Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
RedEyeJedi

Don't join the army

155 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

Stellar

What the hell are you talking about? Are you sure we're not talking about 2 different things? I never stated an opinion on war tactics.

Indeed you did when you said that its no good seeking out the enemy where they are, but we should sit here and wait for them to attack us.

I've only stated that I don't like the way the army treats some people.

No...not only did you say that what the army does is wrong, but you said that you dont like the way the army treats people, not some people, but people in general.

Everytime you quoted me, you quoted me talking about the ones who actually DO do that.

No, you werent talking about that. You were talking in general. You said that the military screws you up, breaks you down and turns you into ruthless killing machines. You never said "it does that to some people."

I'm talking about the ones who tell them they are nothing, tells them they are garbage, and nothing buy maggots, etc...

OMG! The military huts the recruits's feelings! OMG!!! :cry:

What do you want them to do? Build an army or raise kittens?

Whats the big deal if that happens during basic? Its meant to weed out the weak, and strengthen those who are left. Those who cant take it, 1. Dont belong in the army and 2. Never should have joined.

Jeez, next you'll be complaining that the military puts them in harms way :rolleyes:

Everyone wants to jump on me, but yet when someone calls those who don't want to join the army gutless and spineless and "they need a babysister", no one says crap.

Because he was refering to you, and you've been complaining about the military since the beginning of the thread. Not only that, but if you feel so offended that some people's feelings are hurt in basic, I'd just about agree with him. I wouldnt want you or anyone like you in my or my allie's military, Pte. Pyle.

I'd keep a gun in my house anyway. If I found it more logical to keep a gun in my house, then to follow a law that may get me killed, I'd rather keep the gun.

Why dont we just get rid of the military and the police? Afterall, you can hold off criminals AND invading armies all by yourself, right?

I never said YOU called me names. Read above. Some other guy did. And I note again: I only talked bad about the people who do what I've been saying. People I know who are close to me, and were in the army have told me things. I am talking bad about THOSE people.

:cry: :cry: :cry: They called me poopy-pants :cry: :cry: :cry:

Would you feel safer if all of the nations soldiers, airmen, marines and seamen acted like that?

Also, everyone gets upset because I have a different opinion on war.

Funny how you're the only one going on about that. Everyone else sees the true reason why people are getting upset.

The way people in the military talk and act, it makes them seem almost "evil" if evil ever existed.

Especially the way they talk to people being trained and new recruits. Their hearts are filled with nothing but hate.

Those are the types of comments that are getting people here upset... and me on the otherhand, I'm still trying to figure out what validity you have in saying these comments? You have NO experience in the military AT ALL.

How long have you been in the military Stellar? According to your profile, you're about 18 years old...

It'll be 2 years in January. I started my application when I was 16 and joined when I was 17.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ShaunZero

Those are the types of comments that are getting people here upset... and me on the otherhand, I'm still trying to figure out what validity you have in saying these comments? You have NO experience in the military AT ALL.

I already told you how I know some of them talk this way. They've done it to my friends and family. I sure as hell won't join just to find out if my close friends and family are telling me the truth, when I know they wouldn't lie to me.

Indeed you did when you said that its no good seeking out the enemy where they are, but we should sit here and wait for them to attack us.

I'm not talking about if it is a good tactic or not. What I mean is that I don't see it as something "good" or "ok". It all comes down to your morals, which is why I said it's subjective. There's more people dying right now than if we'd never gone there. What if they would have never attacked us again? Then we'd be saving alot of lives by not going... In my opinion we should focus on DEFENDING ON OUR GROUNDS. Incase they do come.....

No...not only did you say that what the army does is wrong, but you said that you dont like the way the army treats people, not some people, but people in general.

Oh well. At least I can clear it up now and tell you that I meant those that DO do it that way.

OMG! The military huts the recruits's feelings! OMG!!! crying.gif

What do you want them to do? Build an army or raise kittens?

Whats the big deal if that happens during basic? Its meant to weed out the weak, and strengthen those who are left. Those who cant take it, 1. Dont belong in the army and 2. Never should have joined.

Jeez, next you'll be complaining that the military puts them in harms way

It's not like that at all. I'm just saying that I'm sure there's a more mature and respectful way to go about doing it. How about telling them the actual dangers, and how serious it is? That'll weed out the weak as well.

