ivytheplant Posted June 20, 2006 #101 Share Posted June 20, 2006 2. "it's God's work because the bible says so" if i wrote down in a book that i was the one that created eveything, would you believe me???? NO Not to mention it's a circular argument to try to prove the Bible is true by saying what's in the Bible is true. Like saying God exists, therefore God is real. That's pretty much the only "logic" I've seen. And it isn't even logic. It's a logical fallacy at best. Sigh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idriss Posted June 20, 2006 #102 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Not to mention it's a circular argument to try to prove the Bible is true by saying what's in the Bible is true. Like saying God exists, therefore God is real. That's pretty much the only "logic" I've seen. And it isn't even logic. It's a logical fallacy at best. Sigh... agreed, i have yet to see ONE PIECE of hard evidence that something was true in the bible i doubt this would ever happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exeller Posted June 20, 2006 Author #103 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Let me tell ya what. Like I've said probably 30 times before, I'm a Bahai, and as a bahai, ww3 is something I believe in. I believe that ww3 will be a thermonuclear war. Right after the war is over, a meteor will strike earth and kill off lots of people. Though alot of people will die from the later affects of bombs. Then, an earthquake so strong the whole world will feel it, around 12 on the richter scale. Then finaly, a change in the earths crust. "When the fourth wind of destruction is let loose, there will be a rapid slipping of the earth's crust. The north pole will move into the Lake Baikal area of Siberia. The United states will move southward about four thousand miles toward the equator. Because of the equatorial bulge which raises the sea level a mile at the equator, most of the areas of the United States that are less than a mile above sea level will be under water. There will be volcanic eruptions which will cause enormous amounts of ash to be thrown into the earth's atmosphere. Looking at the sun and the moon through the volcanic ash will cause the sun to be obscured from view as though it became black. The moon will appear to be red like blood as it does when it sets on the horizon. When the volcanoes erupt, molten rock and lava will be thrown into the atmosphere. When they fall back to earth it will seem as though "the stars of the sky fell to the earth". As the earth's crust shifts thousands of miles, the sky will be misplaced. Much of the land will be inundated. Mountains and islands will disappear or rise from ocean or sea bottoms and they will be moved to different places. With the second, third and fourth winds of destruction another one third of the world's population will be killed. When the four winds of destruction are finished, only one third of the world's population will be left alive." Then Jesus returns. As a Bahai this is just something I believe in, and if you want a reason, go to this website. Everything I've talked about is included, and reasons are given for these beliefs, but I'm expecting no one will read it. http://uhj.net/armageddon.htm The reason I say it will happen in around 5-10 years is that is around the time Iran will acquire the a-bomb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyny Posted June 20, 2006 #104 Share Posted June 20, 2006 oh but apprently the bible can?!!!!!! i wholeheartedly believe in Science at least it has EVIDENCE that things are real lol so when is WW3 starting? i see we have another 'prophet' on our hands. please warn me so i may be able to fully join with the anti-christ's army and lead the rebellion against this when we win you may be spared lol Ya know what I BELIEVE IN GOD...and no i'm not shoving it down anybodys throat because its a statement of faith!! Science is THE most inconsistent, FLAWED and wonderful thing...i like parts of science, i dislike other parts. BUT when it comes to using science as a backbone for a belief I DONT THINK SO. Science is sooooo inconsistant, they cant even make a computer without finding a way to better it 2 months later. And science is that way with EVERYTHING, they always prove themselves wrong one way or another... God does not change his mind and he is NEVER inconsistant! God wont say well maybe i didnt create man on the 6th day i got that wrong.....NOPE i dont think so. So you "evolutionists" believe what you want i choose to believe that i am worth something, not just a piece of dirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwyny Posted June 20, 2006 #105 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Well....yeah. Why wouldn't you? It's not like it's obvious where that's from.. A circle does not have a beginning or an end, that's why it's a circle. You have not actually proven a single thing. All you have said is that since you think that the only cause for the universe's existence could be god, so that means he definetely exists. Don't talk down to people and assume they don't