Was 'U' instructor's speech free - or racist?

[__Kratos__]

Comments a University of Minnesota instructor made at a rally are causing controversy about what is and is not considered racist.

Susana De Leon, an activist and part-time instructor of Mexican-American studies, was involved in a verbal confrontation at the rally in Owatonna.

"Yes, people from Europe are wet backs man... their backs so wet because they had to cross an ocean to get here,” De Leon said at the rally.

De Leon is also an immigration attorney who led the rally in Owatonna.

She added that it is not possible for minorities to be racist against white people.

Nathan Smit, of the Minnesota Coalition for Immigration Reduction, says he felt her comments were racist toward white people.

“It actually almost hurt my feelings,” Smit said.

De Leon said the confrontation escalated because members of the immigration group were being intimidating.

"Eventually they came and shove a sign in my face, and they're murmuring under their breathe the most terrible racist things,” De Leon said. “So there's a point, yes, I take the sign and I take it away."

Another member of the immigration reduction group said it was De Leon who escalated the confrontation – with her words.

"I would never say those things to anybody, even if I didn't like them,” said Paul Westrum. “But the thing is, because she's a minority she thinks she can get by with it."

Vivian Jenkins Nelson, a diversity expert from the Inter-race Institute and author of the ‘Diversity Dictionary’, would not condemn De Leon’s language, but did say it was not helpful.

"There are much bigger conversations that need our attention and effort than name calling at a rally somewhere,” Jenkins Nelson said.

Westrum and Smit said her language would be considered racist if a white person had used those terms.

But Westrum is more angry that she is paid by the public.

"I'd like to see her services terminated,” he said.

University officials declined 5 EYEWITNESS NEWS’s request for an interview, but they said state employees have the same freedoms of speech and have the right to participate in political and social protests.

Source

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It's free speech, I think. I just found it more then amusing. Just...so funny. She is racist against white people though. Kind of out there loud and clear.

“It actually almost hurt my feelings,” Smit said.

[Imaginary Friend]

I think it's the analogy they missed in the whole thing. Akin to the slurs regarding immigrants from Mexico to America, when America was founded by them that invaded from Europe, the native peoples. Akin to what Mexicans and other immigrants are doing as well. Only with respect to the hispanic invasion, we're actually accommodating enough to augment the American way of life to accommodate those that choose not to learn the language, and suffer no incentive to do so because the language conforms to their native tongue so they don't have to.

Is it racist!? Well it's one race calling another a name, so some would say so.

I like this little addendum to her "slur" however, as if because these are the facts, she can say that and not be racist;

She added that it is not possible for minorities to be racist against white people.

Cracker

Casper

Pasty

Pink meat.

Yeah, all those slurs against whites and counting. If they are said to a white person by a person of color are they not a racist? Regardless of being a person of color, per this womans way of thinking, is a minority and as such is not able to speak a racial slur!?

Then what is it if not a slur that denigrates the color, or lack there of, of a persons racial pigment!?

People like this woman crack me up. Then I stop laughing and realize as stupid as she is, and with power, she's far more dangerous than laughably lame.

Edited May 6, 2006 by Imaginary Friend

[RedEyeJedi]

I personally don't see that as racist. She's basically countering racism. Mexicans get called wet-backs, she's just pointing out that white people are not native to America themselves, so she's highlighting hypocrisy.

LOL at the bit you quoted, I was gonna mention that.

[Imaginary Friend]

LOL at the bit you quoted, I was gonna mention that.

Yeah. It's not the first I've heard someone say it, however it always makes me laugh.

[RedEyeJedi]

Yeah. It's not the first I've heard someone say it, however it always makes me laugh.

Hhhmmmm... I actually meant the bit Kratos quoted about almost getting offended, you pipped me to the post. But I do agree that her statement about it not being possible to make racist slurs against whites is a bit silly.

[Imaginary Friend]

Hhhmmmm... I actually meant the bit Kratos quoted about almost getting offended, you pipped me to the post.

Hahaha! Too funny.

