Online Telekinesis Experiments

[Virtual Particle]

Unfortunately, the internet is one of the most resourceful, yet deceiving places one can visit. It is also a place where one can falsify their identity, and claim irrational statements. It's like spam in an e-mail; you have to look through a bunch of crap to find one valid e-mail.

I agree but truthfully one can say the same thing about dating or investing in the stock market. Human endeavors are full of those who see a way to take advantage; the paranormal simply is no different. In relation to same (human endeavors) the term "Caveat Emptor' is always applicable and in relation to these online telekinesis experiments they are free.

I agree, everyone here at UM is interested in a phenomenon, one way or another, just in what aspect. I personally am interested in his area, but I have my resonable doubt. Which may not be a bad thing.

One of the issues I consistently bring up is with respect to interacting with indigenous cultures, this because my initial exposure to the paranormal, entailed interacting with such peoples. The term reasonable doubt is most applied in relation to matters of jurisprudence in which there is a defense to a particular issue, as well as prosecutor, a judge and often a jury. It seems clear though that what you are suggesting is that you simply have not had the type of experiences which suggest validity of psi in your mind (you did mention that before). He is a question; if psi were put on trial could an impartial jury be found?

I do not see disbelief of psi as "bad" but I do feel that the Radin meta-analysis does in fact confer reasonable doubt in favor of psi, as well as the consistency, in relation to the effort to experimentally quantify the phenomenon that would be what it is all about.

Any thoughts?

[durnut]

Here is a question; if psi were put on trial could an impartial jury be found?

That's actually a good question, one that I can't give an answer to. Unless by an extremely rare occurrence of chance, I don't believe psi could have an impartial jury. Only due to the fact of how controversial it is, yet at the same time, it may be a lot easier to find an impartial jury then one would expect. So Triad, I cannot give you an answer to your question.

I do not see disbelief of psi as "bad" but I do feel that the Radin meta-analysis does in fact confer reasonable doubt in favor of psi, as well as the consistency, in relation to the effort to experimentally quantify the phenomenon that would be what it is all about.

I can see the point you are trying to make, I believe I used "Reasonable doubt" in the wrong context. I should have used the word doubts instead.

Edited September 11, 2006 by durnut

[Virtual Particle]

Durnut doubts are not a problem here is a rather weird but enlightening way to spend an afternoon. Take a car in good working condition to ten mechanics in your local area and complain about a problem (make one up). See how many of them will agree with you that there is definitely something wrong and then ask for an estimate for repairs (see how that changes if you send your wife or girlfriend).

In relation to psi sure, there are scoundrels, crooks and thieves who will take advantage of little old ladies in wheelchairs who can only see through one eye is deaf and her only son died during desert storm, but then again, so will just about anyone else in respect to any other chosen vocation she happens to need. Recently here in Miami we had a doctor who's specialty was treating cancer patients, he was referring them to a pharmacy which would give them a discount (not much of a discount) and it turned out, that the medicine they so desperately needed, included a "filler', they were only getting half the dosage they needed to treat there disease.

Ok so maybe the little old lady also had cancer and she was seeing the above doctor, she gave the idiot $20 and he or she told he her dead husband was still alive in some godly way.

You see this is what ticks me off about skeptics who argue that psi cannot be real and there must be a struggle against those who claim otherwise. Lets face it, in relation to all the crap one has to confront in respect to day to day life, some idiot comes along and provides you with crap that is actually positive...that is no reason to blame Psi.

Any thoughts??

[durnut]

Triad, I am not trying to tick you off. I am mearly saying that I will be more open of the respectible claims people will have. I will just still have my doubts about it, I just won't say it's impossible, just improbible, from my point of view that's all. I apologize if I have caused you dismay in anyway at all.

[Virtual Particle]

I am not upset with you Durnut if anything those last comments were a rant in relation to Ai behavior. I do understand doubts, just in light of all the other problems with respect to the world that some come here and behave as Ai did is hard for me to really fathom. Any way again, I do appreciate your thoughtful responses and hope that you will try the advise I gave you, the relationship between the paranormal and emotion is very clear, so in relation to how your thinking is organized there is an effect.

Like when a person ends a relationship, one of the reasons it takes so long to get over it, is because neural connections have formed and changes need to be made before those feeling are easily disregarded.

Any thoughts?

[durnut]

Well, I just got out of two relationships back to back, not that I wanted to lose them. One day at a time I guess.

I baisically took a look at it this way, how can I be honest to myself and fair to others, if I go about things with a one track mind. I would like people to be understaning and give me the benefit of the doubt if I had a claim. I feel I have a better outlook on life now, more than ever, since my last two relationships. I wasn't given a chance to show them my potential. I dont want to be like that anymore. So Triad, I thank you for your input. I'm happy with my new outlook on the world. Much thanks.

[Jaguat]

Well Triad I have had a lot of fun watching you and ai guardian having a great debate b/w the 2 of you but I eventually had to have an input due to the lack of scientific facts that you, Triad have put across. The Russians did a lot of research in this feild as they were hoping to use people with psi ability to try and infiltrarate/influence the American defence Program. Unfortunately the Russians got few results that supported their hopes that psi would help them to destroy the Americans, There have been several docos that show the lack of results that have been shown that show that even the Russians became sceptical of the use of psi. I would suggest a thorough research through the archives of the SPR ( Society of Psychic Research) to show how the results changed through the advancement of technology and the advancement of the human race in general. These experiments keep popping up every decade and still show no conclusive results.

I would suggest a look at ALL of the psi institutes on all continents and their results before the insults start

[Virtual Particle]

Jaguat there is another thread which presents evidence specific to the most recent research in the US offering conclusive evidence, but as far as its application as a weapon, take into consideration that kind of interpretation is more in tune with fiction from the context of what the internet publically has to offer.

