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hidden chambers under the great sphinx


vampiredreamer

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Can I see a reference to Gadalla talking about psi-org energy... mm never heard or read of such views of his work...

Gadalla talks about this in his book Pyramid Handbook. You can purchase and download it from his website.

At six bucks it's not too painful, although you must understand what your purchasing is not an academic or scholarly historical treatment. It is unsubstantiated, science-fiction fringe of the highest order. As with many fringe writers, Gadalla sprinkles in a wee bit of facts to make his writing sound balanced, but the simple truth is, it's primarily nonsense.

If nothing else, the Pyramid Handbook is good for a chuckle. :D

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kmt_sesh,

Speaking of dubious information, years ago I came across something about the Pyramids and that the Priests were actually behind the construction, the layouts of the chambers were there for a specific purpose. The Kings were duped into building them for something along the line of monuments to their greatness and the Priests used them for some sort of initiation process of the younger ones.

Through administration of Soma and the purported powers of the shape of the Pyramid and the exact location of the chamber used, the combination of the three forced OBE experiences on the trainees.

I can not remember in what publication I read that, too many years ago. Have you heard anything along those lines in your research?

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kmt_sesh,

Speaking of dubious information, years ago I came across something about the Pyramids and that the Priests were actually behind the construction, the layouts of the chambers were there for a specific purpose. The Kings were duped into building them for something along the line of monuments to their greatness and the Priests used them for some sort of initiation process of the younger ones.

Through administration of Soma and the purported powers of the shape of the Pyramid and the exact location of the chamber used, the combination of the three forced OBE experiences on the trainees.

I can not remember in what publication I read that, too many years ago. Have you heard anything along those lines in your research?

Hi, StarLord. I have indeed come across this information before, but it doesn't belong to ancient Egyptian tradition. I believe it stems primarily from reinterpretation on the part of the Rosicrucians and their interests in initiation rituals. It is one of many spins applied by people long, long ago in their efforts to try to understand the monuments of Egypt. Pyramids were tombs--it's that simple. If they're talking about Egyptian pyramids in general, it doesn't make much sense because no two have the same precise positioning of internal features. If they're talking about the Great Pyramid in particular, that also doesn't make sense because they're trying to remove only one pyramid from a much larger context of royal funerary architecture, and that is never a proper way to approach a real understanding. ;)

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Have they been in the rooms yet? This thread was started over 2 years ago and I really don't feel like going through all the posts.

Not much has changed except Hawass drilled four or six apparently

random holes in the area and has been pumping out vast amounts of

water. This is causing the area to dry up protecting the monuments.

There is also a report (as well as a book) by Andrew Collins that

a cave network exists on the opposite side of the plateau which ex-

tends to the pyramids. Hawass has been exploring a cave in the

nearby Osiris shaft and denying that any caves exist at Giza.

Collins believes that the cave of Hermes exists under here. I doubt

he's far wrong.

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Not much has changed except Hawass drilled four or six apparently

random holes in the area and has been pumping out vast amounts of

water. This is causing the area to dry up protecting the monuments.

There is also a report (as well as a book) by Andrew Collins that

a cave network exists on the opposite side of the plateau which ex-

tends to the pyramids. Hawass has been exploring a cave in the

nearby Osiris shaft and denying that any caves exist at Giza.

Collins believes that the cave of Hermes exists under here. I doubt

he's far wrong.

There is no cave in the Osiris shaft. It was hewn by man all the way to the bottom. There is no natural inlet or outlet beyond a tiny fissure--I think it was you who directed my attention to the fact that Hawass would like to get a little camera in there to see what they might find, but it's nothing but a crack. The shaft itself ends in a chamber whose features were clearly carved by man, from floor to ceiling. All of this information is widely available.

I've commented on the "Hermes' thing before. Collins specifically refers to this as the "Tomb of Hermes." The god Hermes belongs to the ancient Greek culture, not to Egypt. There is no Hermes tradition native to Egypt, and the ancient Egyptians did not regard him as their founder. They themselves specifically refer to Meni (the Greek Menes) as their founder, and none of the earliest kings were even buried at Giza. You have to go to Abydos to find their tombs.

