Talon Posted February 22, 2006 #101 Share Posted February 22, 2006 Let's stick to the topic at hand; if you wish to discuss the Russian war efforts please start a topic to do so and do not divert this thread... Due to the ignorance of many people of the Soviet war effort I agree, as for another thread, it seems rather pointless to start more tripe about the USSR not helping Allied victory elsewhere. For the topic at hand, I still retain that 3 years is a bit much for being stupid. If he was saying the Holocaust was a good thing, then lock him up for 3 years, and there are plenty of people who do and nothing is done about it. I think time a resources would be better spent on locking up people who defend the murder of 11 million people (6 million jews, 5 million socialists/communists etc), rather than some retards who claim its all just Alllied propoganda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BazookaTooth Posted February 22, 2006 #102 Share Posted February 22, 2006 As much as it is amazingly stupid to deny the hollocaust,there shoulden't be a law against it if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erikl Posted February 22, 2006 #103 Share Posted February 22, 2006 Don't be silly. If you would like to compare the freedom of speech with the freedom to murder and rape then by all means go for it... I'm not the one being silly here as you obviously missed my comparsion - I equated the freedom of movement that is deprived to any prisoner by definition (because they are prison dwellers - hence the word prisoner), as a result of crime they participated in, to the freedom of movement. I for one as a soldier find even the slightest limitation to my freedom of movement to be awkward - being a prisoner is unthinkable. One can't use freedom of speech as an excuse to say and do whatever one wants without regards what so ever. People has to know words have powers. And books, too, have an enormous power as well, for the simple fact that most people take something that is written to be true, because they believe that if someone put an effort to actually write what they have to say, then perhaps there is some truth to it. And if the only way to stop people from saying harmful things is by locking them away and prevent their books from being published or them lecturing their harmful ideas to the public, then by all means. Losing your freedom of speech, is this: making a threat, ordering a crime and such. Just like losing your freedom of movement is killing someone or commiting some other crime Kratos I'm going to kill you. There, here's a threat. Should my freedom of speech be prevented now? will this post be deleted? Ofcourse not. Becuase anyone knows I'm not serious, nor do I have anyway to do anything about it even if I was being serious. You can't just generlize what should be the limit on freedom of speech, because it's such an important right. You should instead judge every case for what it stands. And yes, this debate about whether or not this freedom should be prevented in some cases is also an important part of the process, and should happen whenever someone's freedom of speech is questioned . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StalingradK Posted February 22, 2006 #104 Share Posted February 22, 2006 Due to the ignorance of many people of the Soviet war effort I agree, as for another thread, it seems rather pointless to start more tripe about the USSR not helping Allied victory elsewhere. For the topic at hand, I still retain that 3 years is a bit much for being stupid. If he was saying the Holocaust was a good thing, then lock him up for 3 years, and there are plenty of people who do and nothing is done about it. I think time a resources would be better spent on locking up people who defend the murder of 11 million people (6 million jews, 5 million socialists/communists etc), rather than some retards who claim its all just Alllied propoganda. Talon's my new hero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
__Kratos__ Posted February 22, 2006 #105 Share Posted February 22, 2006 And if the only way to stop people from saying harmful things is by locking them away and prevent their books from being published or them lecturing their harmful ideas to the public, then by all means. And who gets to choose what is harmful and what is not? You? Me? Guy down the street from me? WHO? No one has the right to take freedom of speech from another. Kratos I'm going to kill you. There, here's a threat. Should my freedom of speech be prevented now? will this post be deleted? Ofcourse not. Becuase anyone knows I'm not serious, nor do I have anyway to do anything about it even if I was being serious. You can't just generlize what should be the limit on freedom of speech, because it's such an important right. You should instead judge every case for what it stands. And yes, this debate about whether or not this freedom should be prevented in some cases is also an important part of the process, and should happen whenever someone's freedom of speech is questioned . *Calls up Israeli embassy* So, if someone you don't like says something you can say it's not freedom of speech and get them in jail. ... That is not how it should