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Another 'Only in the UK' story


Moon Monkey

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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6172805.stm

Surely a basic grasp of english is necessary before residency is granted or money is spent on them by the taxpayer ? Spend the money in their own countries teaching them english while their application is considered.

There is a crazy, PC, 'couldn't make it up' story every day in the UK, for example 70% of bosses banning xmas decorations being put up by staff or parties for both the fears of upsetting non-christians and litigation should somenoe get into trouble at an office party or hurt themselves hanging tinsle. Its crazy.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/new...tmas_glitz.html

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sadly in the liberal and politically correct world we live in its perfectly acceptable for parades with homosexuals and transvestites waltzing down the road promoting bestiality and to have Islamic rallies calling for death to all westerners yet Christians aren't permitted to put a small snow globe or Christmas ornament up in their office.

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well monkey as ive said b4 that once cool place is dead and buried.

thats a shame but its true.

i read that 1st article you put up and im not even surprised, you couldnt make it up really could you.

it may cost less to teach the remaining english to speak 6 other languages!!

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sadly in the liberal and politically correct world we live in its perfectly acceptable for parades with homosexuals and transvestites waltzing down the road promoting bestiality and to have Islamic rallies calling for death to all westerners yet Christians aren't permitted to put a small snow globe or Christmas ornament up in their office.

Ah.. who's.. promoting bestiality? No one. Islamic rallies calling for violence is equaly not really allowed. By librals or conservitives. And Christians are allowed to put whatever they want on their houses or in their offices. Save.. from what I've seen here... other faiths arn't allowed to. We currently had an issue at Seatac (airport) A rabbi asked to put a manora up at the airport with all the christmas trees and christian holiday stuff. What was the Port of Seattle's responce? Tell him no and took everything down for a day or two before putting it all back up again... sans the manora.

So, yeah.. try again.

As the matter of what's happening in England. *sighs* On one hand... I don't like that these women are being forced to live in England.. and not allowed to learn english. The language barrier is doing more harm then good.. however, native languages help keep a sence of family ancestory and history. Granted... this is not doing that. This is hindering people from living. And it's mindnumbing. I'm all for people learning more then one language... hells if I had any kids, I'd have insisted they learn atleast two or three...

England has every right to make English as their national language, and make everyone who moves there to learn it.

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We currently had an issue at Seatac (airport) A rabbi asked to put a manora up at the airport with all the christmas trees and christian holiday stuff. What was the Port of Seattle's responce? Tell him no and took everything down for a day or two before putting it all back up again... sans the manora.

I was following this story but couldn't find it again, sounds like something the beurocrats would do :P

But seriously why consider a Christmas tree to be a religious symbol anyway? Just because it has "Christ" in the name?

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Ah.. yadda yadda christmas tree is really from the northern european panthiests (celts and norse and germatic tribes/clans.. aka pagans) was called Yule tree, yackity smackity, absorbed into the early church to make Christmas, hibby yibby...

Meh... truthfully, it's not that flippin hard to put up a manora, pagan yule symbols, christian whatever, kwanza things, and who ever else has a winter festival up. I mean, if they put up a holiday all about thing.. Christians will cry foul because their (stolen) holiday was being repressed and turned into something pagan (IRONY)...

BUT THIS IS NOT THE PLACE FOR THIS DISCUSSION!

Onwards about the English language in England!

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I was born here in the UK, and some of the p.c. has gone right out the window. You are almost half afraid to say, or do anything in case it is banned.

They were talking about putting taxes depending on what kind of view we get where we live. I have never heard anything so bizarre, except back in the 1600's, when people were taxed for the number of windows that they had in their house.

We get taxed for some pretty odd things here. At times you feel they have a tax on eveything, including the air you breathe. (Whoops, I hope that doesn't give them any more bizarre ideas for taxing us to death and beyond).

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sadly in the liberal and politically correct world we live in its perfectly acceptable for parades with homosexuals and transvestites waltzing down the road promoting bestiality and to have Islamic rallies calling for death to all westerners yet Christians aren't permitted to put a small snow globe or Christmas ornament up in their office.