Because he was refering to you, and you've been complaining about the military since the beginning of the thread. Not only that, but if you feel so offended that some people's feelings are hurt in basic, I'd just about agree with him. I wouldnt want you or anyone like you in my or my allie's military, Pte. Pyle.

Who said it bothers me that "their feelings get hurt"? Not liking someone calling you a "Maggot" 24/7 and being downright immature and disrespectful to you, does not in anyway show that you're a bad soldier. What gives you that idea? You don't know me at all, so you have no idea if I'd make a good soldier or not. And to be honest, the yelling and screaming wouldn't make me upset in a sad way, it'd only p*** me off and make me not even want to learn from someone that immature. There no NEED for it.

They called me poopy-pants

Heh... how immature. I give my opinion on the yelling and screaming and here you are acting like a child.

You seem like the type of guy who thinks he's tougher than everyone who disagrees with war. The exact type that would call them "gutless" and "Spineless" like the guy above.

Edited by Zero of Deism

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Fluffybunny

Who said it bothers me that "their feelings get hurt"? Not liking someone calling you a "Maggot" 24/7 and being downright immature and disrespectful to you, does not in anyway show that you're a bad soldier. What gives you that idea? You don't know me at all, so you have no idea if I'd make a good soldier or not. And to be honest, the yelling and screaming wouldn't make me upset in a sad way, it'd only p*** me off and make me not even want to learn from someone that immature. There no NEED for it.

You seem like the type of guy who thinks he's tougher than everyone who disagrees with war. The exact type that would call them "gutless" and "Spineless" like the guy above.

Actually there is a NEED for it, but you haven't the experience to draw from to know.

If you were to experience the military and combat(I have), you would realize that the preparation of soldiers for battle is difficult. During boot camp and in some cases advanced training Drill Instructors are tasked with creating a stressfull environment to teach soldiers how to be able to work efficiently and accurately under difficult situations. The soldiers reaction to stress needs to be developed so that the first time that they are under fire their instinct does not take over and cause them to fail at any task given.

The namecalling and yelling isn't something that is always happening; it occurs at the very beggining of training and makes for a rather stressful time. It isn't fun, but it is something that would be a disaster if it weren't done in the fashion it is. If you were to actually know a drill instructor and ask questions, you would find that the drill instructors care about each one of their recruits and does the best they can in the time given in order to prepare their soldiers to survive in combat and stressful situations, to do that they have to create artificial stress and then order the soldiers to carry out given tasks.

That stress and yelling allows the soldiers to be able to perform well under the worst of conditions and has been proven to work over the past many years, but you do not have the understanding to know better.

Your generalizations of soldiers is pretty disgusting and further shows your ignorance of the soldiers you call killers. Infantry soldiers are frontline and do the majority of the fighting, but are actually not the majority of the soldiers in the theater; support soldiers are needed as well. Can any soldier shoot a rifle? Yes. Do they? probably not; they are good at whatever their job may be, but are not infantry soldiers. I was a combat medic. I helped people in combat situations. Could I fire a weapon? yes, very well, but I was better at healing than killing and did so often regardless of who was hurt.

One would hope that you would at least ask questions and have the knowledge of the topic before making generalizations like you have; otherwise it makes your ignorance of the subject painfully obvious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Michelle

It may help some people that take martial arts or self defense classes that it's like muscle memory. Someone can't show you something once and expect you to react accordingly without practice. The enemy doesn't fight fair.

Edited by Michelle

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
coldethyl

It's not like that at all. I'm just saying that I'm sure there's a more mature and respectful way to go about doing it. Not liking someone calling you a "Maggot" 24/7 and being downright immature and disrespectful to you,

Yeah, exactly just like you do, huh? You just have no clue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ShaunZero

You know what, that brings up a good idea too. Think about Martial Arts. They teach you how to defend yourself in real life situations(Some Styles), but they do without all the immature screaming and disrespectful name calling.

Your generalizations of soldiers is pretty disgusting and further shows your ignorance of the soldiers you call killers.

I define a "killer" as someone who goes out and kills someone when they're on the offense. That is what I call a killer. So, if you find nothing wrong with killing someone when they're on the offense, why are you complaining about me calling them killers?

Hell, what is a killer if that isn't? I mean sure, I respect them for doing something they believe to be right. But I also have the right to my own opinion which is that they are doing something that I find "wrong". I mean honestly, if I see it as wrong, what else do you want me to say about it? I can't say good things about it...