I blame it on the impersonal pronoun! (|("LOL That bit you quoted.")

[__Kratos__]

I personally don't see that as racist. She's basically countering racism. Mexicans get called wet-backs, she's just pointing out that white people are not native to America themselves, so she's highlighting hypocrisy.

LOL at the bit you quoted, I was gonna mention that.

The difference between over 500 years ago and now, is that there is a country here now with laws. Not so much hypocrisy.

Just think if the US didn't have laws against immigration, tons and tons of people would flock here in a heart beat and the entire country would crash.

I still welcome legal immigrants to come from where ever.

And that being almost offended part was the part that just made me laugh.

[RedEyeJedi]

The difference between over 500 years ago and now, is that there is a country here now with laws. Not so much hypocrisy.

In my opinion the laws that people lived by 500 years ago in America were much better than any of the laws people live by today. Laws of nature and harmony.

[__Kratos__]

In my opinion the laws that people lived by 500 years ago in America were much better than any of the laws people live by today. Laws of nature and harmony.

So you know nothing about Native American warfare, torture and such? Peace and harmony isn't all of them in the land that is now American.

[RedEyeJedi]

So you know nothing about Native American warfare, torture and such? Peace and harmony isn't all of them in the land that is now American.

Something tells me they were not as brutal as the Europeans. Can't quite think why.

[__Kratos__]

Something tells me they were not as brutal as the Europeans. Can't quite think why.

Well, not many countries in the world weren't forged with war.

[Watzel]

Something tells me they were not as brutal as the Europeans. Can't quite think why.

You are right. They were not AS brutal as the Europeans, they were often more so.

Read up on Indians from Pre America's history before engaging your limited intellect.

[PLO]

LOL watzel, maybe you should read up on the effects of european migration into the Americas and see how europeans decimated hundreds of thousands of native peoples with slavery, warfare and disease, and thats even before the U.S goverment began its practice of genocide against them.

Edited May 7, 2006 by PLO

[shikon1]

native american torture was pretty brutal and eurpoean tortures were that much worse but hey it happened like 500 years ago so whats the point of arguing about it now?

oh yeah that was a racist comment, just because shes mexican dosent mean shes immune to being racist, and about the wet-back thing.........its called a boat

Edited May 7, 2006 by shikon1

[truthorder]

So you know nothing about Native American warfare, torture and such? Peace and harmony isn't all of them in the land that is now American.

Ummmmm, I'm Native American.

Wanna get into this?

Wanna get into what the settlers did to MY people?

I'm an American and I support my country. But that doesn't mean I don't neglect what has happened to the history of my people.

In our nation's capitol....our NATION'S CAPITOL.....their football team is nicknamed the "Redskins"

Now tell me something. What would happen if a school, ANY school, or professional team decided to call themselves the "Blackskins" or the "Whiteskins"?

There would be a serious uproar and you know it.

Before you go and talk a bunch of crap about how Native Americans mistreated others, how about you go and take a look at your history and recognize that people INVADED this land, and TOOK this land for their own?

Wanna talk about the Trail of Tears for a little while?

[Talon]

She added that it is not possible for minorities to be racist against white people.

What a load of ****.

she's just pointing out that white people are not native to America themselves, so she's highlighting hypocrisy.

And what? You think she's any more native to America with a name like that?

[__Kratos__]

Before you go and talk a bunch of crap about how Native Americans mistreated others, how about you go and take a look at your history and recognize that people INVADED this land, and TOOK this land for their own?

I wasn't saying natives were blood thirsty animals or that they were horrible people. I was just saying they weren't all peaceful like RedEyeJedi said. Basically every culture has it's skeletons. Many nations are forged on war. Just here (in the US), it was the natives that got beaten.

What a load of ****.

About my same exact words.

[Grandpa Greenman]

She added that it is not possible for minorities to be racist against white people.

