Would it make you happy if...........

[Jodie.Lynne]

....the "opposition" on this site went elsewhere?

I keep seeing comments like this:

OP... keep up the good work...

if they weren't threatened by it... they wouldn't care...

from different segments of our population here, which sometimes makes me feel that I'm on a battleground rather than a forum for the exchange of ideas. It seems, sometimes, that the object here is to "win" rather than impart knowledge and debate.

So speak freely- who wants to see only like minded posts on this board, and who wants the "others" to shut up and move on? And who is for everyman to have an opinion of their own?

And, to thaphantum: I'm not picking on you, you were just the latest example of the "win" attitude I saw.

[Kalien]

Debating is all part of the fun IMO

[Shadow_Hill]

....the "opposition" on this site went elsewhere?

Not at all. If I wanted discussions where the other party just agreed with me I'd talk to my husband [just kidding... he doesn't agree with me really... well, he does, but only when he wants to... you know what I mean ]

I posted a comment on the thread about what we've learned at UM saying that it saddens me that some people here just want to win. You're asked a question about what you believe and then you get the person who asked bashing you on the head with their opinions until you just have to throw your hands up and move on to another thread.

I am sick of reading "them and us" posts. I am not a "them" or an "us"... I am a "me". I don't get it. I don't want to wage war, I just want to explore what everyone believes and why. If I wanted people telling me "can't come up with an answer eh?... Yeah, I win!" I would go back to the school playground (and find people with more sense to talk to).

edited: cos I'm stoopit

Edited April 13, 2007 by Shadow_Hill

[rev r]

Swords, words...same thing J my friend. I was once told that it was wise to treat every encounter with another human as a battle for your life. I'm not so sure about that now. There really isn't anything that anyone can take from me.

I do get frustrated and take things a little too personally at times. I have a huge ego. Sometimes I have to just step back and take a breath.

Long story short, I like the opposition. It forces me to have to get over myself.

[Wolf MacCanine]

I always enjoy a good debate,but unfortunately some of the debates have ended up as battles instead.But,everyone should be able to have their own opinion and be able to express them.In the course of debate...who knows...some may look at new or different evidence and such and learn from it.

[Crimson_Magician_7]

Posting whatever you want to do is cool in all, I just wish that people would call a spade a spade and tell their opinions as opinions not try to use hearsay as scientific fact to validate things and ideas which have no ground to stand upon in order to be called fact.

And dropping the notion of "Our faith is the right way, and what your doing is a sin but if you act now..." from discussion helps majorly and makes people look less like complete fools.

I know that is harsh, but I speak truth plainly.

[distortedpandy]

Debating is all part of the fun IMO

Agreed.

[SilverCougar]

Alot of these "debates" just turn out to be circulare logic, discussions, fights, and just make me feel like I'm talking to a damned wall. *chuckles*

What I would love to see stop happening, is the whole "Can't think up of a comback!?" thing and "Your like is bias, only my links are unbias. About everything." thing. The most frustraiting thing is when someone tries to make it into a p***ing contest with insults and smuggery... And to top that off with someone demanding sources (without bringing any of their's to the party) only to say "It's bias, I won't accept it. Here's mine, it's perfect." When really their's is just as "bias" as anyothers out there.

Frying..pan..logic!!

[thaphantum]

....the "opposition" on this site went elsewhere?

I keep seeing comments like this:

from different segments of our population here, which sometimes makes me feel that I'm on a battleground rather than a forum for the exchange of ideas. It seems, sometimes, that the object here is to "win" rather than impart knowledge and debate.

So speak freely- who wants to see only like minded posts on this board, and who wants the "others" to shut up and move on? And who is for everyman to have an opinion of their own?

And, to thaphantum: I'm not picking on you, you were just the latest example of the "win" attitude I saw.

it wasn't a win attitude... i was just telling SON not to let people tell him that he is being intollerant because he doesn't believe what they think he should... i was showing support in what he was saying... and if people weren't threatened by what he said... they wouldn't have all gotten together and agreed that he was intollerant... when he wasn't...

he was just stating how he viewed it and how he believes that people should be allowed to teach their kids whatever they feel is right... so if that's a win attitiude by agreeing with SON... then so be it...

[GoddessWhispers]

....the "opposition" on this site went elsewhere?

I keep seeing comments like this:

from different segments of our population here, which sometimes makes me feel that I'm on a battleground rather than a forum for the exchange of ideas. It seems, sometimes, that the object here is to "win" rather than impart knowledge and debate.

So speak freely- who wants to see only like minded posts on this board, and who wants the "others" to shut up and move on? And who is for everyman to have an opinion of their own?