Oh...really...?

I guess the stupidity of political correctness is needed as a counterpart to the stupidity of narrowmindness.

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just read the posts here by certain members to see why this crazy situation got a foothold.

nothing matters more to the pc brigade then self rightious dignity!!

what i could never understand is the way these liberal do gooders say "everyones unique and they have the right to their own culture"

and at the same time say "everyones the same".

we are not all equal thats a fact and certain cultures are absolutly not compatable.

so why are so many forced to accept their visitors customs however disgusting and be considered a racist, bigot, or nazi for saying that they are not happy about it?

i suppose thats the punishment our kids deserve for their grandads fighting facism!!

complete and utter madness.

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There is plenty of room on a Christmas/Yule tree to put on ornaments for other faiths celebrating at the same time of year. I wonder why no one did that?

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When I was in Tech School, the class put up a tree in the front of the room. Menorahs are often rather expencive so I wasn't about to leave mine in a place whereit could be stolen. I seriously doubted that they would let me light a bunch of candles in a classroom so I made a bunch of little wooden menorahs with hooks on them and no one raised any sand when I put them on the tree. I didn't keep them though. Some of my fellow students liked them so I gave them all away.

Now for a little wise*ss section... Christmas Trees are described in the bible before there was a Christian OR a Christmas. No joke. Don't believe me? Jeremiah 10: 3-4. The bible does not call them "X-mas Trees" but, it does describe the practice fairly well, nearly two thousand years before they became a X-tian tradition!

3 - For the laws of the nations are delusions: For it is the work of the craftsmans hands. He cuts down a tree in the forest with an ax,

4 - He adorns it with silver and gold, he fastens it with nails and hammer, so that it does not fall totter.

It's an admonition to not do the things that the "heathens" did.

Edited by Lord Umbarger
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Jeremiah 10:5 Like a scarecrow in a melon patch, their idols cannot speak; they must be carried because they cannot walk. Do not fear them; they can do no harm nor can they do any good."

Just like I always thought: It sure doesn't hurt to have one. Makes the house smell good too..

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It warms my heart to see that someone actually pulled out their bible and read a couple of lines from it!

Did you also read the lines right before it? The ones refering to not doing as the heathens do?

Actaully, I think that the bible is saying that you shouldn't use the tree as an idol or a god. The "can do you no harm nor good" part is more or less a way of sying that a tree as an idol is useless. Take special note, it does NOT say that it cannot make the house smell better! :D

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Would you believe thta I managed to double post?

Edited by Lord Umbarger
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Although the overdone PC-ness currently observed grates with me as much as the next person, I see it as a natural human process, or social reaction when we become aware of a social injustice. We tend to run away with it and in our enthusiasm/hysteria exaggerate massively. As a metaphore, it always reminds me of the movement of a pendulum. First it was swaying to one extreme, let's take for example religious suppression, pogromes, racism, etc, no it veers to the other extreme. Naturally at some point it will come to a healthy equilibrium in the middle and common sense will kick in again...

Another example in the UK would be the overzealousness regarding children's safety, or, in other words, the fear of schools of having their pants sued off by overprotective or simply greedy parents, which lead to one school somewhere forbidding mothers to hencefoward bring home-baked cakes to the school bazaar and the like ('cause these days we have nut-allergy sufferers, coeliacs, allergy to dairy products, etc. etc...It's a miracle that children are allowed to eat cake at all...And, just in parentheses, it's likely that the same worried parents will take the kids to Macdonalds for a Happy Meal later on...) Or even more bizarre, the school that handed out goggles to kids in the playground and demanded that they were worn at all times when playing conkers in order to avoid eye injuries leading to partial or total blidness, possibly loss of both eyes...Because, as we all know, there have been generations of poor blinded, conker-struck children erring the streets of the UK...

As I said, or hope, at some point common sense will kick in again...