Collins is embarking on a wild goose chase if he thinks such a thing actually exists. He needs to learn how to differentiate between cultures and their traditions before muddying the waters for his readers.

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Somone buy me a plane ticket and il crawl in there :P im pretty skinny :P

lol if i ever went to egypt i would go in there though

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There is no cave in the Osiris shaft. It was hewn by man all the way to the bottom. There is no natural inlet or outlet beyond a tiny fissure--I think it was you who directed my attention to the fact that Hawass would like to get a little camera in there to see what they might find, but it's nothing but a crack. The shaft itself ends in a chamber whose features were clearly carved by man, from floor to ceiling. All of this information is widely available.

Before saying there are no caves at Giza Hawass was down in the Osiris Shaft with

a camera on a snake exploring whatr HE called a CAVE. I have no idea if it's a true

cave or not and have to go with whjat I'm told. For hundreds of years it's been re-

ported by many that there is clear water in a hole at Giza and that it's used for swim-

ming. Several have said this is at the bottom of the OS. There is an anecdotal re-

port from a few years ago that something dropped in this water "fizzed". There are

reports that manmade passages near the botom have water erosion.

I can't quite agree that any of this is "widely available" and to the degree it is it

has only been so for the last few years.

I've commented on the "Hermes' thing before. Collins specifically refers to this as the "Tomb of Hermes." The god Hermes belongs to the ancient Greek culture, not to Egypt. There is no Hermes tradition native to Egypt, and the ancient Egyptians did not regard him as their founder. They themselves specifically refer to Meni (the Greek Menes) as their founder, and none of the earliest kings were even buried at Giza. You have to go to Abydos to find their tombs.

A rose by any other name...

Yes, he probably should use the term "Tomb of Thoth" swince he is referring to the

God from before the time of the Greeks. But keep in mind no one ever heard this term

so he is simply using one that is more communicative. Hermes= Thoth.

There you go sneaking in that king's tomb thing again. I don't think you'll find the

tomb of any kings at Giza nor their headstones but there might be a tomb of the God

Thoth/ Hermes and there is, I believe, the birthplace of Hermes right where Collins

says it is.

Collins is embarking on a wild goose chase if he thinks such a thing actually exists. He needs to learn how to differentiate between cultures and their traditions before muddying the waters for his readers.

I think he probably knows the difference between a God and another founded on that God.

Edited by cladking
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Before saying there are no caves at Giza Hawass was down in the Osiris Shaft with

a camera on a snake exploring whatr HE called a CAVE. I have no idea if it's a true

cave or not and have to go with whjat I'm told. For hundreds of years it's been re-

ported by many that there is clear water in a hole at Giza and that it's used for swim-

ming. Several have said this is at the bottom of the OS. There is an anecdotal re-

port from a few years ago that something dropped in this water "fizzed". There are

reports that manmade passages near the botom have water erosion.

I can't quite agree that any of this is "widely available" and to the degree it is it

has only been so for the last few years.

I think we're just being fussy about word usage. I prefer the word "chamber" because in an archaeological sense it refers to a void or cavity carved by man, not necessarily by nature. On the web page at his website where Hawass writes about the Osiris shaft, he calls the bottom-most cavity a chamber. I'm merely trying to stress the point that this cavity was cut by man. It was carefully carved with a raised platform, a channel, and even pillars.

If there was any kind of little pocket or void originally in the limestone down there, it was of course only incidental that the Egyptians came upon it when cutting the shaft. They would not have known about it. I stress again there are no other forms of access into this bottom-most chamber. No tunnels or corridors, natural or otherwise, that connect to any other subterranean feature with which the Egyptians were familiar. There is only the tunnel that had been cut to about sixteen feet out from the chamber, and was never finished.

The "swimming hole" is in fact the Osiris shaft. It's true that people used to swim in it years ago because the ground water was all the way up to the top of the shaft. It has lowered in recent years and Hawass's teams used pumps to clear out the rest of the water. In everything I've read about this ground water in the Osiris shaft, I've never come across any mention of "fizzing." It's just plain old water, the same that has been pooling up around the Sphinx in recent years.