Talon you right on the money. I have been in situations were I was the victim of racism. I worked in a factory where there were a large number of blacks. I got a long fine with everyone but this one bunch. They would start every phrase they spoke to me with "You white people..." I finally told them they were being racist. It started to get worse at that point until one of my buds who was about 6'4 and Black told them to back off. So then they went on to pick on someone else. My bud and I pointed out what was going on to the boss and it was long before those guys were out. They were just bullies but they were black racist bullies.

My objection to the mass immigration problem is not who they are but what they are doing to wages. People come and are willing to work for close to nothing that undermines wages. That is why no one will do those jobs; you can't live off the wage they pay unless you live in a house with 25 other people. If it keeps up America will be just like where they came from and we will all be knocking on Canada’s door and they aren't going to let us in.

[Watzel]

"LOL watzel, maybe you should read up on the effects of european migration into the Americas and see how europeans decimated hundreds of thousands of native peoples with slavery, warfare and disease, and thats even before the U.S goverment began its practice of genocide against them."

I am very familiar with quite a bit of history. Enough to know that when one person of a particular race says that another race is more brutal, it is nothing more than a racist comment that reflects ignorance.

Every race of people on earth have at one time brutalized others and other races. So just picking out one and saying they are worse is lame and brain dead. As one person said on here, what's the point of pulling up the brutality of our human history? I see it as just a way to provoke hatred.

It happened a long time ago, learn from it and get over it. If you cannot say something that teaches others benevolence then do the world a favor and keep your gob shut.

[PLO]

lol, a few things i couldnt understand in your reply. You said.

"I am very familiar with quite a bit of history. Enough to know that when one person of a particular race says that another race is more brutal, it is nothing more than a racist comment that reflects ignorance"

but before that you said this.

"They were not AS brutal as the Europeans, they were often more so"

Now you just kinda implied that not only are you racist, but your an ignorant one at that.

"So just picking out one and saying they are worse is lame and brain dead"

no it isnt, and i agree theres certainly two sides of every story, especialy when it involves "terrorism" but paticular cases in history have highlighted certain groups as being worse. Its hardly "brain dead" to say the Peoples Republic of China were clearly much worse than say, Tibetan monks? as Chinea when invadin Tibet had a peculiar habbit of executing the pacifist monks. So it could be said, China was far worse than the average tibetan monk.

"As one person said on here, what's the point of pulling up the brutality of our human history?"

BEcuase your not going to learn anything if you dont put things into their context, including the historical one, it just so happens oddly enough our history is covered in the blood of others, much like today.

"If you cannot say something that teaches others benevolence then do the world a favor and keep your gob shut"

that isnt very benevolant.

Edited May 7, 2006 by PLO

[supercar]

Before you go and talk a bunch of crap about how Native Americans mistreated others, how about you go and take a look at your history and recognize that people INVADED this land, and TOOK this land for their own?

The Native Americans are the ones who invaded when they marched across the Bering Strait thousands of years ago!

Sure the Spanish basically started a holocaust when they came to America. But when Cortez overthrew the Aztecs guess who helped him? Other indigenous peoples. Other indigenous people helped start the holocaust against 'their own' people.

[Guest Lottie]

Watzel and PLO,

Keep the insults to yourselves and read this again: http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...showtopic=68673

[PLO]

where insults?

[Watzel]

As I said, every race of people on earth have been guilty of brutality.

What are you trying to say PLO, that their is some superior race on earth that is not capable of being cruel to others? I think by implying that you may in fact be just making it clear that you have a problem of being racist.

[PLO]

"What are you trying to say PLO, that their is some superior race on earth that is not capable of being cruel to others?"

thats not what i said at all or even implied, and if your going to twist words about with the affect of coming to different conclusions at least use some wit. But its an interesting point you got there, becuase the answer to that question would be yes and no, yes i beleive we, humanity have the capability to abstain from such cruelty, why certain people can propogate such cruelty, i do not know. I do not however beleive this in a mad Nietzschian/Hitler-esque Superman kind of way if thats what you were trying to imply. By the way you should actually read some Nietzsche and his concepts of a superman and see how Hitler completely twisted everything he was trying to tell or even warn people about.