zandore Posted October 5, 2006 #26 Share Posted October 5, 2006 I knew this would come in handy some day You are correct as a TERM it might not have existed before 1874 (or there about) but it did exist as a religion long before then..... You are correct as a TERM trinity might not have existed in the Bible, but it did exist as a concept "The next time believers tell you that 'separation of church and state' does not appear in our founding document, tell them to stop using the word 'trinity'. The word 'trinity' appears nowhere in the bible. Neither does Rapture, or Second Coming, or Original Sin". Dan Barker Dan Barker BIO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Link of Hyrule Posted October 5, 2006 #27 Share Posted October 5, 2006 I'm not American, Z. I don't really have any position on these documents by those Founding Fathers. What are you trying to say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted October 5, 2006 Author #28 Share Posted October 5, 2006 his saying that would fit well with him being an eastern philosopher of the times AND most importantly, be his indicator that the "creator" is within everything. Too bad his followers got it all wrong and turned it into a cult of man-love. Hmm well that is an interesting way to perceive that message.....but perhaps all things are sometimes interperted wrongly? Even your perception of Christs message? IMO of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted October 5, 2006 Author #29 Share Posted October 5, 2006 ........ No, according to the Christian bible, Jesus is NOT God. I'm willing to back this up as well. I'll leave a link to my old thread later. what he is the son of God- so how is he not God? Unless perhaps you think of him as a Hercules type god? Seriously though why do you say this- because you don't believe the father son and Holy ghost are al;l in the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadMachine Posted October 5, 2006 #30 Share Posted October 5, 2006 (edited) what he is the son of God Aren't we all the "sons and daughters" of God? Edit: Reworded. Edited October 5, 2006 by MadMachine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandore Posted October 5, 2006 #31 Share Posted October 5, 2006 I'm not American, Z. I don't really have any position on these documents by those Founding Fathers. What are you trying to say? All you have to do is read the quote "The next time believers tell you that 'separation of church and state' does not appear in our founding document, tell them to stop using the word 'trinity'. The word 'trinity' appears nowhere in the bible. Neither does Rapture, or Second Coming, or Original Sin". Dan Barker Dan Barker BIO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Link of Hyrule Posted October 5, 2006 #32 Share Posted October 5, 2006 (edited) Yep, read the quote. Still don't know what you're trying to get at. WHy did you reply to my post with that Dan Barker quote. Could you expand on it in your own words, please. In relation to the post I made earlier, I see not the relevance. Thanks Edited October 5, 2006 by Paranoid Android Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandore Posted October 5, 2006 #33 Share Posted October 5, 2006 Yep, read the quote. Still don't know what you're trying to get at. WHy did you reply to my post with that Dan Barker quote. Could you expand on it in your own words, please. In relation to the post I made earlier, I see not the relevance. Thanks The words trinity, rapture, second coming, or original sin appear no where in the Bible.....concept yes but words (in that context) Simple enough for you now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperactive Posted October 5, 2006 #34 Share Posted October 5, 2006 Hmm well that is an interesting way to perceive that message.....but perhaps all things are sometimes interperted wrongly? Even your perception of Christs message? IMO of course. well, from where I sit, if Jesus existed he was a simplton philosopher that brought the basics of Eastern teachings to the West. It was the immediate followers of him that transformed the words into the cult of man-love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bella-Angelique Posted October 5, 2006 #35 Share Posted October 5, 2006 The words trinity, rapture, second coming, or original sin appear no where in the Bible.....concept yes but words (in that context) Simple enough for you now? One could say the concept exists in the New Testement that people should only eat fish while in groups by pointing to examples shown, while the actual statement is never made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted October 5, 2006 Author #36 Share Posted October 5, 2006 well, from where I sit, if Jesus existed he was a simplton philosopher that brought the basics of Eastern teachings to the West. It was the immediate followers of him that transformed the words into the cult of man-love. Well those basic teachings are swell. I mean love thy neighbor as thyself. I love this one- although a lot of people don't use this one. I can't imagine why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Link of Hyrule Posted October 5, 2006 #37 Share Posted October 5, 2006 Simple enough for you now?Truthfully, no. Your post just rephrased the quote. I know what the quote means. I understand what the quote says. What I don't understand is your choice to use that quote in response to my post (link). Could you explain the rationale. What was the intended purpose in bringing up that quote in relation to that post? What point/s in my post did it refute or reaffirm? ~ PA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIDEON MAGE Posted October 5, 2006 #38 Share Posted October 5, 2006 There is, of course, a middle ground, which I doubt anyone wants to hear. The universe was made by God directly, using Laws that can be discerned by Science. Those Laws are what controls things, although there may be occasional interference, known as miracles. God is "out there", but not directly connected