The Scole Experiment

[Bogeyman]

I know this has come up before but not as often as it should and definitely not as often as most of the rubbish that keeps appearing here.

This is a beauty because it was investigated by the Society For Psychical Research who dont get involved with any old paranormal claim.

This is really good stuff for anyone who hasnt seen or heard of it before.

This is a new(ish) website about it btw.

Bogey

http://www.thescoleexperiment.com/s_files_00.htm

The Society for Psychical Research

http://www.spr.ac.uk/

The Scole Experiment chronicles the extraordinary results of a five-year investigation into life after death. At the beginning of 1993 four psychic researchers embarked on a series of experiments in the Norfolk village of Scole. The subsequent events were so astounding that senior members of the prestigious Society for Psychical Research asked to observe, test and record what took place."

Edited January 15, 2007 by Bogeyman

[coldethyl]

Looks interesting but a lot of info to review. I've bookmarked it.

[Sweetpumper]

Me too. Looks very interesting.

[Violet_Blue]

That's amazing... the images are incredible! I would love to know more details as to how to set up something similar.

[Bogeyman]

It always makes me wonder when a topic like this gets little or no interest ....a link into seemingly very real afterlife research is to me the most interesting there could possibly ever be.

Everyone's got a vested interest in this ...and then you see a thread called "psychic vampires" tops the interest here...... Sheesh

(No offence Karmaharbour )

[143]

It always makes me wonder when a topic like this gets little or no interest ....a link into seemingly very real afterlife research is to me the most interesting there could possibly ever be.

Everyone's got a vested interest in this ...and then you see a thread called "psychic vampires" tops the interest here...... Sheesh

(No offence Karmaharbour )

I just find any sort of picture hard to believe. It was interesting though.

[Bogeyman]

I just find any sort of picture hard to believe. It was interesting though.

Well take the pictures as a bonus......If the SPR found it interesting enough to get involved well theres something to it.

One of the very interesting things that i saw was that Thomas Edison is purportedly involved in the team of "Spirit Scientists" trying to link up from the afterlife.....

On a completely unrelated site www.worlditc.org that deals with ITC and EVP ...Edison has also been named as being part of a team trying to set up a communication link.Heck they even have a picture of him there as he is now (supposedly).

Take this site on it's merits and read the research before looking at the pictures ....i think it's one of the more credible sites i've seen regarding Afterlife contacts.

Bogey

[Violet_Blue]

Bogeyman, I think if such clear communication to and from the "other side" is possible... it must leave many people speechless.

I personally had never heard of the Scole Experiment, but after reading that site and looking at all the photographs, I'm more shocked by the fact it's not on the news and more people around the world are trying to improve or work on those methods. It's really incredible and it has to make you wonder if it's real... and how exactly did they do it?

[Bogeyman]

. It's really incredible and it has to make you wonder if it's real... and how exactly did they do it?

Violet

I cant pretend to know if it's real or not....but if it is a fake ...why spend 5 years doing it...and being scrutinised by the SPR and many other scientists along the way.

It's a huge leap to take something like this on face value ....i know this and i am probably biased in wanting it to be true...but this doesn't make it fake....i think it did get some TV coverage back in the 90s but like everything else...todays news is tomorrows fish & chip wrapping.

Bogey

[Barek Halfhand]

It always makes me wonder when a topic like this gets little or no interest ....a link into seemingly very real afterlife research is to me the most interesting there could possibly ever be.

Everyone's got a vested interest in this ...and then you see a thread called "psychic vampires" tops the interest here...... Sheesh

(No offence Karmaharbour )

hey B-man!

will read promise hav'nt yet but WILL !!

anyway as for as karm glad you used him as an example keep in mind his OP was a photo witch is easier to get freaked over than a long read but You have a point so there must be something really good about that link so this newer guy will take advisement!...............B

update: cool sites bogey!

When the going gets tuff

and the stomach acids flow

and the winds of conformity are nipping at your nose

and some trendy new atrocity has brought you to your knees

come with us we'll sail the sees of cheese....

F'n PRIMUS

Edited January 16, 2007 by Barek Halfhand

[Violet_Blue]

Violet

I cant pretend to know if it's real or not....but if it is a fake ...why spend 5 years doing it...and being scrutinised by the SPR and many other scientists along the way.

