Debunking the Disclosure Project

[drew hempel]

Oh yeah thanks for the verification

Even though you keep saying eyewitness testimony means nothing, I'll accept you did see a black triangular craft.

But did the triangle craft land and the pilots get out and explain to you the working of the propulsion system?

How do you know it was powered by this stuff?

I don't expect any proof but you can explain your reasoning.

Here's details on the black triangle propulsion system -- http://robocat.users.btopenworld.com/tr3b.htm

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 26 2006, 05:44 AM' post='1365605']

Here's your explanation for the 1952 D.C. flap: http://www.shout.net/~bigred/UFOsWrit.htm

Are you serious???

Get the real story!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ <^>

1952 Washington D.C. UFO Incidents

http://www.ufocasebook.com/washingtondc1952.html

July 13: 0400 EDT.

National Airlines plane en route to National Airport, about 60 mi. SW of the city observed a blue- white ball of light hovering to the west. Object then "came up to 11,000 ft. [and] then maintained a parallel course, on the same level, at the same speed, until the aircraft pilot turned on all lights. Object then departed from the vicinity at an estimated 1000 m.p.h. Weather was excellent for observation." The crew said the object "took off up and away." No other air traffic was reported in the area at the time. (AF Int.)

http://www.project1947.com/fig/1952d.htm

“…the skies above the nation's capital were crowded with UFOs darting here and there, over the White House, over the Capitol Building, over the Pentagon“.

“They were seen from the ground, seen and also detected on radar from control towers at Washington National Airport, Bolling Air Force Base across the Potomac River, and from nearby Andrews Air Force Base. The radar operators conferred by telephone to ensure they were tracking the same targets. In many cases, airline pilots flying in the area were able to provide visual confirmation of radar tracking.”

“The appearance of unidentified objects flying with impunity over the heart of the American government and its military establishment was embarrassing to the Department of Defense, whose responsibility it was to protect the country from airborne intrusion. A flood of questions from reporters led the U.S. Air Force to call its biggest but also most embarrassed and confused press conference since World War II.”

http://ufologie.net/htm/usa1952.htm

The Book

http://www.amazon.com/Invasion-Washington-...l/dp/0380814706

“It was Saturday night, July 19, 1952 -- 50 years ago this weekend -- one of the most famous dates in the bizarre history of UFOs. Before the night was over, a pilot reported seeing unexplained objects, radar at two local Air Force bases -- Andrews and Bolling -- picked up the UFOs, and two Air Force F-94 jets streaked over Washington, searching for flying saucers.”

“Then, a week later, it happened all over again -- more UFOs on the radar screen, more jets scrambled over Washington. Across America, the story of jets chasing UFOs over the White House knocked the Korean War and the presidential campaign off the front pages of newspapers.”

" 'Saucer' Outran Jet, Pilot Reveals," read the banner headline in The Washington Post.

"JETS CHASE D.C. SKY GHOSTS," screamed the New York Daily News.

"AERIAL WHATZITS BUZZ D.C. AGAIN!" shouted the Washington Daily News.

http://www.amazon.com/Invasion-Washington-...l/dp/0380814706

“Airline, civil and military pilots described the objects as looking like the lit end of a cigarette or a cluster of orange and red lights. “

“One jet pilot observed 4 lights in the vicinity of Andrews Air Force Base, but was not able to over-take them, and they disappeared in about two minutes.”

http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc892.htm

“Around midnight on July 19, 1952, radar operators at Washington National Airport noted several 'blips' on the radar over Washington D.C. (15 miles from the Washington National airport). These objects appeared to be traveling at 100 to 130 m.p.h. and would then suddenly accelerate to unbelievable speeds - sometimes in excess of 7,200 m.p.h. Washington National radar operators immediately contacted a local radio operator who confirmed that he too was tracking the objects. With two confirmations in hand they decided to further clarify the situation with Andrews Air Force Base.”

http://www.spartechsoftware.com/dimensions...OWashington.htm

----------------------------------------------------------------------------- <^>

Now, once again, Drew, show us where those UFOs were conventional aircraft.

Edited September 26, 2006 by skyeagle409

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 26 2006, 06:06 AM' post='1365619']

Look -- you post a photo that's his OLD results while his latest is 250 pounds plus lift. Again this is just one guy doing his own research. AGAIN YOU ARE BEING MISLEADING WITH PHOTOS -- CAUSE YOU CAN'T READ!! HAHA

Sorry, but that has nothing to do with the UFOs of recorded history nor the incidents that have been presented by the Disclosure Witnesses.

Edited September 26, 2006 by skyeagle409

[drew hempel]

Sorry, but that has nothing to do with the UFOs of recorded history nor the incidents that have been presented by the Disclosure Witnesses.

"conventional craft" -- once again we agree! Certainly what was seen in D.C. 1952 was NOT conventional craft.

Now consider this really good article by Richard Dolan on black triangles. Dolan's UFO is another one I recommend, forward by Jacque Vallee (I had to bike out the suburbs to read Dolan's book but it was worth it!!)

http://www.greatdreams.com/ufos/Triangle-ufos.htm

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 26 2006, 06:34 AM' post='1365638']

"conventional craft" -- once again we agree! Certainly what was seen in D.C. 1952 was NOT conventional craft.