understand-it's your logic that's flawed. There is no possible way to prove either the existence or non-existence of a god. It's all about how you reason it to yourself. Everybody just leave everyone else alone. This topic is one big troll machine and I'm requesting it to be closed. yeah it does...you draw a circle you have to start somewhere and guess what it ends at the same place it starts, giving you an illusion that you have brain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exeller Posted June 20, 2006 Author #106 Share Posted June 20, 2006 God does not change his mind and he is NEVER inconsistant! God wont say well maybe i didnt create man on the 6th day i got that wrong.....NOPE i dont think so. So you "evolutionists" believe what you want i choose to believe that i am worth something, not just a piece of dirt. Can someone explain this to me. Really, please, this God created the blahblah 6 days thing. I don't get it. Is it a christian belief? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivytheplant Posted June 20, 2006 #107 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Ya know what I BELIEVE IN GOD...and no i'm not shoving it down anybodys throat because its a statement of faith!! Of course you're not and we appreciate that. I do have to point out a couple of things though... Science is THE most inconsistent, FLAWED and wonderful thing...i like parts of science, i dislike other parts. BUT when it comes to using science as a backbone for a belief I DONT THINK SO. Science is sooooo inconsistant, they cant even make a computer without finding a way to better it 2 months later. And science is that way with EVERYTHING, they always prove themselves wrong one way or another... But that's the beauty of science! It's not that scientists "change their mind" or are "inconsistent." Far from it. They formulate theories with the evidence at hand. Someday, the evidence changes and the theory must change. If the sun doesn't come up tomorrow, then we have to create a new theory about the sun rising. Science doesn't "prove itself wrong" because you can't prove or disprove anything in science. All you can do is falsify one theory. So using the sun analogy, if the sun doesn't come up tomorrow, then the theory that the sun rises every morning has been falsified and we now have a theory that the sun won't rise. Then, one day, the sun might rise again and the theory that it doesn't rise has been falsified and a new theory that the sun rises has been formulated. Also, you can't use science as a "belief." People who claim science is a religion and that people just merely "believe" in science is silly. You can't merely believe what science tells you to believe. You have to look it up yourself, research it yourself, and come to your own conclusions based on the evidence. Anyone who knows anything about science understands this. THAT'S how science works. It's a beautiful thing. God does not change his mind and he is NEVER inconsistant! God wont say well maybe i didnt create man on the 6th day i got that wrong.....NOPE i dont think so. So you "evolutionists" believe what you want i choose to believe that i am worth something, not just a piece of dirt. It's not evolution that says man was created out of dirt. It's the Bible that says that. yeah it does...you draw a circle you have to start somewhere and guess what it ends at the same place it starts, giving you an illusion that you have brain! As I (and others) have already pointed out, a circle is a symbol of renewal. Of neverending. Which was pointed out here. Just in case it's too much effort to look it up (a trend I've noticed), "Like JMPD1 said, then it's not a circle. A circle, by it's nature, continues the cycle. All you said is that the artist ended drawing his circle and that the paper ended its life when it decayed. The circle itself, has not ended. There's a reason the circle has been used in religious and spiritual practices all around the world. It is a symbol of cycles, renewed life, of neverending. Think." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivytheplant Posted June 20, 2006 #108 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Let me tell ya what. Like I've said probably 30 times before, I'm a Bahai, and as a bahai, ww3 is something I believe in. Sorry, I don't recall you saying anything about being Bahai at all in this thread. I also am unfamiliar with Bahai beliefs and since you named Jesus as returning, I assumed you were of a Christian belief system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exeller Posted June 20, 2006 Author #109 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Ivyplant I don't think you are aware, but I answered your question about my beliefs of WW3. Anyway if you are, good for you, just need to clerify, if I spelled that right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big cheese Posted June 20, 2006 #110 Share Posted June 20, 2006 (edited) Ya know what I BELIEVE IN GOD...and no i'm not shoving it down anybodys throat because its a statement of faith!! Science is THE most inconsistent, FLAWED and wonderful thing...i like