be. Just because you don't like what someone is saying, doesn't mean they shouldn't say it... means you should learn to rebut comments or ignore them. I can go outside right now, take down my American flag in the front yard, post a Nazi flag, get a SS uniform and give a good yell to "Heil Hitler!" while saluting; and it's still freedom of speech... no matter how much you hate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamboIII Posted February 23, 2006 #106 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Due to the ignorance of many people of the Soviet war effort I agree, as for another thread, it seems rather pointless to start more tripe about the USSR not helping Allied victory elsewhere. For the topic at hand, I still retain that 3 years is a bit much for being stupid. If he was saying the Holocaust was a good thing, then lock him up for 3 years, and there are plenty of people who do and nothing is done about it. I think time a resources would be better spent on locking up people who defend the murder of 11 million people (6 million jews, 5 million socialists/communists etc), rather than some retards who claim its all just Alllied propoganda. there wer a LOT more people killed during the holocaust than 11 million Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StalingradK Posted February 25, 2006 #107 Share Posted February 25, 2006 If you look at population stats... No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamboIII Posted February 25, 2006 #108 Share Posted February 25, 2006 there are dozens of different poulation stats, all of which are probably wrong, especially back then. do you think that they really went to each house and were like "excuse me, how many people live in your home?" no they estimated, and in the chaos of WWII they had to make uneducated guesses to how many people died, there is a link on this thread on the 1st or 2nd page that shows how 11 million is way off. you lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamboIII Posted February 25, 2006 #109 Share Posted February 25, 2006 The mistake many make in remembering the Holocaust , rather than researching it, is to imagine the Jews were the only victims. Consequently, as they are the most vocal advocates for remembering their plight as if they were the only ones, people believe. And filmmakers that seek to exploit the tragedy with the myopic attention to that lie, serve no good purpose to educate with their medium of communications, but rather propagate the lie and thereby make the Jews the victims they profess to be throughout their own history. Nothing could be further from the truth! While the number of Jews murdered is subject to debate; claimed as anywhere from 6 to 9 million or higher , depending upon the "source" one reads, there were others that were victims of this sick twisted intolerance under Hitlers regime. Ukrainians 5.5 - 7 million Jews (of all countries) 6 million + Russian POWs 3.3 million + Russian Civilians 2 million + Poles 3 million + Yugoslavians 1.5 million + Gypsies 200,000 - 500,000 Mentally/Physically Disabled 70,000- 250,000 Homosexuals Tens of thousands Spanish Republicans Tens of thousands Jehovah's Witnesses 2,500 - 5,000 Boy and Girl Scouts, Clergy, Communists, Czechs, Deportees, Greeks, Political Prisoners, Other POWs, Resistance Fighters, Serbs, Socialists, Trade Unionists, Others: Unknown Table assembled from figures quoted by Milton; Lukas 38-39, 232; Gilbert 824; Berenbaum 123; and Holocaust Internet information sites. Table Source Link. see? that loooks like a lot more than 11 million Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metacast Posted February 25, 2006 #110 Share Posted February 25, 2006 (edited) So if this guy did deny it once, but no longer denies it, but for some reason they are bringing up the charges again, and giving him three years... then this is my progressive guess. He now preaches the same story we do. It did happen. He admits it. Lawmakers want to start the unneccecary case so they can get the anti-holocoust denial laws repealed for the unfairness of the situation. Then as planned, certain individuals and groups in the background powers can start their anti-sentimism programs furthering their program in polarizing opinions for their occult nwo agenda. it could be... its something to think abut. but realisticly this isnt true unless we watch it happen. then we can say this was the case. Edited February 25, 2006 by ADbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
__Kratos__ Posted February 25, 2006 #111 Share Posted February 25, 2006 So if this guy did deny it once, but no longer denies it, but for some reason they are bringing up the charges again, and giving him three years... then this is my progressive guess. He now preaches the same story we do. It did happen. He admits it. You really think so? He's a historian that's been preaching this for years and years, he's not going to really change his mind after a couple months, it's just a ploy to get a lighter sentence. “These Holocaust deniers are very slick people. They justify everything they say with facts and figures.” — Steven Some, Chairman, New Jersey Commission on Holocaust