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('cause these days we have nut-allergy sufferers, coeliacs, allergy to dairy products, etc. etc...It's a miracle that children are allowed to eat cake at all...And, just in parentheses, it's likely that the same worried parents will take the kids to Macdonalds for a Happy Meal later on...)
I don't know how old you are and it's none of my business but, do you remember when you were growing up and we all rode bicycles without a helmet, we ate things chock full of MSG's and saturated fats, our mothers weren't afraid to have a beer while pregnaut and our parents smoked in the car with us in the back seats? Ever shared a Coke or Pepsi bottle with your friend from up the street without worrying about germs? Remember when if you screwed up in class the teachers could "Bust your ****" and Mom thought that it was a good idea? Remember putting butter on your corn without people looking at you strange? Peanut butter was good for everyone and pizza gave you zits? Remember how you hated that one teacher but, never tried to kill her? Remember when political correctness was what soviet re-education camps strove for and the freeworld fought against? Yeah? And most of us turned out to be pretty alright.

Strange how school shootings, childhood diabetes, AIDS, babies in garbage cans, next-door neighbors you don't know and teachers molesting students all seemed to come about around the same time as "political correctness".

Here's a little something that I got from Rense.com.....

Then And Now

12-8-6

Scenario - Jack pulls into school parking lot with rifle in gun rack.

1953 - Vice Principal comes over, takes a look at Jack's rifle, goes to his car and gets his to show Jack.

2006 - School goes into lockdown, FBI called, Jack hauled off to jail and never sees his truck or gun again. Counselors called in for traumatized students and teachers.

Scenario - Johnny and Mark get into a fist fight after school.

1953 - Crowd gathers. Mark wins. Johnny and Mark shake hands and end up best friends. Nobody goes to jail, nobody arrested, nobody expelled.

2006 - Police called, SWAT team arrives, arrests Johnny and Mark. Charge them with assault, both expelled even though Johnny started it.

Scenario - Robbie won't be still in class, disrupts other students.

1953 - Robbie sent to office and given a good paddling by Principal. Sits still in class.

2006 - Robbie given huge doses of Ritalin and/or Prozac. Becomes a zombie. Almost

commits suicide. School gets extra money from state because Jeffrey has a disability.

Scenario - Billy breaks a window in his father's car and his Dad gives him a whipping.

1953 - Billy is more careful next time, grows up normal, goes to college, and becomes a successful businessman.

2006 - Billy's Dad is arrested for child abuse. Billy removed to foster care and joins a gang. Billy's sister is told by state psychologist that she remembers being abused herself and their Dad goes to prison. Billy's mom has affair with psychologist.

Scenario - Mark gets a headache and takes some headache medicine to school.

1953 - Mark shares headache medicine with Principal who has a headache also.

2006 - Police called, Mark expelled from school for drug violations. Car searched for drugs and weapons.

Scenario: Mary turns up pregnant.

1953 - 5 High School Boys leave town. Mary does her senior year at a special school for expectant mothers.

2006 - Middle School Counselor calls Planned Parenthood, who notifies the ACLU. Mary is driven to the next state over and gets an abortion without her parent's consent or knowledge. Mary given condoms and told to be more careful next time.

Scenario - Pedro fails high school English.

1953 - Pedro goes to summer school, passes English, goes to college.

2006 - Pedro's cause is taken up by state democratic party. Newspaper articles appear nationally explaining that teaching English as a requirement for graduation is racist. ACLU files class action lawsuit against state school system and Pedro's English teacher. English banned from core curriculum. Pedro given diploma anyway but ends up mowing lawns for a living because he can't speak English.

Scenario: Johnny takes apart leftover firecrackers from the 4th of July, puts them in a model airplane paint bottle, blows up a red ant bed.

1953 - Ants die.

2006 - BATF, Homeland Security, FBI called. Johnny charged with domestic terrorism, FBI investigates parents, siblings removed from home, computers confiscated, Johnny's Dad goes on a terror watch list and is never allowed to fly again.

Scenario - Johnny falls while running during recess and scrapes his knee. He is found crying by his teacher, Mary. Mary, hugs him to comfort him.

1953 - In a short time Johnny feels better and goes on playing.

2006 - Mary is accused of being a sexual predator and loses her job. She faces 3 years in State Prison.

