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You don't exist, so don't worry about it

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Cantus

Brr... This subject is really dangerous and creepy.. in the past there was a lot of debate about this subject... just remember one thing when you are interested in these kind of "stories".... when all does not exist, then one can murder at will, disregard any moral and ethics.... to go short: it doesn't really matter of we are real or not.. we are here now: so just let us make the best of it!

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Harks

I don't know if this is right, but I heard a saying that said; "Are we a physical being having a spiritual experience or a spiritual being having a physical experience". The theory that we do not exist is just in the practical thinking of man, technically we do not exist. As I have said before there are too many variables to make such a decision about our existence. Quantum physics are being changed all the time because new discoveries and theories are happening each day. How can we be expected to believe each new theory that comes every day, unless we all understand it.

Finally the point about we should not worry about it, does not explain the suffering and hunger of most of the world countries of today. If this is an illusion then a lot of people are having a bad trip. :P

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joc

The obvious problem with the theory of 'all is illusion' is our own consciousness and ability to create thought process. If it is our 'thought process' that has introduced the theory that our 'thought process' doesn't exist then perhaps it does exist after all.

The fact is, things are seldom as they seem. Much of what we think, if not most is indeed illusion. He overlooks one point though....if the building blocks of the universe don't exist...then nothing exists...one cannot get beyond the fact that the essentials do exist, quarks, etc. do exist...while they may not be completely stable...they themselves are not illusion....if they are, then where does that illusion originate?

Edited by joc

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777MileStare

What is between illusion, and the imagination that does exist- that is illusory only when it is accepted as imagination itself? It is the origination of all illusion that is not compatible with the imaginative state, where if it is imagination that creates an illusion equal to the original, where did that grand illusion come from? In other words, how does one learn to acknowledge that if everything that is the universe, including the absolute "nothing" that is inexplicably included (whether anyone likes it or not), has a something in between to be even considered illusory?

It takes, the imaginative state to even get to the point that anything is illusory. That is my point - (being an artist I figure I would say so), but if there is one GRAND ILLUSION, there is one GRAND IMAGINATION behind it - there has to be.

Because if anything, just because it is illusory, being that you don't see (experience) the reality, you don't know everything about what is happening in perceptiveness. Why is it illusion then?

Maybe I was rewording something, I wasn't sure, but if I wasn't, I hope this is at least a bit enlightening.... ( I understand this to be a kind of re-cap of what Joc ^ was saying though - thanks Joc )...

Edited by PFlack

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stellarocks

If this is an illusion...What can we really do?

What can we taste,see,touch,smell, and hear?

What Can WE Change?

If this is an illusion we have the ability to change anything we want because we'd be illusions and everything else would be an illusion as well.

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SparkOfOm

Where there is nothing there is Light

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jeceris

time is an illusion. lunchtime doubly so-douglas adams

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Zombie

I agree with that statment but not all 100 percent I mean sometimes I wonder if i don't exist and I'm only 14 my friend asked me one day just out of nowhere "do you think we exist?" and if more then one person thinks that then who knows what could be true and false.

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Bella-Angelique

I wonder if i don't exist and I'm only 14 my friend asked me one day just out of nowhere "do you think we exist?"

You think therefore you exist.

Science when it does not have absolute answers is as prone to bouts of magical thinking as some of their ancestors the alchemists were.

Do not get caught up in it. Stay level headed and work with reality from everyday life. Learn how educational and governmental systems work. This will help you a lot more than magical thinking practice to alter the realities you are living in.

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777MileStare

Where there is nothing there is Light

So what is the opposite of Light? Something?

Or Everything?

Or the absolute most lacking of all things, people, places, ideas, that are/is nothing that is the DARKEST.

Where would you call it Dark?

& why did you say where anyway?

I thought there was more to where than meets the eye.

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SparkOfOm

The measurement of time was something invented by man so they could schedule meetings and not be late for work... right?

Since time is based on the rotation of the planet, that would mean that other planets have different hours in the day. Wow.. I'd never be on time.

But then again... it's all an illusion.. ha ha.

Curse our finite minds.. *sigh*

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SparkOfOm

Where there is something, there is also light.

ah.. the confusion continues... hehe

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smallpackage

This article is patheticly flawwed and just plain illogical. If this were all an illusion, what is causing the illusion? What created the illusion? God? Is god an illusion too? I don't know about you guys, but even trying to comprehend that is too much for the average brain.

Now that I think about it, if what we individually see is an illusion, then wouldn't we (humans, animals, everything) be telepathicly connected to know what we look like? While reading a book, everyone projects a different world when they read a description. If this theory were true, and I were to look at one of my friends, What I see would be completely different from what they see in the mirror, unless their body has decodable descriptions written all over it. Oh wait, it's an illusion!

Edited by smallpackage

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balbert

Umm If this is an illusion how do you think we can change it?

mabe focusing really hard?

its easy to do it in your mind...just close your eyes and think of anything you want

but how do we make it become reality? hmm...

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Tokoyo

Let's face it, its a stupid theory, for the most part.

I pretty much agree that it's a stupid theory. I would like to point out that it seems to be poor plaigarism off of various Eastern religious concepts, especially (maybe even only) Zen Buddhism. Maybe it'd be more accurate to say the Wests version of Zen Buddhism though, not sure.

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777MileStare

Where there is something, there is also light.

ah.. the confusion continues... hehe

Well, you didn't exactly answer my question. Where do you think nothing is in actuality, since you think there is Light, but the Dark is not a where - where there is an everything in a "where" no different than a somewhere - something?

What continuum of a confusion?