parts of science, i dislike other parts. BUT when it comes to using science as a backbone for a belief I DONT THINK SO. Science is sooooo inconsistant, they cant even make a computer without finding a way to better it 2 months later. And science is that way with EVERYTHING, they always prove themselves wrong one way or another... God does not change his mind and he is NEVER inconsistant! God wont say well maybe i didnt create man on the 6th day i got that wrong.....NOPE i dont think so. So you "evolutionists" believe what you want i choose to believe that i am worth something, not just a piece of dirt. Id argue it’s your understanding and knowledge of science that is flawed and inconstant. Time and time again you are shown what real evidence is and proofs of a cobrative nature yet you choose to interpret those proofs as inconstant we can show you over and over how its your understanding that leads to your Doubs but you don’t want to see that and infact you cant and will never see that but that’s ok. Your argument s are weak but that’s ok too your logic is flawed and that’s ok too you see its ok to not understand we’ll forgive you for that. Theres a hissy fit if ive ever seen one, I <3 all the bold and "eeeeeeeeeeeee"'s and as far as a circle having an end it does, if you dont understand what I said, I understand (even though it takes not much energy to do so). Nothing else i say at this point will matter because you will not listen, just like you didnt listen to anything I've already said, but in the end we shall see, even though I’ve proven god exists. I could prove all day but if you choose to be ignorant, Ignorant you shall be A circle isn’t a circle until its, completed then if it is a circle its biggining and end are indisiferable form any other point within its circumference so you are talking complete rubbish. Your attitude is exactly what is fundamentally wrong with religion the numbing of intellect .you make weak arguments based on a flawed logic .you haven’t proven god exists only that you are incapable of serious debate closed to new ideas and suffer a predisposition to making silly inane statements with nothing other than statments to back them up but again as I said to gwyn that’s ok I feel had you understood the comments made by other posters who I might add made perfect sense you would make a more interesting debater . You make the bold comment that your existence is proof of gods so i ask you your parents had nothing to do with it ? Your genes did not give you the colour eyes you have? .As you Christians are so fond of saying you can never know the mind of god how do you know if he is consistent . I challenge you to offer your proofs for scrutiny show your source for this proof or is it just words and hot air as i suspect Edited June 20, 2006 by Big cheese Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaoszerg Posted June 20, 2006 #111 Share Posted June 20, 2006 (edited) thank you exe11er for replying to my post Edited June 20, 2006 by chaoszerg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 20, 2006 #112 Share Posted June 20, 2006 (edited) Theres a hissy fit if ive ever seen one, I <3 all the bold and "eeeeeeeeeeeee"'s and as far as a circle having an end it does, if you dont understand what I said, I understand (even though it takes not much energy to do so). Nothing else i say at this point will matter because you will not listen, just like you didnt listen to anything I've already said, but in the end we shall see, even though Ive proven god exists. I could prove all day but if you choose to be ignorant, Ignorant you shall be. Good luck in life. and there-after LOL you would KNOW a hissy fit from BM if you REALLY SAW IT trust me the post above is far from it...ohh wait you call it one cuz I pointed out a few lil truths about you pouncing on Stellar for sharing his views...when you say you couldn't make head nor tail of them No I can't listen...but I read does that help?? ohh and btw JMPD was the 1st to say this to you about the circle..but read the above post here from BIG CHESE..he has already quoted you on the circle.... There is a big difference in someone showing you how ignorant you where towards a non believer, by 1st - Saying you can't make out his posts 2nd- Saying you couldb't make head nor tail of his rambling...I guess you could say 3rd was when you called it all RAMBLING in what you call ignorance..hun it's NOT ignorance when we ALL pointed this out to you......scroll back hun...a few more gave you the same as me.....so when BM here was one of many that pointed out your arrogance ...you get all in my face Ohh well at least I wasn't the 1st to post my thoughts to you on what you said to Stellar....incase it didn't escape your notice...I only did it to make you see that ignorance & arrogance does not help your matters...showing arrogance towards a non believer only makes you look bad, not the NB....If I was an non believer...and I had you to TRY and influence me to follow God...I think after your arrogance I would laugh and walk away from you far far away LOL because you go about it the wrong way..you