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I don't know how old you are and it's none of my business but, do you remember when you were growing up and we all rode bicycles without a helmet, we ate things chock full of MSG's and saturated fats, our mothers weren't afraid to have a beer while pregnaut and our parents smoked in the car with us in the back seats? Ever shared a Coke or Pepsi bottle with your friend from up the street without worrying about germs? Remember when if you screwed up in class the teachers could "Bust your ****" and Mom thought that it was a good idea? Remember putting butter on your corn without people looking at you strange? Peanut butter was good for everyone and pizza gave you zits? Remember how you hated that one teacher but, never tried to kill her?

Absolutely! Remember exchanging chewing gums? Roaming through the forest on our own? Peeing into the public swimming pool? (Well, I'm actually pretty sure that that will still be around for a long time)

Remember when political correctness was what soviet re-education camps strove for and the freeworld fought against? Yeah? And most of us turned out to be pretty alright.
Now you're exaggerating !!!

Strange how school shootings, childhood diabetes, AIDS, babies in garbage cans, next-door neighbors you don't know and teachers molesting students all seemed to come about around the same time as "political correctness".

Now you're being extreme & undifferentiated!

-School shootings are related to much more complex, social problems.

-Childhood diabetes probably has more got to do with junk food & dietary ignorance of many parents.

-I really don't see where AIDS comes into this!

-In olden times unwanted babies were thrown into the river

-Teachers, priests, uncles & the like HAVE molested children, and not just since yesterday. Children have rights. But, as I said, with awareness often comes hysteria.

I also remember how in kindergarten (that was in the seventies...) we had a hyperactive boy. Our schoolteacher knew nothing better to do than tie him to the chair with chords & gag him with a hankerchief for an hour or two.

In my opinion, Political Correctness is part of, and has evolved from Human Rights. And although PC-ness in many cases has derailed, I'd rather have a bit too much of the former than too little of the latter. And, just by the way, I am categorically againts corporeal punishment. Violence perpetrates violence; And surely, if we as a race are capable of splitting the atom, mapping the genome and send rockets into space, we can come up with a more viable & constructive alternative.

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Perhaps I made it sound a little too much PC was the ultimate cause of all the bad changes in our world. That was unintensional. Maybe it is just the fruit of a world gone nutty. It just seems sad to me that reliance on common sence goes out the window when people bring too much PC into the room. Obviously, either is an extreme. Unfortunately, they are not in equal proportions.

I refuse to refer to someone, such as myself, as educationally self-deprived. If the little b*stard dropped out of school then he's a dropout! A person who murders someone is not "blind to the worth of human life, he's a killer. When you sweeten the definition of negative things, you take away the stigma.

The proper treatment for a hyperactive child is not to send him to a school that does not have recess and pump him full of ritalin any more than it is to strap him to a chair. The better solution is to make him run around the football field a couple of times. That always seemed to work for me.

-Teachers, priests, uncles & the like HAVE molested children, and not just since yesterday. Children have rights.
True, and we used to give child molesters a fair trial right before we'd hang them. Maybe it didn't work all the time but, what we do now doesn't seem to work either.

It just seems to me that PC has, in far too many instances, replaced common sence and I think that people are worse off for the trade.

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Perhaps I made it sound a little too much PC was the ultimate cause of all the bad changes in our world. That was unintensional. Maybe it is just the fruit of a world gone nutty. It just seems sad to me that reliance on common sence goes out the window when people bring too much PC into the room. Obviously, either is an extreme. Unfortunately, they are not in equal proportions.

I refuse to refer to someone, such as myself, as educationally self-deprived. If the little b*stard dropped out of school then he's a dropout! A person who murders someone is not "blind to the worth of human life, he's a killer. When you sweeten the definition of negative things, you take away the stigma.

The proper treatment for a hyperactive child is not to send him to a school that does not have recess and pump him full of ritalin any more than it is to strap him to a chair. The better solution is to make him run around the football field a couple of times. That always seemed to work for me.

True, and we used to give child molesters a fair trial right before we'd hang them. Maybe it didn't work all the time but, what we do now doesn't seem to work either.