It's a huge leap to take something like this on face value ....i know this and i am probably biased in wanting it to be true...but this doesn't make it fake....i think it did get some TV coverage back in the 90s but like everything else...todays news is tomorrows fish & chip wrapping.

Bogey

Oops! posting before I was even finished reading all those articles on the Scole Experiment Site, I'm still reading... I am getting the bigger picture now... I can see and understand all the work that has gone on in their research.

The commonest argument in support of the critics is that scientific advances proceed by replication: do it in a different lab by different experimenters, and you overcome initial doubts. Do it again in a third or umpteenth lab, and you have won over the doughtiest of critics. Many psychical researchers, and not a few spiritualists, subscribe to this approach. Even Mrs. Emily Bradshaw, our wise, lively and charismatic spirit informer during the Scole sittings, said that replication is what we want.

The parrot-cry for replication is based on a totally false understanding of the nature of psychic experiences. Replication implies complete control over all the parameters of an experiment. The experimenter must know just what temperature, humidity, size, number, pressure, weight etc., will be required. Any change in one of these variables can wreck the experiment and falsify the results. This is orthodox science. It works admirably for the purpose for which it is designed. But it is entirely inappropriate to the psychic world. Here we have little or no control over the parameters. We cannot even be sure of what they are, let alone how they function. An attempt at replication is immediately sabotaged by the experimenter effect: the fact that the personality, attitude, vibrations of the himself is known to have an effect on the outcome. Strange to say this was demonstrated nearly half a century ago in a classic experiment conducted with G.W. Fisk by one of the Scole Report's critics, Professor Donald West. We can rarely say, let alone determine, when a spirit originated voice or phenomenon will occur, or what form it will take.

Why getting proof of paranormal activity is difficult... and why in my opionion these experiments are so amazing. I believe they are true and hope they continue their incredible research. Thanks for this post Bogey!

[Loonboy]

I'm sorry, but to paraphrase Lisa Simpson, I'm MTV generation (almost).

Can someone summarise this so I don't have to spend the next hour reading...?

[Episteme]

Loonboy, to summarize, there were experiments done in what was deemed "the scole hole" (basically a somewhat controlled environment in a cellar) over I believe a five year period attempting to obtain scientific evidence of life after death mainly in the form of photographic evidence or psychic photography. The results were impressive, to say the least. In addition to the photography and writing on negatives, they reported voices, touch, lights and other paranormal phenomenon.

I reviewed the site a bit and found it to be impressive, too impressive. I then read some reports by Montague Keen, a member of the Council for the Society of Physical Research. Then I went on to search for some more skeptical views. What I found was that these purpoted scientific experiments weren't done in a very controlled environment. They were done in the dark and didn't allow any night vision cameras to be used, when the technology was widely available at the time to have them used without the mediums knowledge. The cellar door was never locked, breezes were felt, the list goes on but these were the biggest things that to me point to fraud. Most seem to suspect fraud on the part of the mediums, not the scientists. In light of the extraordinary findings, they should definately do these experiments again in an environment that would be acceptable to both skeptics and believers alike.

Here is one of Keen's reports. Note the dismissal of his collegues distrust in the controls of the experiment in the last paragraph:

It was disturbing to discover that some of our most senior colleagues found themselves unable to get past the first stage, dedicating themselves to pointing to the admitted weaknesses in some aspects of the controls, but diligently ignoring those features which individually or cumulatively made the case for authenticity overwhelming. Those who read the report in its entirety, and note the replies given to the critics' contributions published alongside it, will, I believe endorse a view clearly echoing the overwhelming reaction of the Study Day audience in their reception of Dr Crawford Knox's contribution, which he forcefully summarises in these pages.

Wouldn't those senior collegues turn around and say the opposite of him, putting so much faith in an experiment with "admitted weaknesses in some aspects of the controls"?

Another great summary of the weaknesses in the experiment are here. The thread is lengthy so to get to the meat look for "Dogwood" or use "ctrl F" to find the second dogwood entry, he has a very informed post on the subject.

[Loonboy]

Thank you, Episteme.

[bLu3 de 3n3rgy]

Very interesting...

Edited January 17, 2007 by Anvil

[Bogeyman]

Episteme

Good work there...thanks for that .Despite all this i still think theres something to it. If you read the conditions imposed by the scientists along the way it leaves very very little room for fraud. As far as James Randi goes i tend not to read him because he's got a vested interest in any Paranormal claims being proved fraudulent....otherwise he'll have to part with his million quid

As with everything like this we should thread carefully and not take anything for granted ...a healthy sceptical view is crucial .....i'll be keeping an eye on this one though because it's one of the most authentic investigations i've seen.