make people wanna go against following god..a lot of religious folk do this and dont realize they are turning people off the idea of God... Edited June 20, 2006 by Beckys_Mom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 20, 2006 #113 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Ya know what I BELIEVE IN GOD...God does not change his mind and he is NEVER inconsistant! God wont say well maybe i didnt create man on the 6th day i got that wrong.....NOPE i dont think so. So you "evolutionists" believe what you want i choose to believe that i am worth something, not just a piece of dirt. So are you saying...you KNOW for a fact God does not change his mind..and you know for sure he is NEVER inconsistant?? Or could it be a case of....you BELIEVE in your mind?? ANd those that follow evolution, don't think you are a peice of dirt..we arent that....billions of years ago we evolved from bacteria...but remember it took so long...but if you dont believe in it..thats fine..no hassle....you aint the only one that don't believe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big cheese Posted June 20, 2006 #114 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Id like to point out Bm that most people offering more probable alternatives to biblical accounts aren’t doing so as to prove the non existence of god. We can’t do that anymore than a believer can prove it exists out side of a human construct. For me I can only offer facts and proven principle regarding observable mechanisms as to whether god exists or not what ever the word god implies I can honestly say I don’t know either way as there is nothing to base an opinion on other than words. Religious ideologies are an entirely different ball game thoe and as you correctly point out its these narrow minded people who spout meaningless diatribes without really knowing what there talking about that give other believers like your self a bad name (not that I hold you in the same regards) its a shame that a few bad apples spoil an otherwise interesting debate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaoszerg Posted June 20, 2006 #115 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Does it really matter if any of us believe or not . So what if some of us dont believe in god does it really matter. If you believers keep your faith then your fine are you not? Us non believers are not going to screw up your chance of getting into heaven or where ever it is you are going to go when you die are we? We have all chosen our own path so why does it matter if some of us decide to wander off the same course you belivers decide to go. Lol cant we all just get along Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 20, 2006 #116 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Id like to point out Bm that most people offering more probable alternatives to biblical accounts aren’t doing so as to prove the non existence of god. We can’t do that anymore than a believer can prove it exists out side of a human construct. For me I can only offer facts and proven principle regarding observable mechanisms as to whether god exists or not what ever the word god implies I can honestly say I don’t know either way as there is nothing to base an opinion on other than words. Religious ideologies are an entirely different ball game thoe and as you correctly point out its these narrow minded people who spout meaningless diatribes without really knowing what there talking about that give other believers like your self a bad name (not that I hold you in the same regards) its a shame that a few bad apples spoil an otherwise interesting debate I don't know WHY religious people think that for some strange reason..when someone talks about evolution...they assume this must mean there is NO GOD??? WHY do these people think this??? its a big million dollar question I guess it's madness....I mean if a lot of these people used their heads wisely, and thought about it...they would SEE that evolution is NOT saying there is no God....and if they used their heads again, they would understand that NO ONE can or can't prove there is a God..cuz they are only following a faith...so whats the big deal?? I say God could well be responcible for evolution, but there is not one jabronie here can prove to me that my theory is wrong...not even the big cheese himself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivytheplant Posted June 20, 2006 #117 Share Posted June 20, 2006 (edited) So are you saying...you KNOW for a fact God does not change his mind..and you know for sure he is NEVER inconsistant?? Or could it be a case of....you BELIEVE in your mind?? ANd those that follow evolution, don't think you are a peice of dirt..we arent that....billions of years ago we evolved from bacteria...but remember it took so long...but if you dont believe in it..thats fine..no hassle....you aint the only one that don't believe So, if God doesn't change his mind, and the Bible is filled with God changing his mind...then either the Bible is lying or God is just as fickle as the rest of us humans. I don't know about you BM, but it makes