That stress and yelling allows the soldiers to be able to perform well under the worst of conditions and has been proven to work over the past many years, but you do not have the understanding to know better.

Has it ever been tested if they perform just as well WITHOUT IT? If not then you can't say you have the experience either.

If you want me to be 100% honest. I don't think it's all that bad untill it goes too far. I guess it was all just to argue. :lol:

One would hope that you would at least ask questions and have the knowledge of the topic before making generalizations like you have; otherwise it makes your ignorance of the subject painfully obvious.

I'm pulling from information of true stories. Unless you expect me to believe that all of my friends and family have been lying to me the entire time. I've also heard stories from others that are very similar to what my friends and family have told me. My sister is one as well. They are all similar stories. Just like in these videos.

Just look at the commercials on TV. They seem to try and pull in the young ones with all these things like "We'll pay for your school" or they show someone jumping from a helicopter saying "Do something amazing!", what the hell is amazing about dropping into a battle field where people are dying in front of you? I saw another where they were testing a bomb or something, and a car exploded, then it said "See something amazing" or something of the like. Why not be real and tell them what'll really happen? You say if the army isn't for you then don't join, but look at how they make it look on TV. NOT how it really is. And a recruiter never tells you that they'll be screaming at you and treating you like crap at first. They only talk about the positives.

I could also say that you and Stellar don't have the right experience to know what I'm talking about, because you havn't experienced what my friend's and family have. You're saying the opposite, that I havn't experieced what you have, which I'm guessing is the "good" according to you. So... if you didn't experience the "bad" then you can't talk about it I guess... ;) According to you. I guess we can call it fair and I won't comment on the so called "Good". =D Ok, ok, I'm messing around...

Again, I ask. Should I be allowed to walk over to my neighbor and put a bullet in his face if I think he's a danger in the future? That's what's going on right now.... Why aren't I allowed to do it here?

Why should I go to jail for tracking down and killing someone who let's say... killing my daughter?

Edited by Zero of Deism

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Michelle

You haven't taken a martial arts or self defense class either have you? :hmm:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ShaunZero

Umm, yes I have. By screaming I'm not talking about screaming before a punch either.... Martial Arts deals more with relaxation than anything else.

Edited by Zero of Deism

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
AriKiya

Well...I can see this a long and controversial thread...but this is one of those things I've always had STRONG opinions about. The military IS needed (as much as I hate to admit it). I've never been in the military myself, but I have plenty of friends and family that were. I have a lot of respect for the people that go out there and travel overseas to fight for what they think is right, my issues with the military are completely with the government BEHIND it.

The government, and all the self-righteous people out there who take all the bad things out on the soldiers that have gone overseas in the name of our "freedom." I once saw a man get spit on - SPIT ON - by a complete stranger because he was one of the soldiers that fought in Afghanistan. WTH? Like these people don't have enough torture in their own heads to deal with after what they've been through without complete strangers looking down on them. Vietnam was a perfect example - how many of our soldiers were lost over there, and the ones that came home - AFTER having been sent off valiantly being called heroes - only to come home to picketers who threw signs in their faces and called them "babykillers." It's the government that puts them in this situation, convincing them that what they're doing is the right and patriotic thing to do.

I remember sitting in highschool watching those recruiting videos, all full of proud, upbeat music and images, and thinking, "those ****ing bast***s!" I was harrassed myself for several weeks by a recruiter because I was the highest scoring person - mail or female - in the state on my ASVABS (which were mandatory, btw). And the part I scored highest in, which was the only reason I could figure he was SOOOO interested, was the part where you match up the numbers at the bottom with the numbers in the columns - bomb coordinates. He came to my school, pulled me out of several classes, he called my HOUSE - and after several atteptms on my part to "politely" tell him that I wanted no part of it, I finally snapped and told him he was a "war-monger" and I wasn't, nor would I EVER be, interested.

Unfortunately, we need a military, but can't have one without people to fill it - which is truly, truly sad. Without sounding like a total hippie (lol), it's true that the casualties of war are far greater than we realize. I'm glad someone posted this. Maybe a few lives (and a few peoples sanities) will be saved because of it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Stellar

I already told you how I know some of them talk this way.

You generalise though and say everyone in the military is screwed up, evil, hate filled, etc.

They've done it to my friends and family.

From your description, your friends and family arent suited in the military anyway, and are likely to give biased testimony.

I'm not talking about if it is a good tactic or not. What I mean is that I don't see it as something "good" or "ok".