And, to thaphantum: I'm not picking on you, you were just the latest example of the "win" attitude I saw.

It may appear as such. The Tolerance card is played often enough, and the the apologist side , after exampling intolerance, claim it has a right to be intolerant and should be tolerated, but that one can not then call them intolerant because that can not be tolerated.

Clearly it's a matter of either not knowing what tolerant is, or it's an attempt to decry objection to intolerant attitudes and claim an offense, so as to excuse the behavior so that it might then perpetuate itself.

It's a public forum, as far as I'm concerned it's also a microcosm of the macrocosm, or world at large. So, while there are indeed multiple SN's on board, that profess to defend one another and make it appear as if there is a movement or battle to gain a superior placement in any discussion or debate, it all means nothing really in the larger picture, because the credibility is in question, being the Internet. Simply, one may argue in font speak , but the bravado is not credible necessarily because of what is spoken, because one can always play Devils advocate , without anyone knowing who they really are, or what they really think. I also don't think anyone here expects UM forums to be a repository of higher learning. I see it as an opportunity to impart ideas, discuss opinions and perhaps throw something out there by which someone might learn something about which they were previously unaware. I know I hope to do that when I sometimes post certain threads. However, it's not necessarily guaranteed that shall be the case, and because it is a discussion forum, for all that that means, it may just illicit a dialog wherein people at least learn something about who they are in the process. Other than that, everything else is arbitrary. Although I will say I do think some people, not speaking to anyone here directly or by implication, attend forums just to exercise their vicious side, because if they did so person to person off-line they would be less likely to be tolerated or perhaps even disciplined. So it's an outlet of sorts, for those that are supressed otherwise, in the real world.

[Kalien]

GW you are totally one of my favorite members.

[Jodie.Lynne]

it wasn't a win attitude... i was just telling SON not to let people tell him that he is being intollerant because he doesn't believe what they think he should... i was showing support in what he was saying... and if people weren't threatened by what he said... they wouldn't have all gotten together and agreed that he was intollerant... when he wasn't...

he was just stating how he viewed it and how he believes that people should be allowed to teach their kids whatever they feel is right... so if that's a win attitiude by agreeing with SON... then so be it...

IamsSon? who said anything about Iams?

I took your quote from THIS thread:

Did You Know?

Here is your quote in its entirety, IamsSon isn't even IN this thread.

and so do you... what's your point?

why does something have to go into details about how something happened for it to be true? when people say man went to the moon... they don't give you all the details of how they built the shuttle and went through training... so whether or not tectonic plates were mentioned is IRRELEVANT... according to the Bible... God did it... so why would it need to mention tectonic plates?

the OP stated his intentions from the beginning... and what else could the earth being divided mean? please provide your interpretation... the Bible NEVER refers to mankind as the earth... so based on the Hebrew language... it means exactly what it says...

almost makes you wonder how they knew that it used to fit together...

the earth was divided... that is a FACT... it's not an OPINION so why would the OP call it an OPINION?

OP... keep up the good work...

if they weren't threatened by it... they wouldn't care...

[thaphantum]

IamsSon? who said anything about Iams?

I took your quote from THIS thread:

Did You Know?

Here is your quote in its entirety, IamsSon isn't even IN this thread.

i was reading the other thread right before i responded to this... so that was fresh on my mind... on the other hand... that has been an ongoing debate between 2 threads... so maybe you should read it all... before you make an assumption...

and by the way... the person who originally said it was opinion came back and said it was a FACT, but still wanted the OP to say it was an opinion....

but however you feel about it is fine with me...

[GoddessWhispers]

GW you are totally one of my favorite members.

I am privileged you think so. Thank you. I very much enjoy reading you as well.

[EmpressStarXVII]

I've noticed the "win" attitude a lot as well. I think it would be really boring for us all to believe the same thing. But I think most of us are probably guilty of wanting the defensive side to try and "see" our side of the story.

[Kalien]

I've noticed the "win" attitude a lot as well. I think it would be really boring for us all to believe the same thing. But I think most of us are probably guilty of wanting the defensive side to try and "see" our side of the story.

Just human nature I guess.

[Leonardo]

I'm probably as guilty as anyone for being a bit pig-headed when I get a bee in my bonnet about something on the forum. I do strive, however, to be open-minded and I make no attempt to 'convert' people but simply try to open their minds to other possibilities...

Debate is a great way of exchanging ideas, but it is difficult to be open-minded sometimes. I wouldn't want the 'opposition' to go away though. The place would rapidly degenerate into a boring, back-slapping clique if that happened.