You can definitely believe that! We didn't have aircraft that could fly at 7000+ mph in 1952

[skyeagle409]

To further add:

Radar Tracks Blips and Blobs

Author's Note: Since 1952, when my article "What Radar Tells About Flying Saucers," was published in TRUE, radar has played a vital part in building up proof of UFO reality

"Considering the objects' relative position, just before they vanished, this last would require a speed of from 5,000 to 7,000 mph. At the time, this seemed unbelievable to Barnes and the other controllers. But Captain Pierman later confirmed the objects' tremendous speed."

"They'd go up and down at terrific speed, or streak off and disappear. Between Washington and Martinsburg, we saw six of these fast-moving lights. (Control Center radar showed them at the same position.) I don't know what they were, but they weren't shooting stars."

"Another confirmation of the visitors' incredible speed came later that night, from the Washington tower. Operator Joe Zacko had been watching the A.S.R. scope when one of the mystery objects abruptly appeared just west of Andrews Field. Unlike the slower M.E.W., the A.S.R., with its 28-rpm antenna, can track extremely high speeds. As Zacko watched, fascinated, the blips made a bright streak or trail, heading north-northeast toward Riverdale. Then the trail ended as swiftly as it had come.

Howard Cocklin, hastily called over by Zacko, also saw the bright trail. Together they figured the object's speed from its trace."

"It had been making two miles per second-7,200 m.p.h. "It was as if it had descended rapidly, almost vertically," Cocklin told me later. "That would bring it suddenly into the A.S.R. beam area. It seemed to level off for those few seconds, and then abruptly ascend out of the beam again."

http://users.ev1.net/~seektress/blip.htm

Edited September 26, 2006 by skyeagle409

[lacotta]

Download the Documentary with Torrent!

Doc:Black Box UFO Secrets(6th file)

Also Military (Nighthawk F-117A) encounter with UFO....If they didn't know about, then who the hell was there?

Check this out!

wiki:UFO - look for file "twiningopinionamc_23sept47.pd"

Edited September 26, 2006 by lacotta

[rapid7]

Look -- you post a photo that's his OLD results while his latest is 250 pounds plus lift. Again this is just one guy doing his own research. AGAIN YOU ARE BEING MISLEADING WITH PHOTOS -- CAUSE YOU CAN'T READ!! HAHA

His latest experiment is a lifter which weights a maximum (with payload) of wait for it- 25O grams! Not pounds. Btw it can only lift 60 g.

That's grams btw, it can't pull 60 G turns or anything.

So, it's you who cannot read. Basic observation skills.. go unobserved, yet again.

How's this for a misleading photo.

Source http://jlnlabs.imars.com/lifters/maximus2/index.htm

Edited September 26, 2006 by rapid7

[contactismade]

Don't even bother rapid, that stuff clears his head by 6 feet or so.

I seen that lifter demonstrated in a garage too bad it requires so much juice.

[drew hempel]

You can definitely believe that! We didn't have aircraft that could fly at 7000+ mph in 1952

Nick Redfern on black triangles: "The earliest report which we were able to uncover dated from September 1952 and concerned the sighting of triangular-shaped UFOs seen during a NATO exercise called ‘Mainbrace’. Significantly, UFOs were witnessed by military personnel reported throughout Mainbrace, including a now-famous encounter reported by half a dozen Royal Air Force personnel stationed at RAF Topcliffe in Yorkshire who saw a circular shaped UFO operating near the airfield."

[drew hempel]

His latest experiment is a lifter which weights a maximum (with payload) of wait for it- 25O grams! Not pounds. Btw it can only lift 60 g.

That's grams btw, it can't pull 60 G turns or anything.

So, it's you who cannot read. Basic observation skills.. go unobserved, yet again.

How's this for a misleading photo.

Source http://jlnlabs.imars.com/lifters/maximus2/index.htm

Well it's the principle that counts! Here you go -- not your garage project and it's public domain so...

The microwave electro-thermal (MET) thruster using water vapor propellant

Brandenburg, J.E. Kline, J. Sullivan, D.

Kennedy Space Center, Univ. of Central Florida, Kennedy Space Center, FL, USA;

This paper appears in: Plasma Science, IEEE Transactions on

Publication Date: April 2005

Volume: 33, Issue: 2, Part 2

On page(s): 776- 782

ISSN: 0093-3813

INSPEC Accession Number: 8398059

Digital Object Identifier: 10.1109/TPS.2005.845252

Posted online: 2005-04-18 09:10:47.0

Abstract

The research to develop the microwave electro-thermal (MET) thruster at Research Support Instruments, Inc. (RSI) using a variety of gases as fuel is described. The MET has undergone dramatic evolution since its first inception, and it is now moving toward flight development. The MET uses an electrodeless, vortex-stabilized microwave discharge to superheat gas for propulsion. In its simplest design, the MET uses a directly driven resonant cavity empty of anything except gaseous propellant and the microwave fields that heat it. It is a robust, simple, inexpensive thruster with high efficiency, and has been scaled successfully to operate at 100 W, 1 kW, and 50 kW using 7.5-, 2.45-, and 0.915-GHz microwaves respectively. The 50-KW, 0.915-GHz test was perhaps the highest power demonstration of any steady-state Electric thruster. The MET can use a variety of gases for fuel but the use of water vapor has been shown to give superior performance, with a measured specific impulse (I/sub sp/) of greater than 800 s. When this added to the safety, ease of storage and transfer, and wide availability of water in space, the potential exists for using a water-fueled MET as the core propulsion system for refuelable space platforms