Its the same thing.

It all comes down to your morals, which is why I said it's subjective.

No it doesnt come down to your morals. It comes down to which methode is tried, tested and proven to be *the* best way of accomplishing the job (winning the war/protecting people).

There's more people dying right now than if we'd never gone there. What if they would have never attacked us again? Then we'd be saving alot of lives by not going... In my opinion we should focus on DEFENDING ON OUR GROUNDS. Incase they do come.....

Are you refering to Afghanistan or Iraq? Your problem is with the administration then, not the military.

At least I can clear it up now and tell you that I meant those that DO do it that way.

And now Ill tell you that there's nothing wrong with the way the army treats people. Its not as if the army forced them to join either...

It's not like that at all. I'm just saying that I'm sure there's a more mature and respectful way to go about doing it.

If there was a more mature and respectful way of accomplishing the same or more, then it'd be used. You, lacking experience, however, believe there is another way. There is not.

How about telling them the actual dangers, and how serious it is? That'll weed out the weak as well.

They do do that too. It doesnt accomplish the same job though. What do you think they tell them "Oh dont worry, its safe! Its all just a game too!"? Well, there's your ignorance speaking again. And btw, that name calling and constant "harassment" helps with other things besides simply weeding out the weak.

And let me tell you something else, a lot of people talk the talk, but in the army you have to walk the walk. A lot of people will hear about how serious and dangerous it is, and think they could do it, but if that was the extent of the matter, they'd freeze and cost more lives.

Who said it bothers me that "their feelings get hurt"? Not liking someone calling you a "Maggot" 24/7 and being downright immature and disrespectful to you, does not in anyway show that you're a bad soldier. What gives you that idea? You don't know me at all, so you have no idea if I'd make a good soldier or not.

Indeed I do, because I've seen people like who before. Its not simply that you dont "like" it, its that you dont understand the purpose of it and thus *hate* the military for doing it. I'd rather 1 motivated soldier who's indifferent to the name calling he recieved than 5 complainers who whine about everything and, in their ignorance and lack of experience, think they can do a better job at something.

And to be honest, the yelling and screaming wouldn't make me upset in a sad way, it'd only p*** me off and make me not even want to learn from someone that immature. There no NEED for it.

There is a need for it, but you're too ignorant to accept it. Instead of keeping quiet about a matter you know nothing about, you'd rather argue it. And "to be honest", the yelling and screaming is also MEANT to p*** you off. You may not *want* to learn from someone that "immature", and thats why the army breaks you down, gets rid of that little attitude of yours and rebuilds you. You either will learn from them, or you wont make it and you'll come out crying about how the big mean boys wouldnt let you play with them.

Edited by Stellar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Stellar

Heh... how immature. I give my opinion on the yelling and screaming and here you are acting like a child.

Thats how you sound.

You seem like the type of guy who thinks he's tougher than everyone who disagrees with war. The exact type that would call them "gutless" and "Spineless" like the guy above.

Really? I friggin' disagree with war. I accept that war is, however, unavoidable sometimes, just like it was in WWII when the allies had to fight against the axis.

There you go again though... "He's in the military, so he MUST be a screwed up, warmongering killing machine!" :rolleyes:

You know what, that brings up a good idea too. Think about Martial Arts. They teach you how to defend yourself in real life situations(Some Styles), but they do without all the immature screaming and disrespectful name calling.

You're comparing warfighting to Martial Arts? Martial Arts doesnt train people to move towards the sound of gunfire and fight those that are trying their best to kill them... sometimes even when the odds of you comming out alive are slim. By your analogy, a martial artist would be a better soldier, but thats not true. Fighting a war is far different, and martial arts doesnt prepare you to do so.

I define a "killer" as someone who goes out and kills someone when they're on the offense. That is what I call a killer. So, if you find nothing wrong with killing someone when they're on the offense, why are you complaining about me calling them killers?

But you attribute a negative connotation to it, especially when you call them "rutheless" killers.

But I also have the right to my own opinion which is that they are doing something that I find "wrong".

Sure you have the right to your own opinion, just as I have the write to my opinion on how ****ed up yours is and how arrogant it is for you, who lacks experience, to tell US that there's better ways to do things. I dont tell a pilot how to fly a plane, do I?

I mean honestly, if I see it as wrong, what else do you want me to say about it? I can't say good things about it...