Yes, he probably should use the term "Tomb of Thoth" swince he is referring to the

God from before the time of the Greeks. But keep in mind no one ever heard this term

so he is simply using one that is more communicative. Hermes= Thoth.

There you go sneaking in that king's tomb thing again. I don't think you'll find the

tomb of any kings at Giza nor their headstones but there might be a tomb of the God

Thoth/ Hermes and there is, I believe, the birthplace of Hermes right where Collins

says it is.

I think he probably knows the difference between a God and another founded on that God.

I haven't been explaining it well but what I've tried to stress with this "Tomb of Hermes" is that it's complete fiction. It's a Greek invention. Yes, the Greeks equated Hermes with the Egyptian god Thoth, but the Egyptians did not reciprocate. Evidently Collins is not able to differentiate in this case because there is no such thing as the Tomb of Hermes, and there is definitely no such thing in the Egyptian tradition as the Tomb of Thoth. Hellenistic tradition also places a Tomb of Hermes in Hebron, near Jerusalem, so why doesn't Collins look there, too?

So, yes, Hermes = Thoth in the ancient Greek culture, but the Egyptians never regarded it that way. At no point did they, the Egyptians, practice a tradition in which Thoth had a tomb at Giza. Thoth didn't have a tomb, period. This is the sort of thing I should hope people can see for themselves: it's handy to be able to discard bad speculation that is at odds with the cultural traditions of ancient Egypt.

As for your jab at the kings' tombs, no one can logically deny that Khufu, Khafre, and Menkaure were buried there. The only people who doubt this are the people who rely on fringe speculation, so they're not exactly starting from solid ground to begin with. They possess little to no understanding of the archaeology and research that have taken place, and so they conveniently either ignore it or pretend it doesn't matter. Rather inane, that. Khufu, Khafre, and Menkaure each had a pyramid, and in a sense each did have a sort of tombstone: the sets of mortuary temples, valley temples, and causeways in which their names and images were carved.

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I think we're just being fussy about word usage. I prefer the word "chamber" because in an archaeological sense it refers to a void or cavity carved by man, not necessarily by nature. On the web page at his website where Hawass writes about the Osiris shaft, he calls the bottom-most cavity a chamber. I'm merely trying to stress the point that this cavity was cut by man. It was carefully carved with a raised platform, a channel, and even pillars.

If there was any kind of little pocket or void originally in the limestone down there, it was of course only incidental that the Egyptians came upon it when cutting the shaft. They would not have known about it. I stress again there are no other forms of access into this bottom-most chamber. No tunnels or corridors, natural or otherwise, that connect to any other subterranean feature with which the Egyptians were familiar. There is only the tunnel that had been cut to about sixteen feet out from the chamber, and was never finished.

I agree arguing semantics is a fool's passtime. But it was Hawass who called

it a cave and I've seen mention of caves in other sources.

The "swimming hole" is in fact the Osiris shaft. It's true that people used to swim in it years ago because the ground water was all the way up to the top of the shaft. It has lowered in recent years and Hawass's teams used pumps to clear out the rest of the water. In everything I've read about this ground water in the Osiris shaft, I've never come across any mention of "fizzing." It's just plain old water, the same that has been pooling up around the Sphinx in recent years.

Ground water and water below the water table are not the sanme thing. It's best

to think of ground water as water that hasn't soaked in or runoff yet. It's always

"dirty" water. Water below the water table has soaked through porous stone or oth-

er material and is usually good water.

This isn't quite the same thing as water in an aquifer but is for most practical

purposes. It was not ground water in the osiris shaft nor was it rainwater that

got in. I don't know what it is but I believe that it's thought to be at the water

table and is higher than the river. This would be normal but there is also a mas-

sive aquifer which flows under Giza and this could be that aquifer. Without actually

testing (which may or may not haVe been done) there is simply no way to know.