It just seems to me that PC has, in far too many instances, replaced common sence and I think that people are worse off for the trade.

If you put it like that with regards to PC-ness, yes, I do agree with you. Especially when it comes to those silly euphemisms. If you're too fat, you're too fat, and not gravitationally challenged. However, I think it's silly not because it takes away the stigma, but because we should simply call things by their name. I don't think stigmatising something has ever helped solving a problem. But, saying that, we also have to be aware that how we name a thing influences how we feel about it. It DOES make a difference whether you call a child retarded, or whether you say it has learning difficulties. Again, you really can take things too far. But in general, it's the hard-core zealots that go on the politically correct rampage; I think the majority of people naturally react in a more healthy manner.

I think though that your feeling that the world has gone potty, or is more potty than it used to be, is not reflected in reality. If you study social/cultural history for a bit, you'll discover that people were over-the-top and hysterical about something in any era; it just changes. The victorians for example were obsessed with the idea to be buried alive. In medieval times, people were superstitious to the point of paranoia-everybody was a potential witch. During the cold war, everybody was potentially either a spy or a communist. In antiquity and during the renaissance people were paranoid about being poisoned (well, that was actually often justified)

Anyway, people of any epoch generally seem to have the feeling that the world is going to the dogs, and actually is not more decadent than it used to be. Our historical perception seems to be a bit lopsided. I always marvel at people who say that there is so much more crime. Man, just look at the history books again: A hundred years ago, in any mayor city, you could be glad to get from one end of town to the other alive. In the 1700'ds, you were thrown into gaol for stealing a loaf of bread. Etc, etc, etc. Let's face it, we are a violent species.

And yet, never before in history has humanity had such lofty humanitarian & humanistic ideals. Never before in law has the right & dignity of the individual been protected to such an extent. Oh, yes, realisation & application of these ideals are lagging behind massively, and with the new ideas come political clumsiness & cluelessness as how to handle them; but hey, let's be a bit patient.

The capacity for violence, cruelty, addiction, abuse of power as well as indifference lie within all of us and are part of the human psyche. And it is on this level that we have to deal with them. We cannot run away from our shadow. And no legislation (or fancy renaming) will simply make them disappear, hanging or no hanging.

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how we name a thing influences how we feel about it. It DOES make a difference whether you call a child retarded, or whether you say it has learning difficulties.

Whether you say "IT" has learning difficulties....., Just who is this "IT" that you speak of?!? Ha-ha. Actually, I know where you're coming from. Things always do seem better in retrospect. If you think that prices were fair when you were a kid, ask your parents what thier memories of prices were during the same period.

Deffinately, today is safer than life a hundred years ago. I really wouldn't want to live in a pre-toilet paper world. There are just a lot of the "new way" of looking at a lot of stuff that I don't agree with. Human nature is the same as it has always been but, the way we deal with it has changed. To me it seems that we left a lot of the better things behind. If you get the chance, read the other thread titled "More school trouble". A four year old was accused of sexually assulting a teachers aide. He hugged her and was thrown out.

Like I said before, I know where you're coming from. I think that we are both getting at the same thing just from different directions.

Edited by Lord Umbarger
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I’m surprised this story even made the news, what with all the suppression of er 'minority' stories in the press. In London we’ve got a real problem- people are too afraid to walk the streets in case they come across one the sinister gangs which er according to the Government, Press and even our PC police force are not suppose to exist.

Operation Trident is failing miserably. <_<

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Lord Umbarger:Dec 15 2006, 04:31 AM

Whether you say "IT" has learning difficulties....., Just who is this "IT" that you speak of?!?

Oh, don't be too harsh, we do let it out of the attic once in a while...

A four year old was accused of sexually assulting a teachers aide. He hugged her and was thrown out.

That just beggars belief. I'm speechless. When I think of what we kids were up to after Kindergarten :blush: I wonder what these people would do if they saw Italian parents kissing their babies' sexes when they bathe them. Quite a common practice for centuries. Lynch them as paedophiles?

Like I said before, I know where you're coming from. I think that we are both getting at the same thing just from different directions.

Agreed!

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