to events, but at the same time, omnipresent and omniscient. There is not a single book directly written by God, but that doesn't mean She doesn't exist or love us. The problem is, that different people like Jesus and Buddha catch just a glimpse of what is really going on, and teach what they can to others. I hate to break it to you, but J and B were teaching the exact same thing: live as good a life as you can and don't hurt people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jodie.Lynne Posted October 5, 2006 #39 Share Posted October 5, 2006 And I think that Gideon has hit the nail squarely on the head. If you must worship something, worship the MESSAGE not the MAN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlantisRises Posted October 6, 2006 #40 Share Posted October 6, 2006 I prefer to worship Myself JMPD. Thats the only thing i can be sure of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunZero Posted October 6, 2006 #41 Share Posted October 6, 2006 (edited) There is, of course, a middle ground, which I doubt anyone wants to hear. The universe was made by God directly, using Laws that can be discerned by Science. Those Laws are what controls things, although there may be occasional interference, known as miracles. God is "out there", but not directly connected to events, but at the same time, omnipresent and omniscient. There is not a single book directly written by God, but that doesn't mean She doesn't exist or love us. The problem is, that different people like Jesus and Buddha catch just a glimpse of what is really going on, and teach what they can to others. I hate to break it to you, but J and B were teaching the exact same thing: live as good a life as you can and don't hurt people. I really like that outlook on things... Edited October 6, 2006 by Zero of Deism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperactive Posted October 6, 2006 #42 Share Posted October 6, 2006 I prefer to worship Myself JMPD. Thats the only thing i can be sure of. how are you so sure of that? I posit that you can not prove you exist! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlantisRises Posted October 6, 2006 #43 Share Posted October 6, 2006 how are you so sure of that? I posit that you can not prove you exist! Thats very true. And an argument i have had for a long time with friends. The fact is that i am not sure of myself. Existance is something I assume to be true nothing more. Yet as a human being my mind has a hard time expanding to cover that, therefore i Assume that i exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandore Posted October 7, 2006 #44 Share Posted October 7, 2006 The words trinity, rapture, second coming, or original sin appear no where in the Bible.....concept yes but words (in that context) Simple enough for you now? One could say the concept exists in the New Testement that people should only eat fish while in groups by pointing to examples shown, while the actual statement is never made. What does fish have to do with the concepts (but not specificaly mentioned in the Bible) of the "trinity, rapture, second coming, or original sin"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jodie.Lynne Posted October 7, 2006 #45 Share Posted October 7, 2006 I think Z, she is using the example of "Jesus feeding the multitudes" with fish to illustrate that, while not directly using specific wording, the bible passage could be used to imply certain concepts or guidelines by the reader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bella-Angelique Posted October 7, 2006 #46 Share Posted October 7, 2006 I think Z, she is using the example of "Jesus feeding the multitudes" with fish to illustrate that, while not directly using specific wording, the bible passage could be used to imply certain concepts or guidelines by the reader. Yes. People can point to anything out of context, compile multiple examples, and then say it means something that is never stated in the text itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandore Posted October 7, 2006 #47 Share Posted October 7, 2006 (edited) Truthfully, no. Your post just rephrased the quote. I know what the quote means. I understand what the quote says. What I don't understand is your choice to use that quote in response to my post (link). Could you explain the rationale. What was the intended purpose in bringing up that quote in relation to that post? What point/s in my post did it refute or reaffirm? You really don't understand do you?..... I knew this would come in handy some day You are correct as a TERM it might not have existed before 1874 (or there about) but it did exist as a religion long before then..... "The next time believers tell you that 'separation of church and state' does not appear in our founding document, tell them to stop using the word 'trinity'. The word 'trinity' appears nowhere in the bible. Neither does Rapture, or Second Coming, or Original Sin". Dan Barker Dan Barker BIO It agrees with what you said in the post I quoted. EDIT: Fixed Quotes Edited October 7, 2006 by zandore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zandore Posted October 7, 2006 #48 Share Posted October 7, 2006 Yes. People can point to anything out of context, compile multiple examples, and then say it means something that is never stated in the text itself. I agree Bela....Christians do it all of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bella-Angelique Posted October 7, 2006 #49 Share Posted October 7, 2006 I agree Bela....Christians do it all of the time. Not as often as the Surpreme Court here though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Link of Hyrule Posted October 7, 2006 #50 Share Posted October 7, 2006 It agrees with what you said in the post I quoted.Thanks, Z. That's what I was trying to work out. It wasn't really clear (at least to me) what point you were trying to make. Thanks for clearing it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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