[Jjbreen]

You can definitely believe that! We didn't have aircraft that could fly at 7000+ mph in 1952

I often wonder at statements like this -

My question would be: And you know this for certain, how?? You have access to what to back this statement?

There is enough evidence out there that Zero G goes back to the 1920's - based on some records and research - you can find it online, just search engine it.

In fact -> here just a quick: Zero Gravity 1920

(NO, I didn't check them all - but skimmed)

http://www.google.com/search?q=Zero+Gravit....netscape:en-US

My hat goes off to the dude that started the Propaganda Doctrine - "Man kind is to stupid to have this kind of technology!" The dude that started this, must of done his home work on how to sell Propaganda Doctrine!

There is enough recent 40+ years of history of "technology" we simply were not suppose to have, until it was shown we did. Who knows what is still 'out there' that we don't know about??

J -

Edited September 26, 2006 by Jjbreen

[rapid7]

Well it's the principle that counts! Here you go -- not your garage project and it's public domain so...

Oh right, so we're onto a new propulsion system. Theoretical or established?

Let me guess- it’s already been perfected by zie Nazis 60 yrs ago.

The microwave electro-thermal (MET) thruster using water vapor propellant

Abstract

In its simplest design, the MET uses a directly driven resonant cavity empty of anything except gaseous propellant and the microwave fields that heat it. It is a robust, simple, inexpensive thruster

Ok, so it's a thruster, So what?

Did this power the triangle craft?

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 26 2006, 05:10 PM' post='1366072']

Nick Redfern on black triangles: "The earliest report which we were able to uncover dated from September 1952 and concerned the sighting of triangular-shaped UFOs seen during a NATO exercise called ‘Mainbrace’. Significantly, UFOs were witnessed by military personnel reported throughout Mainbrace, including a now-famous encounter reported by half a dozen Royal Air Force personnel stationed at RAF Topcliffe in Yorkshire who saw a circular shaped UFO operating near the airfield."

"Black Triangles" were also sighted during the 1940's as well.

[rapid7]

Here's details on the black triangle propulsion system -- http://robocat.users.btopenworld.com/tr3b.htm

Yeah, I'm aware of the TR-3B and I'm aware how its alleged existence became known into the public domain.

A speech given at the International UFO Congress, in Laughlin, Nevada in 1998 by Edgar Rothschild Fouche, (an engineer who claims to have worked at Area 51), suggests that the Black Triangle is a Top Secret, experimental, U.S. Air Force vehicle known as the TR-3B, code named "Astra".

Everything you want to know about the Black triangles at a glance

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TR-3B_Astra

If a conventional nuclear reactor is used it must be designed in an unconventional way which looks suspiciously like impossible technology for this time period.

Btw Drew the link you selected is nothing special, there are many different theories speculating upon the type of propulsion system used by the TR-3B. If it even exists

Which one is correct? Do you know? Click

[skyeagle409]

name='Jjbreen' date='Sep 26 2006, 06:57 PM' post='1366196']

I often wonder at statements like this -

My question would be: And you know this for certain, how?? You have access to what to back this statement?

I don't have access to anything of that nature but I do know that if you have a secret aircraft you would not parade it over a major metropolitan area at night with lights ablazing while cruising around 100 to 130 mph and then allowing your secret aircraft to conduct exotic acrobatics that violate most of the federal flight regulations governing flight operations within airspace over cities. Should your secret aircraft malfunction and crash in the middle of that city, then you can bet you last dollar that your secret aircraft won't remain secret for very long.

Our first supersonic fighter was the F-100 and it first flew in 1953, which was months after the Washington UFO incidents took place and the F-100 was not capable of reaching mach 2 either, yet those UFOs were zooming off at velocities beyond mach 9 without creating a sonic boom. There are places where secret operations are conducted and the prohibited flight zones over our nation's capital are not considered flight test zones for secret aircraft.

Edited September 27, 2006 by skyeagle409

[drew hempel]

"Black Triangles" were also sighted during the 1940's as well.

Right -- but there's a well-documented record of fraud going all the way back to the sightings in the 1890s -- Redfern is going with just unquestionable documents from well qualified sources.

Consider Greg Bishop's expose on fraud and disinformation promoting the "alien invasion" propaganda vis a vis secret aircraft:

http://excludedmiddle.com

Flying Saucers You Have Swallowed

A Short History of UFO Hoaxes is found on Greg Bishops website -- above link -- just go into his archives for the zine.