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Nirwana

Real or not I think there's not a single person that can explain how everything started, if we don't exist at all how can we have a mind to start with? I think it's very possible that we're living in an illusion of some kind but "something" has to exist outside of this.. I think it's all a matter of understanding and I think scientists are missing a point, and the point is the things we can't see or measure, the spiritual world I think.

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ai_guardian

The original 'everything is an illusion' article is flawed in a number of ways.

First of all, if everything is an illusion then the the article (theory?) is also an illusion and using the words of the author - 'we shouldn't worry about it', LOL.

Secondly, the flippant use of scientific findings without knowing the true context is a very fatal flaw of any theory. The most obvious is stating that 'virtual' particles wink out of existence yada, yada...and they go into other dimensions or universes or realities, is speculation at best. To prove any such happening is a paradox! What should be noted though is, as much as science tries to get at the truth there are things/phenomena that science does not understand YET.

Thirdly, to base an article around 'reality' and 'illusion' it is a MUST that these terms be defined beyond a shadow of a doubt. What exactly is meant by 'reality' and what exactly is meant by 'illusion', hmmm.

The quality or state of being actual or true.

One, such as a person, an entity, or an event, that is actual: “the weight of history and political realities” (Benno C. Schmidt, Jr.).

The totality of all things possessing actuality, existence, or essence.

That which exists objectively and in fact: Your observations do not seem to be about reality.

...by this everything IS reality. Even if an illusion actually exists - it is reality! If everyone in the world is able to touch you to sense your solidity and you notice that when you run into a solid object there is resistance, is this not objective actual existence? I think the definitions must be more definitive so as to avoid misinterpretations. ie. anything is real that can be measured to have either spatial extents, energy or time between events.

Having said all that, I can see where this 'illusion' obsession derrives from. Partly from Quantum Physics of course but also due to our inability to pinpoint the process for something becoming solid. Higgs boson and higgs field are theorised to account for this but no confirmation yet.

Cheers

Guardian

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DaKong

^^O RLY?

Haha, just kidding :P I went on chat today with my friends and told them about this...

The result? I freaked everyone out so much that one of the mods had to kick me out because according to them I "should just keep being the stupid one" :P

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Tokoyo

people always want to know that the pain and suffering they endure isn't really there, and so that makes their worries dissapear, slightly.

I do not think he should jump the gun and say nothing exists, just because we dont understand the fundelmentals of everything smaller than an electron. we know its there, and what if the 'empty space' is actually full of something. there is no solid evidence its empty, only specualtion.

I could go on, but I'm watching stargate on skyone ( :blush: ), thus from what I just stated, I dont agree with his article, its kind of like a scapegoat. as I do not beleive in good and evil, he's basically saying murder, saddness, hope, love and generousity are not there, that people do not commit or feel the emotions, because people do.

besides, nothing is actually something.

I concur.

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lizzie00014

Once you understand... you are confronted by millions of illusions... because understanding is what causes us to exist in the first place.

You actually don't want yourself to know the truth... if you did... you would kill yourself.

exactly!! U took the words right out of my mouth.

Some people know within themselfs that they can not handle the truth.....so they simply hide themselfs from the truth, well at least thats one way to look at it. :D

Edited by lizzie00014

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anime101

Here's the thing...Illusion is something itself. There is no such thing as absolute nothingness. The air between your molecules, no matter how significantly nano, is something. Illusion is an existance itself. And for illusion to exist, there must be something there to recieve it. It's like the question, "does art have to have an audience to be art?". Well in another context, illusion HAS to have an audience to be an illusion.

It is right that, time does not exist. Time was just a human invention to organize everything. All it is is the rotation and revolution of the earth and universe. Aging is simply our cells dying and reproducing. Keep in mind that there are planets with multiple suns lighting them out there, so they may actually not get day and night at all. Time only belongs to earth (if you wish to believe that life does not exist outside this planet. But I do, so I believe that they have their OWN concept of time).

On another note...I used to believe that perfection did not exist...but looking at the breakdown of atoms to ions to other particles...I realize now that structurly, we are perfect. Because without quarks, bosons would not exist, and therefor ions would not exist, therefor atoms would not exist, there for matter would not exist. As it says, these units go down a long way. Sure our state of minds may not be anywhere near right, and we age to die, but as we live...the way our bodies function together in symmetry to keep us alive...it goes to show that the structure of matter itself is perfect (if I am making sense. I know what I mean in my own mind ^^; )

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O'Malley

(ahem)... maybe nothing isn't something...maybe nothing is really nothing. Perhaps we just can't wrap our human minds around this.

We think "but oh there's always gotta be something, right?" But where is a thought before it becomes a thought, if the universe is expanding, into what is it expanding?

We tend to think everything has a beginning and an end, that things cannot exist without some kind of opposite, that there is always an answer.. but maybe, just maybe the only answer is that that's just the way things are.

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S Sharath Chandra

I think this whole nonsense of extending the rules of the Quantum World to the REAL MACRO world began with the publishing of the book called "Quantum Healing" by none other than Deepak Chopra. He was richly and rightly awarded the IGNOBLE PRIZE for it !!!

The Quantum world is ruled ONLY probablities and probablity density functions and many such uncertainities. Not the real world. Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle, if were to be true in the REAL world, then we couldn't have so precisely placed the International Space Station or the Hubble Telescope or even flown those jet planes, because at any time we could never be sure of both the momentum and the position of the above.

The rules of the Quantum world don't apply to the REAL world and vice versa...

:-)

Sharath

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SparkOfOm

We should all just go to South America and drink some Ayahuasca. Then we'll really see what something from nothing or nothing from something or whatever it is really is :)

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