Edited April 14, 2007 by Leonardo

[sbradj]

guilty...but at times its such fun.. i wouldnt want anything changed about it..great way to exchange thoughts opinons belifs ...we all should know when to go on..including myself...when it comes down to it its a no win situation.just ones opinon..

[Schnaffler]

Not at all. If I wanted discussions where the other party just agreed with me I'd talk to my husband [just kidding... he doesn't agree with me really... well, he does, but only when he wants to... you know what I mean ]

I posted a comment on the thread about what we've learned at UM saying that it saddens me that some people here just want to win. You're asked a question about what you believe and then you get the person who asked bashing you on the head with their opinions until you just have to throw your hands up and move on to another thread.

I am sick of reading "them and us" posts. I am not a "them" or an "us"... I am a "me". I don't get it. I don't want to wage war, I just want to explore what everyone believes and why. If I wanted people telling me "can't come up with an answer eh?... Yeah, I win!" I would go back to the school playground (and find people with more sense to talk to).

edited: cos I'm stoopit

Yup, along with threads where evidence is requested and debunked constantly! Some debates turn into mindless hamster wheels with no-one getting anywhere.

I don't want to wage war, I try to read everything with an open mind and understand other people's opinions even if I don't agree. But I have been shot down. I also get dis-heartened when people resort to using patronising little comments when discussing my posts.

Tash

[IamsSon]

I would hate if the opposition was forced to leave UM, especially since I would probably be the one forced to leave.

I enjoy debating! And I will freely admit that whenever I feel I am being challenged to a fight, I jump right in... I'm not proud of this and I am continually working on it, but so far I'm failing miserably at it. The best solution I have come up with lately is to just walk away, but the "debate warrior" in me is really &!$$@* off about that!

I really do not mind having my views challenged, what really gets to me is when the retorts to my posts become attacks on me instead of debates against my point. I'm a Christian, politically conservative (card-carrying member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy ), and outspoken, I expect to find opposition here in UM, and so far I have not been disappointed. What is disappointing is that at times it seems that all that those who have ever felt put down by others with more power want is to have power so that they can turn around and put others down too; instead of having learned that all that putting others down generates is resentment.

[Leonardo]

I would hate if the opposition was forced to leave UM, especially since I would probably be the one forced to leave.

I enjoy debating! And I will freely admit that whenever I feel I am being challenged to a fight, I jump right in... I'm not proud of this and I am continually working on it, but so far I'm failing miserably at it. The best solution I have come up with lately is to just walk away, but the "debate warrior" in me is really &!$$@* off about that!

I really do not mind having my views challenged, what really gets to me is when the retorts to my posts become attacks on me instead of debates against my point. I'm a Christian, politically conservative (card-carrying member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy ), and outspoken, I expect to find opposition here in UM, and so far I have not been disappointed. What is disappointing is that at times it seems that all that those who have ever felt put down by others with more power want is to have power so that they can turn around and put others down too; instead of having learned that all that putting others down generates is resentment.

I disagree with everything you just said!

[Schnaffler]

What is disappointing is that at times it seems that all that those who have ever felt put down by others with more power want is to have power so that they can turn around and put others down too; instead of having learned that all that putting others down generates is resentment.

I agree! Treat others as you would like to be treated!

[brave_new_world]

....the "opposition" on this site went elsewhere?

I keep seeing comments like this:

from different segments of our population here, which sometimes makes me feel that I'm on a battleground rather than a forum for the exchange of ideas. It seems, sometimes, that the object here is to "win" rather than impart knowledge and debate.

So speak freely- who wants to see only like minded posts on this board, and who wants the "others" to shut up and move on? And who is for everyman to have an opinion of their own?

And, to thaphantum: I'm not picking on you, you were just the latest example of the "win" attitude I saw.

I too often forget to listen and absorb different view points and knowledge and feel the need to "win". It comes down to the fact that we think often think that the more intellectual or smarter you are the more superior you are.

Character is higher than intellect and it is a shame that we put the intellect on such a pedestal. In my view you could be the smartest person on earth but this still doesnt compete with the simplicity of have in God.

[IamsSon]

I disagree with everything you just said!

Who do you think you are to disagree with me! Do you think I care!

[Shadow_Hill]

I think the sad part about the "I win!" mentality, is that the person who feels that way learns nothing. If you argue just for the sake of beating your opposition down then you are deaf to every word he utters. You meet every question you are asked with suspicion, and your response will be one intended to further your goal... to win. What is to be gained by being the best in a war of words if the words you hear you are deaf to and the words you utter serve only to squash your opponent by whatever means. Belittling personal comments, and an insistence that your opponent is lacking in some way say more about you than they do about your opponent.