, 2006 i carve stone, and smoothing a stone by hand is tough but can be done when i said abrasives i mean any thing from sand mixed with water and any number of things, what im saying when it was orignally made it could have been smoothed by hand, Got ya Thought you were referring to the cleaning process once reaching the lab. Thanks for the links on the Giant's Causeway. Ireland seems such a beautiful place and is full of so much history. Hope to visit someday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosanchero Posted June 16, 2006 #349 Share Posted June 16, 2006 WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOO i have been waiting for this, lol, i was kind of hoping that more work was done Here are some HELI shots of Pyramid Of Sun Aka Visocica Pictures Taken By "Austrian CIMIC Unit ( der KEILER)" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragon Posted June 16, 2006 #350 Share Posted June 16, 2006 moon pyramid excavations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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