MORE DETAIL ON CIA DISINFORMATION PROMOTING THE ALIEN INVASION.

Project Beta and Underground Bases

An Interview With Greg Bishop

Dateline: Tuesday, July 12, 2005

By: STUART MILLER

By: Phenomena News Editor

Phenomena News Editor, Stuart Miller, talks to Project Beta author Greg Bishop about how many of the cornerstones upon which today's ufological lore are built had their origins in the fertile minds of military intelligence and the behind-the-scenes spook-brigade.

SM: In our prior email correspondence, you commented about a slightly negative review of the book that had appeared on Amazon.

GB: The guy gave it five stars but he said he didn’t know if any of it was true and that the premise of the book was that everything about UFOs was made up by the government. He either didn’t read the book or he read it with a preconception that he kept.

SM: I’ll tell you something. When Nick (Redfern) launched the book publicly, Nick’s emails everywhere were the first I think that most people knew about the book……….

GB: Oh really? God, I have even more to thank him for than I thought I did. I just saw a couple of the reviews he put up. They were really positive and I was very happy about it.

SM: Oh he did, he reached out and really pushed very hard and got others to get behind it too. Let’s put it this way, I don’t think the UFO community could not have known the book was coming out. But the point I wanted to make was, to an extent, Nick’s email gave that same impression. Maybe that guy read it and just absorbed it and went into the book with that attitude. Nick had certainly convinced me, before I’d started to read the book, that all of ufology was a myth and it was a very pleasant surprise to open the book to realise that that’s not what you’re saying.

GB: I’m saying that a great deal of the wackier elements of ufology, especially the stuff that happened about underground bases, exchange of technology and that aliens seeded the planet with religious leaders, all that’s either been made up or capitalised on by the Intelligence agencies. It’s hard to get that across to someone who has no grounding whatsoever in the field, and that’s the kind of people who want to buy the book so it has to have some kind of point, and you can’t have these grey areas where people get disinterested or confused.

SM: But the difficulty with this stuff is, well for example, a letter would have been sent to Bennewitz and within that letter, there would be a large element of disinformation and made up crap and so on, but there would also be elements of truth and the trick is to identify those elements that are true. I can’t remember the name of the air force officer who wrote a particular letter to Bennewitz, it’s the one where he goes on about the four rolls of film, but then he goes on about Roswell. Now if you weren’t reading that within this book and knowing that a substantial part of it was a load of bunk, it’s very compelling. It’s the sort of thing you not only want to read but also to believe.

GB: Yeah, exactly. I think they tapped into that “want to believe” vein very well and the main reason was to keep people away from sensitive air force projects and the secondary reason was to find out who was interested, why, and what they think. And the third reason, which not many people talk about but which I think makes a lot of sense is that they got off on it. They thought it was kind of funny.

SM: What, just basically yanking people’s chains?

GB: Any job you do there are boring parts and standard parts, and these are government people. They were actually leading these people on a wild goose chase and that is the point of counter intelligence, to lead people away from what they didn’t want them to see. Well, they did that and they also capitalised on these stories. Rick Doty grilled Bill Moore on different aspects of the UFO phenomenon – its history, different cases etc and then capitalised on those when talking to other people. Like for instance Linda Howe; I mentioned that little episode in the book too.

I already posted this....

Greg Bishop - Part Two

Dateline: Tuesday, July 12, 2005

By: STUART MILLERBy: Phenomena News Editor

Part Two of Stuart Miller's chat to Project Beta author Greg Bishop about how many of the cornerstones upon which today's ufological lore are built had their origins in the fertile minds of military intelligence and the behind-the-scenes spook-brigade continues...

SM: You’ve said there that all these intelligence agencies knew what they were doing but the impression in the book is that they didn’t. It sounds like a chaotic mess on Kirtland. The NSA were involved in projects on Kirtland and Doty didn’t know about them.

GB: Exactly. They wouldn’t tell what they were doing. There might have been somebody at the base who sort of knew what was going on but the intelligence agencies at least back then, I don’t know how they’re going to be doing things now, they were very secretive even with other intelligence people because you don’t know who these people are. Even if they’re checked out, they’re not cleared to know what Project “X” is so you’re not going to tell them about it unless you absolutely have to.If Doty needed to know they were putting together some sort of system to encrypt messages or communications with weapons or something like that, they’d tell him. But if he wasn’t, they wouldn’t tell him and they’d keep him in the dark about it and as far as Doty or anybody else was concerned, they had no business to ask. And if they didn’t get a straight answer, they would drop it. The fact that they’re so secretive between each other causes these problems and makes it kind of comical, yes, but the reason for it is just the weird echelons of who needs to know what.

SM: What is your impression of Richard Doty? What do you think of him?

GB: Let’s see. I think he enjoyed that job. Keeping secrets, lying to people, keeping things from some people and not from others, having access to something that most people don’t; he enjoyed that. A lot of people would. I don’t know if I’d enjoy lying to people and playing games with them, I’m not that kind of person, but his personality was such that I think he likes to do that. Personally, when I met him, he didn’t say anything cryptic, he didn’t give me the impression he was trying to mess with me but since I knew he was that kind of person, I could pick some of those things out. While I was sitting there I just kind of let it all flow. He didn’t let me record it and I had to remember everything he said and immediately run back to the hotel and take two hours typing up everything he said so I wouldn’t forget it.