What the rest of us (notice you're the only one arguing your position, the rest of us seem to have one unified position against you) want you to do is stop talking about a subject you know nothing about... instead of making comments on "how things should be done", and accept that there are others here who are much more suited to tell you whether the way things are done works or if theres a better way.

Has it ever been tested if they perform just as well WITHOUT IT? If not then you can't say you have the experience either.

Actually:

1. Its a logically sound method.

2. It has been tested... that's how they developped the training plans.

3. I can make a direct comparison between people who were trained slightly differently and tell you that those who have undergone the more harsh training have come out to be better soldiers than the others.

If you want me to be 100% honest. I don't think it's all that bad untill it goes too far. I guess it was all just to argue.

Theres no benifit from it until its taken "too far".

I'm pulling from information of true stories.

Oh really? What information? That theres better ways of training soldiers than to scream at them? That it is better to win a war and protect yourself/others if you are defensive and react rather than take the initiative and attack? What kind of "true stories" qualify you to say those things? And what makes you better suited to talk about the subject than the rest of us who actually live(d) it?

Unless you expect me to believe that all of my friends and family have been lying to me the entire time. I've also heard stories from others that are very similar to what my friends and family have told me. My sister is one as well. They are all similar stories. Just like in these videos.

Maybe it'll be easier to discuss it if you told us exactly what they said...

Did they tell you that its better to be on the defensive? Did they tell you theres a better way than screaming and yelling to accomplish the same thing?

Just look at the commercials on TV. They seem to try and pull in the young ones with all these things like "We'll pay for your school" or they show someone jumping from a helicopter saying "Do something amazing!"

What would you rather they say? "Dont join the military."? "Go sit down, work at a desk and hate your job."?

what the hell is amazing about dropping into a battle field where people are dying in front of you?

1. Dropping out of a helicopter is something people dont normally do. Training such as this IS fun, different, and can be considered "amazing".

2. With regards to the battlefield, some people would call it amazing, but you wouldnt understand why.

I saw another where they were testing a bomb or something, and a car exploded, then it said "See something amazing" or something of the like. Why not be real and tell them what'll really happen?

Because recruiting commercials, just as every job announcement, is meant to draw your attention to specific people, you can then ask those people questions and proceed with applying or not. EVERY job does this, not just the military.

You say if the army isn't for you then don't join, but look at how they make it look on TV. NOT how it really is.

Oh no? "Not how it really is"? How would you know that, you're not in the army. The TV commercials show the job of specific trades. I can tell you that the Canadian Forces commercials, and the american military recruitment videos I have seen arent lies. But again, you cant simply watch a recruitment video showing the job of a computer technician, then join the infantry and say that the video lied to you.

And a recruiter never tells you that they'll be screaming at you and treating you like crap at first.

1. They did for me.

2. Ask "What's training like?" "How are you treated?" and they'll answer you truthefully.

They only talk about the positives.

Untrue. They'll talk about the negatives... but they advertise the positives, just as EVERY SINGLE BUISNESS AND COMPANY does.

I could also say that you and Stellar don't have the right experience to know what I'm talking about, because you havn't experienced what my friend's and family have.

You could, but you'd be grasping at straws because we're not discussing their experience, we're discussing your generalisations and your "I know how to do it better than you" attitude.

So... if you didn't experience the "bad" then you can't talk about it I guess...

Oh, but I have experienced the "bad" that apparently your friends and family have. I've been screamed and yelled at and all that. That's what basic is like. I do have experience with the army and can say that people arent "rutheless killers", "screwed up" or anything that yous aid "people in the military" are.

Again, I ask. Should I be allowed to walk over to my neighbor and put a bullet in his face if I think he's a danger in the future? That's what's going on right now.... Why aren't I allowed to do it here?

Then complain about the government, not the military.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ShaunZero

That's way too much to read. And to begin with, you see it your way, I see it my way, there's no point in argueing. Just because my opinion is not the same as yours, you assume I don't know anything about the subject. Just live and let live. I guess I'll be the bigger man and leave this entire thread alone.

This'll only go in circles and waste everyone's time.

I doubt this is what the Topic Owner wanted...

Edited by Zero of Deism

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cubsfan7

*coughcoughcommicough* the only reason there pushed like that is so that when there in action they arent scared...really its done for the safety of the solders...go and get some treehugger(i think one created this) and put him in a war without tough training then ull c wat happened

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
bLu3 de 3n3rgy

All i can say on this subject is that with out military or defence we wouldn't have or know what we do in the western world.