I haven't been explaining it well but what I've tried to stress with this "Tomb of Hermes" is that it's complete fiction. It's a Greek invention. Yes, the Greeks equated Hermes with the Egyptian god Thoth, but the Egyptians did not reciprocate. Evidently Collins is not able to differentiate in this case because there is no such thing as the Tomb of Hermes, and there is definitely no such thing in the Egyptian tradition as the Tomb of Thoth. Hellenistic tradition also places a Tomb of Hermes in Hebron, near Jerusalem, so why doesn't Collins look there, too?

So, yes, Hermes = Thoth in the ancient Greek culture, but the Egyptians never regarded it that way. At no point did they, the Egyptians, practice a tradition in which Thoth had a tomb at Giza. Thoth didn't have a tomb, period. This is the sort of thing I should hope people can see for themselves: it's handy to be able to discard bad speculation that is at odds with the cultural traditions of ancient Egypt.

This concept comes from a later time. It might have no bearing whatsoever on the

pyramid builders. As I've said repeatedly, I don't believe there is anything in

here other than the "broadhall of Osiris N" which is a cave according to the Pyra-

mid Texts in noi uncertain language. This is the location of the "heart of the Gods"

and is the origin of the legend of Thoth/ Hermes. It's hardly impossible there are

the emerald tablets or some such down here but the only thing specifically mentioned

as being down here near the time of construction is a.,- the tomb of Osiris and b.,-

four fiery red jars containing Osiris' efflux (carbon dioxide).

As for your jab at the kings' tombs, no one can logically deny that Khufu, Khafre, and Menkaure were buried there. The only people who doubt this are the people who rely on fringe speculation, so they're not exactly starting from solid ground to begin with. They possess little to no understanding of the archaeology and research that have taken place, and so they conveniently either ignore it or pretend it doesn't matter. Rather inane, that. Khufu, Khafre, and Menkaure each had a pyramid, and in a sense each did have a sort of tombstone: the sets of mortuary temples, valley temples, and causeways in which their names and images were carved.

There is the simple fact that no king has ever been found in any of the great pyra-

mids and no evidence to support the contention. The fact that there were forces that

might destroy them doesn't prove that they were ever there. There's still the PT which

say that these were not tombs. There's Herodotus who says the king was buried under

Giza on an island like Osiris. I don't believe him necessarily but the fact re-

mains that all the evidence which says these were tombs are constructs. physical evidence

is wholly lacking.

Ironically they aren't even looking for the physical evidence because egyptology is

foounded on the assumption that they are tombs built by ramps. All theories which con-

tradict this are fringe theoiries by definition.

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i bet they will find the lyrics to the rick roll song :rofl:

naw but they will probably find scrolls and artifacts.

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Thanks for sharing. If or when they get fully inside, they'll find something interesting or that will provide advacement in the study of ancient Egypt.

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  • 1 month later...

has anyone actually thought that the egyptian government and archealogical community who have looked after the pyramids and the sphinx have stopped all the access to dig and research so they can preserve these monuments to our past these wonders of the ancient world and because they have been very picky on what information or who does what to them that alot of people have came to conclusions that there is more than meets the eye under these monuments and that there is something with so much power or knowlege and its got all aout of hand and really there is just foundations or columns holding the sphinx up and they used it as an offerings chanmber or buriel chamber or it could be the fantastic we all just dont know and i think the world should know e.g make an effort to preserve these monuments and at the same time work away around getting to these chambers or tunnels im sure digging 30 meters or so away from the sphinx and then making a tunnel to go underneath to the chamber and reinforce all the way will preserve the sphinx for the sake of knowlage this needs to happen what if it is the fantastic and there is a wealth of knowlage that will save us or show us the light out of darkness what if there is a ultimate cure the cure for everything what if its a spaceship that has been left there for us to find which will take us to or help us communicate with our makers or it could be a real good find tombs and artifacts this is too important for the aurthorities to restrict us from finding out im sure if we vow to protect these monuments and make all the effort they should let us, why would the ancients make this stuff underground if it wernt meant to be found if by us or spirits or gods

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has anyone actually thought that the egyptian government and archealogical community who have looked after the pyramids and the sphinx have stopped all the access to dig and research so they can preserve these monuments to our past these wonders of the ancient world

Not only have people thought this, but Zahi Hawass has been saying this very thing for decades, and rightly so.

and because they have been very picky on what information or who does what to them that alot of people have came to conclusions that there is more than meets the eye under these monuments and that there is something with so much power or knowlege and its got all aout of hand and really there is just foundations or columns holding the sphinx up and they used it as an offerings chanmber or buriel chamber

There is no chamber under the sphinx, and the sphinx has nothing holding it up.