[Episteme]

I agree that there could be something to it. However I don't pass off Randi entirely, especially when you're looking from the trickster's point of view. Apparently the mediums wore glowing armbands, I assume they weren't too bright (the armbands, not the mediums - nyuk) as they didn't want the room to be illuminated. I think it was in the thread I linked where they discussed stagehands silently working in complete darkness using only a single point of light for reference. With knowledge of the environment and a bit of practice, people can pull off some pretty impressive stunts.

Colin Fry (going under the pseudonym "Lincoln") was busy making a name for himself using this type of medium reading in the dark when he was caught in the act in the Scole cellar - though not during the Scole Experiments. He was strapped into a chair and a trumpet covered in glowing paint was said to float. When the lights were turned on in the middle of one of these sessions, Fry was found standing and holding the "floating" trumpet. It is still unknown how he removed and reapplied the straps without being found out during previous sessions.

[Violet_Blue]

... What I found was that these purpoted scientific experiments weren't done in a very controlled environment. They were done in the dark and didn't allow any night vision cameras to be used, when the technology was widely available at the time to have them used without the mediums knowledge. The cellar door was never locked, breezes were felt, the list goes on but these were the biggest things that to me point to fraud.

I too wonder why they didn't place any hidden night vision cameras, I would think you would want to record such an event... why did it have to be in pitch darkness?

Colin Fry (going under the pseudonym "Lincoln") was busy making a name for himself using this type of medium reading in the dark when he was caught in the act in the Scole cellar - though not during the Scole Experiments. He was strapped into a chair and a trumpet covered in glowing paint was said to float. When the lights were turned on in the middle of one of these sessions, Fry was found standing and holding the "floating" trumpet. It is still unknown how he removed and reapplied the straps without being found out during previous sessions.

[Bogeyman]

I agree ....For the last piece of the jigsaw to fit...there must be infrared cameras ...i can never fathom the argument against these as they dont impose any light on the scene.

But Nil Desperandum on this one ...read the evidence "for"

E.G ....The film that was held in the scientists hands in a locked box and still in the wrapping ....and when they developed it it had these images on it ...how could this be faked ?

[trickyhomunculi]

Looks interesting, bookmarked it. good find

[bLu3 de 3n3rgy]

Theres no mention of any control experiements or is there? One control SHOULD have been to repeat the process in daylight and with lights on at night.

[Episteme]

But Nil Desperandum on this one ...read the evidence "for"

E.G ....The film that was held in the scientists hands in a locked box and still in the wrapping ....and when they developed it it had these images on it ...how could this be faked ?

Still planning going back to look for this one. I recall seeing something the skeptics said about the locked box but don't remember what it was. Will try to do this when I have more time, but am guessing it will take quite a bit of digging.

Theres no mention of any control experiements or is there? One control SHOULD have been to repeat the process in daylight and with lights on at night.

If I recall correctly there were no control experiments at all. The mediums refused to, I guess "perform" with the lights on.

[bLu3 de 3n3rgy]

from a mediums point of view if i was put in that situation and it was all above board i'd be wanting to repeat it in as many conditions as possible, I have my own ideas why they would prefere the dark ( nothing to do with fraud) but i'd be too curious to NOT want to repeat it in daylight or whatever....

Edited January 23, 2007 by Anvil

[Sadonis]

I'm not religious, but I do think that there is absolutely no way you can know about the afterlife before you experience total death(not just death..like on a surgery table and your heart stops) yourself.

It's quite possibly the greatest mystery of all time..in fact...it IS the greatest mystery of all time. Nothing trumps it..and everyone would do anything to get money to trick you into thinking otherwise.

[Barek Halfhand]

I'm not religious, but I do think that there is absolutely no way you can know about the afterlife before you experience total death(not just death..like on a surgery table and your heart stops) yourself.

It's quite possibly the greatest mystery of all time..in fact...it IS the greatest mystery of all time. Nothing trumps it..and everyone would do anything to get money to trick you into thinking otherwise.

Hey Sadonis

glad your back! All I can say is a month ago i felt the SAME way...now the opposite is the case...nuff said..............B