It isn't all just about war, the military are important for various reasons -some examples - peace keeping, managing foreign affairs, helping with world wide emergancys... Over here in scotland the RAF respond to more emergancies than the police/coast do where it involves helicopters and rescues from sea to cliffs to mountains, because helicopters for covering difficult terrian and all the islands with expertise in saving lifes is essential here.

Edited by Anvil

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ShaunZero

go and get some treehugger(i think one created this) and put him in a war without tough training then ull c wat happened

You'd be surprised. Look at Martial Artists. They may have the tough training, but they don't have all the screaming. They deal with "peace" and being calm. Instead of screaming they use meditation. They are some of the most calm people in the middle of chaos. They know how to think straight and all. That's one of the main focuses in Martial Arts; Staying calm and level headed in combat.

Another difference is that in Martial Arts, they teach you to never use it unless absolutely necessary.

When it comes to helping people out in need, I think the military is great. All I really have a problem with(Mostly) is going into someone else's country and killing them. Even if we think we're "helping" someone.

To me that's the same as me walking over to my neighbors house and killing him because what I think he's doing is "wrong" or "evil". We are all entitled to our opinion, and that is mine.

With that, I leave this topic...

Edited by Zero of Deism

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
IamsSon

you're in the army now !,

you're not behind a plow ! ,

you'll never get rich ! ,

you son of a B%@ !

you're in the ARMY now !

well all i got to say is this --if you join any armed service just for your own selfish reasons --i don't want your sorry @ss in my outfit!

if your a winy spoiled brat with no discipline and no dedication i don't need you .

if you don't have the guts or the dedication your whats called a negative asset--that means somebody has to cover your @ss--in other words the armed forces are not there to babysit your sorry @ss! we do serious stuff like fight wars. we don't play . and this ain't a joke . when you pull a trigger , push a button someone likely dies--if you do the task wrong it could be YOU. if you fail to do your duty it could cost your life or the lives of your comrades .

before you even think about joining--look in the mirror--if you don't have what it takes--don't waste our time or endanger my comrades by sending a gut-less wonder to the field of action . the the armed forces aren't for everyone. and i would rather have one motivated MARINE that 100 un motivated "where the chow hall ?"--riding the sick-bay" goldbricks !

From a former Army dogface to a strac jarhead: Semper Fi "Hooooaaah!"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cubsfan7

You'd be surprised. Look at Martial Artists. They may have the tough training, but they don't have all the screaming. They deal with "peace" and being calm. Instead of screaming they use meditation. They are some of the most calm people in the middle of chaos. They know how to think straight and all. That's one of the main focuses in Martial Arts; Staying calm and level headed in combat.

Another difference is that in Martial Arts, they teach you to never use it unless absolutely necessary.

When it comes to helping people out in need, I think the military is great. All I really have a problem with(Mostly) is going into someone else's country and killing them. Even if we think we're "helping" someone.

To me that's the same as me walking over to my neighbors house and killing him because what I think he's doing is "wrong" or "evil". We are all entitled to our opinion, and that is mine.

With that, I leave this topic...

umm i dont think ive ever seen a martial artist fight when bullets are goin over his head...ur 2nd paragraph is messed up, so u think that we shouldnt take dont dictatars, and going with the help part do u also think we shouldnt have fought against hitler in WW2 or gone to WW1 to help out there

and the treehugger thing i was just pointing out that the guy who made this is a treehugger]

also u said twice that u werent gonna come to this thread again

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
girty1600
I guess I'll be the bigger man and leave this entire thread alone.

I see you decided against the bigger man plan. ;) I won't hold that against you though.

It would be great if threads such as this could be void of stereo-typing and slanderous remarks but that doesn't seem possible at this point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
contactismade

Where to start? Well first of all I am a military brat, i spent my childhood one CFB or another for twenty years. Both my parent were in the military, as well as my older brother. And before all that my family had a member in the military stretching back to Scotland.