It was carved from an outcropping of the bedrock limestone at Giza, it's not a statue that was "placed" there.

this is too important for the aurthorities to restrict us from finding out im sure if we vow to protect these monuments and make all the effort they should let us, why would the ancients make this stuff underground if it wernt meant to be found if by us or spirits or gods

Again, "the ancients" did no such thing.

Harte

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  • 3 months later...

Not only have people thought this, but Zahi Hawass has been saying this very thing for decades, and rightly so.

There is no chamber under the sphinx, and the sphinx has nothing holding it up.

It was carved from an outcropping of the bedrock limestone at Giza, it's not a statue that was "placed" there.

Again, "the ancients" did no such thing.

Harte

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There is nothing to find under the sphinx,

it was found many years ago, scurried away, and hidden. The controlling factors of this planet have all that was in the hall of records.

Knowledge is the key to control......that is why everything is hidden, and that which is questioned is covered up.

Edgat Cayce was no fraud, and all that he told was verified as true, except for those things involving atlantis and such.

Why is it all of his statements were believed, except those involving atlantis????

Because what information he gave, was used imediately, for a purpose.......then to cover up the fact that it was true, excavations were denied.

Explain to me, how the egyptians lived like rats in the desert, and then POOF! they had brilliant mathematical skills and created the spinx and the pyramids.....and then POOF! no more great accomplishments.

This is equal to where we are at today, and then all the advances made in technology, just ended, and not another computer was produced.....or we went back to building huts made from baked mud.

Edited by eastonct124
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There is nothing to find under the sphinx,

it was found many years ago, scurried away, and hidden. The controlling factors of this planet have all that was in the hall of records.

Knowledge is the key to control......that is why everything is hidden, and that which is questioned is covered up.

Edgat Cayce was no fraud, and all that he told was verified as true, except for those things involving atlantis and such.

Why is it all of his statements were believed, except those involving atlantis????

Because what information he gave, was used imediately, for a purpose.......then to cover up the fact that it was true, excavations were denied.

Explain to me, how the egyptians lived like rats in the desert, and then POOF! they had brilliant mathematical skills and created the spinx and the pyramids.....and then POOF! no more great accomplishments.

This is equal to where we are at today, and then all the advances made in technology, just ended, and not another computer was produced.....or we went back to building huts made from baked mud.

I would have to ask, how much time have you devoted to a proper study of the Early Dynastic Period, the timeframe prior to the Old Kingdom and the Great Pyramid? You're missing a hell of a lot of information. And no more great accomplishments? It would seem you've never heard of Karnak, Luxor, Abu Simbel, Deir el Bahri, Dendera, Edfu, and numerous other sites containing works of engineering and architectural wonder that surpass the Great Pyramid in sophistication and complexity.

But when your source is Edgar Cayce, I can understand why you're probably not familiar with substantive historical research.

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I would have to ask, how much time have you devoted to a proper study of the Early Dynastic Period, the timeframe prior to the Old Kingdom and the Great Pyramid? You're missing a hell of a lot of information. And no more great accomplishments? It would seem you've never heard of Karnak, Luxor, Abu Simbel, Deir el Bahri, Dendera, Edfu, and numerous other sites containing works of engineering and architectural wonder that surpass the Great Pyramid in sophistication and complexity.

But when your source is Edgar Cayce, I can understand why you're probably not familiar with substantive historical research.

Don't forget, eastonct124 needs the glue of conspiracy to hold it together, else it would wither all the quicker under the light of truth.

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Don't forget, eastonct124 needs the glue of conspiracy to hold it together, else it would wither all the quicker under the light of truth.