sense to me! Edited June 20, 2006 by ivytheplant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keira Posted June 20, 2006 #118 Share Posted June 20, 2006 The thing that is getting to me about this is the way you talk of God like it is a fact. It isn't. No, science can't dissprove the fact that God exsists, but the Bible can not prove it either. Just because it says in a book that there is a God does not make it the truth. I'm completely fine with believers. I have a lot of friends who follow the word of the Bible and i'm fine with that. But really, do you think your actually going to change any people views by posting your comments? Yes, this is a very good topic and is probably making a lot of people think, but don't expect people to change thier views because of it. There is as much evidence to say that God doesn't exsist as there is saying that he does. Its just one of those things that we all have to decide for ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckys_Mom Posted June 20, 2006 #119 Share Posted June 20, 2006 So, if God doesn't change his mind, and the Bible is filled with God changing his mind...then either the Bible is lying or God is just as fickle as the rest of us humans. I don't know about you BM, but it makes sense to me! Hmm good points ivy...see if they believe the bible is Gods actual fact words..then God must change his mind more than once ..as it is very contradicting...but see I find it hard to believe that they are Gods words...cuz God is not that stupid to contradict himself..so IF I where to say..the bible is Gods words...then I may as well say God is stupid Lets see how many ignore the lil word I added in --> IF- LOL its fun when people ignore it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellar Posted June 20, 2006 #120 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Science is sooooo inconsistant, they cant even make a computer without finding a way to better it 2 months later. Perhaps thats because as technology advances, new architectures become possible to create... ever think of that one? Its funny how you falt science for being "inconsistant". That, imo, shows a lack of proper understanding of how science works. Its very rarely inconsistant, infact, its more often expanding upon itsself in order to be closer and closer to the truth. Wouldnt this be more preferable than than being consistantly wrong? As for religion... Im suprised that you can say that science is inconsistant but not your religion. Your churches have made unsupported claims for many years, and were stubborn enough to oppose what science said... until they couldnt deny it anymore... kind of like the whole idea of the Earth being round and Earth being the center of the universe... And science is that way with EVERYTHING, they always prove themselves wrong one way or another... Please show me an example of things in modern science being proven wrong? God does not change his mind and he is NEVER inconsistant! God wont say well maybe i didnt create man on the 6th day i got that wrong.....NOPE i dont think so. God tried to make Lucifer the most beautiful and perfect angel, no? How did that turn out? So you "evolutionists" believe what you want i choose to believe that i am worth something, not just a piece of dirt. Alright. I think your mistakenly under the impression that your "feeling" or your "desire" is actually worth anything though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaoszerg Posted June 20, 2006 #121 Share Posted June 20, 2006 The thing that is getting to me about this is the way you talk of God like it is a fact. It isn't. No, science can't dissprove the fact that God exsists, but the Bible can not prove it either. Just because it says in a book that there is a God does not make it the truth. good point. If there is a book on lets say the care bears does that mean the care bears are real creatures. I would hope not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivytheplant Posted June 20, 2006 #122 Share Posted June 20, 2006 If there is a book on lets say the care bears does that mean the care bears are real creatures. I would hope not Next you'll say My Little Ponies aren't real either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaoszerg Posted June 20, 2006 #123 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Next you'll say My Little Ponies aren't real either! Brace yourself and sit down.....i dont know how to break this to you. the talking magical my little ponies.................there not real im sorry lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keira Posted June 20, 2006 #124 Share Posted June 20, 2006 OMG! Go ahead and ruin a girls dreams why don't you! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_sasquatch_hunter Posted June 20, 2006 #125 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Brace yourself and sit down.....i dont know how to break this to you. the talking magical my little ponies.................there not real im sorry lol LOL. Cruel man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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