SM: That was actually my next question; you said he bull sh**ted you to a degree and you explained your criterion for actually putting information he gave you for putting into the book. Could you give me an example of something he told you that wasn’t true or you didn’t believe was true and didn’t end up in the book?

GB: He told me that one time Paul had been given a contract to work on something for the air force and he had gone out to this testing area out in the mountains near Albuquerque to do this on government land. He said while he was there he saw a UFO and took pictures of it, really good pictures. He told Doty about it and Doty had to go later to his house when Paul wasn’t there and replace the pictures Bennewitz had taken with blank frames and keep that information for the government. I was thinking, “Well there’s no way I can find this out. It sounds interesting but I don’t know whether I can put it in the book.”Then I get back and I was talking with Bill about it and he starts laughing so I ask him why? He said that’s just like Rick and he’s come out with that story before with people and he’s never seen it in the literature or anything and he know its complete junk.But the thing was, I think he was telling me that to let me know that’s what he did with Paul generally anyway. He’d go into the house, they’d find things which were sensitive and take them and either not replace them or replace them with blank frames and just generally keep tabs on him and keep the most sensitive stuff, whatever that might be. I think he was giving me a little hint there as to his modus operandi and what was going on with the fake story.There was a physicist from the air force who did the same thing with me. He didn’t really tell me fake stories but he would answer questions I asked him later in the conversation or the next day or the next week or the next month, in another way. It’s a very weird thing. It takes time to pick up on this and realise that’s what’s going on. I didn’t realise it until I got home. I thought, “Oh my god, he’s giving me a hint about what was going on at the base by not answering my question directly but telling me to look in a certain area.” This guy drove me on to Kirtland air force base and drove me around and showed me things. This physicist is now in his 70s and he was in charge of a lot of things on the base and I asked him what they were so interested in, a fairly straight forward question. And he said he wasn’t really sure and there were a lot of things going on at the base at the time. He didn’t think it was the electro magnetic testing platform because that turned out that it didn’t do the job it was supposed to do after all that effort. Most of it is underground now and he drove me by it and I saw these antennas on top of it and there are bunkers underground and they do the testing under there now so you can’t see it.But he also drove me near the Manzano weapons complex and at one end there’s the Star Fire optical range. And we could see it from the road there.

Edited September 27, 2006 by drew hempel

[drew hempel]

I don't have access to anything of that nature but I do know that if you have a secret aircraft you would not parade it over a major metropolitan area at night with lights ablazing while cruising around 100 to 130 mph and then allowing your secret aircraft to conduct exotic acrobatics that violate most of the federal flight regulations governing flight operations within airspace over cities. Should your secret aircraft malfunction and crash in the middle of that city, then you can bet you last dollar that your secret aircraft won't remain secret for very long.

Our first supersonic fighter was the F-100 and it first flew in 1953, which was months after the Washington UFO incidents took place and the F-100 was not capable of reaching mach 2 either, yet those UFOs were zooming off at velocities beyond mach 9 without creating a sonic boom. There are places where secret operations are conducted and the prohibited flight zones over our nation's capital are not considered flight test zones for secret aircraft.

Secret -- like the Bin Laden-Bush attacks on the Pentagon!

Flying Saucers You Have Swallowed

A Short History of UFO Hoaxing

© 1995 By Gregory Bishop

"You cannot depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus"--Mark Twain

No one likes to be the butt of a joke. To protect ourselves from embarrassment, some may never admit that they have been fooled, even if evidence to the contrary is presented afterwards. The wacky world of ufology has always been a fertile field for hoaxers and charlatans of every persuasion. While most four-color glossy tabloids screaming from the newsstand tout the latest photo, sighting, or revelation of conspiracy, none of them (save possibly Fortean Times) seem ready to deal with the shady art of the hoaxer, exposing our vulnerability to suggestion.

When British geezers Doug Bower and Dave Chorley confessed that they (among others) had created many, if not all of the crop circles in Southern England, there were two reactions. By far the most popular one was the "Oh, we knew it all along" school. This was the view perpetrated by the press with the usual tongue-in-cheek attitude. For the rest of us, immediate denial took hold. "How could they have done all of those things?" Both of these views spring from the same basic need: "THEY CAN'T FOOL ME!" A look at the history of UFO hoaxing can be considered an exercise in caution and the eagerness to grab on to the first thing that attracts, or turning on the filters before a situation is completely understood. Anyone can look stupid when fooled by an everyday office prank, but this is as nothing compared to the world-class jackass status achieved by vocal support of cream-of-the-crop saucer events that turn sour.

The "golden age" of ufology (at least in the publishing world) latched on to many of the earliest airship stories of the late 19th century to try and prove the durability of the phenomenon. Without exception, the authors of the 1950s, and '60s took the newspaper accounts at face value, never bothering to cross-check the stories. Par for the course was the story of the "Great Kansas Cownapping."