In relation to remote viewing there has been some interesting data, which all the major powers deny at present they are working on. But then again, governments denial in relation to all sorts of issues is not a rubber stamp, what it leaves is questions, especially in relation to the fact, that all the major powers maintain extremely high levels of security, in relation to exactly what they are doing. Now, I am sure you can find links which claim otherwise and if you do searches for the alternative opinion an equal number of links will appear.....

The bottom line is, until governments of the world decide to become totally open about what exactly they are researching or you by some special clearance are prepared to allow us access to CIA, KGB,....files, we really are just spinning our wheels here and wasting gas. So let me just say that I am very glad you enjoyed the conversation but in respect to your response I have looked at research through out the world and to be clear perhaps you should take into consideration the first Journal entry in SPR...

Random Generators and Living Systems as Targets in Retro-PK Experiments

Helmut Schmidt

ABSTRACT: PK efforts by one subject on two kinds of prerecorded time intervals were compared. One kind was provided by the durations of successive breathing cycles of a human subject. The other kind was computer generated, with the help of a true random number generator, such as to match the breathing cycles with regard to average length and variance. After the prerecording of the interval lengths, each interval received a random target assignment, long or short, specifying the direction of the PK effort. An audio feedback had a built-in inversion provision, however, so that the subject listened to tones of varying durations with the goal of always extending the durations of the tones. The subject succeeded in this task by purposeful PK missing by means of getting mentally and physically tense and then desperately attempting to shorten the tone intervals. With both kinds of intervals 20 sessions were held, each session containing 40 time intervals. The subject could not consciously distinguish between the two kinds. The PK-effect on the actual breathing intervals was significant with z=3.17 (p=.00076, one-tailed). The scoring on the other intervals was lower, z=1.68 (p=.046, one-tailed), but the difference is not statistically significant.

Link

Any thoughts?

PS: Glad you enjoyed the conversation now consider this

Edited September 16, 2006 by Triad

[durnut]

Here is a link I am contributing to the psychic group out there. I find it ironic that I took this test for the first time and I scored a 51% or something like that. Like the page says, dont make any conclusions on just one test. Then I clicked one number 25 times and scored a 33 percent. Anything under 28% isn't sufficent enough to say you may have psychic abilities. Enjoy.

[Atheist God]

Here is a link I am contributing to the psychic group out there. I find it ironic that I took this test for the first time and I scored a 51% or something like that. Like the page says, dont make any conclusions on just one test. Then I clicked one number 25 times and scored a 33 percent. Anything under 28% isn't sufficent enough to say you may have psychic abilities. Enjoy.

I scored 60% just guessing.....

[Virtual Particle]

As far as this type of testing I have not presented nor will I ever offer an endorsement in relation to such. In respect to the paranormal research I have presented conclusions are made as a result of many times more, than what this implies as offering validity.

Furthermore, what has been presented by me applies true random number generators which use unpredictable quantum fluctuations as a source for there randomness.....

http://noosphere.princeton.edu/measurement.html

Not certain here Durnut, but are you actually trying to suggest there is a comparison???

Any thoughts?

Edited September 17, 2006 by Triad

[durnut]

Here is a link I am contributing to the psychic group out there.

Triad, as you can see, I was specific in my wording to clear up any confusion. Obviously, if someone is psychic, then they would clearly be able to foresee the outcome.

As for your question, no, I am not comparing the two tests, just simply offering an online test for the psychic group.

Edited September 17, 2006 by durnut

[Virtual Particle]

Ok I understand where you are coming from in all sincerity (as stated) I tend not to endorse such tests specifically because they are not under the direction of qualified testing procedures. But it does seem quite innocent and as you’re suggesting a welcome alternative to what has been offered to date. Would only add that with respect to trying this, repeating the test (without guessing) several hundred times and then assessing the responses would be a good way to evaluate the results.

Any thoughts?

[durnut]

Agreed, when a test is repeated, and is successfully passed several hundred times, then I would say almost all possibility of randomness is out of the equation.

[Virtual Particle]

In actuality Durnut what you have presented is a variant of the clasic Zener test....

http://www.scientificpsychic.com/esp/esptest.html

A computerized version of the official test that saves your results can be downloaded from ScientificPsychic.Com.

The actual download for the test can be found here...

http://www.scientificpsychic.com/paranormal.html

Here is one that also keeps score but does not have to be downloaded...

http://www.hexatron.com/psi/index.html?

Any thoughts?

Edited September 18, 2006 by Triad

[durnut]

Wow, I must say I am impressed with myself, 13 out of 20 guesses were correct. However, I do understand this means nothing, as it was only 20 questions and I do not believe myself to be psychic. I would only pass this off as chance for myself. Who knows, maybe I am psychic.

[Virtual Particle]

That a big advantage one has with these experiments it can be done in the privacy of your own home and one can set up protocols and run ones own statistical analysis. An important point here is not to maintain the same standard as time goes along, increase

your expectations in relation to what to you is significant.

Any thoughts?

[miyako]

http://www.fourmilab.ch/rpkp/experiments/bellcurve/

This is an actual running effort to test PK ability, there is a demo, practice and record modes, the later actually enter data into the experiment.

Any thoughts?

my final score:24

[The Bapao Guy]

If you click that you want it to go left, it goes to the right. If you click you want it to go right, it goes left.

A fake, that's for sure.

[mewtwo]

Is this one posted yet?

http://www.psychic-experiences.com/psychic...inesis-test.php

This one seems pretty straight-forward.