Education Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StalingradK Posted February 26, 2006 #112 Share Posted February 26, 2006 (edited) Rambo... Holocaust, HOL-O-CAUST not World War II. Not Pow's, prisoners. We are talking about the people the NAZI's wanted to commit Genocide on in order to eliminate the entire race or beliefs. It was 11 million. I think I know this subject more than you. My teacher taught us everything about the Holocaust since he's part of the Museum Society for the Holocaust Memorial in D.C. You lose. You don't even have the right sense of the word Holocaust or you would realize it's meaning. Edited February 26, 2006 by StalingradK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metacast Posted February 26, 2006 #113 Share Posted February 26, 2006 (edited) i thought he changed his mind a long time ago. when he read some documents that confirmed it. Edited February 26, 2006 by ADbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamboIII Posted February 26, 2006 #114 Share Posted February 26, 2006 (edited) Rambo... Holocaust, HOL-O-CAUST not World War II. Not Pow's, prisoners. We are talking about the people the NAZI's wanted to commit Genocide on in order to eliminate the entire race or beliefs. It was 11 million. I think I know this subject more than you. My teacher taught us everything about the Holocaust since he's part of the Museum Society for the Holocaust Memorial in D.C. You lose. You don't even have the right sense of the word Holocaust or you would realize it's meaning. lol, you know more than me about the holocaust... how old are you 10, 11? oh wow, your teacher taught it to you! let me just say that a teaching from the museum is a VERY biased teaching... POW's that were included in the list were still killed by Nazis as part of the holocaust. even if you exclude all POW's on the list then there is still more than 11 million people. maybe your teacher should teach you some math next time. ok then tell me me the right meaning of the word holocaust because im sure you dont know it... the fact that you dont know about all these other groups of people other than the Jews just shows your ignorance of the subject. The Jews use the holocaust as propaganda WAY too much, that is why everyone thinks that the Jews were the only group targeted in the Holocaust. In actuallity, Holocaust deaths range up to 25 million max Edited February 26, 2006 by RamboIII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamboIII Posted February 26, 2006 #115 Share Posted February 26, 2006 there were actually more nonJews killed than Jews in the Holocaust, just a litle FYI that i bet you all did not know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellar Posted February 26, 2006 #116 Share Posted February 26, 2006 lol, you know more than me about the holocaust... how old are you 10, 11? Im willing to bet he does, considering he can at least figure out 2006-1991 with any semblance of accuracy. POW's that were included in the list were still killed by Nazis as part of the holocaust. even if you exclude all POW's on the list then there is still more than 11 million people. maybe your teacher should teach you some math next time. *sigh* Casualties of war and casualties of the holocost are two different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamboIII Posted February 26, 2006 #117 Share Posted February 26, 2006 Im willing to bet he does, considering he can at least figure out 2006-1991 with any semblance of accuracy. *sigh* Casualties of war and casualties of the holocost are two different things. i never said they were the same! there were POW's in the concentration camps you ignorant fool, also your first part of the post makes no sense. I also said if you take out ALL POW's (even though they shouldnt be) then there are still more than 11 million dead. This is not my info anyway i copied it from someone elses post. It is by a professor from the University of Arkansas.. i think he/she would know WAY more than you do about the Holocaust say something worth while next time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamboIII Posted February 26, 2006 #118 Share Posted February 26, 2006 there is also the whole deal that more ukranians died than jews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gun Totin' Gerbil Posted March 6, 2006 #119 Share Posted March 6, 2006 the Russians did nothing for the war. many forget that the Soviets were part of the AXIS in the begining of the war. and only became an Ally whenever Germany turned against them. for most of the war The Soviets were on defense against the Germans and only made an actual offensive in the last few months of the war. they really did zip. They were on the defensive until stalingrad in 1942 , from that point on germany was mostly in retreat in russia, how can you say russians were only on the offence in the last few months of the war? , what nonsense . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffybunny Posted March 6, 2006 #120 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Since this thread can not seem to stay on topic there is no need to keep it open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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