Lets get some facts out of the way here

fact: More people in the military never see active service in theatre than do.

fact: Its not the "Salvation Army" you join when you sign up its the ARMY, the danger is implied no matter how stupid you are.

fact: "Freedom" is not "free", it has a price and SOMEONE has to pay it.

fact: The treatment of recruits is a tried and tested mechanism, it is thousands of years old. They were doing it to newbies in the Roman Legions. Its not designed to hurt a persons "feelings" its designed to put a recruit under stress as someone else said. It is also a mechanism that trains the recruit to obey all orders from a superior officer, except those that are immoral. In the heat of battle there can be no hesitation, hesitation equals dead squad mates. It is not natural for a human to take another humans life without immediate and apparent danger to ones own life, but that is a by product of war so they had to find someway to do it.

fact: The army stretches your own definition of what you think your limits are, knowing your limits is the single most overlooked skill ever. Most people don't understand this concept because of years of being told that they are special beings with "feelings" that deserve respect. Respect is earned not handed out in cereal boxes, there are situations where you defer this and give respect regardless but for the most part your actions usually dictate your respect level.

fact: Zero knows zero about this topic.

fact: If you don't understand "the dangers" or the "seriousness"of joining the army, send me an email with your address and I will come by and strike you in the head with a tack hammer, BECAUSE YOU ARE TOO STUPID TO LIVE.

Sure I wish the world was different but it isn't, the fact that people want to kill me because of simple geography and or religious affiliation is stupid, but unfortunately out of my hands. Survival is MY option not THIERS. If someone expects me to sit around and wait for someone to come back and hurt my fellow Canadians and only engage them on our soil then I invite this person to put their money where their mouth is. I rather like the dramatic sequence in "A Few Good Men" where Jack is explaining that while you may find his very existence repugnant, deep down you need him on that wall you want him on that wall. Who's gonna man a post,you who thinks that the military is a waste of time while you sit in your computer chair and call down all the people you owe your comfort to, no it will be people like my family. I would just as soon you said thank you rather that the rants of the wholely ignorant and unexperienced. If someone says it sucks being a doctor should everyone avoid that training from now on? No because being a doctor is not for everyone, just like the military is not for everyone. Like the cowardly or easily offended types, pascifists, the training is there to get rid of that type too.

Those who are not a member of the brotherhood of war are not qualified to offer an opinion, you EARN that right the hard way, the timid need not apply.

Edited by contactismade

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
AtlantisRises

Well. I completed my final test for Officer College yesterday. So as of next year i will be an Officer Cadet in the Australian Army.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
cubsfan7

congrats

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mekorig

Pretty hot debate, isnt it?

Well, my take on the thing: I belive that nations need their militaeries. They work for defense offense in the case needed , and a lot of other services. I also agree that the military life is not for everyone. When kid i think in joining, but when i was older i find my personality and idea of the world totally imcompatible whit the needed to the military life.

But a trend i have found in some (not all, but a important part) active and inactive military personel is that they have a feeling of superiority toward civilians. The clasical "you are free because of me" is one example, the other is calling a non-military person "guthless". Off corse its a valid argument, but beign repeated after 100 times it lost meaning. And in some cases this feeling grows to a worse feeling that they are the real defender of the nation, and that they are the only source of leadership for the better of the nation. My country suffered reapeted times that when the militars thinked that their intervention was "for the better of the nation". Civilians, while non-combatants in a war, can still defend thenselfs, and this caused a lot of deaths.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
artymoon

First, I'd like to say thanks to all on UM who serve or have served in the military and to their families...you have my utmost respect. :):tu:

Secondly, I don't understand all the exchanges with Zero, how can you even reason with him about the army when he doesn't even believe war is necessary sometimes? Just an observation.

I take offense to the belief that all military personnel were somehow fooled into joining. Many of them joined out of pride for their country and a chance to make a difference, many had fathers and grandfathers that served proudly also. Almost all know going in the challenges ahead, not only within themselves but with respect to fighting wars. After all, their primary job and duty is to defend this country, there is no attempt at skirting around that fact by recruiters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tooth_and_Claw

thats a good film

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
OvercastComfort

I would agree to certainly consider the implications of joining the military before doing so. Nobody wants a reluctant soldier on their hands; if you don't want to do the job, stay home.

Having said that, I don't agree with war. However, I believe it vital to fight at rare times. Like now, in Iraq, I think that is a bogus war. No disrespect to military, as they do their jobs honorably still, unaffected by the politics of war, they fight bravely.

This thread was never about the respectability of soldiers, so I understand, it was about the dangers of signing your name to the government. As for people who call anti war folks babies and they need a spine or something degrading to that affect, I'm anti war and I could do things to someone that would disgust you to imagine----and I'm anti-war. Reluctance is not indicitive of ability.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.