The Yates Center Farmer's Advocate of April 23, 1897 reported on patriotically-named Alexander Hamilton, and his story of an airship which had 'napped one of his prize heifers. A respected farmer, Hamilton was not one to just make things up. His story, however, seems almost prophetic, given modern accounts of anomalous livestock tampering:

Last Monday night at about 10:30 we were wakened by a noise among the cattle. I arose thinking that perhaps my bulldog was performing pranks, but upon going to the door saw to my utter astonishment that an airship was slowly descending upon my cow lot, about 40 rods [600 feet] from the house... It consisted of a great cigar-shaped portion, possibly three hundred feet long, with a carriage underneath. The carriage was made of glass or some other transparent substance alternating with a narrow strip of some material. It was brightly lighted within and everything was plainly visible--it was occupied by six of the strangest beings I ever saw. They were jabbering together, but we could not understand a word they said. Every part of the vessel which was not transparent was of a dark reddish color. We stood mute with wonder and fright. Then some noise attracted their attention and they turned a light directly upon us. Immediately on catching sight of us they turned on some unknown power, and a great turbine wheel, about thirty feet in diameter, which was revolving slowly below the craft, began to buzz and the vessel rose as lightly as a bird. When about three hundred feet above us it seemed to pause and hover directly above a two-year-old heifer which was bawling and jumping, apparently fast in the fence. Going to her, we found some material fastened in a slip knot around her neck and going up to the vessel...We tried to get it off but could not, so we cut the [fence] wire loose to see the ship, heifer and all, rise slowly, disappearing in the northwest.

Hamilton then related that the cow's hide was found later in another field, with only his brand to identify its dried hulk, and no tracks left in the soft ground around it. The statement was followed by a sworn affidavit by 12 prominent members of the community, from bankers and judges to the town postmaster. No less an illustrious figure than Jacques Valée championed the case, citing it as one the earliest examples of a solid UFO report. The validity of the story was never checked with anyone in Yates Center until Jerome Clark, acting on a tip from Bob Rickard of Fortean Times actually took the amazing step of writing to the paper that published the original story. Ninety three-year-old Ethel Shaw wrote back, describing how as a 14-year-old girl, she had been in the Hamilton home when Alexander came in and declared to his wife, "Ma, I fixed up quite a story and told the boys in town and it will come out in the Advocate this weekend." Mrs. Shaw also revealed that the affidavit signers were all members of the local liars club, who used to try to top each others' tall tales. The group broke up soon after Hamilton's prank, which is not surprising considering the way in which the cownapping legend took hold. The account was reprinted with embellishments and artists' conceptions in countries as far away as France.

Another early story which most every wide-eyed hopeful ufologist has read concerns the little Texas town of Aurora and the strange permanent inhabitant of the local cemetery, said to be the victim of a crashed airship. The Firesign Theatre wove this event into the storyline of their 1974 album Everything You Know Is Wrong. "Not from around here, but a real square little fellow" read the epitaph on the alien's gravestone. The actual events surrounding the story are much stranger than even these formidable talents could make them.

Early on the morning of June 14, 1973, someone sneaked into the cemetery and stole the tombstone, which bore a crudely carved outline of a flying saucer on it. The jokesters, hoaxters, or shadowy sinister meddlers then poked "long, slender, pointed saw-toothed metal probes" into the ground to remove whatever they could from underneath the site. The perpetrators, according to one investigator, "knew what they were after and also must have tried to get specimen remains of the occupant's body, clothing, or something to identify him by. The whole grave robbery was handled in a thoroughly professional manner." It may be speculated that one of our favorite shadow groups who really run the government wanted the prize for their own, but thereafter MUFON and NICAP descended upon the story like kids after free candy. Both unequivocally supported the spaceman stories. Walt Andrus, then and present director of MUFON, fought tooth and nail with the Aurora Cemetery Association for the rights to exhume and examine the remaining remains. He never got them to relent. Eventually, guards had to be posted at night due to souvenir hunters. Jim and Coral Lorenzen of the Aerial Phenomena Research Organization suddenly became skeptical about Aurora, even after supporting other more wild tales from around the globe. Perhaps they simply wanted to disagree with Andrus and the NICAP cronies for the sake of showing them up, but they were to be vindicated (in a roundabout way) on this occasion.

The only source for the original story was published in the Dallas Morning News of April 19, 1897. The reporter, F.E. Hayden described the scene in Aurora's town square at 6:00 AM of that fateful day. An airship, obviously experiencing some sort of breakdown, came sailing toward the town:

...it was making a speed of only ten or twelve miles an hour, and gradually settling toward earth. It sailed over the public square and when it reached the north part of town [it] collided with the tower of Judge Proctor's windmill and went to pieces with a terrific explosion, scattering debris over several acres of ground...The pilot of the ship is supposed to have been the only one aboard, and while his remains are badly disfigured, enough of the original has been picked up to show that he was not an inhabitant of this world...Papers found on his person--evidently the records of his travels--are written in some unknown hieroglyphics, and cannot be deciphered. The ship was too badly wrecked to form any conclusion as to its construction or motive power. It was built of an unknown metal, resembling somewhat a mixture of aluminum and silver, and must have weighed several tons...