Yes, that's something I didn't comment on, but it's the same old tired conspiracy crap. These people must picture Zahi Hawass and his henchmen dressed like Ninjas and creeping into the night with their shovels and picks, working frantically to dig up, retrieve, and hide away "THE TRUTH" from the rest of us.

I mean, really? :blink:

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Knowledge is the key to control......that is why everything is hidden, and that which is questioned is covered up.

Edgat Cayce was no fraud, and all that he told was verified as true, except for those things involving atlantis and such.

You're right, except where you (probably accidentally) inserted the word "no" above, and the part where you (again, probably accidentally) used the word "true" where you obviously meant false.

Cayce was a fraud that stole his musings about the fictional land of Atlantis from the even loopier musings of an even greater fraud, "Madame" Helena Blavatsky.

Why is it all of his statements were believed, except those involving atlantis????

What are you saying here? It's not true that "all of his statements were believed." Are you aware he spent time in jail for doing what he did?

Because what information he gave, was used imediately, for a purpose.......then to cover up the fact that it was true, excavations were denied.

What information he gave was completely and utterly useless. His ravings on Atlantis were voiced during a trance in which he was supposedly looking for minerals in the area of Bimini (from his bed.) The clues he'd given to the industrialists that he was working for at the time had led them nowhere, so he came up with this load of crap to save face.

If Cayce was right, then China is today a Christian nation, and California fell into the sea in the 1950's.

Harte

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I just keep wondering what Hawass meant when he said there

are important clues for how the pyramids were built down under

Giza back in 1996.

I don't believe he's ever said so that's one secret right there.

If we kept count it would look like the biggest most loosely kept

secret in history.

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I dont know much about Edgar, but what about that Nile running backwards claim?

From what I've read, if it's true, that a pretty nice "guess".

I'm not convinced that EC was a scam artist. I "believe" in things like collective conscience because there is hard evidence for it. In fact there is hard scientific evidence for many things, including human's ability to affect the outcomes of random number generation.

EC could have been tapping into something. He could have been tapping into it only sometimes. What we was tapping into might be not be infallible. There are lots of explanations for EC that involve at least something more to it than "he was a scammer and made it all up"

I'm an empiricist, and a big fan of science as a process.

On the other hand, scientific establishment has a bad habit of holding onto ideas long after their time, when better evidence and more fitting theories are available. This is well documented across ALL the sciences. Science likes change more than say, religion, but not a whole lot more :)

There is hard scientific evidence for all kinds of crazy things involving conscience, intention, will, and so on. It's reality.

Edited by Qwasz
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I dont know much about Edgar, but what about that Nile running backwards claim?

From what I've read, if it's true, that a pretty nice "guess".

I'm not convinced that EC was a scam artist. I "believe" in things like collective conscience because there is hard evidence for it. In fact there is hard scientific evidence for many things, including human's ability to affect the outcomes of random number generation.

EC could have been tapping into something. He could have been tapping into it only sometimes. What we was tapping into might be not be infallible. There are lots of explanations for EC that involve at least something more to it than "he was a scammer and made it all up"

I'm an empiricist, and a big fan of science as a process.

On the other hand, scientific establishment has a bad habit of holding onto ideas long after their time, when better evidence and more fitting theories are available. This is well documented across ALL the sciences. Science likes change more than say, religion, but not a whole lot more :)

There is hard scientific evidence for all kinds of crazy things involving conscience, intention, will, and so on. It's reality.

Hear, hear!!!

The world is infinitely complex and it simply astounds me that

anyone might believe he understands it at all. All we can see

is snapshots of reality and these are filtered though what we

know and what we belive as well as what we can grasp. It's easy

to have a very distorted view of the little we can see.

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Hear, hear!!!

The world is infinitely complex and it simply astounds me that

anyone might believe he understands it at all. All we can see

is snapshots of reality and these are filtered though what we

know and what we belive as well as what we can grasp. It's easy

to have a very distorted view of the little we can see.

I'll agree that we don't know everything, but expounding that into...unorthodox views isn't really proving anything.

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