Some observant readers may catch themes in this story which were to haunt crashed saucer accounts for many decades to come--the strange writing, unknown metal, wreckage strewn "over acres"--these are familiar details from Roswell, Aztec, Corona, and others. Perhaps this is coincidence, perhaps precognition a' la Jules Verne and H.G. Wells. In any case, J. Allen Hynek was interested enough (and believed in the story) to send his Texas friend Donald Hanlon 'round to investigate. He located one Oscar Lowery, who had been eleven years old when the crash occurred. Lowery ventured the opinion that the story had been completely made up by Hayden in order to put Aurora back on the map, since it had been wiped from it by the decision to run the railroad tracks further north, thus effectively cutting off the town from its manifest destiny. He went on to say that Judge Proctor never owned a windmill, and that a lot of people had known the story was a lie because Hayden had talked about it. Later investigations of the crash site with metal detectors and shovels failed to turn up anything more interesting than a few old license plates, stove lids, and the like. (This occurred years before the later squabbles between the ufological factions, and one wonders why this account and others like it were ignored, although it may not be hard to guess.)

One may also wonder why if the spaceman's body was "badly disfigured" in the fiery crash, how any papers found "on his person" could have survived very intact. There are so many questions raised by this event it is hard to believe it wasn't cooked up by F.E. Hayden just as the cownapping tale was: in order to get away with a colossal joke (and in this case maybe bring a few gullible people with money to the struggling and shrinking community.) It worked, but was almost 70 years too late. While other airship accounts are not so easily torn apart, it is important to remember that all experience that is not personal has gone through at least one filter. It is fortunate that a few of the original residents were still alive to contest the story.

Moving us into the glorious age of the contactees is a man named Karl Mekis, who in 1959 announced himself as "Venus Security Commissar On Earth", and sold "survival kits" and jobs for the faithful in the post-take over "World Republic Of Venus." He and a partner had accumulated a fortune in excess of $300,000 before he was caught and ordered to stand trial in an Austrian court.

Mekis was a retired Nazi SS guard who, on a boat on his way to South America met another WWII fugitive, Frank Weber-Richter. The two cooked up a scheme to scare and bilk the public and line their own pockets with space-invasion gold. Setting up their office in Santaigo, Chile, they started buying ads in popular European science-fiction magazines announcing the imminent invasion of Earth by Venusian forces. One of the ads read: "Only a handful of Earth people will be picked to rule with the Venus Masters after the invasion. And you can be one of them--if you act now." Others offered protection for less cash: "World Republic Of Venus. Chauffeur wanted to serve top official of Venus after invasion of Earth."

Showcasing their acquired talents for propaganda, Mekis and Weber-Richter also offered marriage to Venus men for Earth women to build a new "master race." The Venusians were said to be properly white and able to speak in a "clear, intelligent tongue." People sent in their life savings in order to be among the saved on "Day X." (HEY! What's going on here, Ivan Stang?) Their wealth brought them to the attention of the Chilean police, and the two were forced to flee to Italy. After many postponements and delays, they were finally cornered in Austria and Mekis was sent to trial, but his partner escaped. Witnesses described their fear and reactions to the ever escalating stories pouring out of Mekis' offices. One man received a letter warning: "PLANNED INVASION DELAYED. NEED FINANCIAL SUPPORT. PLEASE SEND ALL YOU CAN" and sent in his last $1,100. Other witnesses presented their passports announcing them as official citizens of Venus. Mekis was convicted on seventeen counts of fraud and swindling and sentenced to five years in a cushy Austrian jail.

Here's a note I left at the end of the article which never made it to print, but rediscovering it was a delight:

If we can't overcome the ingrained games, (emotional and intellectual) that we are encouraged and forced to play when confronted with strange and anomalous information, whatever we can learn from studying this subject will be lost on us.

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 27 2006, 02:25 AM' post='1366861']

Right -- but there's a well-documented record of fraud going all the way back to the sightings in the 1890s -- Redfern is going with just unquestionable documents from well qualified sources.

Remember, Nick Redfern also claimed that aliens are real in his books. Regardless, the UFO incidents I have presented are well known and of course, were not hoaxes by any means. In fact, go to your local library and pull out microfilm for August 1952 and further. You will find that the Wasington D.C. UFO incidents were not hoaxes and in fact, knocked everything else off the headlines. In fact, the incidents were responsible for one of the largest press conferences in history, so how did Nick Redfern overlook that fact?

So in that regard, none of the UFO incidents that I have presented have nothing to do with hoaxes and in fact, they are well documented.

Edited September 27, 2006 by skyeagle409

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 27 2006, 02:35 AM' post='1366872']

Secret -- like the Bin Laden-Bush attacks on the Pentagon!

What does President Bush have to do with the attacks on the Pentagon? Your problem is, you spend too much time reading the wrong books.

Flying Saucers You Have Swallowed

You need to stop reading those fictional books and do some real research.

Since I experienced my own UFO sighting over Vietnam in 1968, I can safely say that you are also on the wrong side of the fence, in other words, I know as a matter of fact that UFOs are real and intelligently controlled flying crafts that have nothing to do with conventional aircraft. Add to the fact that my compatriots have verified the Bent-Waters UFO incidents as well.

So now, I would like for you to claim on this board that the Washingtton D.C. UFO incidents were hoaxes and if you do, then I have something for you.

Edited September 27, 2006 by skyeagle409

[drew hempel]

Remember, Nick Redfern also claimed that aliens are real in his books. Regardless, the UFO incidents I have presented are well known and of course, were not hoaxes by any means. In fact, go to your local library and pull out microfilm for August 1952 and further. You will find that the Wasington D.C. UFO incidents were not hoaxes and in fact, knocked everything else off the headlines. In fact, the incidents were responsible for one of the largest press conferences in history, so how did Nick Redfern overlook that fact?

So in that regard, none of the UFO incidents that I have presented have nothing to do with hoaxes and in fact, they are well documented.

Again I totally agree -- Disclosure Project seems to rely (from the D.C. Capitol Press Conference) on well-documented UFO sightings -- NOT ALIENS!!

As Dr. Clarke has verified -- right after the U.S. set up over 10 bases in the U.K. there was a huge spike in UFO sightings! Hmmm... and now the secret UK UFO records have been released.

They were not released previously because of the Cold War and now it's been confirmed that there has been NO ALIEN records in the U.K.

So again -- yes UFO sightings of unconventional craft are quite common (I had one!) and often by police, military, etc. -- but just cuz they're "humanoids" in a "saucer" does not mean they are ALIENS.

haha.

http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2006Sep25/0%2...nUFOs%2C00.html

Here's the latest news on Dr. David Clarke's analysis of the secret UFO files released in 1997 by the UK -- it was in the press on Sept. 25.

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 27 2006, 02:47 AM' post='1366890']

Again I totally agree -- Disclosure Project seems to rely (from the D.C. Capitol Press Conference) on well-documented UFO sightings -- NOT ALIENS!!

LOL!! Many of the witnesses whose cases were presented are well documented, so once again, I find you on the wrong side of the fence. You need to stop reading those comic books.

Now, prove those UFOs over Washington as those of mankind. If you are unable to provide the proof they are those of mankind, then I will figure that you have thrown in the towel.

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 27 2006, 02:47 AM' post='1366890']

http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2006Sep25/0%2...nUFOs%2C00.html

Here's the latest news on Dr. David Clarke's analysis of the secret UFO files released in 1997 by the UK -- it was in the press on Sept. 25.

You posted a reference that mentions the British MoD??? Weren't you aware that it was the British MoD that claimed the "Haut Memo" didn't exist in their closet? I wondered who offered them the towel to wipe the mud off of their faces when the British MoD had pulled the "Haut Memo" out of their closet under the watchful eyes of the public, the same public who were told by the British MoD that the "Haut Memo," which was released by them, didn't exist.

Put down that comic book, Drew! Your comic books are sources of laughs, not facts! The British MoD is a partner in government UFO cover-ups.

The Halt Memo the British MoD denied exisited.

http://www.geocities.com/area51/cavern/1001/memo.html

Edited September 27, 2006 by skyeagle409

[drew hempel]

LOL!! Many of the witnesses whose cases were presented are well documented, so once again, I find you on the wrong side of the fence. You need to stop reading those comic books.

Now, prove those UFOs over Washington as those of mankind. If you are unable to provide the proof they are those of mankind, then I will figure that you have thrown in the towel.

Look I just posted Nick Redfern's NATO records stating in 1952 there were aircraft that fit the capabilites of the D.C. sightings -- yet you have chosen to ignore this information!

What obfuscation you practice!!

Now consider the "earlier" black triangle sightings -- I just read through them and none of them are qualified sightings -- they're all ambiguous! The first one is in france -- but it's objects of all shapes, the others are over the moon.

The only sightings in 1940s of black triangles occur in 1946!!

So again this technology was picked up during WWII.

http://dbarkertv.com/FTHistory.htm

And just for the record -- I'VE NEVER READ A COMIC BOOK IN MY LIFE!!

[skyeagle409]

name='drew hempel' date='Sep 27 2006, 03:10 AM' post='1366913']

Look I just posted Nick Redfern's NATO records stating in 1952 there were aircraft that fit the capabilites of the D.C. sightings

Drew, listen very carefully! Your comic books are not viable sources of information on UFOs. We didn't have aircraff that could fly at 7000 mph in 1952, much less have 10-12 of them flying through prohibited flight zones while breaking many other CAA regulations of 1952 regarding flight operations near airports and over our nation's capital.

Sorry, but no secret aircraft involved in the 1952Washington UFO incidents.

I almost forgot to add that if you really want to read what happened over Washington in 1952, read the following publication at your library and you will see that the Washington UFO incidents involved no aircraft at all as responsible for those incidents and please bring it to the attention of Nick Redfern as well.

LIFE Magazine, August 4, 1952, Pages 39-40

Edited September 27, 2006 by skyeagle409